Board 8 > Anime & Manga (And Crabs) Discussion Topic 1

(+) Yeah! (+)

New Titan ep.

The Faye thing was cruel but they got that out of the way much faster than I imagined and I'm thankful for that.

If I understand correctly, Zeke and the others are working for Marley and not on Grisha's side? And our Ymir got punished way back when because Reiss wanted nothing to do with the war and Ymir worshipping?

Holy cow with the identity of who killed Eren's mom.

Fuck I'm gonna have to rewatch the whole series. Time to speculate on the nine.
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Oh right. Mikasa looked wonderful.
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with regards to ymir: if I'm reading your post correctly it seems like you're mistaken. you seem to think she's from within the walls and was punished by the Reiss family?

she is from marley. she was taken off the streets by some pro-eldian restorationists and they claimed that she had the blood of the king and named her ymir. they were punished for worshiping her in secret. her fate is exactly the same as the restorationists in this episode.

this is why she was able to read the marleyan writing on the canned food, and knew what herring was, and knew the word saru (monkey), and knew who the "real enemy" was (but reiner stopped her from telling eren)

oh also I guess I was gonna wait until at least after this episode to explain for some reason the story having VILLAINOUS characters with some similarities to nazis has somehow led a select group of people to believe that the story is somehow pro-nazi propaganda... because... ??? I have no idea. I'd have to lead a very confused life to even begin to understand how that logic makes sense.

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MariaTaylor posted...

with regards to ymir: if I'm reading your post correctly it seems like you're mistaken. you seem to think she's from within the walls and was punished by the Reiss family?

she is from marley. she was taken off the streets by some pro-eldian restorationists and they claimed that she had the blood of the king and named her ymir. they were punished for worshiping her in secret. her fate is exactly the same as the restorationists in this episode.

this is why she was able to read the marleyan writing on the canned food, and knew what herring was, and knew the word saru (monkey), and knew who the "real enemy" was (but reiner stopped her from telling eren)

oh also I guess I was gonna wait until at least after this episode to explain for some reason the story having VILLAINOUS characters with some similarities to nazis has somehow led a select group of people to believe that the story is somehow pro-nazi propaganda... because... ??? I have no idea. I'd have to lead a very confused life to even begin to understand how that logic makes sense.

Yeah, I couldn't remember if when she was turned it looked the same as this.

And not for once have I felt the show is pro anything. You're clearly being showed how despicable everyone is.
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I really need to catch up...
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Those are some pretty big Titan reveals. Its interesting seeing this series keep coming up with new stuff to shake up what you know, but a small part of me also likes when it was simpler too haha. Only 3 episodes left now I think? Man I really want to see more already.

Quints

FeelsBadMan

Also I can't tell if this means Yotsuba wins or is eliminated. I'm leaning more towards win
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KommunistKoala posted...

Quints

FeelsBadMan

Also I can't tell if this means Yotsuba wins or is eliminated. I'm leaning more towards win

I hadn't chosen a side up til now but I think I've been converted to Yotsuba's. Hope this means she'll win, but Itsuki still hasn't had her arc and I'm scared that Negi is going to pull first girl on us despite all the talk about him not liking first girl trope.
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I feel like this chapter kind of eliminated Itsuki but that might just me being optimistic

We'll see since yeah she's probably about to have an arc
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KommunistKoala posted...

I feel like this chapter kind of eliminated Itsuki but that might just me being optimistic

We'll see since yeah she's probably about to have an arc

Yeah I agree this chapter, imo, very much indicated Itsuki still doesn't really have feelings for Fuu, and that's prolly her death knell.

But she might be pulling a Yotsuba lol
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people who are caught up on Ace (aka not swordz) get to start appreciating the greatness of Wolf Boy hell yeah

Ep11s description on Crunchy was such a troll. Made me think I was gonna get a great episode mostly about Sawamura pitching, but there wasnt much of it. Wonder how long it will be before I get to see him pitch an amazing game. I feel like Furuya has sorta stolen the MC role from him sometimes >_>

hey I finally finished the Space Runaway Ideon TV series! that took a lot of time because I'd only watch a few episodes at a time, and sometimes take pretty long breaks before watching a few more eps. honestly it might be interested to see exactly when I started. I know it was years ago but I'm not sure exactly how many years. probably around 3.

the beginning is really good. there are some great episodes in the middle but they're largely separated by a lot of padding episodes without much character development or plot advancement. I mean yes changing arcs between Buff Clan Commander #4 and #5 is technically advancing the plot, I guess. but even those usually involve them fighting the same commander for multiple episodes. and most of the commanders don't have much interesting going on.

I guess I will say this... another notable criticism I have is that the conflict largely revolves around the Buff Clan. but the adventure spans a huge section of the universe. it makes me wonder why no other alien civilizations are out there, and the show doesn't address this directly.

despite having a rushed ending due to cancellation I do sort of like how the series ended. it was a little too abrupt but you can see what they were going for and it's kinda neat. it's very interesting for sure. the last part of the series is definitely great and among some of the best material the show has to offer. I am pretty interested in watching the movie to see how the 'official' ending turns out, and I'm happy that an official ending was made eventually... but at the same time if the series ending was all that we got, I think I'd be okay with it I guess.

overall I thought the series was very good. it's dated but it's so unique, weird, and interesting in a lot of ways. the padding is the worst thing about it. it has a lot of similar elements to the original Mobile Suit Gundam, which you'd expect... but I will say I like Gundam more overall. Ideon got an 8/10 from me, while the Mobile Suit Gundam movies are all 10/10 or very close to it.

still, there are some elements of Ideon that I like more than anything in Gundam. so these flat scores don't really tell the whole story. the overall themes of this story are pretty great but you can see where the execution wavers at times, and that's really a shame. this could have been an absolute cultural milestone on the level or above Gundam. still, it managed to have an awesome influence on the mecha genre. it's definitely a classic as far as I'm concerned.
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I guess there is one other planet full of people aside from where the earthlings are from, and the buff clan. maybe two... I can't full remember all of the details of some earlier episodes. and I do like how one of them ends up being relevant to the final arc. you think there would be more, but, eh.. then again this might be a sign that the original Logo Dau aliens and a lot of other civilizations were wiped out by the Ideon in the past, which would be pretty interesting. the more I think about it the more this actually makes sense.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-T8Q6FDdl4" data-time="

given the content of the OP/ED, you can tell Tomino had everything planned, or some idea, from the very beginning. so I think details like Logo Dau being abandoned can't be easily overlooked.
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characters

Cosmo: I will say this show has more of an ensemble than Mobile Suit Gundam, so right away it's hard to say that Cosmo is the "main character" in the same way that Amuro is. they have some similarities and some differences. Cosmo has a pretty goofy character design but I think aside from that he's a very interesting character. One thing about Cosmo is that early on in the series he's fairly rebellious and reluctant. He is more eager to fight than Amuro but he does have the same sort of defiant streak at times... but in the later half, and especially the last 1/3 of the series... god... it's like Cosmo just kinda gives up. the amount of times he starts saying stuff like "there's nothing we can do about it. we just need to keep fighting." really got me at certain moments. I realized how much his character had changed due to the constant fighting and loss.

I think MSG is more overt with its themes, but Cosmo just fucking gives up. the subtlety of his character is a lot more harrowing than the overt nature of amuro and MSG. In the final episodes he goes out and slaughters people with no questions asked, and barely even has any kind of emotional reaction to what's going on around him. yeah you could chalk this up to weak writing or character inconsistency but given what we know of the theme of this series and other shows by Tomino, I think it's not an accident. mobile suit gundam is anti war. ideon is anti war. we're not supposed to think that cosmo going out and killing people makes him cooler. humanity and the buff clan are BOTH in the wrong, and this is very apparent in how the series portrays its themes and the ending. even his emotional reactions to tragedy become a lot more muted. the kid just dies inside and it's pretty dark. what a fantastic character.

the fact that I've written so much talking about just the first character is making me realize how great this series really is. wow.

Kasha: Kasha's greatest strength, and also her great sin, is that she never gives up on questioning authority or being skeptical of everything that is happening to them. I almost wonder what different direction the series would have went in if people took Kasha and her skepticism a bit more seriously at times. I think she is smarter than she lets on and this is really conveyed by how she often chooses to simplify things. Complicating ideas is the way that manipulative people get you to agree to things that are against your own interest. She really shows her intellect by choosing to acknowledge what is going on around them and focusing on the simple, discreet, and apparent truths they can observe.

Unfortunately I think this skepticism is one of the reasons the Ide could never fully be endeared to her character. I love that she doesn't bend over backwards for the earth military forces and you have to give credit to her influence into the final decisions made by Bes in pivotal moments like this. It just seems like among the council of people who always got to voice their opinion, Kasha was always outnumbered when it came to the Ideon. Still, she continued to go out and fight (for her own survival and to defend the other crew members) despite her feelings. But at the end of the day the Ide always seemed vindictive toward Kasha, especially in cases where the Ideon Gauge would randomly stop working or lose power. we know for sure that the Ide has a will of its own. with that knowledge, all of these moments suddenly have significance. when and why it chooses to bestow its power all tell us about the Ide's character.

If people would listen to Kasha they might have avoided a lot of problems, or maybe she was wrong and there was no way to escape the situation they were in. With the way things happened, though, it's partially because of Kasha that people never fully trusted the Ide, and they suffered even more for the "sin" of not blindly submitting to the will of the Ide.
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Bes Jordan: With Bes we first have to immediately talk about one of the things I love about this series, the fact that the Ideon doesn't have a consistent piloting roster. It varies based on who is available and what is needed at the time. The Ideon is made of three separate vessels that combine into one giant robot. Bes, Kasha, and Cosmo pilot them at the beginning, but, Bes is needed to captain the Solo Ship and so he stops being a pilot pretty early on. This is really cool to me for whatever reason.

Bes is a total badass in the early episodes. He is the person with the most military experience and physical combat training and these skills are valuable early on. I think Bes is an amazing captain. One thing about Bes is that there is a group of people on the bridge always, everyone is allowed to offer their own opinion, and Bes often ends up making a decision based on how these discussions play out. He's a lot like Captain Picard from Star Trek: The Next Generation in that regard. if he was also as badass as Kirk when it came to fighting. He stops going on as many direct combat missions because he is needed on the ship the most often, but there is some moments where his skill set comes into play even later in the series.

The unfortunate thing about Bes is that he's too good and far too naive. In some ways this serves to benefit the members of the Solo Ship. I think him accepting Karala and later Gije is a great way to show that understanding between the humans and the Buff Clan is possible. It should have been possible. But he underestimated the hatred and the ignorance of the Buff Clan and didn't put enough serious thought and effort into what would have been required to find true peace. the idea of abandoning the Solo Ship was definitely for the greater good, but he overlooked all of the evil forces out there that were obviously going to try and exploit the Ide for their own gain. Then again he was constantly under pressure, being attacked to the point of exhaustion and sickness. He probably had no real time to sit down and think about these kinds of things. all while being crushed under the immense pressure of trying to keep everyone alive. he always needed to be vigilant. when you're good, and capable, and you're born into a shitty world, you can't rest... if you give up, then you're leaving everyone else to suffer as a result of your inaction. In those circumstances I think he did the best possible.

Karala: Karala is stuck in an unfortunate weird place as a character. She gets some good development early on, and her role in the story is pretty vital. Her relationship with Bes is absolutely pivotal to the central themes of the series. Of all the characters that suffered as a result of the rushed ending and the cancellation of the series, Karala is the major victim. Her scenes in the final episode are just great. I love how badass she becomes as a result of being a mother, but I also wouldn't let this undercut the fact that she's always been competent and clever. Nothing that she does is unexpected. It's just her harnessing her established strengths out of a new necessity to protect herself and her child.

The scene where her father tries to kill her is absolutely nuts. To me that shows the full potential of what this series could have been and we get a glimpse of how the pretty great character of Karala could have been even better. there were so many plot elements and ideas still left to explore. I wanted to see her meet Harulu again. I wanted to see her interact with the Buff Clan and make better attempts at forming peace and understanding between both sides. It almost seems unfair that the Ide dropped her into an unwinnable negotiating position and told her that was her final chance. I guess it's no more unfair than the series getting cancelled.
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So I reread 5-toubun with the new revelations.

I love everything about rewatching Yotsuba with the entire fact that she loved him for the beginning, it reframes so many of her actions. The park scene at the end of their date is so fucking bittersweet now. The part where she lied to him when confessing and used that as proof she could actually lie to Fuutarou in particular. It's amazing what one can do with foreshadowing when one actually knows the future.
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before and after attack on titan destroys your soul

https://imgur.com/TasqCqp
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Talk about a series I was reading before it got hot.

But then I stopped reading before it got REALLY hot too
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on a totally unrelated note the character creator in Code Vein looks pretty neat

I sort of actually want to play this game now...
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MariaTaylor posted...

on a totally unrelated note the character creator in Code Vein looks pretty neat

I sort of actually want to play this game now...

Yeah it like... Looks better than I expected.

I expected it to be total trash tho so not actually saying much.
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Attack on Titan new episode. Those final lines. Wha..?
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Also please protect Historia
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profDEADPOOL posted...

Yeah it like... Looks better than I expected.

I expected it to be total trash tho so not actually saying much.

that is like my exact feelings.

but I pretty much enjoy any game that will let me create a character, especially if there's lots of neat options. it's better if the actual game is good but I would at least mess around with the character creator and try it out.

BK_Sheikah00 posted...

Attack on Titan new episode. Those final lines. Wha..?

I think it was a good decision to punctuate the episode with that scene

really hoping for a teaser or something in next week's episode. I mean it's going to end exactly where I figured it would end and I think that will be great but... I guess I just want to see something else cool and unexpected.
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MariaTaylor posted...

really hoping for a teaser or something in next week's episode. I mean it's going to end exactly where I figured it would end and I think that will be great but... I guess I just want to see something else cool and unexpected.

I too am interested because there's the cadence of two chapters of the manga per episode but there's really only one chapter left before they uh, go in the different direction.

So either they really stretch things out and pad it, or the 2nd half of the episode serves as a very lengthy teaser of what's to come!

Maria I gotta ask. Was the manga already past the basement when S2 aired? Like was that ED back then obvious for manga readers?
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yes
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Man so far this Ace season feels like teasing Sawamura pitching lol. Just watched last weeks episode and Im like oh man Sawamura is gonna do some pitches with one of the new catchers and the episode ends before he does :(

he didn't pitch very much in season 2, either. there was an entire arc about him having the yips and being unable to pitch. remember that?
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I do, but I thought Id at least see him throw the pitches with the new catcher this episode. Even just one or two couldve been squeezed in. Might just go out of my way to watch the episode from today so I dont have to wait a week.

There are two things I'm thinking about.

1. "To you 2000 years in the future..." WHAT DOES THAT MEAN. Now we know about paths this is very relevant.

2. I think both Eldia and Marley have their histories wrong. But it doesn't matter, like Krueger said. Fuck everyone outside our core team. That said, wtf did the King see? He wasn't just a wuss. Something's up that made him and his inheritors go yeah, we're better off here.
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well regarding 2000 years at least, it's pretty easy to figure something out.

The king who retreated behind the walls was the 145th King
Each king lived 13 years before passing on their power
145 Kings = 145*13=1885.
The walls have existed for 107 years
1885+107=1992.
Eren has 8 more years to live
1992 + 8 = 2000

seems as if Ymir's message, and the story of Attack on Titan, is the memories that are inherited by Eren, and it's really important that he passes them on to his successor. the message is specifically addressed to someone in the year when Eren will die and pass on his power.

... maybe?
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Pat and Woolie talking about Attack on Titan. Had a couple of the same questions as me. As fellow Anime-only, it was pretty cool. Love the hype.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX1JTBoE6aw" data-time="
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Btw how much time passed between the fall of Wall Maria and battle of Trost? And how much since then? Just a few months right?
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Yeah I remember that got mentioned, when they went to visit their old training instructor. He comments how it's only been "a few months" (since Trost) but he doesn't recognize them. Which makes sense considering all they'd been through.

Time difference between Maria and Trost is 5 years.

MariaTaylor posted...

well regarding 2000 years at least, it's pretty easy to figure something out.

The king who retreated behind the walls was the 145th King
Each king lived 13 years before passing on their power
145 Kings = 145*13=1885.
The walls have existed for 107 years
1885+107=1992.
Eren has 8 more years to live
1992 + 8 = 2000

seems as if Ymir's message, and the story of Attack on Titan, is the memories that are inherited by Eren, and it's really important that he passes them on to his successor. the message is specifically addressed to someone in the year when Eren will die and pass on his power.

... maybe?

This is genius and I never thought of it that way before, damn. The theory I was operating under was Eren eventually gains the power of all 9 titans and I don't know, gains access to the truth of what happened 2000 years ago. Or some zany time travel stuff goes down. The fact Kruger was saying things that happened in the future means memories can either travel back in time, or Eren's consciousness travels back in time, maybe to 2000 years ago, so Kruger is "remembering" a memory from the past? Heck, maybe there's even a bootstrap paradox where he becomes the "demon" that gives Ymir the power.... ah, who knows.

The bigger problem with that whole theory is Eren getting all 9 titans means he would need to eat Armin, unless they figure out a bypass to get the power without killing him.

I've basically stopped speculating at this point, I'm ready to just enjoy whatever happens next.

(edit: appropriately tagging the following as MANGA SPOILERS though. this is a complicated subject so it probably helps to be clear.)

also the biggest problem with the all 9 theory is that Pieck would need to die. if that happens I will destroy this fucking universe.
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I still like re-reading stuff and analyzing past chapters, I had a lot of fun reading the entire Marley arc a second time after everything we've seen now. but I no longer think about what will happen next.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmzrMOPkfNk&feature=youtu.be

Hey hey! New Persona 5 Valentine's OVA.
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just finished watching episode 1 of Gunbuster. I originally watched this series when I was in my early to mid 20's and I thought it was pretty average at the time. honestly, my tastes have changed a lot since then, and it's easier for me to appreciate more "classic" things within the context of when they were released.

either way though, I thought this was pretty great. noriko is given really concise characterization early on but they do it so efficiently. the first scene of all the robots training outside made me laugh. the robots in general made me laugh quite a bit. they're awesome but also comical, and that's in a good way. noriko has a solid arc in this episode.

the best thing is that I specifically remember thinking that the beginning was a bit boring and that it got great by the end. if I'm already loving the first episode I can only imagine how much more I'm going to enjoy the later stuff.
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I know it's not that kind of show, but my romcom heart hopes Jean gets Mikasa in the end. Onviously her cutting her hair because Jean complimented her is tsundere behavior.
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Gunbuster 2, another really solid ep. I like how much the captain of the ship respects COACH. literally burying noriko and onee-sama's crime so they don't get thrown into the brig. and then he picks them for the candidates of the mission on COACH's recommendation.

I want to say the highlight for me in this episode was like... literally every moment. hard to explain but while the fight was happening at the beginning I was like oh wow this is the best. but then we got character development and stuff and I was like oh wow now THIS is the best. but then the mission into space was incredibly tense and just so well done. it also had some fantastic visual shots that really stood out to me. I especially loved when COACH boards the ship and the way his red flood lights interact with the interior of the ship. it looks unique and great.

basically every major scene in this episode, while you're watching it, feels like the best part of the episode. and that's a pretty nice quality to have. really enjoyable stuff.
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main purpose of this episode was the development of coach, reinforcing the relationship between noriko and her dad, giving a strong and immediate impression on the new character jung, and introducing the idea of time being different back on earth compared to while they're on missions in space. the last thing of course being supremely important to the overall narrative. I think it did a good job of all of those things. especially in under 30 minutes.
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Disappointing last episode for AoT's season - they really went the "stretch it out" route to not encroach on the next manga chapter/start of the next arc. Very weak sneak peek of what's the come too! Still a great season though.

If the typical 2-chapters-per-episode rate is maintained and they just finished chapter 90, then a season 4 of 12 episodes would take us through chapter 114, and looks like they're at 118 so that would work?

I guess we hope for a return in the April-July 2020 timeframe (based on the starting time for each part of season 3...)

they literally just announced the final season will be fall 2020
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oh snap I didn't see that

.....okay that's later than I hoped!

And also confirmed it's the last season, I wonder how many chapters are left and it'll be like Brotherhood when the anime and manga almost end at the same time, hmm...

I really wanted to see Falco in the trenches as the end of this season, I think that would have been pretty incredible, but I didn't get my hopes up too much. I figured it wasn't likely anyway.
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I thought it was beautiful.

First, poor Hitch.

Second, there's something really sad about everyone being happy except Eren, who is keeping himself distant. I think it does a good job portraying his burden and in a way it's reminding me of the Breaking of the Fellowship. Damn

10/10 season.
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Final thought though

What the hell is going on with Annie anyway. It weirded me out that they said no Titans inside the walls. Did they forget one of the nine is in the capital? Or did I forget what happened to her? Because I'm thinking she has to wake up at some point and screw something up
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Another amazing Titan season though that was probably the least exciting of the finales and it didnt have an oh fuck I gotta see what happens next hook like the others did. Im also curious about BKs question above because it really feels like they just plain forgot all about Annie even though Armin tried to use her name as a bargaining chip a few episodes ago. Shes sure spending a lot of time being frozen

Regarding BK's final thought:

Assuming they meant "active" Titans like, roaming the landscape. Annie is still encased in crystal and deep under ground so if she ever did emerge and shift into a Titan she'd be buried under too much dirt and debris to get out.

Armin name-dropping her was a callback to the end of Season 2 when he did the same routine that resulted in them getting Eren back (with an assist from newly-one-armed Erwin). No success this time since Zeke rightly convinced him it was a bluff, they couldn't torture her without her turning into a Titan.

They probably could break the crystal if they wanted to, now that they have Thunder Spear technology, but yeah... opted to just leave it alone. These writers are so good at planning ahead that I have faith she'll come back into play at some point.