Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 248: a Perfect impeachment hearing

(+) Yeah! (+)

Honestly I'd consider voting for Biden over Ted Cruz.
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Jakyl25 posted...

Its kind of the same principle as to why I still prefer Trump over Ted Cruz

i'll grant you i'm still not sure who i prefer between those two
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though cruz is in "I TOTALLY ENDORSE TRUMP" mode now so i guess i'll take trump. if cruz is now the same slimy bastard he always was + trump's policies he really has nothing going for him.

it was a more interesting question during the campaign of the previous election!
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Jakyl25 posted...

Kind of the same principle as the theory that the President cant plead the 5th because he cant be criminally charged, and thus cant incriminate himself

That's really interesting. I like it.

I suppose it turns on whether the President can't be criminally charged because there is no one to charge him in our current system as it stands, or if he could not be criminally charged in all conceivable systems under the current Constitution.

That is, suppose Congress passed a law bringing back the office of the independent counsel - a law enforcement office that operates independently of the President and does not answer to him - would that be constitutional? If it would, then I think the President should retain his 5th Amendment right to remain silent, because his admission of crimes could well lead Congress to pass this law and then his words would be used against him.
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red sox 777 posted...

If you're going to charge him with witness intimidation or whatever based on them, then yes, that does violate his freedom of speech rights.

So it's not illegal to intimidate someone through speech? That would certainly...not hold up in any courtroom anywhere.

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HeroicSpiderPig posted...

red sox 777 posted...

If you're going to charge him with witness intimidation or whatever based on them, then yes, that does violate his freedom of speech rights.

So it's not illegal to intimidate someone through speech? That would certainly...not hold up in any courtroom anywhere.

It is, unless the speech is protected free speech. Those tweets contained basically 100% political opinions, which are the most protected of protected free speech. I didn't see anything intimidating or threatening in there. Unless there are some other tweets that were deleted that I didn't see.
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https://i.imgur.com/qtKUihs.jpg
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What

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https://twitter.com/ryanlizza/status/1195479167762141185?s=21

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Grimlyn posted...

https://i.imgur.com/qtKUihs.jpg

is this the pizazz that the media was looking for???

Trump pardons two war criminals and restores the rank of a third:

https://twitter.com/jaketapper/status/1195498457072590848?s=21

Fucking disgusting

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He pardoned them and not Roger Stone or Paul Manafort?

Like, how can Trump expect people to stay loyal to him if he won't reward the loyal ones?
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If he pardons Stone or Manafort thats another article of impeachment

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But if he proves that he will throw all of his supporters under the bus, how can he expect to win an impeachment trial? The dilemma....
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Trump has been betraying people his entire life and it hasnt cost him much of anything yet!

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red sox 777 posted...

He pardoned them and not Roger Stone or Paul Manafort?

Like, how can Trump expect people to stay loyal to him if he won't reward the loyal ones?

Id bet money he ends up pardoning Stone.


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https://twitter.com/timodc/status/1195494240723226624?s=21

Very rude of Sondland to let others overhead another Perfect phone call!

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https://twitter.com/VickyPJWard/status/1195528462846636032

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Former reasonable-ish Republican Elise Stefanik is now going all in on Trump following her bullshit stunt earlier today:

https://twitter.com/elisestefanik/status/1195507322317086725?s=21

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trump: *spends billions of dollars on the military*
stefanik: DeMoCrAtS aRe HeLl-BeNt On MaSsIvE gOvErNmEnT
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LordoftheMorons posted...

If he pardons Stone or Manafort thats another article of impeachment

It's not. He can pardon whoever he wants to.

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https://www.wsj.com/articles/mainland-chinese-soldiers-take-to-hong-kong-streets-for-first-time-since-protests-began-11573907250

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Corrik7 posted...

It's not. He can pardon whoever he wants to.

Just as how Trump firing Mueller would have been obstruction of justice, using the pardon in a corrupt way is impeachable.

Do you think the following are unimpeachable?

1. Trump sells pardons for a million bucks each
2. Trump suggests that maybe something should happen to his political opponents, and then pardons someone who assassinates one of them.
3. Trump commits crimes and then pardons himself

When abused, the pardon power destroys the rule of law.

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LordoftheMorons posted...

Just as how Trump firing Mueller would have been obstruction of justice, using the pardon in a corrupt way is impeachable.

Do you think the following are unimpeachable?

1. Trump sells pardons for a million bucks each
2. Trump suggests that maybe something should happen to his political opponents, and then pardons someone who assassinates one of them.
3. Trump commits crimes and then pardons himself

When abused, the pardon power destroys the rule of law.

The pardon power destroys the rule of law no matter how it is used.

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you mean like this?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Clinton_pardon_controversy
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Oh no, you really owned all us libs now, really nailed our hypocritical love of Bill Clinton!
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Pardons are removing the legal system from the equation. They by definition destroy the rule of law by being used. They probably shouldn't actually exist at all, so we can't really complain at their usage not being how we wish it to be used with the power being granted to it being allowed.

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https://mobile.twitter.com/jonrosenberg/status/1147911922051964928

months old memes still relevant to today's con strawmen
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Also I kind of love SmartMuffin using Wikipedia as a source despite all the alt right whinging that its part of the Soros conspiracy to silence their views and will never expose real truth
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Corrik7 posted...

Pardons are removing the legal system from the equation. They by definition destroy the rule of law by being used

Fair enough, that's basically true
Corrik7 posted...

They probably shouldn't actually exist at all

Yeah, in an ideal world they shouldn't
Corrik7 posted...

so we can't really complain at their usage not being how we wish it to be used with the power being granted to it being allowed.

bruh
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Literally this guy
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/330/819/e47.png
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https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1195764757569122305?s=21

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Guess no one's posted about Bill Barr's insane speech to the Federalist Society yet:

https://twitter.com/JoshABlock/status/1195693914872778758

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Your perception gap: 11%
On average, Republicans have a perception gap of 27%
and Independents have a gap of 20% when assessing Democrats

https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2019/11/opinions/fractured-states-perception-gap/


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The Kurds are being slaughtered right now because of Erdogan and Trump:
https://twitter.com/RichardEngel/status/1195865204850122752

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Your perception gap: -1%

On average, Democrats have a perception gap of 19%
and Independents have a gap of 13% when assessing Republicans

I was WAY too generous on Donald Trump being a flawed person, though.
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Ashethan posted...

Your perception gap: -1%

On average, Democrats have a perception gap of 19%
and Independents have a gap of 13% when assessing Republicans

I was WAY too generous on Donald Trump being a flawed person, though.

I put 100% for Democrats in regards to their country. That was my one that was the most off I think lol.

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LA Governor runoff being counted right now. Close race. (Literally 50.0-50.0 on NYT's tracker right now.)

Only ~25% of Orleans Parish in atm though and JBE leads 55k-5k in what has been counted there. Not sure what data people are saying about it overall though. Saw some talk that JBE was outpacing his earlier vote though.
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https://twitter.com/waltshaub/status/1195805707595141120

in a shocker, Trump was lying about how Doral got chosen for the G7

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Looking at the outstanding precincts in LA, I think I'd rather be JBE here but I am absolutely not a data guy. Gonna be close though.
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xp1337 posted...

Looking at the outstanding precincts in LA, I think I'd rather be JBE here but I am absolutely not a data guy. Gonna be close though.

Dave Wasserman from Cook Political Report agrees with you!
https://twitter.com/redistrict/status/1195903034737467392?s=21

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yay!

Oh, okay a good chunk of Baton Rouge and New Orleans came in and JBE went from 10k down to 11k up. ...And both those places still have about as much left as what caused that shift.

91% of the state is in overall and over half of the remaining precincts are in those two parishes. This should be over.
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Impeachment sure is backfiring on the Dems!

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Sorry for the double post, but seeing local reporters say that legislature calls also have the GOP falling short of creating a supermajority in the state house of representatives so paired with a JBE win they can't just veto override to get things done (inclduing redistricting.)
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Wasserman calls it for Edwards:

https://twitter.com/redistrict/status/1195908899708293120?s=21

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https://twitter.com/greenfield64/status/1195910533452451840

Gonna go with 23 (needs to escalate from Bevin!)

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He was down 153 points
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22.

will claim that rispone only got 27% in the first round (technically true!) and he brought him all the way up to 49. so close.

then again the pathological need to lie means he may actually inflate even that and not be satisfied with twisting the truth as badly as that scenario already would be.

so what i'm saying is 23 is a good call
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xp1337 posted...

Sorry for the double post, but seeing local reporters say that legislature calls also have the GOP falling short of creating a supermajority in the state house of representatives so paired with a JBE win they can't just veto override to get things done (inclduing redistricting.)

Whats on JBEs agenda?
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Jakyl25 posted...

Whats on JBEs agenda?

No idea, I'm not deep into LA politics! I meant that more as a "the GOP can't just ram through whatever they want by override vetos making it a symbolic win only" critically, it would mean they'd have to work with democrats on redistricting at least.

JBE himself though is kinda what people assume Manchin is. He's pro-life and pro-gun. Probably one of the most conservative Democrats in a high position. ...Kinda has to be to win in LA.
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