Community Mafia Topic 11 - Ancient B8 Mafia History (2009-2011)

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Board 8 » Community Mafia Topic 11 - Ancient B8 Mafia History (2009-2011)
And given literally everyone else's it feels like series regulars only <_<

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Meow1000 posted...
I've been wondering if Ctes is some kind of self-votestuffer but you just summed up why that wouldn't make sense yes.

He also has that innocent scan, if Ulti is legit, so to be anti-town he would also need to be godfather
~C~ FD
http://i.imgur.com/dGDfxaw.png
Forceful_Dragon posted...
Well shit. I spent several hours with my mom after work today so I WAS busy, but then I waited a little longer for MZero to check in because I wanted to test if he was really taunter based upon how he reacted to the day going up.

Sorry about that, I didnt think about there being uses for pineapple vendor, just ended up telling Kirby and Mzero when arguing you were town.

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
PunishedBen posted...
I didnt think about there being uses for pineapple vendor

-_-'

Proving the Taunter real/fake was one of the only ways I could think of to squeeze something more tangible out of the role. I guess my role also further muddies the water for SBell's role by creating more possibilities for a false positive.
~C~ FD
http://i.imgur.com/dGDfxaw.png
TotallyNotMI posted...
all these claims are giving me a headache i believe almost none of them
Thats a bit of a copout. Game has to have a doctor and cop right? And why would scum claim it so early? Ulti has been hinting since day 1. Whose claims are you referring to when you say this?
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
Forceful_Dragon posted...
-_-'

Proving the Taunter real/fake was one of the only ways I could think of to squeeze something more tangible out of the role. I guess my role also further muddies the water for SBell's role by creating more possibilities for a false positive.
Has anyone really doubted MZero though

But yes SBell's role had just as much chance of killing 3 town (including itself) than it had of killing any scum. Basically impossible to actually balance a game around it.

But like no reason to really dispute this claim from FD.
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in numbers. ~War13104
Never stoop to the level of idiots. They will drag you down and beat you with experience.
Nah, Mzero is still the #1 most town cleared person in the game due to the way Taco interacted with Knightz. I can show work if needed but thought it was fairly obvious
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
PunishedBen posted...
Nah, Mzero is still the #1 most town cleared person in the game due to the way Taco interacted with Knightz. I can show work if needed but thought it was fairly obvious
I'm still under the belief that Taco knew Knightz was scum for out of game reasons and it's probably a good thing they're both gone.
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in numbers. ~War13104
Never stoop to the level of idiots. They will drag you down and beat you with experience.
ctesjbuvf posted...
So why did you tell it in a neighbor chat?
ctesjbuvf posted...
All fine answers imo.

Still very curious about telling about BP in a chat.
Well now you know. Part of a reaction test and contingency plan for protecting myself. BP was the best thing I thought i could get away with with my flavor, but since Kirby didnt know the flavor at all I added that I would be able to flavor scan him too if he posted my poem. He posted it immediately, no questions asked.
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
We agree on that.
~Peaf~
So anyway let's see.

MI was right that town feels weak compared to the powers we already know scum has, especially given how SBell's role had negative EV and shouldn't even be considered a town power role.

If there are 5 scum there's at most one liar is in the power claims.
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in numbers. ~War13104
Never stoop to the level of idiots. They will drag you down and beat you with experience.
Leafeon13N posted...
If you are convinced ben is town you should be lynching blade, tbh.

Stop trying to make red scum for phantom reasons.
Can you elaborate?
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
PunishedBen posted...
Thats a bit of a copout. Game has to have a doctor and cop right? And why would scum claim it so early? Ulti has been hinting since day 1. Whose claims are you referring to when you say this?
This is a bad post. I made a post expressing doubt over the claims then continued to post analyzing things in more detail and came to the conclusion that the majority of the claims had to be real. It's cherry picking an older thing I said and already worked through to make me look bad.
We do not have much connection, you and I. Still, this encounter feels special. I hope you won't mind if I think of you as a friend.
PunishedBen posted...
Well now you know. Part of a reaction test and contingency plan for protecting myself. BP was the best thing I thought i could get away with with my flavor, but since Kirby didnt know the flavor at all I added that I would be able to flavor scan him too if he posted my poem. He posted it immediately, no questions asked.

While I did forget about the flavor scan part, honestly, I did find that part weird... because why would you need to flavor scan me if you trusted that I was town and openly claimed my flavor lol

That was 100% me just trusting you, and part of me figured some of it was BS. But in any case, if you're third-party, you clearly have no intention of scum siding, so if you need a leash, we got you lol

Still, if you're not actually Bulletproof, I'm not sure what your end goal would've been if you actually got shot and killed by scum. Which begets the question of why even do the reaction test in the first place when it'd have the chance of backfiring and sowing needless paranoia.

But I'll get off your back and let you do your thing. I am pretty damn certain you're not scum at the very least.
Kirby321 is 60% epicsauce, 40% epic failure
Soo... how was your day?
TotallyNotMI posted...
This is a bad post. I made a post expressing doubt over the claims then continued to post analyzing things in more detail and came to the conclusion that the majority of the claims had to be real. It's cherry picking an older thing I said and already worked through to make me look bad.
I was catching up through the posts I missed and saw that for the first time and thought to ask. I just saw this post, which I assume is what you're referring to unless there's more. I'll refrain from commenting till I read everything...

TotallyNotMI posted...
okay so we're at what 13 alive

scum has 3-4 left

If it's 3 we have 4 more mislynches before mylo
If it's 4 we have 3 more mislynches before mylo

so yeah I think logically it's best to let ulti/blade be? If Blade is scum (which I don't think anyway but), they can't kill Ulti. If Ulti is scum, they can't kill Blade and Ulti has to keep giving us scan results.

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
Kirby321 posted...
While I did forget about the flavor scan part, honestly, I did find that part weird... because why would you need to flavor scan me if you trusted that I was town and openly claimed my flavor lol

That was 100% me just trusting you, and part of me figured some of it was BS. But in any case, if you're third-party, you clearly have no intention of scum siding, so if you need a leash, we got you lol

Still, if you're not actually Bulletproof, I'm not sure what your end goal would've been if you actually got shot and killed by scum. Which begets the question of why even do the reaction test in the first place when it'd have the chance of backfiring and sowing needless paranoia.

But I'll get off your back and let you do your thing. I am pretty damn certain you're not scum at the very least.
If I got shot then it basically confirms all of my neighbors town because they shot me even though i said I was bulletproof.

It wasnt supposed to backfire if you all trusted me and didnt out it like you did lol. But it can only backfire on me at worst, and I can defend myself. Otherwise its a useful reaction test. And if I did neighbor scum then its a great way to either figure that out by their reaction or dissuade them from shooting me
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
PeaceFrog posted...
I feel like igcd content has really leaned heavily on his mechanic more than much else and suspect there's something nefarious at play there. A scan on him would have been nice by now but i understand we can't be getting scans on everyone, Ulti.
I'm not going to deny that I've hung back, but the best players are doing their thing, and I'm just along for the ride. Plus, when I get a gun tomorrow, I'll put some pressure on people.
All posters and events depicted in this post are entirely fictitious. Any similarity to actual events or posters, living or dead, is purely coincidental.
I'm just worried that there aren't gonna be many good targets left to shoot if the game goes on after today.
Kirby321 is 60% epicsauce, 40% epic failure
Soo... how was your day?
PunishedBen posted...
If I got shot then it basically confirms all of my neighbors town because they shot me even though i said I was bulletproof.

It wasnt supposed to backfire if you all trusted me and didnt out it like you did lol. But it can only backfire on me at worst, and I can defend myself. Otherwise its a useful reaction test. And if I did neighbor scum then its a great way to either figure that out by their reaction or dissuade them from shooting me

It still feels like doing too much. Did you forget that we're AHEAD?

I'm asking for base hits and you're trying to hit a home run. This is two games in a row now you've fake claimed bulletproof, and both times I fail to see the logic.

If any of your 3 dates were scum then you've removed yourself as a potential night kill, narrowing the pool of "good targets" for scum FOR them.

It's not AS egregious as your counterclaim BP in Toy Story, but it still feels like a negative expected value lie. Yeah it gives YOU more life, but it feels worse for town.

At best it's a poor town play, and at worst it's a selfish stay-alive tactic for some kind of exodia win condition.
~C~ FD
http://i.imgur.com/dGDfxaw.png
Kirby321 posted...
I'm just worried that there aren't gonna be many good targets left to shoot if the game goes on after today.
Why wouldn't the game go on after today
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in numbers. ~War13104
Never stoop to the level of idiots. They will drag you down and beat you with experience.
Tbh, I was just trying to think of the absolute best possible way to use Neighborizer as town. ....And my experimenting may have gone too far. I realize after your explanation how similar it feels to last game, but that was not my intention. >_>

I didnt see the downsides besides lying, but everyone knows I don't mind doing that
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
PunishedBen posted...
I didnt see the downsides besides lying

the downside is rather than trying to convince scum NOT to shoot you, you should have been trying to convince them TO shoot you. Then you're effectively a bodyguard in addition to neighborizer.

your little white lie should imply there's something about your role that you don't trust your neighbor enough to reveal, something they MAY be willing to kill you for, if they're scum.

Toss in a "I'll be keeping an eye on you, Chang/Kirby/Mzero" as one of your last posts of the day and it becomes clear upon your flip who you targeted that night, potentially correctly implicating them.

Or you could just keep pretending to be BP :shrug:
~C~ FD
http://i.imgur.com/dGDfxaw.png
Anyways, that's enough telling Ben how to use the role that might not even be town.

As for today, I think we should lynch from the vanilla pile. 6 vanilla (potentially 7 with ctes, potentially 8 with lopen) feels like a lot and Red > MI = Peaf > Death would be my current order, subject to additional reading. Death still had godfather fear so he's not completely ruled out (remind me to teach Ulti was "confirmed" means after this game), but that still puts him last vanilla lynched from a statistical standpoint.
~C~ FD
http://i.imgur.com/dGDfxaw.png
The thing is I was aiming to neighbor town, not scum. I was pretty certain all of the people I targeted post Chang claiming were town, so acting like I didn't trust them wasn't the angle, and I DID trust them. So potentially 100% confirming them by telling them all I was Bulletproof was a better use of my power.
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
I don't see how that confirms them.

You didn't get shot. They might be scum who BELIEVED you. Your upside is ambiguous at best.
~C~ FD
http://i.imgur.com/dGDfxaw.png
Well, that was only when I died, it would show that scum didn't know I was BP

So I WAS aiming to die this game! ....as long as i successfully kept neighboring town.
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
In that scenario you're dead.

Everyone you neighborized is supposed to come forward and say "whoa, I was SURE he was bulletproof! He made me speak the Latin and everything!"

And then everyone else was meant to take that to mean "yup they are full cleared because someone they thought was BP died"

And you didn't once consider the existence of a strongarm?

.

Forceful_Dragon posted...
Anyways, that's enough telling Ben how to use the role that might not even be town.

Just gonna take my own advice and stop again.
~C~ FD
http://i.imgur.com/dGDfxaw.png
Well I was expecting strongman to be used early in the game, and if I died that quickly then none of this would have mattered anyway, because yes I'd need at least two people alive after me to cooberate with each other that I told them I was bulletproof. And then the conclusion should be obvious from there.

And yes I would love to stop explaining myself too. Tomorrow hopefully I can refocus on talking about something other than me
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/26864890/
PunishedBen posted...
Can you elaborate?
No because its irrelevant now that you took back the bulletproof.

But kirby knows hes jk for sure, bp+doc+jk is too much protection. So if he thinks you are town and bp logically he should think blade is a dirty liar.
My first thought is to just let the claimed doc and cop all live and see what happens night4. We are ahead enough to allow this I think.
Violet IGN: Malta, Sword IGN: Pandora
Home: Pandorian/JBURSQAVTAGA
I cant say this logic wont fuck us but...

Its been assumed(I'm not quite sure why but since it has and no one has debated it i'm assuming its true) that scum has access to Lopen's flip. They are absolutely shooting like they fear extra protection.

So lets reasonably safely assume Lopen was not protection.

Scum fears protection exists, with several unclaims still out there blade claims protection(Doctor, not BG). Thats asking for a counterclaim with scum still I would argue down in this game.

I think its pretty safe to assume blade as town, especially with town trapped with roles designed to completely fuck us. If scum knew lopen was protection, they are pretty much shooting with impunity. But since they didn't we should assume they thought other protection existed and thus wouldn't fuck themselves with a protection claim.
"First thing that crosses my mind: I didn't get any GameFAQs Karma yesterday." Math Murderer after getting his appendix removed.
htaeD posted...
My first thought is to just let the claimed doc and cop all live and see what happens night4. We are ahead enough to allow this I think.
I don't think I necessarily trust the way Ulti has played at all but this may be accurate. The only way I see ulti as lying is if Lopen is cop and that is going to take a stretch on everyone's part. It is basically a situation where I think the proper play is "hunt that last if needed" as much as I'm sure everyone wants to make the hero play.
"First thing that crosses my mind: I didn't get any GameFAQs Karma yesterday." Math Murderer after getting his appendix removed.
I guess I have to defer here and I hate to ask this.

But does FD giving love or whatever provide a definitive flavor clear? Cause in a mafia sense its not alignment indicative but beyond that I couldn't comment.
"First thing that crosses my mind: I didn't get any GameFAQs Karma yesterday." Math Murderer after getting his appendix removed.
I think I am mostly in agreement the plan should be torch some vanillas. I think 4-5 would be reasonable and 6+ would be the host deciding they wanted to fuck town even harder.
"First thing that crosses my mind: I didn't get any GameFAQs Karma yesterday." Math Murderer after getting his appendix removed.
Also there is probably a sweet spot where killing Ulti and confirming his confirms is the right play. Quick math in my head says this is not it.
"First thing that crosses my mind: I didn't get any GameFAQs Karma yesterday." Math Murderer after getting his appendix removed.
Also I don't think I've missed it and ctes is unclaimed. He needs to either fill that box or tell us he has some form of game plan for not claiming.

I still instinctually do not trust people that are turned into no-vote status.
"First thing that crosses my mind: I didn't get any GameFAQs Karma yesterday." Math Murderer after getting his appendix removed.
Also I have no fear of ben being 3p.

If anyone is 3P it is still IGCD and it still isn't worth looking into.
"First thing that crosses my mind: I didn't get any GameFAQs Karma yesterday." Math Murderer after getting his appendix removed.
And I cant even begin to guess what the balancing should be in this game
Too many nillas, too few, too much protection, too much antitown power: all of it is just white noise.

Btw I still just think Peaf is scum anyway

Violet IGN: Malta, Sword IGN: Pandora
Home: Pandorian/JBURSQAVTAGA
Tho I will say that if anyone is Indy, flavorwise, it would be Pierce.
God I love that bastard.
Violet IGN: Malta, Sword IGN: Pandora
Home: Pandorian/JBURSQAVTAGA
red13n posted...
He needs to either fill that box or tell us he has some form of game plan for not claiming.

I definitely have some form of game plan for not claiming.
Guinness Book of World Records is the name of the diary that belongs to azuarc , the winner of the Game of the Decade II guru contest.
Tbh Red I was a bit surprised at how easy you claimed. For similar reasons you wanting this of all people is a bit weird.
Guinness Book of World Records is the name of the diary that belongs to azuarc , the winner of the Game of the Decade II guru contest.
PunishedBen posted...
Ulti has been hinting since day 1.

When day 1?
Guinness Book of World Records is the name of the diary that belongs to azuarc , the winner of the Game of the Decade II guru contest.
Also Ben why did you never neighbor me? I am curious.
Violet IGN: Malta, Sword IGN: Pandora
Home: Pandorian/JBURSQAVTAGA
ctesjbuvf posted...
Tbh Red I was a bit surprised at how easy you claimed. For similar reasons you wanting this of all people is a bit weird.
Never that easy. But I to go over in my head if I have potential plays up my sleeve if I don't and I couldn't come up with any.
"First thing that crosses my mind: I didn't get any GameFAQs Karma yesterday." Math Murderer after getting his appendix removed.
I had some potential cards rolling around in my head to play yesterday if need be.

Today it likely would have just left me unable to talk as openly about the setup.
ctesjbuvf posted...
I definitely have some form of game plan for not claiming.
The payoff for this better be good.
Let's see

Ctes is town
Chang is town
Kirby is town

Then other players. Don't think too much about order listed.

Ulti is town unless he is claiming Lopen's role. I have not yet gone back to try to read up on d1. Unless something very concrete is presented, I don't think it makes sense to consider too much today, but the SBell scan sure is weird considered he was Ulti's town soul read.

Death is town unless specifically godfather. I think this holds regardless of Ulti'a alignment. If he snuck a teammate in there it would be that role. It's definitely possible.

FD is town unless his role can somehow switch into the evil version of the charcater (I don't know the flavor well).

Blade is probably town, for all the interactions and stuff. I have kept him in the poe because I respect his scumgame and because of a few posts that didn't feel like they were made in good faith, but I don't see it anymore. It helps that doctor checks out with play and he has saved exactly who I would have guessed was shot at as well.

Based on play Ben still feels more towny than not to me. I think his thoughts come more from a town perspective.

MZero should still be town based on Taco and Wallz.

I have been a bit back and fourth about IGCD tbh. I think he feels more towny than not, but I wouldn't lock it in.

Finally the vanillas:

Red
Peaf
MI

While looking at Ulti's d1 still isn't a bad idea, it's probably fine today to consider vanillas? Kirby still didn't claim his JK right? Otherwise I still think based on Wallz interactions, Peaf is the best lynch.
Guinness Book of World Records is the name of the diary that belongs to azuarc , the winner of the Game of the Decade II guru contest.
Kirby321 posted...
I'm just worried that there aren't gonna be many good targets left to shoot if the game goes on after today.
If there aren't good targets left then that means we've won.
All posters and events depicted in this post are entirely fictitious. Any similarity to actual events or posters, living or dead, is purely coincidental.
Post #98 was unavailable or deleted.
UltimaterializerX posted...
##Unvote
##Vote: Ben

Its a role meta angle, but I do think this is correct.
My only issue with Ben being scum is that he and Sultan have the ability to absolutely blow up my scumdar with one post when they are not town, and I have not had that with him this game.
All posters and events depicted in this post are entirely fictitious. Any similarity to actual events or posters, living or dead, is purely coincidental.
ctesjbuvf posted...
While looking at Ulti's d1 still isn't a bad idea, it's probably fine today to consider vanillas? Kirby still didn't claim his JK right? Otherwise I still think based on Wallz interactions, Peaf is the best lynch.
Can you please elaborate on "wallz interactions"? From my pov that's pretty vague and since i know it gets you to the wrong answer I'd love to help explain any of my past posts and tell you where i was coming from at the time.
~Peaf~
Board 8 » Community Mafia Topic 11 - Ancient B8 Mafia History (2009-2011)
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