Voy's Tuvix dilemma

The morals of killing Tuvix to save the lives of Tuvok and Neelix is comparable ethically to harvesting the organs of an innocent dude to save 2 people.

No

It's just splitting a fused entity back to its original forms. Nobody is being killed

Nobody cries about Gogeta/Vegito "dying" every time they split back to Goku and Vegeta

No

It's just splitting a fused entity back to its original forms. Nobody is being killed

Nobody cries about Gogeta/Vegito "dying" every time they split back to Goku and Vegeta

Tuvix does not want to die.

Tuvix is just confused and doesn't understand he isn't being sent to die

I think it's weird how much energy gets spent debating this made-up ethical quandary that has no actual real-world parallels and can only happen in fantasy scenarios.

Like at least the trolley problem could happen.

Socrates' hypotheticals were based in reality, not fantasy.

Fusing two people together is not science fiction, it is fantasy.

Debating about a fictional scenario that could happen makes sense, debating about a fictional scenario that could never happen does not.

I get that ignoring this is part of your schtick, but you will not rope me into it.

I'm pro-choice and even I think that's cold. The fact Tuvix was "an accident" doesn't change that he is, innocent, sentient life that wants to live and did nothing wrong.

It's still the right thing to do whether you've got distaste for it or not. If your child was run over by a car and splattered into a million pieces that somehow rearranged into two smaller alien beings, wouldn't you press a button to put them back together, to get your child back?

Creatures borne of freak accidents/chance (this is NOT the same as an accidental or unwanted pregnancy and you know that)

really don't have as much right as something the universe naturally decreed. Tuvix was an unfortunate accident and he went back where he belonged.

I think it's weird how much energy gets spent debating this made-up ethical quandary that has no actual real-world parallels and can only happen in fantasy scenarios.

Like at least the trolley problem could happen.

If your existence hinges upon my non-existence, something ain't right. It's why vampires are bad people. You can't go around drinking people's blood! You can't go around subsuming the existence of two other sentient humanoids! It's not fair! Vampires don't have a choice and neither did Tuvix, but that's why there are vampire slayers and Captain Kathyrn Janeways.

:P

If your existence hinges upon my non-existence, something ain't right.

It's why vampires are bad people. You can't go around drinking people's blood! You can't go around subsuming the existence of two other sentient humanoids! It's not fair! Vampires don't have a choice and neither did Tuvix, but that's why there are vampire slayers and Captain Kathyrn Janeways.

:P

Tuvok and Neelix's existence hinged on Tuvix's non-existence.

He would argue the opposite without hesitation if he felt it would generate more responses. In fact, given this topic's regularity here, I guarantee he has at some point.

Except Tuvix literally didn't exist at the onset of the problem.

So it's ok for parents to harvest their child's organs if both their lives are at stake? Parents were there first, after all, they called dibs.
Tuvix' existence isn't an ongoing threat to other lives. Comparisons to parasites and vampires are false. At the time of the question, Tuvix exists and Tuvok and Neelix are essentially dead. You should not kill one non-consenting individual, who is actively pleading to live, to revive two others.

Never really thought about which episodes were Goo Crew. I see the episode starting a few episodes before. It then what we see Goo Crew for like 4 or 5 episodes. Then resumes when the Goo Crew episode ends. I'm not sure the showrunners would have though of that. That would have been wild

goo crew are just the one episode

The starting conditions make it different than the trolley problem.

Janeway also doesn't push Tuvix in front of a train.

That's why it's allegorical.

The starting conditions make it different than the trolley problem.

The only dilemma worth addressing here is how much effort I should put in responding to a gimmick account playing an antagonist on a dying video game message board. It is at least a dilemma based in reality.

Thinking about it a bit more, the pro-Tuvix line is actually pro-choice. It's the bodily autonomy argument, you have autonomy over your own body and medical choices related to it. If you want to choose to have an ear parasite or vampire feed on you, that's one thing, but if you reject that that's your choice. Same for Tuvix, he should have final say over the medical decision concerning his life.

The only dilemma worth addressing here is how much effort I should put in responding to a gimmick account playing an antagonist on a dying video game message board. It is at least a dilemma based in reality.

I see it this way, his life was a stolen life. A life that was less than the two lives, that were taken without permission, to create it. The life did not belong to him. It belongs to the people who were unwillingly combined to create it. They get it back.

I see it this way, his life was a stolen life. A life that was less than the two lives, that were taken without permission, to create it. The life did not belong to him. It belongs to the people who were unwillingly combined to create it. They get it back.

Yeah, the reset button was one of the most frustrating things about Voyager. If they wanted to do another TNG type show they could have done that. They chose to make it about a ship having to survive on their own with a mixed Starfleet and Maquis crew, so why make that your premise if you're barely going to engage with it?

I see it this way, his life was a stolen life. A life that was less than the two lives,

that were taken without permission, to create it.

The life did not belong to him. It belongs to the people who were unwillingly combined to create it. They get it back.

My opinion of Voyager has always been: brilliant premise, incredible start, quick transition into inoffensive mediocrity with occasional flashes of potential.

I don't think Janeway would capitulate and execute Harry Kim.

Crazy to think how well DS9 was doing at the time and Voyager network execs were like "Hey, let's do none of that."

It was my understanding that DS9 did only middling rattings wise. It's not until you can have teh DVD or streaming that you get to enjoy the long story crafting they did.

Also they dropped the ball pretty hard sometimes. changling doctor

Tuvok probably would have found executing Tuvix "logical" as he is a capable officer and Voyager has a manpower shortage.

Would cloning Tuvix have worked? You can then seperate neelix and tuvok. Would they be able to do it with tech onboard voyager? It solves the dilemma but then adds another.

It was my understanding that DS9 did only middling rattings wise. It's not until you can have teh DVD or streaming that you get to enjoy the long story crafting they did.

Also they dropped the ball pretty hard sometimes. changling doctor

Would cloning Tuvix have worked? You can then seperate neelix and tuvok. Would they be able to do it with tech onboard voyager? It solves the dilemma but then adds another.

I can believe that

"But a sexy blond babe in her underwear front and center and have the Borg turn up every week" were 100% just trying to get TV ratings and it shows.

DS9 had some great stories and character beats but they weren't exactly gonna win over the kind of people who like Micheal Bay movies.

Wait people were upset that a Changling took the place of Dr Bashir for a while?

Never heard that before. Why?

No. To do cloning you need Bio-mimetic gel which is a rare compound and strictly controlled by the federation.

It's unlikely they have any aboard Voyager.

I'm not sure if that's the only way to do cloning. There are a lot of episodes with cloning, and I'm fairly certain the majority of them don't mention bio-mimetic gel. Also, it would depend on how you define cloning. Transporter duplication (like with Tom Riker) is the same end result.

No, no. It's not that it happened but the fact the actor only acts differently in that one episode.
He was replaced a year ago and acts the same as the normal doctor until that episode. When the episode reveals he was replaced is the only time he acts like somebody pretending to be the Bashir.

From what I understand the writers knew Siddig would make it obvious and intentionally didn't tell him.