Current Events > Ohio House passes Heartbeat to ban abortions of fetuses with a heartbeat.

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Damn_Underscore
11/20/18 11:53:57 AM
#51:


Tmaster148 posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
You can't prove souls exist. Let's not make policy based on religious principles. If religious people are against abortions they can chose to not get them.

Separation of church and state.


I agree, but when it's a question of life and murder not everyone will agree.


Murder is the illegal killing of another person. Abortion is literally not murder.


This is such a dumb semantics argument.

If you would rather I say "when it's a question of life and homicide" then fine
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KiwiTerraRizing
11/20/18 11:54:08 AM
#52:


This is why Kavanaugh was nominated
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Tmaster148
11/20/18 11:54:44 AM
#53:


Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
You can't prove souls exist. Let's not make policy based on religious principles. If religious people are against abortions they can chose to not get them.

Separation of church and state.


I agree, but when it's a question of life and murder not everyone will agree.


Murder is the illegal killing of another person. Abortion is literally not murder.


This is such a dumb semantics argument.

If you would rather I say "when it's a question of life and homicide" then fine


Homicide is also defined by being unlawful killing.
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VipaGTS
11/20/18 11:55:52 AM
#54:


why do you guys still argue with Damn_Underscore?
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Damn_Underscore
11/20/18 11:56:26 AM
#55:


Tmaster148 posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
You can't prove souls exist. Let's not make policy based on religious principles. If religious people are against abortions they can chose to not get them.

Separation of church and state.


I agree, but when it's a question of life and murder not everyone will agree.


Murder is the illegal killing of another person. Abortion is literally not murder.


This is such a dumb semantics argument.

If you would rather I say "when it's a question of life and homicide" then fine


Homicide is also defined by being unlawful killing.


No, homicide is defined as the killing of one human being by another.
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Damn_Underscore
11/20/18 11:58:02 AM
#56:


VipaGTS posted...
why do you guys still argue with Damn_Underscore?


Can you explain why my arguments are bad (other than the fact that you disagree with them), or are you fine just using ad hominem attacks?
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Damn_Underscore
11/20/18 12:00:19 PM
#57:


_Rinku_ posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
hockeybub89 posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
monkmith posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
The heartbeat cutoff is meaningless, they're essentially saying they want to ban abortion at conception if they could.

You may disagree with that, but to try to make this an issue of "misogyny" is dumb at best and deceitful at worst. No one is trying to to ban women from menstruating, once a fetus is involved this becomes a huge grey area. And the father is going to affected just as much.

unless the father is also carrying a baby for 9 months, with all the health risks and burdens associated, kindly shut the fuck up.


Why are you so angry? The father will be affected just as much emotionally and financially as the mother.

Still not in his uterus.


Females are biologically designed to give birth. That's just how it is. If men gave birth people would sill have the same beliefs about when life begins.

Do you have any qualms whatsoever if the woman wants an abortion but the man doesn't?

[Citation Needed]


People are only against abortion because they believe life begins at conception.
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_Rinku_
11/20/18 12:00:32 PM
#58:


s0nicfan posted...
To all the people in this topic, I'm curious what you believe the cutoff should be for abortions. I fully support abortions, but it's a lot easier to bitch about a cutoff than it is to provide your own and justify it. For example, third trimester is a pretty common one because at that point you could conceivably have a premature birth and through medical science the baby could survive.

Honestly, I think a woman should never be required to carry a pregnancy to term if she doesn't want to do so at any point. If she changes her mind, the occupant of her uterus is there without her consent and has no right to siphon nutrients out of her.

Keep in mind that 99% of abortions performed past the point of viability are for issues that either threaten the health of the mother or that would mean a severely reduced quality of life for the child once it's born (if they're born alive at all). It is literally no one but the mother's business if she wants to terminate a pregnancy where she knows that her child will only live for a few agonizing hours. Restrictive cutoffs limit women's ability to make these decisions for themselves and potentially amplify the grief they feel.
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Damn_Underscore
11/20/18 12:05:47 PM
#59:


@_Rinku_

This is a very hypothetical question, but let's say the due date is today and the mother changes her mind and decides to get an abortion. Are you still ok with that?

I understand it's difficult to implement a cutoff, but you have to agree that there are at least some situations where abortion is unacceptable.
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Solar_Crimson
11/20/18 12:07:00 PM
#60:


Ex-Kefiroth posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
I will sign the bill, he said. I believe that the essential function of government is to protect the most vulnerable members of society. That includes the unborn.


a fetus is not a member of society

And as posted, they stop giving a shit about them once they're born.
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OctilIery
11/20/18 12:07:17 PM
#62:


Pro lifers pass an unconstitutional law? Color me shocked.
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_Rinku_
11/20/18 12:08:23 PM
#63:


Damn_Underscore posted...
@_Rinku_

This is a very hypothetical question, but let's say the due date is today and the mother changes her mind and decides to get an abortion. Are you still ok with that?

I understand it's difficult to implement a cutoff, but you have to agree that there are at least some situations where abortion is unacceptable.

I'm fine with it. It's her body, her choice.

FYI, as men (I assume you're a man), our opinions take a backseat here.
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creativerealms
11/20/18 12:08:57 PM
#64:


KiwiTerraRizing posted...
This is why Kavanaugh was nominated

I thought it was because he said a president was above the law.
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Damn_Underscore
11/20/18 12:13:01 PM
#65:


_Rinku_ posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
@_Rinku_

This is a very hypothetical question, but let's say the due date is today and the mother changes her mind and decides to get an abortion. Are you still ok with that?

I understand it's difficult to implement a cutoff, but you have to agree that there are at least some situations where abortion is unacceptable.

I'm fine with it. It's her body, her choice.

FYI, as men (I assume you're a man), our opinions take a backseat here.


You have an unreasonable opinion.

If I asked someone who is staunchly pro-life, "what if the doctors determine that giving birth would kill the mother, should she get an abortion?" and they say no, then that person would have an equally unreasonable opinion on the other side of the spectrum.
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_Rinku_
11/20/18 12:16:09 PM
#66:


Damn_Underscore posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
@_Rinku_

This is a very hypothetical question, but let's say the due date is today and the mother changes her mind and decides to get an abortion. Are you still ok with that?

I understand it's difficult to implement a cutoff, but you have to agree that there are at least some situations where abortion is unacceptable.

I'm fine with it. It's her body, her choice.

FYI, as men (I assume you're a man), our opinions take a backseat here.


You have an unreasonable opinion.

If I asked someone who is staunchly pro-life, "what if the doctors determine that giving birth would kill the mother, should she get an abortion?" and they say no, then that person would have an equally unreasonable opinion on the other side of the spectrum.

I don't think I do. My opinion maintains a woman's bodily autonomy. The hypothetical opinion you've posited does not.
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Questionmarktarius
11/20/18 12:16:33 PM
#67:


Damn_Underscore posted...
If I asked someone who is staunchly pro-life, "what if the doctors determine that giving birth would kill the mother, should she get an abortion?" and they say no, then that person would have an equally unreasonable opinion on the other side of the spectrum.

If you really want to make a staunch pro-lifer squirm, bring up molar pregnancies and teratomas.
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Damn_Underscore
11/20/18 12:20:41 PM
#68:


_Rinku_ posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
@_Rinku_

This is a very hypothetical question, but let's say the due date is today and the mother changes her mind and decides to get an abortion. Are you still ok with that?

I understand it's difficult to implement a cutoff, but you have to agree that there are at least some situations where abortion is unacceptable.

I'm fine with it. It's her body, her choice.

FYI, as men (I assume you're a man), our opinions take a backseat here.


You have an unreasonable opinion.

If I asked someone who is staunchly pro-life, "what if the doctors determine that giving birth would kill the mother, should she get an abortion?" and they say no, then that person would have an equally unreasonable opinion on the other side of the spectrum.

I don't think I do. My opinion maintains a woman's bodily autonomy. The hypothetical opinion you've posited does not.


Well I think that certain drugs like heroin should be banned because they are too dangerous to try even once and they are just bad for society.

It would be pro-people's bodily autonomy to allow all drugs and let people decide if they want to take them or not, but the consequences of that would be terrible for society/emotional reasons.
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hockeybub89
11/20/18 12:21:32 PM
#69:


Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
You can't prove souls exist. Let's not make policy based on religious principles. If religious people are against abortions they can chose to not get them.

Separation of church and state.


I agree, but when it's a question of life and murder not everyone will agree.


Murder is the illegal killing of another person. Abortion is literally not murder.


This is such a dumb semantics argument.

If you would rather I say "when it's a question of life and homicide" then fine


Homicide is also defined by being unlawful killing.


No, homicide is defined as the killing of one human being by another.

So accidents and self-defense are homicide? All cops that shoot people commit homicide?
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SaithSayer
11/20/18 12:22:00 PM
#70:


Yeah because women are gonna be all...

"Wait...I gotta take a roadtrip now? Fuck....guess I'm havin' this kid then..."
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Questionmarktarius
11/20/18 12:24:07 PM
#71:


Damn_Underscore posted...
Well I think that certain drugs like heroin should be banned because they are too dangerous to try even once and they are just bad for society.

It's bad for society because it's illegal.
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_Rinku_
11/20/18 12:25:17 PM
#72:


Damn_Underscore posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
@_Rinku_

This is a very hypothetical question, but let's say the due date is today and the mother changes her mind and decides to get an abortion. Are you still ok with that?

I understand it's difficult to implement a cutoff, but you have to agree that there are at least some situations where abortion is unacceptable.

I'm fine with it. It's her body, her choice.

FYI, as men (I assume you're a man), our opinions take a backseat here.


You have an unreasonable opinion.

If I asked someone who is staunchly pro-life, "what if the doctors determine that giving birth would kill the mother, should she get an abortion?" and they say no, then that person would have an equally unreasonable opinion on the other side of the spectrum.

I don't think I do. My opinion maintains a woman's bodily autonomy. The hypothetical opinion you've posited does not.


Well I think that certain drugs like heroin should be banned because they are too dangerous to try even once and they are just bad for society.

It would be pro-people's bodily autonomy to allow all drugs and let people decide if they want to take them or not, but the consequences of that would be terrible for society/emotional reasons.

I disagree. I think people should be free to use recreational drugs as long as they don't let it impact their lives in a significant way.

You're pulling the whataboutism card though, so it's not like it matters.
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Damn_Underscore
11/20/18 12:28:35 PM
#73:


hockeybub89 posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
You can't prove souls exist. Let's not make policy based on religious principles. If religious people are against abortions they can chose to not get them.

Separation of church and state.


I agree, but when it's a question of life and murder not everyone will agree.


Murder is the illegal killing of another person. Abortion is literally not murder.


This is such a dumb semantics argument.

If you would rather I say "when it's a question of life and homicide" then fine


Homicide is also defined by being unlawful killing.


No, homicide is defined as the killing of one human being by another.

So accidents and self-defense are homicide? All cops that shoot people commit homicide?


Yes, that is literally the definition of homicide. It's from Latin.
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SaithSayer
11/20/18 12:29:47 PM
#74:


Get your abortion in a different state. Problem solved.
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Damn_Underscore
11/20/18 12:31:05 PM
#75:


Questionmarktarius posted...
Damn_Underscore posted...
Well I think that certain drugs like heroin should be banned because they are too dangerous to try even once and they are just bad for society.

It's bad for society because it's illegal.


Didn't I have this same argument with you in another topic? I said heroin can destroy relationships with friends and families if you remember that. It also destroys people's bodies.
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_Rinku_
11/20/18 12:31:23 PM
#76:


SaithSayer posted...
Get your abortion in a different state. Problem solved.

Not everyone can afford to drive to another state. Especially not someone looking to have an abortion because they can't afford a child.
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SaithSayer
11/20/18 12:34:10 PM
#77:


_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
Get your abortion in a different state. Problem solved.

Not everyone can afford to drive to another state. Especially not someone looking to have an abortion because they can't afford a child.

You'd be surprised what people can do when they have to. A roadtrip is cheaper than raising a kid.
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Solar_Crimson
11/20/18 12:37:48 PM
#78:


SaithSayer posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
Get your abortion in a different state. Problem solved.

Not everyone can afford to drive to another state. Especially not someone looking to have an abortion because they can't afford a child.

You'd be surprised what people can do when they have to. A roadtrip is cheaper than raising a kid.

The costs of raising a kid is over a long period. Not many people at that moment can afford the tome or money to take such a trip.
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Damn_Underscore
11/20/18 12:39:16 PM
#79:


Also if Roe v. Wade ever was overturned and it was up to states to decide, there would be a modern version of the Underground Railroad to help women get abortions.

Tbh that would be more morally reprehensible and cause more distress in society than just allowing abortions, but that's what would happen.
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_Rinku_
11/20/18 12:40:08 PM
#80:


SaithSayer posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
Get your abortion in a different state. Problem solved.

Not everyone can afford to drive to another state. Especially not someone looking to have an abortion because they can't afford a child.

You'd be surprised what people can do when they have to. A roadtrip is cheaper than raising a kid.

This is bullshit. A woman might not be able to afford to travel for an abortion, but the pregnancy will likely continue to term. Then she can go to the ER where they will have to admit her, and she'll give birth against her will.

You're also ignoring that it's not just the cost of a roadtrip. Many states require mandatory waiting periods between the consultation and the procedure. This means taking off those days or making multiple trips (which equals even more money lost), not to mention recovery time after the procedure.

These restrictions keep people from accessing abortions and force women to birth children they do not want. You know this and are intentionally being intellectually dishonest
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Questionmarktarius
11/20/18 12:46:23 PM
#81:


Damn_Underscore posted...

Didn't I have this same argument with you in another topic?

...probably.

We'll make the exact same stubborn arguments again soon, as well.
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SaithSayer
11/20/18 12:56:49 PM
#82:


_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
Get your abortion in a different state. Problem solved.

Not everyone can afford to drive to another state. Especially not someone looking to have an abortion because they can't afford a child.

You'd be surprised what people can do when they have to. A roadtrip is cheaper than raising a kid.

This is bullshit. A woman might not be able to afford to travel for an abortion, but the pregnancy will likely continue to term. Then she can go to the ER where they will have to admit her, and she'll give birth against her will.

You're also ignoring that it's not just the cost of a roadtrip. Many states require mandatory waiting periods between the consultation and the procedure. This means taking off those days or making multiple trips (which equals even more money lost), not to mention recovery time after the procedure.

These restrictions keep people from accessing abortions and force women to birth children they do not want. You know this and are intentionally being intellectually dishonest

When you want something badly enough, you find a way to make it happen. You can make excuses or results. Pick one.
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Questionmarktarius
11/20/18 12:58:58 PM
#83:


SaithSayer posted...
When you want something badly enough, you find a way to make it happen. You can make excuses or results. Pick one.

Anyone know a good place to invest in pennyroyal futures? Perhaps even a lab attempting to reincarnate silphium?
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_Rinku_
11/20/18 1:06:06 PM
#84:


SaithSayer posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
Get your abortion in a different state. Problem solved.

Not everyone can afford to drive to another state. Especially not someone looking to have an abortion because they can't afford a child.

You'd be surprised what people can do when they have to. A roadtrip is cheaper than raising a kid.

This is bullshit. A woman might not be able to afford to travel for an abortion, but the pregnancy will likely continue to term. Then she can go to the ER where they will have to admit her, and she'll give birth against her will.

You're also ignoring that it's not just the cost of a roadtrip. Many states require mandatory waiting periods between the consultation and the procedure. This means taking off those days or making multiple trips (which equals even more money lost), not to mention recovery time after the procedure.

These restrictions keep people from accessing abortions and force women to birth children they do not want. You know this and are intentionally being intellectually dishonest

When you want something badly enough, you find a way to make it happen. You can make excuses or results. Pick one.

Again, that's bullshit, and it reeks of privilege. You have zero clue what you are talking about.
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Solar_Crimson
11/20/18 1:43:08 PM
#85:


_Rinku_ posted...
Again, that's bullshit, and it reeks of privilege. You have zero clue what you are talking about.

That seems to be a trend. All of this is nothing more than an appeal to emotion.
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SaithSayer
11/20/18 8:23:51 PM
#86:


_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
Get your abortion in a different state. Problem solved.

Not everyone can afford to drive to another state. Especially not someone looking to have an abortion because they can't afford a child.

You'd be surprised what people can do when they have to. A roadtrip is cheaper than raising a kid.

This is bullshit. A woman might not be able to afford to travel for an abortion, but the pregnancy will likely continue to term. Then she can go to the ER where they will have to admit her, and she'll give birth against her will.

You're also ignoring that it's not just the cost of a roadtrip. Many states require mandatory waiting periods between the consultation and the procedure. This means taking off those days or making multiple trips (which equals even more money lost), not to mention recovery time after the procedure.

These restrictions keep people from accessing abortions and force women to birth children they do not want. You know this and are intentionally being intellectually dishonest

When you want something badly enough, you find a way to make it happen. You can make excuses or results. Pick one.

Again, that's bullshit, and it reeks of privilege. You have zero clue what you are talking about.

Even if it means selling some of your stuff, begging numerous relatives, do some work. It isn't like the legal window to get an abortion is a week long. There's time to raise the money for the abortion and the gas money.
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_Rinku_
11/20/18 9:07:07 PM
#87:


SaithSayer posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
SaithSayer posted...
Get your abortion in a different state. Problem solved.

Not everyone can afford to drive to another state. Especially not someone looking to have an abortion because they can't afford a child.

You'd be surprised what people can do when they have to. A roadtrip is cheaper than raising a kid.

This is bullshit. A woman might not be able to afford to travel for an abortion, but the pregnancy will likely continue to term. Then she can go to the ER where they will have to admit her, and she'll give birth against her will.

You're also ignoring that it's not just the cost of a roadtrip. Many states require mandatory waiting periods between the consultation and the procedure. This means taking off those days or making multiple trips (which equals even more money lost), not to mention recovery time after the procedure.

These restrictions keep people from accessing abortions and force women to birth children they do not want. You know this and are intentionally being intellectually dishonest

When you want something badly enough, you find a way to make it happen. You can make excuses or results. Pick one.

Again, that's bullshit, and it reeks of privilege. You have zero clue what you are talking about.

Even if it means selling some of your stuff, begging numerous relatives, do some work. It isn't like the legal window to get an abortion is a week long. There's time to raise the money for the abortion and the gas money.

You have zero clue what you are talking about. Kindly shut your mouth.
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CountDog
11/20/18 9:11:05 PM
#88:


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Tmaster148
11/20/18 9:11:48 PM
#89:


CountDog posted...
I'm not against abortion, but a lot of people abuse it, so its a tuff debate for me.


That doesn't happen.
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Questionmarktarius
11/20/18 9:25:07 PM
#90:


CountDog posted...
but a lot of people abuse it

At $500-1000 a pop?
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hockeybub89
11/20/18 9:56:23 PM
#91:


CountDog posted...
I'm not against abortion, but a lot of people abuse it, so its a tuff debate for me.

No they don't.
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tennisdude818
11/20/18 10:16:47 PM
#92:


_Rinku_ posted...
Fuck anyone that supports this anti-woman shit.


Half of the kids killed in abortions are girls.
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LepartialJury
11/21/18 3:09:40 AM
#93:


Luckily Massachusetts and New Mexico are taking care of things
https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/398485-massachusetts-passes-nasty-women-act-repealing-173-year-old-abortion-ban
https://apnews.com/15f70f18467840fe922c103509126eac
Time to move out of Saudi Arabia wannabe states.
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ImTheMacheteGuy
11/21/18 4:42:54 AM
#94:


Ohio should either reverse this or be kicked out of the US.
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SaithSayer
11/21/18 5:02:25 AM
#95:


ImTheMacheteGuy posted...
Ohio should either reverse this or be kicked out of the US.

It's not gonna last.
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_Rinku_
11/21/18 9:48:28 AM
#96:


tennisdude818 posted...
_Rinku_ posted...
Fuck anyone that supports this anti-woman shit.


Half of the kids killed in abortions are girls.

Congratulations! This is the stupidest post I've read in a while.

Shut up with your anti-woman garbage.
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CyricZ
11/21/18 9:57:26 AM
#97:


LepartialJury posted...
Luckily Massachusetts and New Mexico are taking care of things
https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/398485-massachusetts-passes-nasty-women-act-repealing-173-year-old-abortion-ban
https://apnews.com/15f70f18467840fe922c103509126eac
Time to move out of Saudi Arabia wannabe states.

A quote in the Mass article:

"This whole legislation is an exercise in posturing and pandering"

Yeah, no shit. When you're worried about the federal government taking steps to remove rights, sometimes a clear statement needs to be made.
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Inferno Dive Dragoon
11/21/18 9:57:42 AM
#98:


Pro-lifers showing how awful they are?

Must be a day ending in "y".
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scorpion41
11/21/18 10:00:31 AM
#99:


Pro choicers advocating baby murders...must be a day ending in y.
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lww99
11/21/18 10:06:15 AM
#100:


Ashamed to live here.

When did Ohio become the most Republican state in the US?

Open carry, no abortion, no weed

Whats next
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GFAQz
11/21/18 10:08:00 AM
#101:


Her body
Her Choice
Her finical responsibility.
Also fair next
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