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| Topic | Are you satisfied with the verdict in the chauvin trial? |
| Lirishae 04/22/21 9:20:09 AM #84 | wolfy42 posted... I don't think he would commit murder on purpose while being witnessed by other cops and citizens (including kids). I could be wrong, but I highly doubt it.You should have stopped at "I could be wrong," because you are. This happens literally all the fucking time, especially to brown and black people. Cops are rarely indicted for murder and even more rarely convicted, even when there's video proof of guilt. American police kill over a thousand civilians a year, many of them innocent, fleeing, or only guilty of misdemeanors. The willful ignorance of people like you helps perpetuate this system. https://tinyurl.com/3x3f76hh https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/04/20/chauvin-police-officer/ wolfy42 posted... Obviously the jury thinks he did, and there may be information I don't have.You have more information available to you than the jury, because the judge strictly limits what is allowed to evidence. But you're stubbornly clinging to incredibly naive and downright ignorant views in defiance of facts and reality. I hate to break it to you, but the world is not as nice and fair as you seem to want to believe it is. wolfy42 posted... To be convicted of murder he has to have had intent to kill, and the jury believes he did.It's first degree murder that requires proving intent to kill. Second degree murder is not premeditated. wolfy42 posted... I refute the idea that Chavin actually tried to murder George, he was having a lark kneeling on him, but still thought he was ok, when he found out he wasn't the dude didn't realize how serious it was,....Are you fucking serious??? This was not some frat boy hazing incident gone terribly wrong. Derek Chauvin purposefully applied lethal force against a non-resisting victim in defiance of police protocol. George Floyd said over 20 times he couldn't breathe. Derek Chauvin continued cutting off his oxygen. Bystanders pleaded with Chauvin to stop. Chauvin didn't stop. Eventually, George Floyd no longer had a pulse. Even when he no longer had a pulse, Chauvin continued depriving him of oxygen for over two minutes. There is no way that Derek Chauvin thought George Floyd was okay despite not being able to breathe and not having a pulse. There is no way it was an accident. wolfy42 posted... even the prosecution and the jury didn't think it rose to first degree murder.The jury doesn't make the decision what charges are brought. The only reason he wasn't charged with murder one was because he's a cop, and it's extremely difficult to indict a cop, let alone convict one. So the prosecutors went for lesser charges to make it easier to convict him. wolfy42 posted... If I was his defense attorney I would state that either my client was insane as he committed murder in front of witnesses and while being filmed and laughed while doing soIt's a good thing you're not a defense attorney, because you have no fucking clue what you're talking about. An insanity defense requires a diagnosis of a mental health disorder that would render someone incapable of distinguishing reality from fantasy and right or wrong. It's not "you'd have to be crazy to do that!" It's crazy like if I ask you what you'd like to wear today and you reply telling me about the Christmas party you had with the queen of the ants. wolfy42 posted... he did not know that he was endangering George's life,Yeah, who knew that not being able to breathe can kill someone? /sarcasm --- "Little scratches on people's hearts will be gone if they pat them from behind, but the humans don't know that." -Li'l Cactus 3DS FC: 0619-3174-3155 |
| Topic | Are you satisfied with the verdict in the chauvin trial? |
| Lirishae 04/22/21 4:51:11 AM #80 | wolfy42 posted... It's a tricky situation actually and not as cut and dry as it may seem to some.There are not, in fact, two sides to everything. When you're talking about abusers or systematic oppression, not taking the side of the victim enables the abuser/oppressor. Abusers/oppressors are quite happy that you only see gray when you look at what should be a black & white situation, because gray is a huge improvement from black. And that ensures that they will maintain the status quo where they win at the expense of their victims. wolfy42 posted... He was in an official capacityWhich makes things worse, not better. When police take someone into custody, they are legally and morally responsible for that person's well-being. wolfy42 posted... but acted against his training and directly put someone's life in danger.He didn't "put someone's life in danger." That would only be the case if George Floyd survived with severe/critical injuries. He was straight up MURDERED while bystanders pleaded with Chauvin to stop, but he continued even when George no longer had a pulse. wolfy42 posted... Anyway how much time he deserves is kinda hard to really pin down, the dude was smiling and laughing while kneeling on his neckWhat you just described is the behavior of a sociopath. They lack the part of the brain that controls empathy, which affects much more than just compassion; it reduces their ability to relate to others. Because of that, they aren't affected by social cues that would cause others to modify their behavior (fear of reputation loss, defying authority, etc.) Even though people with empathy are capable of murdering in self-defense or for personal gain, they possess the empathy to relate to the victim and very often find it to be a traumatic experience, even if they hate the person. Someone with empathy won't murder for the sake of murder, at the very least out of fear for societal consequences (going to jail, etc.). Someone who can murder a human being in broad daylight, in front of a crowd, knowing they are being recorded, and smile and giggle while doing it, is a danger to society. We currently do not have the means to treat these people; in fact, treatment tends to make them worse instead of better. Chauvin should be behind bars for the rest of his life. wolfy42 posted... you have people who straight up walk up to someone and blow their brains out, they only get 5 yearsI tried to Google this but couldn't turn up anything. Even if true, two wrongs don't make a right, or do you just believe honestly that human life is that cheap? wolfy42 posted... so yeah, giving the dude 20+ years seems pretty harsh considering he was doing a job that did give him some expectation of being able to do what he did (even if he did it wrong and endangered George's life etc)So much wrong in so few words. Again, George Floyd's life wasn't just endangered; he DIED because he was murdered. He didn't die because Chauvin made a mistake while following police protocol. He died because Chauvin purposely cut off his oxygen for NINE minutes. Around two minutes with no oxygen is loss of consciousness, four minutes is permanent brain damage, five minutes and beyond is death. And Chauvin maintained his position for NINE MINUTES, long after he had no pulse, and never summoned medical assistance. If it was an accident, why didn't Chauvin stop after any of the 20+ times George Floyd said he couldn't breathe? Why didn't he stop when the bystanders pleaded with him to stop? Why didn't he stop when he had no pulse? You don't "accidentally" cut off someone's oxygen for nine minutes. And no, his job absolutely did not give him the expectation that he could do what he did; it was only permitted very briefly to subdue a resisting, thrashing suspect, and was supposed to be stopped as soon as the suspect quit resisting. George Floyd did not resist; Chauvin's lawyer laughably tried to argue that Floyd saying "I can't breathe" was resisting arrest because video clearly showed that he did not resist. --- "Little scratches on people's hearts will be gone if they pat them from behind, but the humans don't know that." -Li'l Cactus 3DS FC: 0619-3174-3155 |
| Topic | SHOCKER!! George Floyd's FRIEND who was in the CAR with him will NOT TESTIFY!!! |
| Lirishae 04/05/21 5:23:28 AM #44 | Mead posted... How many more minutes did the cop need to kneel down on the dying/dead man in order for some of yall to see this as murder?Nine minutes was already massive overkill. For the uninformed, people generally pass out around two minutes without oxygen. Four minutes without oxygen leads to permanent brain damage. Five to six minutes without oxygen is death. --- "Little scratches on people's hearts will be gone if they pat them from behind, but the humans don't know that." -Li'l Cactus 3DS FC: 0619-3174-3155 |
| Topic | Should police have qualified immunity for setting people on fire? |
| Lirishae 03/20/21 4:58:53 AM #22 | Zeus posted... Qualified immunity is largely what gives them that latitude to operate. They couldn't f***ing operate without qualified immunity. Take that away and then when anybody got injured during an arrest -- which most people who resist arrest will do because physical force becomes necessary -- the cops would have pretty f***ing major problems, so literally all you'd have to do to not be arrested is resist arrest. As for the question of rampant lawsuits, American society wasn't nearly so sue-happy in the f***ing 60s and courts were less likely to find fault. America's lawsuit culture is f***ing insane now.I can see you didn't read any of the links I posted where this argument is eviscerated. You are assuming that police treat everyone the way they treat middle class white people, which is simply untrue. Poor people and minorities, especially black Americans, have a completely different experience with police that you refuse to see. You're suggesting that we can't question excessive use of force by the police because police won't be able to use any force, which is laughable. And while America does have a problem with nuisance lawsuits used to intimidate and harass little people into silence, your specific invocation of the 60s leads me to believe you meant something else entirely by that statement. Zeus posted... And cops don't act like Judge Dredd now, considering that that even armed violent offenders usually get taken into custody alive.You say that, but where's your proof? Police kill a thousand American civilians per year, many of them innocent, fleeing, or only guilty of misdemeanors. But hey, you don't have to take it on my say-so; check out Reason.com, where you can find right-wing authors chronicling massive police abuses. Not only do police kill many innocent civilians, they steal more from innocent civilians each year via civil asset forfeiture than actual robbers do. Zeus posted... ...what? I don't even know where to start with all of that idiotic trolling. Doubly so considering that a British officer is IN THE f***ING NEWS RIGHT NOW FOR MURDER which has led to a lot of anti-police discussion over there. Which is only the start of your misleading and outright false claims which disingenuously compare two very different populations. After all, when British police break into a home, they're very unlikely to get shot at because guns are all but outlawed. Compare that to the US where cops get shot during routine traffic stops. The fact that a police officer murdering someone is a big deal in the UK just goes to show how fundamentally different things are over there. You claim that the US is different, but Germany has one of the highest rates of gun ownership in the world, yet German police do not kill anywhere near as many people per capita compared to the US. This is another thing you would have known if you read my links. You know what the difference between Amerca and Germany is? https://germanculture.com.ua/daily/gun-laws-in-germany/ Yep, you just made an argument for gun control all by yourself. Zeus posted... https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/27/us/virginia-officer-shot/index.html Oh, please. Policing doesn't even make the top twenty for most dangerous occupations in America. You're far more likely to die on the job as a truck driver than you are as a police officer. Additionally, according to FBI data, most officers who die on duty perish in auto accidents rather than being attacked/shot. https://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/fbi-releases-2019-statistics-on-law-enforcement-officers-killed-in-the-line-of-duty Zeus posted... You suggested that cops deliberately set a guy on fire for the lulz. Don't f***ing move the goalposts. That's the kind of s*** where I made that kind of a complete bulls***, trollish claim I'd be warned and I would accept the moderation on the spot because that's 100% wrong to do. And you know it, too, which is why you chose to post that on an alt with a grand total of 15 AMP where a good chunk of your activity has been this topic.Uhh, this has been my only account since 2005. I suggested that they showed a callous indifference toward human life and supported my claim with statistics and news articles. It only seems like trolling to you because it challenges the right-wing orthodoxy you uncritically believe. --- "Little scratches on people's hearts will be gone if they pat them from behind, but the humans don't know that." -Li'l Cactus 3DS FC: 0619-3174-3155 |
| Topic | Should police have qualified immunity for setting people on fire? |
| Lirishae 03/18/21 1:33:49 AM #18 | Zeus posted... Generally police have to make split-second decisions with life or death outcomes. Had he set himself on fire, they STILL would have faced criticism. Police are routinely put into no-win situations.You're arguing that only cops can criticize cops? This is like saying you have to be a movie director before you can criticize a film. You do not need to be a cop to look at the info from other countries and realize that American cops are far more brutal and deadly than any other first world country. https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/08/us/us-police-floyd-protests-country-comparisons-intl/index.html https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jun/09/the-counted-police-killings-us-vs-other-countries https://vitals.lifehacker.com/how-police-brutality-in-the-u-s-compares-to-other-coun-1843955090 Zeus posted... ...what? Every nation on the planet has situations where police wind up hurting or killing suspects, and most nations have some form of qualified immunity (or stronger). Go troll somebody else.You know how many people American cops killed in 2017? A thousand. You know how many people British cops killed in 2017? Six. In other first world countries, there's generally an independent organization that investigates police misbehavior. In the US, police generally investigate themselves and rarely have charges brought against them. Cops can do their jobs without being above the law. Zeus posted... >Asks "...You seriously believe that"Oh you sweet summer child, you. Where have you been? News stories about police showing callous indifference toward human life are all over the freaking place. US police kill over a thousand people each year and injure many more. If you can't care about human life, you should at least care about the billions of taxpayer dollars that municipalities pay to settle wrongful death and injury cases. Here's a story where cops shot a woman and prevented her from receiving first aid: https://reason.com/2015/07/15/cops-shot-unarmed-georgia-woman-in-the-h/ Here's a cop who shot a woman to get a paid vacation. Note that "shooting to incapacitate" someone is a Hollywood myth; your legs are covered in arteries and you can bleed to death in minutes https://reason.com/2018/08/08/officer-placed-on-paid-leave/ Police shoot a 12 year old boy in his bed: https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/08/chicago-illinois-police-shot-12-year-old-black-boy-in-bed-kneecap.html This is just the tip of the iceberg; there are tons more stories like these. And don't come back at me about these being a "few bad apples," because you know what the rest of that saying is? "A few bad apples spoil the barrel." You can't live in 2021 and seriously believe that the US police system isn't fundamentally broken. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2015/05/11/the-increasing-isolation-of-americas-police/ --- "Little scratches on people's hearts will be gone if they pat them from behind, but the humans don't know that." -Li'l Cactus 3DS FC: 0619-3174-3155 |
| Topic | Should police have qualified immunity for setting people on fire? |
| Lirishae 03/17/21 6:17:34 AM #7 | Zeus posted... Which is basically saying "police shouldn't be a thing, period" because it's damn near impossible for them to operate in any meaningful capacity without qualified immunity.Maybe if they didn't kill and injure thousands of civilians every year they might be able to function without it. The police in other countries seem to be able to carry out their jobs without killing and maiming thousands of people. Zeus posted... They were trying to subdue him before he could set himself on fire, not realizing that the tasers would set him aflame....You seriously believe that? For real? How about, they knew and they just didn't care because cops in the US literally get away with murder all the fucking time. --- "Little scratches on people's hearts will be gone if they pat them from behind, but the humans don't know that." -Li'l Cactus 3DS FC: 0619-3174-3155 |
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