Lurker > hyperpsycho

I said this in the deleted topic but the priest here looks like Carl from Aqua Teen Hunger Force:

https://www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=0070
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hockeybub89 posted...

"We can make conservative Christians accept us if we suppress who we are to please a God who put us in this awful position"

That's kind of what it feels like to me. I don't get this subculture at all.
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I cant deny that however friendly and relatable the B Siders were, they would occasionally say things that made me cringe. Even Julie Rodgers, the sort of down to earth lesbian bro Id love to have for a friend, made me self-conscious as she explained the misconceptions of traditional Christians about gay people, leading me to consider whether I might be considered just a little lustful and hypersexual. However, each one of the B Siders I interacted with also related stories from their past that spoke to the larger LGBTQ experience. Matt Jones talked about how he was unable to come out prior to working at an orphanage in South America, and later losing an internship after his pastor encouraged him to come out to his parish council. Joseph Prever told me how, for years, hed felt nervous and inadequate around other men, unable to become friends with them because of his discomfort with his homosexuality. Julie Rodgers and I talked about how the constant need to curb any subtly masculine mannerisms had left her feeling disconnected and unloved, as if she could never be accepted as she was. Make no mistakecelibate or not, these people are a part of the LGBTQ community. They share the same fears we do, experience the same stigma, and have felt the same tension, between hiding and safety on one side and openness and self-acceptance on the other, that defines the LGBTQ experience in 21st-century America.

Theres a sense that the fight over marriage has significantly polarized the discussion. Those on Side B are isolated, without a real home in the Christian community or in the secular LGBT community, Ron Belgau told me. He talked about the difficulties hed had socializing with gay co-workers, because of their assumptions that he was immature and just needed to get over his religious convictions and really come out already.

On a similar note, Joe Prever told me, Im much more at ease talking to other Catholics about how Im gay than I am talking to other gays about how Im Catholic. I get a little bit insecure that people will see me as some sort of stunted individual, or oppressed by the Church in some way.

Asked how the LGBTQ community could be more welcoming, Matt Jones told me, The least that could happen is to stop saying that I am a self-hating homosexual. I get a little tired of that. Im open with my sexualityIm not ashamed.

Are B Siders ashamed? Are they needlessly denying themselves full participation in adult life? Even if they are, theyve heard all these judgments before, and theyre no more likely to change their religious views than I am to divorce my wife. I think people for whom religion is not a daily part of life dont understand that, for someone like me, religion is not separable from life, its kind of what life is, was how Joe Prever put it. Julie Rodgers said, My convictions about how I am expected to honor God are as integral to who I am as being gay is. If that sounds odd, so be it. But while no one should be expected to extend tolerance to someone who is bigoted or intolerant, theres no need to assume that this particular brand of oddness carries with it any hostility or enmity to the mainstream LGBTQ community. Weve fought for the recognition of our own diversitylets not make any unnecessary rules to limit it.

This is one weird article. I'm not sure what to think of it. I'm probably giving this subculture of LGBTQ Christians more attention than they deserve.
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A celibate lifestyle falls pretty far outside the mainstream for most Americans, but theres a lot in the Side B blogosphere that can stimulate fruitful reflection for those of us beyond its borders. They tackle issues like: How are people who remain unpartnered to fill their human need for intimacy and connection? How can we foster community and connection in a modern world that grows ever more alienating and complex? Why has friendship become so devaluedand whoever said that true intimacy could only be found in the context of a romantic relationship, anyway? If youve ever pondered these sorts of questions (and I certainly have), then there are worse places to go looking for thoughtful discussion of them than the blogs of celibate LGBTQ Christians.

As I grew more familiar with the Side B community, I felt my sympathy for them growing. I genuinely enjoyed Ron Belgaus honesty, his humor, and the thought he put into answering my questions. While speaking with Julie Rodgers and Matt Jones, two contributors to Spiritual Friendship, I was won over by their distinct, exuberant humanity. It began to seem inexcusable to me that theyd catch flak in their blogs comments from mainstream LGBTQ folks accusing them of being traitors or self-hating homophobes. But then, led by a reference in Julies blog, I came across the writing of someone Ill call Rose Brattleworth, an ex-gay Christian author, and I got it.

The site talked about Rose having once been a feminist lesbian in a committed partnership with another woman, before having been moved to convert to Christianity. The story ends with how shes now happily married to a (male) pastor, with some number of homeschooled childrenand, somehow, theres not a word about what happened to the lesbian partner. In this sort of Christian ex-gay narrative, a former life partner can be erased, made unimportant, except as an example of past sins. I found it impossible not to take it personally. The thought that this so-called Christian love could lead me to reject my wife, that this love could somehow be pure or true or rightor even that anyone would ask me to accept such a thought uncriticallyovercame my objectivity completely. I remembered articles, such as this one by Catholic Side B blogger Joseph Prever, which suggested that non-celibate gays were like children who ate sand, or this one by Eve Tushnet, arguing against gay marriage, and I was filled with a desire to argue and confront the B Siders, to force them to choose sides and reveal themselves as enemies of queer people.

But, of course, none of the people Id spoken with had suggested that I leave my wife. They hadnt condemned me or attempted to convert mein fact, several had gone out of their way to explain that they werent trying to judge others or convince anyone to follow their belief system. My previous experiences with Christian condemnation of gay people, had jumped ahead, filling in the gaps, lodging in my throat and making it hard to treat these people as individuals and really listen to what each of them was telling me. If I know anything, its that Im not a perfect celestial being made of love. I am a human, and I feel things. And, some of the things I felt as I engaged with celibate gay Christians were anger and fear relating to the many times the public face of Christianity has aligned itself with bigotry and oppression. If all that happened to me, writing this story, how can I expect more of my gay readers, or of the larger LGBTQ community?

And yet, I do.

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https://slate.com/human-interest/2014/07/celibate-lgbtq-christians-the-mainstream-gay-community-should-be-more-welcoming.html

Far from the mainstream LGBTQ experience of pride parades and marriages, Outward and the Advocate, there exists a small, tight-knit group of LGBTQ people who, though fully out, remain committed to conservative Christian prohibitions on gay sexual activity. While some refer to themselves as SSA or same-sex attracted as a means of distancing themselves from queer identities, others proudly use the LGBT or LGBTQ initialisms that highlight their connection to the wider community. This latter group, in straddling one of Americas deepest cultural divides, present a challenge to the tolerance of both their churches and the secular LGBTQ community.

Celibate LGBTQ Christian bloggers often refer to themselves in shorthand as Side B Christians. The terms Side A, for those who support marriage equality and believe that gay sex is not necessarily immoral, and Side B, for those who believe that homosexual sex is sinful and/or prohibited by the Bible, originated with a now-defunct website called Bridges Across the Divide and was created to foster respectful communication between people on opposite sides of the gay rights debate. Side B gay Christians are, by definition, committed to remaining celibate, while those on Side A can date and marry. LGBTQ people on Side A also tend to fit reasonably well inside the secular LGBTQ community. B Siders, on the other hand, can be a pretty isolated lotwhile they may have friends who are secular and devout, gay, straight, and bi, they remain on the fringes in both the Christian and the LGBTQ world.

All the B Siders I talked to were eager to combat the widespread view of celibacy as necessarily leading to a life of unending loneliness and isolation. In fact, many of the discussions they have among themselves have moved past the question of whether and why to remain celibate and on to how one can do so and still live a fulfilling life. This more practical, positive focus is intended to address something they believe has long been lacking in the mostly negative messages that their faith communities have long presented to LGBTQ people.

In fact, the B siders I spoke with were quick to offer critiques of homophobia within Christian communities, which surprised me, considering that theyd organized their lives around adhering to their rules. Ron Belgau, who co-founded the Spiritual Friendship blog to address the question of how celibate LGBT people can find intimacy and connection within Christian communities, summed up their frustrations by saying: Most of [the Roman Catholic Churchs] thinking is no you cant have sex; no you cant go into the priesthoodthey shut various doors, but theres a need to talk about, OK, no we cant have sex but what can we do? How can we serve the church? Eve Tushnet, another B sider I spoke with, is writing a book to address this same conundrum. For her, the most important issue is not rule-following but the question of how do you lead a good, fruitful life within a Catholic tradition [and] increase the tenderness and beauty in the world?

For those of us with a more secular mindset, this might seem like a strange point to advocate so passionately forbut in the context of a silencing, closed, homophobic church culture, these Side B voices and the challenges they present may reach conservative communities that would shut out any other sorts of LGBTQ voices. That is Belgaus view. I think trying to shift the conversation away on Christian terms has had a significant impact. A strident gay rights voice would not be heard by the Christian right, where remaining within Christian traditions can, he told me.

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DuranOfForcena posted...

EggNogPrince posted...

That is fucked up he dodged a hate crime charge. The whole reason he killed her was because he found out he was hitting on a trans woman.

i'm not defending what the guy did, but it is absolutely the right charge. you don't have to hate transgenders in order to not want to date or flirt with one. and he clearly did not intend on killing her, that's why they went for a manslaughter charge and not a murder charge.

FUCK YOU.
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inloveanddeath0 posted...

TeaMilk posted...

DarkRoast posted...

So glad I'm lesbian

What does this have to do with the topic I don't follow

She hates straight white men

The hate is justified.
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https://www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=0076

RIP Charlies Connors. He died too soon.
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No idea.
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Garioshi posted...

It's fucking disgusting.

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CommonJoe posted...

Fuck them both.

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https://www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=1077

@SmidgeIsntBack
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Only reason I'd go see it is because Eric Andre is in it.
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Cops like you are the reason people hate cops.
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.
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Lyrica posted...

I'm interested

You mean the general, the discord, or both?
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Oh ok so it was just the LGBT board. I thought there was another one for a minute there
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Graveler is decent.
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AlisLandale posted...

Is this just because of his username?

Because if so thats kinda lame

He made a pretty tasteless joke in a topic about Duncanwii's mom. He apologized.
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Damn_Underscore posted...

I think people say Jesus is a socialist based on the verse Paying the Imperial Tax to Caesar

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+22&version=NIV

Which I don't know how you can interpret that as pro-socialist if you actually read the verse, but whatever.

I thought it was the story about the rich man and Lazarus and the rich man who couldn't sell his possessions.
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Any and all shitting on Mako is deserved my guy. Edgy topic or not.
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MarqueeSeries posted...

averagejoel posted...

no, and I have a very negative opinion of anyone who does

This

Anyone who has a positive overall opinion of the police is obviously not part of a group that's marginalized by them, and has no sympathy for those that are

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Metua posted...

The LGBT board is public now, but it's also straight-up dead.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/841-lgbt

Cool, but I know about that board. I was interested in the board RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk mentioned that was mosy gay men.
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I'l like to join the gay board if it's still around and if they let in bi dudes.
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Funkydog posted...

I completely forgot to join the discord when invited as rarely ever use discord. Maybe one day I will try and start using it proper.

One day.

The invite would have expired by now but I can give it to you again if you want.
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RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

It was a division after a lot of gay males realized there was a board that catered to them so the general was just women mostly.

Which board was that?
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@Wetterdew @GameofWheels do you use Discord?
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AlisLandale posted...

Dragonblade01 posted...

Chick tracts are great.

The baphomet and kali tracks traumatized me as a kid. Literally at the start of when my OCD started to kick in. My brain started associating chocolate milk with baphomet titties, made breakfast a pain <_<

https://www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=0070

Ooh, this one scared me too. Now I just laugh because the priest kind of looks like Carl from ATHF.

"Hey, Fryman, I got a demon you can cast out right here! Ha ha ha TONIGHT!"
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Ryuko_Chan posted...

Wetterdew posted...

I'm so tired of whiny people on gamefaqs complaining about calls for gay/minority representation.

same

I am too. I've been sick of it since day one.
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GameofWheels posted...

i need a man but people annoy me nowadays. the last connection i felt with someone romantically was my uber driver but I forgot to get his number cause Im an idiot.

Sorry to hear. Hope things get better.
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MasterGakke posted...

Jack Chick tracts are the height of comedy. I had close to a complete set growing up thanks to a nutbag mall church leaving them EVERYWHERE, but I lost them over the years and that mall is a WalMart now.

When I become god emperor of the world and kill all the evangelicals Chick Publications will be spared.
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https://www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=0076

Please accept Jesus into your life.
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I just want an animated adaptation of Beautiful Darkness. Is that too much to ask?
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How did the LGBT generals die but there's a DSP general and 20+ boogie topics a day lol
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Plenty of Christians divorce.
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Any LGBTQ+ CEmen/CEgals interested in a discord?
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I remember hearing about this movie. Still need to see it.
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https://imgur.com/gallery/bCqRp
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ultimate reaver posted...

hyperpsycho posted...

He said the party was merely reacting to what it considered to be activists efforts to enforce their views on heterosexual people.

It's not in vogue anymore to go full-on "GAYS ARE AN ABOMINATION" anymore except in very very shitty places

Yep. So they have to use dog whistles.
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Local Law and Justice councillor Piotr Kisiel, 37, rejected accusations that his party was trying to stir up outrage against gay individuals.

He said the party was merely reacting to what it considered to be activists efforts to enforce their views on heterosexual people.

You hear homophobes here in the States say the same bs.
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Fuck "family values"
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The Reagan years were awful for anyone who wasn't white and straight.
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pegusus123456 posted...

Fuck anyone who condones gay conversion therapy.

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Good on Amazon for banning the sale of these books. If they ban the sale of anti-vax books than this garbage has got to go too since it kills people too.
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https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/qv7yqq/amazon-gay-conversion-therapy

A group of House Republicans is urging its members to pressure Amazon to resume selling a set of controversial gay conversion therapy books, after the platform announced this month it would no longer carry works by the father of conversion therapy.

The Republican Study Committee, a conservative caucus that includes more than 70% of all GOP House members, issued a handout during a private meeting in the Capitol Wednesday asking members to contact Amazon with concerns about what they referred to as Amazon censorship.

Amazon removed books by Dr. Joseph Nicolosi, a clinical psychologist who is credited with originating gay conversion therapy, a debunked and in some cases illegal pseudoscientific method of trying to turn gay people straight.

Nonetheless, the Republicans want to lobby to get his books such as A Parent's Guide to Preventing Homosexuality and Reparative Therapy of Male Homosexuality back in circulation.

In recent days, Amazon has banned the sale of several books addressing unwanted same-sex attraction, according to the handout, obtained by VICE News. Catholic psychologist, author and therapist Dr. Joseph Nicolosi (deceased) penned multiple books to assist men struggling with unwanted homosexual attractions, feelings and lifestyles.

These books were available on Amazon until an LGBT activist repeatedly petitioned Amazon to remove the homophobic books from the companys website. Amazon removed Dr. Nicolosis books and those of several other authors on similar topics, the document continues. It is not clear that any of the banned books have violated an Amazon policy, but rather that the company is choosing to censor speech.

The handout was issued a day after representatives from Amazon, Facebook, Google and Apple were grilled about antitrust issues in a House committee hearing. Separately, the effort to pressure Amazon would open a new front in Republicans years-long fight with tech companies, which they claim censor conservative viewpoints.

When the Amazon decision was first reported, the company confirmed to news outlets the books were removed because they violate Amazons content guidelines. Conservative media outlets heavily covered the decision as another instance of censorship.

Republicans: "Companies shouldn't be forced to do things that go against their principles!"
Also Republicans: "Amazon should be forced to sell unscientific and harmful books!"
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