Been working on Metroid Retrospective Pt2 lately. C/D Zero Mission is the GOAT

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Board 8 » Been working on Metroid Retrospective Pt2 lately. C/D Zero Mission is the GOAT
wg64Z
09/09/2021
10:06 AM
#1
I have seriously beat Zero Mission at least 8 times in 4 days. The game is SOLID and I'm now heavily leaning into the camp of ZM > Super.

Here's a little tease for anyone who saw Part 1:
https://twitter.com/TarvouldsQuest/status/1435965526598094850

And for those that didn't, check it out!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNXU64vy5sE

Do you like humor, gameplay, and daily content? Check out my hilarious let's play Youtube Channel, Tarvould's Quest!
https://www.youtube.com/TarvouldsQuest
MZero
09/09/2021
11:02 AM
#2
D

The Zero Suit section sucks
MZero , to the extreme
I never saw azuarc coming, but he won the Guru!
RaidenGarai
09/09/2021
11:08 AM
#3
D

Super Metroid
https://www.twitch.tv/zerothe14th
wg64Z
09/09/2021
11:15 AM
#4
MZero posted...
D

The Zero Suit section sucks

wtf that's like my favorite part. I loved that whole section start to finish. What didn't you like about it?
Do you like humor, gameplay, and daily content? Check out my hilarious let's play Youtube Channel, Tarvould's Quest!
https://www.youtube.com/TarvouldsQuest
Lolo_Guru
09/09/2021
11:43 AM
#5
C

Give me zero mission anyday.
Lolo
Shonen_Bat
09/09/2021
11:44 AM
#6
Zero Mission's always been my favorite 2D Metroid. I've tried a few times but could never get into Super Metroid, too many little annoyances put me off
Hello again.
Isquen
09/09/2021
11:51 AM
#7
D. Prime and Super outclass it (and oof, I feel my age that the whole Prime trilogy counts as retro. Made by Retro.)

Fusion was also pretty solid, and just lost out because of its strict linearity.
[The Artist Formerly Known as Earthshaker.]
KommunistKoala
09/09/2021
11:53 AM
#8
D

Super and Fusion
does anyone even read this
Lopen
09/09/2021
12:20 PM
#9
I feel like ZM it's slightly too easy to wall jump and bomb jump to the point where I don't feel accomplished when I do them

But I could see that being a positive for a lot of people
No problem!
This is a cute and pop genocide of love!
Dragonair
09/09/2021
12:38 PM
#10
zero mission is the second best Metroid of all time
FALCON PUNCH!
wg64Z
09/09/2021
12:48 PM
#11
Lopen posted...
I feel like ZM it's slightly too easy to wall jump and bomb jump to the point where I don't feel accomplished when I do them

But I could see that being a positive for a lot of people

You would rather the controls be...harder?
Do you like humor, gameplay, and daily content? Check out my hilarious let's play Youtube Channel, Tarvould's Quest!
https://www.youtube.com/TarvouldsQuest
pjbasis
09/09/2021
01:00 PM
#12
D because my main interest is in the completely player guided freedom of exploration. The gba games mostly throw this out.

Really solid mechanics though, I can replaying it over and over for the bosses and stuff. I did like the zero suit stuff on replay more than I remembered.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr345/Rakaputra/B8%20Girls%202012/pjbas.png
GuessMyUserName
09/09/2021
01:35 PM
#13
D, I think my fav's still super, buuuuut Zero Mission's really great and I hope Dread looks back on it to bring back some things.

I don't think the "guiding" in mzm is an issue at all, it's undeniably helpful for newer players or those who just need that sort of navpoint. But for those who don't... it's very much ignorable, you can continue to just explore every nook as you please and be rewarded. Zero Mission is even a game that intentionally places optional paths if you seek them out, as it's intentionally designed to be completed at low% and speedrun 100% paces, in addition to the standard and they all really have different routes to support what you're trying to accomplish. Significantly more freeing than the literal gated closed Fusion & Other M.

That being said yeah Super definitely has a lot more figuring out where/how you're supposed to proceed - and I don't even think that's because of the chozo statues.

plz for the love of god tho stop making Power Bombs an endgame item
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Been a bad girl, I know I am. And I'm so hot, I need a fan. I don't want a boy, I need a man.
pjbasis
09/09/2021
01:55 PM
#14
GuessMyUserName posted...
But for those who don't... it's very much ignorable, you can continue to just explore every nook as you please and be rewarded.

It's really not.

If you know what's the main path and whats not it makes exploration MUCH less rewarding. I don't want to know all I'm doing is finding a short path with a missile expansion or energy tank.

When I played Hollow Knight I was constantly surprised by the structure of the game because I never knew if I was gonna discover a small secret or a brand new location. I don't want to be guided around the map like I'm on tour with designated exploration zones.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr345/Rakaputra/B8%20Girls%202012/pjbas.png
GuessMyUserName
09/09/2021
02:07 PM
#15
I guess for a first playthrough I can understand that... I haven't had a first playthrough of Zero Mission in a long long time so *shrug*

But then again my first playthrough I accidentally did some big skips and fell off the path of chozo guidance so yeah I really won't be able to relate.
I request affiliated many pipes.
Been a bad girl, I know I am. And I'm so hot, I need a fan. I don't want a boy, I need a man.
Lopen
09/09/2021
02:12 PM
#16
wg64Z posted...
You would rather the controls be...harder?

For stuff like that yeah, assuming they're not super difficult. If I can just effortlessly take every shortcut it's less satisfying to execute for me.

Like I will clarify at no point do I feel like I'm "fighting the controls" in Super Metroid. I think Super Metroid controls well, and ZM controls "too well"

For another example take parrying in SF3. If the window was wider to successfully do it Evo moment #57 or whatever wouldn't be nearly as hype. That's the same kind of thing.
No problem!
This is a cute and pop genocide of love!
transience
09/09/2021
02:37 PM
#17
I could write an essay on this, but instead I'll just say that I put my 8 year old in front of super metroid recently and he got to spore spawn, got frustrated with the controls and bailed on the game. I put him in front of zero mission and he loved it the whole way through.

super metroid does have a wider range of options than zero mission thanks to the wonkiness of its controls and physics, but zero mission is the goat just because it controls better than anything else in existence. (except for AM2R, which is like zero mission+)
xyzzy
Bartzyx
09/09/2021
02:42 PM
#18
KommunistKoala posted...
D

Super and Fusion

Round 2 vs Nichols
Go Dennison!
wg64Z
09/09/2021
02:49 PM
#19
I think there are only 2 or 3 Chozo Statues that actively block you from moving without giving you a waypoint, and one of those is the VERY first one, which you get the long beam 20 seconds later and it barely affects anything. I'll agree though, they didn't feel very necessary to me. The rest are totally optional.

Vertical/Diagonal Bomb jumping is still insanely hard to pull off and rewarding to do. Those are my favorite tricks to pull off. I'm excited for you guys to see the video since a lot of the points you're making I address or even down right agree with.

GBA games "freedom" is way too much of a blanket statement. Zero Mission has a ton of freedom, where as Fusion is insanely strict in it's pathing. I frequently beat Ridley first in Zero Mission since I get the Varia suit immediately after getting the bombs, at least in a sub 15% run.

Do you like humor, gameplay, and daily content? Check out my hilarious let's play Youtube Channel, Tarvould's Quest!
https://www.youtube.com/TarvouldsQuest
pjbasis
09/09/2021
05:35 PM
#20
I know ZM has a lot more going for it than Fusion, but they don't feel as naturally imbedded in the game. And I am emphasizing a first time play through. But I don't really like "skips" as opposed to general nonlinearity. It feels like it misses the point.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr345/Rakaputra/B8%20Girls%202012/pjbas.png
MrGreenonion
09/09/2021
06:08 PM
#21
C
wg64Z
09/13/2021
01:52 PM
#22
Update: Recording footage for Echoes is painful. This game is a SLOG.
Do you like humor, gameplay, and daily content? Check out my hilarious let's play Youtube Channel, Tarvould's Quest!
https://www.youtube.com/TarvouldsQuest
colliding
09/13/2021
05:16 PM
#23
D

it's still super metroid; I don't care if that's the hipster/snob answer, it's just true
while you slept, the world changed
pjbasis
09/13/2021
05:20 PM
#24
I hope mp4 addresses the movement of 3d metroid
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr345/Rakaputra/B8%20Girls%202012/pjbas.png
wg64Z
09/14/2021
08:13 AM
#25
pjbasis posted...
I hope mp4 addresses the movement of 3d metroid

I hope (But realistically know, it will never happen) that the Scan visor is removed entirely.
Do you like humor, gameplay, and daily content? Check out my hilarious let's play Youtube Channel, Tarvould's Quest!
https://www.youtube.com/TarvouldsQuest
Leonhart4
09/14/2021
10:16 AM
#26
I feel like people should just hope the game exists at this point...!
https://imgur.com/WqDcNNq
https://imgur.com/89Z5jrB
wg64Z
09/19/2021
11:32 AM
#27
Echoes is sick dude.

https://twitter.com/TarvouldsQuest/status/1439610908746125322
Do you like humor, gameplay, and daily content? Check out my hilarious let's play Youtube Channel, Tarvould's Quest!
https://www.youtube.com/TarvouldsQuest
pjbasis
09/19/2021
11:34 AM
#28
Leonhart4 posted...
I feel like people should just hope the game exists at this point...!

You know me, existence is not enough
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr345/Rakaputra/B8%20Girls%202012/pjbas.png
GuessMyUserName
09/19/2021
11:39 AM
#29
annihilator beam in multiplayer was absolute carnage

PEWPEWPEWPEWPEW
I request affiliated many pipes.
Been a bad girl, I know I am. And I'm so hot, I need a fan. I don't want a boy, I need a man.
foolm0r0n
09/19/2021
11:41 AM
#30
C, ever since I first played it. The speed is perfect and it let's you do all the tricks and skips without forcing anything on you. SM just feels slow and clunky in comparison.

I do think Sam's level design is nicer on the first playthrough. ZM gets way better when you know some key shortcuts and where it's worth to skip things. Especially the zero suit portion.
_foolmo_
he says listen to my story this maybe are last chance
foolm0r0n
09/19/2021
11:46 AM
#31
Lopen posted...
Like I will clarify at no point do I feel like I'm "fighting the controls" in Super Metroid
You never used the run or select buttons?
_foolmo_
he says listen to my story this maybe are last chance
pjbasis
09/19/2021
11:59 AM
#32
I get we're just comparing within the series, but controls for old snes platformers are still far simpler than the average third person adventure game today. If you can play a game that uses 12 buttons that do different things in different contexts I can't imagine SM would be a fight.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr345/Rakaputra/B8%20Girls%202012/pjbas.png
wg64Z
09/19/2021
05:42 PM
#33
Super Metroids controls are worse than the GBA games and AM2R I think solely based on the weapon selecting and cancel buttons. Also having diagonal aim charted to two different buttons is rough.

Still S tier game though.
Do you like humor, gameplay, and daily content? Check out my hilarious let's play Youtube Channel, Tarvould's Quest!
https://www.youtube.com/TarvouldsQuest
Zylothewolf
09/20/2021
08:26 AM
#34
D, I actually prefer the original because it doesnt have the Zero Suit section.

wg64Z posted...
wtf that's like my favorite part. I loved that whole section start to finish. What didn't you like about it?

Everything! Forced epilogues are usually awful, but this might be the worst Ive played. It was completely unnecessary and didnt even feel like a Metroid IMO.

Ngamer64: Zylo, you're making less sense every day. Azuarc >Me
wg64Z
09/23/2021
11:07 PM
#35
I feel so...defeated.

https://twitter.com/TarvouldsQuest/status/1441237579937067010
Do you like humor, gameplay, and daily content? Check out my hilarious let's play Youtube Channel, Tarvould's Quest!
https://www.youtube.com/TarvouldsQuest
pjbasis
09/23/2021
11:35 PM
#36
Not sure I understand, was it a missable? Been a while since I played MP2
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr345/Rakaputra/B8%20Girls%202012/pjbas.png
wg64Z
09/24/2021
11:55 AM
#37
Permanently missable. And after checking my footage, I actually DID scan it, but then I died and forgot to RE-scan it. Absolutely gutted.
Do you like humor, gameplay, and daily content? Check out my hilarious let's play Youtube Channel, Tarvould's Quest!
https://www.youtube.com/TarvouldsQuest
Board 8 » Been working on Metroid Retrospective Pt2 lately. C/D Zero Mission is the GOAT