Board 8 > Scarlet Ranks 150 User-Nominated Wrestlers Part II

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scarletspeed7
05/11/18 11:00:54 AM
#1:


Rankings So Far:

150. Jenna Morasca
149. Ashley Massaro
148. The Great Khali
147. Krissy Vaine
146. The Final Solution
145. Rhaka Khan
144. Dave Crist
143. Rosa Mendes
142. Jackie Gayda
141. Matt Taven
140. Jinder Mahal
139. Heidenreich
138. Bryan Alvarez
137. Enzo Amore
136. Dan Matha
135. The Boogeyman
134. Vladimir Kozlov
133. Santino Marella
132. Glacier
131. Muhammad Hassan
130. Torrie Wilson
129. James Ellsworth
128. Nikki Bella
127. Jay White
126. The Shockmaster
125. Hornswoggle
124. Kevin Sullivan
123. Steve Blackman
122. Barry Darsow
121. Taylor Wilde
120. Ronda Rousey
119. Bob Holly
118. Chris Kanyon
117. Vickie Guerrero
116. Chase Owens
115. Disco Inferno
114. Sasha Banks
113. MVP
112. Buff Bagwell
111. The Big Boss Man
110. Heath Slater
109. Scott Norton
108. Charlotte Flair
107. Timothy Thatcher
106. Rich Swann
105. Goldust
104. Matt Sydal
103. Kane
102. Bayley
101. Tommaso Ciampa
100. Tyler Bate
99. Taichi
98. Mark Henry
97. Terry Gordy
96. Booker T
95. Vampiro
94. Ron Simmons
93. Dusty Rhodes
92. Dynamite Kid
91. Road Warrior Hawk
90. Raven
89. Alex Wright
88. SANADA
87. WALTER
86. Lou Thesz
85. Hirooki Goto
84. Chuck Taylor
83. Juice Robinson
82. Andre the Giant
81. Maria Kanellis
80. Hayabusa
79. Josh Mathews
78. Jacques Rougeau
77. Toru Yano
76. Triple H
75. Braun Strowman
74. Kevin Nash
73. Sid Vicious
72. EVIL
71. Perry Saturn
70. Daffney

Remaining Wrestlers:

Adrian Neville
AJ Lee
AJ Styles
Arn Anderson
Asuka
Awesome Kong
Becky Lynch
Big Show
Billy Graham
Bobby Heenan
Bret Hart
Brian Pillman
Brock Lesnar
Bruiser Brody
Chavo Guerrero
Chris Jericho
CM Punk
Dan Lambert
Daniel Bryan
Dave Meltzer
Dean Malenko
Diamond Dallas Page
Eddie Guerrero
Edge
Eric Bischoff
Ethan Carter III
Finn Balor
Hiromu Takahashi
Hiroshi Tanahashi
Hulk Hogan
Hurricane
Jake Roberts
Jeff Hardy
Jesse Ventura
John Cena
Jushin Liger
Kairi Sane
Kazuchika Okada
Kenny Omega
Kota Ibushi
Kurt Angle
KUSHIDA
Lex Luger
Matt Hardy
Mick Foley
Mickie James
Minoru Suzuki
Mister Perfect
Miz
Naomichi Marufuji
Pentagon
Randy Savage
Rey Mysterio
Ric Flair
Roderick Strong
Scott Steiner
Seth Rollins
Shawn Michaels
Shinsuke Nakamura
Steve Austin
Ted DiBiase
Terry Funk
Tetsuya Naito
Tomohiro Ishii
Trish Stratus
Ultimo Dragon
Undertaker
Will Ospreay
William Regal

The Remaining Nominations by User:
Anagram - 2
charon - 2
CybrMonkey - 8
Eddv - 3
Girugamesh - 2
GOGZero - 2
gravy - 1
IHateThisCPU - 1
Inviso - 6
Johnbobb - 5
JONA - 6
Lopen - 4
Mega Mana - 4
NFUN - 1
paulg - 2
Preston - 1
Snake - 4
Tom Bombadil - 4
trdl - 2
voltch - 3
ZeroSignal - 6
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scarletspeed7
05/11/18 11:14:52 AM
#2:


#69 - Awesome Kong Nominated by: Preston
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiK692k1lgI" data-time="


I've always been a fan of a monster with some go power, and that's Awesome Kong. Head and shoulders above anyone else in the women's division of her era, Kong will endure in my memory because when she looked her best, she looked like the type of woman who could be Chyna. Kong seemed like the perfect choice for an intergender character.

What matters most about Kong is that she is the one woman of her stature who can put on a good match. She understands wrestling psychology and she presents those little details that make her character feel real. Her presence alone allows her to nail her gimmick, but her wrestling skills reinforce it. That's why her feud with Gail Kim in 2007 lead to the best women's matches in TNA's history. These two women presented such compelling matches that I think any doubter of women's wrestling in the US would be hard-pressed to decry their work.

Of course, her failed run in WWE is what most people here will remember, and while I've never been entirely sure on the circumstances surrounding it (this is when I had stopped watching for a while), I don't hold it against her. In fact, Kong's only real drawback are her mediocre mic skills. That said, it seems that most bookers recognize the necessity for Kong to be a monster and not a promo-cutter. As it should be. Kong was Nia Jax with actual wrestling prowess and a character that wasn't consistently mishandled. Somewhat mishandled? Sure. But Nia lags behind Kong in almost every respect. Perhaps that's why Kong is currently the champion of the most-watched women's promotion in the world!
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PrestonStarry2
05/11/18 11:19:49 AM
#3:


Becky Lynch over Awesome Kong? :/
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Lopen
05/11/18 11:38:46 AM
#4:


I don't hold Kharma against Kong. She had like, what, three segments and six vignettes? Whatever.

I'm surprised she's still the champion of anything though-- I'd seen part of one of the more recent TNA women shows from like 2016 or something and she looked pretty broken down.
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scarletspeed7
05/11/18 11:43:32 AM
#5:


Lopen posted...
I don't hold Kharma against Kong. She had like, what, three segments and six vignettes? Whatever.

I'm surprised she's still the champion of anything though-- I'd seen part of one of the more recent TNA women shows from like 2016 or something and she looked pretty broken down.

The promotion is GLOW on Netflix >_>
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Lopen
05/11/18 11:45:03 AM
#6:


Ohhh... haha. Maybe I should watch that at some point.
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scarletspeed7
05/12/18 8:02:44 PM
#7:


No write-ups today.
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Johnbobb
05/12/18 8:08:39 PM
#8:


tag
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PSN/Steam: CheddarBBQ https://goo.gl/Diw2hs
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scarletspeed7
05/13/18 5:40:19 PM
#9:


Happy Mothers Day!
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scarletspeed7
05/14/18 11:07:25 AM
#10:


#68 - Trish Stratus Nominated by: Tom Bombadil
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdgaM5CywW8" data-time="

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o57EWyUvDvc" data-time="


Trish Stratus could've really coasted by on her looks and sex appeal, which she had in spades. Especially in an era that seemingly commanded it in the WWE. However, she wasn't content with that and it allowed her to become an icon in women's wrestling. Many admire her for proving everyone wrong, and setting the bar for model girls becoming wrestlers. So many pale imitations have followed in her footsteps and failed to come remotely close to achieving her level of success. While she wasn't technically great in the ring as Molly or Ivory, she was still able to command the attention of fans thanks to her ability to convey a story. What she had over those girls though was charisma, and she oozed it. She excelled on the mic, especially as the mean girl heel from 2004-2005. Her face work was also great, as she was the definition of over. She carried herself as a star, she was able to sell to get sympathy from fans and she was key in two great women's feuds (vs. Lita and Mickie). To that, you have to say Trish Stratus earns her places as one of the best women in American wrestling.
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Mega Mana
05/14/18 11:11:23 AM
#11:


I like how both thumbnails are not Trish, but Mickie and Lita.
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scarletspeed7
05/14/18 11:11:56 AM
#12:


Well I can't help no one nominated two of the women I would've rated higher than Trish!
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Lopen
05/14/18 11:13:18 AM
#13:


Excuse me.
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scarletspeed7
05/14/18 11:22:25 AM
#14:


#67 - The Miz Nominated by: Lopen
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8d4SLA4HYp0" data-time="


Despite being ranked very highly, I can already tell that I'm going to have to defend my position on the Miz to a board of unadultered fans of the guy. Remember that his early runs came at a time in which I wasn't watching wrestling; I don't have the same sense of his improvement as others. What the Miz is, to me, is a representation of everything that I don't like about WWE taken to the best possible conclusion. His promo work can reach the top echelon of WWE work, but he is a very staged character. The moments of the Miz on the mic I like the best come from Talking Smack. He CAN be real. I CAN suspend my disbelief for the guy in a way I cannot for other WWE talent. But, too often, I am forced to witness the words of a non-wrestling writer phoning in a monologue instead of the Miz's pure and raw emotion. When the Miz, for example, cut that phenomenal promo on Daniel Bryan, he was at his peak. But after a year of Miz on RAW, I lost all of my goodwill for Miz as he sank back into mediocre storylines with promos that didn't ring true.

Similarly, Miz's wrestling style is some of the best of the pure WWE practice of safe in-ring work. When he's ready to go, he's definitely in the top ten! Top ten percent of the guys in the company. Put him in the ring with a Cesaro or a Ziggler or a Zayn and I guarantee you he will deliver a great match. But it will likely not inspire me the way an Ishii does with his brutal realism or a Ricochet does with his mind-blowing acrobatics. Miz is a safe choice, and I like to play it risky. I want to feel something new and witness something original. Miz is one of the best possible midcarders you could ever have. But he doesn't elicit a strong reaction from me, and almost everyone else above him on this list does.
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scarletspeed7
05/14/18 11:22:57 AM
#15:


Lopen posted...
Excuse me.

Oh right, Mickie is still to come!
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Lopen
05/14/18 12:00:21 PM
#16:


It's funny Trish and Miz are back to back because the way I felt about Trish when she was actually an active wrestler is the way I think a lot of people (less nowadays) felt about Miz.

Like I never really liked Trish, but I always liked people she was feuding with, and looking back I think she brought out the best in Mickie and Lita. Similarly I feel like people gave Miz that same kinda treatment. It's like, yeah, maybe Ziggler carried Miz in those great matches to some extent, but what has Ziggler done since? And maybe Mizdow was largely Sandow being that entertaining but what did he do after Miz?

I appreciate Trish more nowadays for that, because really Mickie and Lita never really had any great feuds that weren't with Trish either. And the common link there would be Trish. There's value in being the one the other guy plays off of.

All that being said I do kinda agree with thoughts on Miz. I've said recently I've been skipping Miz segments in his recent feuds with Balor and Rollins and whoever else. I think the problem is less Miz and more the gimmick not lining up with the guy as presented on TV due to lazy writing. Like he puts himself behind that "I AM MAKING THE IC TITLE RELEVANT AGAIN" schtick but the IC Title hasn't been relevant in quite some time. It's been Miz's coat rack title for most of the past year. I mean maybe Miz could put more input with the writers or something, but I do feel like he does the best with the writing he can short of just completely going off the rails.
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scarletspeed7
05/14/18 12:05:22 PM
#17:


#66 - Terry Funk Nominated by: Snake
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DXslrmzqq8" data-time="


He started at #1, but I docked one ranking for each one of his failed retirements.
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Tom Bombadil
05/15/18 1:17:27 PM
#18:


lol
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Eddv
05/15/18 3:01:18 PM
#19:


scarletspeed7 posted...
Similarly, Miz's wrestling style is some of the best of the pure WWE practice of safe in-ring work. When he's ready to go, he's definitely in the top ten! Top ten percent of the guys in the company. Put him in the ring with a Cesaro or a Ziggler or a Zayn and I guarantee you he will deliver a great match


I feel like youre underselling JUST how important this aspect is.

Ishii could never be on Raw. He just couldnt. He would injure himself snd others and burn out.

The Miz can day in and day out be the same guy he always has been.

To me the guy is pure class and that hes held to the midcard has everything to do with his stature and his lack of indy streetcred.

To me he is Ric Flair or Hulk Hogan or Dusty Rhodes - one of the very best storytellers and sports entertainers there has ever been or ever will be.

He lacks some of the pure intangibles of a Sid or a Bret but not everyone can be Sid.
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scarletspeed7
05/15/18 3:20:26 PM
#20:


The myth that WWE style guys get injured less than NJPW guys is still real.
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Tom Bombadil
05/15/18 3:59:04 PM
#21:


How do the schedules compare?
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scarletspeed7
05/15/18 4:14:43 PM
#22:


Tom Bombadil posted...
How do the schedules compare?

Little tough to compare given you don't have exact schedules, but the WWE house show circuit is either 3 or 4 shows per week (with PPV or an international tour), and the same is true of NJPW. Not everyone competes on both sets of shows. NJPW talent also can end up on shows elsewhere (ie: ROH). NXT only has a max of 3 shows a week but that is a developmental territory with PC work as well.
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scarletspeed7
05/16/18 11:14:33 AM
#23:


#65 - Kota Ibushi Nominated by: CybrMonkey
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Q6NknbHNiQ" data-time="


On pure in-ring ability, Ibushi is one of the best ever. While his long-term selling is a bit poor at times and his real-time selling can occasionally come off as melodramatic he is otherwise an absolute perfect all-rounder. He has crazy acrobatic high-flying skills, extremely stiff strikes, can take some of the sickest bumps imaginable, and he has a great use of facial expressions to communicate his emotions. Sadly, what holds Ibushi back from being considered an all-time great is two-fold, starting with his lack of wrestling accolades. This isn't to say that he would be a 10 out of 10 icon if he simply won the G1 or the IWGP Heavyweight title a few times, but it relates to how his inability to commit to a promotion long term has meant that he hasn't been able to produce any fantastic long-term wrestling storylines (until recently) or title reigns. He's a freelancer who gets up to all sorts of weird wrestling all around the world, alongside more serious wrestling such as in NJPW. This lack of commitment to a single promotion means bookers haven't had chance to trust him with major titles and major pushes though, so he has never had a big string of great matches or any super interesting storylines either.

My other reason is pretty terrible, admittedly, but it is my reason nonetheless. He always has his mouth open, and it makes him look a little dopey. There. I said it. He has kind of a dopey mouth.
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scarletspeed7
05/16/18 11:45:04 AM
#24:


#64 - Seth Rollins Nominated by: paulg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cSGYAha4nk" data-time="


I had him ranked at #1 but bumped him down 2 levels for everyone he injured with buckle bombs.

In all seriousness, Rollins is a guy for whom the last couple years have not been kind. I have lost more and more interest in his character the further into his interminable face run he gets. I'm just not that interested in the character Rollins has become. I'm also not a big fan of the Shield in general. I don't really have the motivation to even explain why. It's funny; when he was champion, I always felt alone in enjoying his run. Since then, it seems that absence has made the heart grow fonder. I look at his "open" challenge match with Neville as proof of just how great Rollins was in his golden era. But after he returned from injury, I really lost interest in the character. He was performing the same sort of schlocky promo as Roman Reigns did, but he had goodwill thanks to his title reign and his absence. Still, I saw most if not all of 2017 as an interminably dull run for his character. Jason Jordan was, to me, more interesting than Rollins.

Now that Rollins is back to be a clinician in the ring, I'm hoping WWE takes up the slack in the promos they forcefeed him. I still don't have interest in his story arc, but I'm having fun watching his matches for the first time since his championship run.

And his laugh is the best.
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Eddv
05/16/18 12:08:27 PM
#25:


I think Rollins is easily the best shield member and that he still ended up overrated haha.

Its not hard to be better than ambrose and reigns though.
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scarletspeed7
05/16/18 12:12:36 PM
#26:


All three can and have been presented better than they currently are (or were in their most recent appearances). Seth probably has the highest potential of all in terms of ability to retire or kill other talent!
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Lopen
05/17/18 12:56:26 PM
#27:


Seth Rollins being able to use the Curb Stomp again adds some much needed impact to his repertoire and I would single-handedly credit that to the upturn in his match quality.

A finisher isn't usually that important but Rollins's offense is so harmless looking without it. He does all these things like Blockbusters and Slingblades that are basically just him floating around his opponent and them falling down with him. Even his superplex, because he rolls through it, actually makes it look a lot less impactful. I said this in the APWT recently but his moveset is just really really bad in general. J&J Security were actually really helpful for him too as it gave him a focus in the match that wasn't just "do moves that look cool"

Meanwhile yeah his character hasn't been compelling since he turned face-- just generic good guy #816.

So I actually think Rollins is really overrated in general, and probably on this list too, though much less so. Still better than Roman and Ambrose, in any case. I do think he has the most potential of the three, too. Just turn him heel again and give him a manager.
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scarletspeed7
05/18/18 11:01:17 AM
#28:


Lopen posted...
A finisher isn't usually that important but Rollins's offense is so harmless looking without it.

I think a major issue is that the curbstomp WAS such a key move for Rollins that when you take it away, he loses a lot of the edge to his character. It's got such violent connotations and it worked perfectly with him.
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PrestonStarry2
05/18/18 11:10:23 AM
#29:


Edge for #1 please. Thank you.
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scarletspeed7
05/18/18 11:11:35 AM
#30:


PrestonStarry2 posted...
Edge for #1 please. Thank you.

It's like you know nothing about my favorite wrestling talents.
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PrestonStarry2
05/18/18 11:20:05 AM
#31:


lol you never done anything like this before. :3
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scarletspeed7
05/18/18 11:20:40 AM
#32:


That's true. I think a lot of people know my top guy though. I won't spoil if you don't.
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Eddv
05/18/18 11:42:05 AM
#33:


#1 is gonna be the Hulkster, brother.
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scarletspeed7
05/18/18 11:45:33 AM
#34:


Eddv posted...
#1 is gonna be the Hulkster, brother.

Much love HH
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Lopen
05/18/18 12:35:58 PM
#35:


I've got your #1 down to a small handful but I'm not positive which one it actually is.
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scarletspeed7
05/18/18 12:38:26 PM
#36:


You were thrown off when I dropped Shockmaster and never recovered.
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Tom Bombadil
05/19/18 3:18:58 PM
#37:


indeed
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Tom Bombadil
05/20/18 4:25:04 PM
#38:


it shocked the world
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PrestonStarry2
05/21/18 1:58:17 PM
#39:


I think the fact that NO ONE nominated Dean Ambrose or Roman Reigns should tell you something.
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scarletspeed7
05/21/18 3:08:27 PM
#40:


I think people are just tired of talking about them.
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scarletspeed7
05/21/18 5:44:46 PM
#41:


#63 - Bruiser Brody Nominated by: Voltch
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FfngjQyIxM" data-time="


Best known for being the second name in JBL's examples of great wrestlers, Bruiser Brody (of "Stan Hansen and ____" fame) is one of those guys that perfected an archetype. The tale of Bruiser Brody is the stuff of legends and nightmares. Stories of his fighting prowess rivaled Meng for years, and his out-of-ring behavior only enhanced his reputation in the ring. The star of countless brutal, gory matches, Bruiser Brody was a monster the likes of which have inspired many for years afterwards. Goldberg even stated that his primary inspiration in-ring came from Bruiser Brody. Surely, current talent like Braun Strowman owe a lot to him. Even guys like Steve Austin and Dean Ambrose owe the popularity of their brawling-based style to Brody. He was a pioneer and an innovator both in the US and Japan, and that can't be ignored.

During his 15 years in the sport, Brody wrestled both as a hated villain and a loved hero. He feuded with the best in the sport during his time in the ring. Dick The Bruiser (for the right to the name "Bruiser", which he lost), Bruno Sammartino, the Funks, Ric Flair, Abdullah the Butcher, the Von Erich Family, Dusty Rhodes, Dick Murdoch, Harley Race, and many more. Probably his most remembered feud, though, was against Andre The Giant. Brody was also one of the biggest draws in the Puerto Rican-based World Wrestling Council. He had legendary feuds/matches there with Abdullah, Carlos Colon, and the Invader. But his feud with the Masked Invader (Jose Gonzalez) proved to be the last of his career.

Brody was murdered in a Puerto Rican locker room on July 17, 1988, the victim of several stab wounds to the stomach. Jose Gonzalez was charged with the murder. The news of Brody's murder sent shockwaves through the world of wrestling, and everyone wanted to know just why someone would murder the well-liked (among his fellow wrestlers) Brody. Tony Atlas witnessed the murder take place while in the same locker room. In a statement to police at the time, Atlas told the authorities that Gonzalez had approached Brody (after a series of real-life confrontations between Brody-Gonzalez) in the shower with a long, concealed hunting knife and stabbed Brody in the torso several times. Atlas would refuse to testify at the trial though, and Gonzalez was eventually acquitted. Brody's family attorney was quoted at the time saying that Atlas refused extradition (he was allowed to do so on a technicality) and that the case had depended entirely on his testimony. Without Atlas, they had no case.

Unlike in the United States, the jury in a Puerto Rican murder case does not have to come to a unanimous decision, and whichever way the majority of the jury votes is how the verdict is rendered. Although Puerto Rican law came to a different conclusion, most familiar with the case believe Brody's murderer walked away a free man. The World Wrestling Council, once a wrestling hot-bed, all but disappeared after the negative publicity and devastating loss of American talent who refused to work in Puerto Rico after Brody's murder.

So why does Bruiser rate so low? I lack much personal experience with his matches. Simple as that.
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scarletspeed7
05/21/18 5:56:01 PM
#42:


#62 - Billy Graham Nominated by: Eddv
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5WJZON9Nl8" data-time="

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yatyp9s3KXM" data-time="

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRO3q0WB6pU" data-time="


Billy Graham was, in some ways, a better Hulk Hogan than Hulk Hogan.

Billy Graham had an undeniable charisma that he could tap in his interviews. His promo work was phenomenally good. It served as a prototype to an entire generation of workers - Jesse Ventura, Hulk Hogan, Dusty Rhodes... all of them adapted aspects of Graham's gimmick to their own purposes, each achieving the same level of success as Graham or greater. What Graham did best was present a bad guy that fans liked; Graham was one of the first so-called "cool heels" who stayed popular with fans despite his villainous status. He planted the seed for men such as "Stone Cold" Steve Austin and The Rock to become antiheroes that fans would love later. In fact, Graham's popularity was such that he would go on to win the WWF Title in an era where bad guys rarely were given the opportunity to have a title run. When one was given this chance, it was usually a very short reign; weeks at the most, and only so someone else could began a babyface run later.

Graham's title reign as a heel was 296 days; that still stands as one of the longest uninterrupted reigns of a heel in modern WWE history.

The innovator of the word Superstar in wrestling wasn't without his vices however. Arrogance was ultimately his downfall - Graham basically had a 4-5 year career because of his politics. His legacy is a fraction of what it should be because he really self-destructed in every opportunity he should have had to become a wrestling icon. When he was WWF champ, he became so upset that he had to give the title to Backlund that he basically took 3 years off from the sport right in his prime. When he returned to the ring he was so bitter that he threw away his gimmick and adapted a very strange karate thing that went over like a lead balloon. It's a sad ending to an awe-inspiring career.
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scarletspeed7
05/21/18 6:03:36 PM
#43:


#61 - Naomichi Marufuji Nominated by: Girugamesh
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQI_ckSUHEQ" data-time="


Casual Kicks!

If Tanahashi is the ace of New Japan (and go ace), Marufuji is the ace of NOAH. Everytime I watch a match of his, Im amazed by his innovative offense and his athletic ability. His kicks are amazing, his chops are wicked, his knees are brutal, and his hair is amazing. I really want to focus on his kicks though; I don't think anyone else in wrestling history can make a kick look so effortless and yet so deadly at the same time. It's why I jokingly refer to his kicks as "Casual Kicks". He looks like he's barely even trying with them, and yet they are graceful and impressive. It's such a Japan way of wrestling. Like brutal beatdown ballet.

Honestly, I need to spend more time watching Marufuji. I tend to love what I see of him, but my exposure is pretty limited. I think with enough matches of his under my belt, I'd rank him in the Top 50 at least.
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Tom Bombadil
05/22/18 6:48:30 PM
#44:


sounds fun
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Tom Bombadil
05/23/18 9:18:29 PM
#45:


Billy Graham did well in my TEW game until he got pissy and left
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scarletspeed7
05/23/18 9:28:54 PM
#46:


Tom Bombadil posted...
Billy Graham did well in my TEW game until he got pissy and left

Sounds... pretty damn similar to real life!
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Tom Bombadil
05/25/18 12:15:22 AM
#47:


quite!
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Tom Bombadil
05/26/18 9:31:58 AM
#48:


I hope Hennig was less whiny IRL
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Tom Bombadil
05/27/18 11:22:56 AM
#49:


Jake gives me trouble too
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Tom Bombadil
05/28/18 11:59:38 AM
#50:


and I feel bad for Ventura because I brought Hogan in and he's pissed
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