Current Events > The term "incel" has outlived its usefulness

(+) Yeah! (+)

The term "incel" was a term used to describe individuals, primarily men, who are involuntarily celibate. It was initially a way to describe someone who struggled with forming romantic or sexual relationships, often leading to feelings of frustration and loneliness. Ironically it was made by a woman. But the meaning has changed.

Nowadays, "incel" is frequently employed as a catch-all insult for any man deemed undesirable or disliked. It has become a sophisticated way to call someone a "loser" or "virgin," both of which are harmful in their own right. And from there this been placed on any one who was sexist. It has been placed on people who have killed their wives, random assholes, and even racist people.

This misuse underscores significant societal issues regarding the value placed on men based on their sexual conquests. It perpetuates a toxic standard where a man's worth is measured by his ability to attract women. Its transformation into a derogatory term for all manner of despicable behavior by men is troubling. This shift reflects and reinforces damaging societal norms about masculinity and sexuality.

TL;DR: Assholes should be called assholes not incels.

But asshole doesn't hit as hard as virgin.

incel was created by misogynistic men who hated that women turned them down

It's overused and misused a lot, but it isn't invalid. No different from many other terms that come up in such discussions.

Guide posted...

But asshole doesn't hit as hard as virgin.

Only assholes use virgin as an insult.

Guide posted...

But asshole doesn't hit as hard as virgin.

despite the former being the moddable one, lol

idk, I feel like "incel" has become more of a political movement, where self-described members align with MRAs.

there are also people who are involuntarily celibate, but as long as they don't have incel ideals, we don't really group them together.

rick_alverado posted...

Only assholes use virgin as an insult.

I'm quite okay with that, which proves my point.

cjsdowg posted...

The term "incel" was a term used to describe individuals, primarily men, who are involuntarily celibate. It was initially a way to describe someone who struggled with forming romantic or sexual relationships, often leading to feelings of frustration and loneliness. Ironically it was made by a woman. But the meaning has changed.

Nowadays, "incel" is frequently employed as a catch-all insult for any man deemed undesirable or disliked. It has become a sophisticated way to call someone a "loser" or "virgin," both of which are harmful in their own right. And from there this been placed on any one who was sexist. It has been placed on people who have killed their wives, random assholes, and even racist people.

I agree. I knew a guy that couldn't get a date and used that as an excuse to give laxatives to many people in retaliation. Incel.

I also know a dude bro who called women "females" and is a libertarian. Douche? Yes. Incel no not quite.

Both men suck but there are a few differences.

The internet is just a revolving door of new buzzwords to be continuously used to spread hate amongst each other.

What's worse? Outliving your usefulness, or failing them for the last time?

To me, the word incel should only be used regarding men who are super bitter, misogynistic, and blame women/society/Chads for their own problems. They don't necessarily have to be virgins, but at the very least they are currently unable to get laid.

It is NOT synonymous with virgins, as I don't ridicule people simply for that. I try to help them, assuming they even want help. People can be asexual or even just be happy alone. That's cool. I only want people to be happy with their lot in life, and not toxic toward others.

The first post doesn't catch the whole story but nevertheless calling people incels isn't any better than calling people sluts, etc.

rick_alverado posted...

Only assholes use virgin as an insult.

Only virgins use insult as an asshole.

Turducken posted...

What's worse? Outliving your usefulness, or failing them for the last time?

The former.

At least the latter implies you were given multiple chances, where as you can do everything right and still "outlive your usefulness". Getting killed for doing a good job is bullshit.

only 80's action movie villains say "you've outlived your usefulness"

Like that thread about Overwatch 2. Apparently disliking Blizzard making OW2 and canceling what they promised makes one an Incel a user said.

I have never before found a time when I aligned in perspective with someone upset about "incel" terminology

I still haven't

Last time I used the words "pretty privilege" and said they were real, someone called me an incel. I didn't even complain about my life, I just said good looking people have a way easier life, and I got called an incel.

wanderingshade posted...

Last time I used the words "pretty privilege" and said they were real, someone called me an incel. I didn't even complain about my life, I just said good looking people have a way easier life, and I got called an incel.

stupid people been using words wrong since long before incel was even a thing

doesn't mean we should stop using words

Guide posted...

But asshole doesn't hit as hard as virgin.

Calling someone an incel on the video game forum GameFAQs doesn't get you moderated, while asshole does.
Same with other buzzwords like chud. They're overused so often it becomes used out of context and basically becomes a forum friendly insult to describe people you don't like.

Diceheist posted...

The first post doesn't catch the whole story but nevertheless calling people incels isn't any better than calling people sluts, etc.

I was going to go with that, but the post got too wordy, and it takes a long time for me to edit something like that when I want to present my best ideas, and not just a fast post about Elsa or something like that.

we really should stop using words. i think we've progressed enough as a species to come up with a better form of communication than spitting obnoxious noises like cavemen and then trying to transcribe them

Lord_Ephraim posted...

Calling someone an incel on the video game forum GameFAQs doesn't get you moderated, while asshole does.
Same with other buzzwords like chud. They're overused so often it becomes used out of content and basically becomes a forum friendly insult to describe people you don't like.

The person you are responding to didn't say "incel", they said "virgin". The two are not synonymous.

rick_alverado posted...

The person you are responding to didn't say "incel", they said "virgin". The two are not synonymous.

Yeah my bad. Still, you can call someone an incel and virgin and get away with it. Some exceptions apply.

It never really had usefulness because it was either used to describe an incredibly small group that literally picked that name for themselves or as an insult mostly by people who didn't understand what it meant.

Now it is used as a synonym for pervert, asshole, misogynist, loser, etc.

cjsdowg posted...

I was going to go with that, but the post got too wordy, and it takes a long time for me to edit something like that when I want to present my best ideas, and not just a fast post about Elsa or something like that.

The way you posted it was fine, what I meant is that a lot of people would respond that there's an actual radical movement of men who call themselves incels and its existence justifies the use of the term in an insulting manner. "Involuntary celibacy" referring to the social condition but "incel" specifically referring to the toxic men.

However, like you said, it's been overused far beyond that scope.

bsp77 posted...

To me, the word incel should only be used regarding men who are super bitter, misogynistic, and blame women/society/Chads for their own problems. They don't necessarily have to be virgins, but at the very least they are currently unable to get laid.

Hm. But IIRC from the sex board. if a sexually successful individual was similarly toxic, you still haven't generally approved of them being insulted for promiscuity or anything.

I just don't think we can have this sort of favoritism where some virgins/dry spellers are fair game to be mocked for their status but no people getting around are.

Diceheist posted...

Hm. But IIRC from the sex board. if a sexually successful individual was similarly toxic, you still haven't generally approved of them being insulted for promiscuity or anything.

I just don't think we can have this sort of favoritism where some virgins/dry spellers are fair game to be mocked for their status but no people getting around are.

So you are defending toxic, misogynistic guys who blame others for their problems? Okay.

I don't insult virgins or promiscuous people. I will go after anyone for being toxic and misogynistic. Why would you assume I wouldn't?

There is def a type of thinking pattern id associate with incels (extreme pessimist + mysogyny + other manosphere/redpill influenced ideas). I know some1 that fits this quite well and they aren't even a virgin and have been in at least 1 relationship before.
He is in his 30s now and has the same world views that I had when I was in my late teens/very early 20s. I grew out of it after some life experience but he has stagnated. It's very sad to me.

Diceheist posted...

I just don't think we can have this sort of favoritism where some virgins/dry spellers are fair game to be mocked for their status but no people getting around are

Virginity / dry spells are a symptom of incelism, not the cause, tho.

AceMos posted...

incel was co-opted by misogynistic men who hated that women turned them down

fun trivia: "incel" was created by a bisexual woman.

AceMos posted...

incel was created by misogynistic men who hated that women turned them down

Wikipedia says it was created by a woman who was involuntarily celibate:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incel

Certainly it became involved in a very toxic community of misogynistic men, but TC is right that it's just being used as a generic insult now.

I never thought of it as a particularly accurate term. In this day and age, I think there's truly very few people that can legitimately be considered to be involuntarily celibate. Pretty much anyone who actually wants sex can surely get it somehow, so anyone who isn't is either fine with their situation or they just simply aren't making much of an effort to change their situation.

You might not be able to get it with the person or under the circumstances that you'd like, but that's just life. Nobody is owed that, and not getting that does not make one "celibate", it just makes you picky/entitled.

Now it just means person I dont like regardless of sexual status.

A person who has regular sex can be called an incel now just by giving vibes online.

I wouldnt use it interchangeably with virgin. For me, its come to mean people so lacking in self-awareness that they dont think that their behaviour is repellent. This often leads to them blaming other people (women as a whole, society, chads, etc) rather than realising that they are the problem.

I think the OP hit the nail on the head

bsp77 posted...

To me, the word incel should only be used regarding men who are super bitter, misogynistic, and blame women/society/Chads for their own problems. They don't necessarily have to be virgins, but at the very least they are currently unable to get laid.

Yes. These are the people who still self-identify as incels. They also have extremely low self esteem and an extremely high standard for women, like they will only fuck a virgin who is leaps and bounds beyond their league, and anyone else is a disgusting whore to them.

I also don't like it how it suddenly all wove together from "sexually inactive/unsuccessful" into a huge cloud of "failing at life / misogynist pig and asshole" with political ribbons attached to it too.

I'm also not succesfull with dating (dating plattforma gave me the worst experience in my life, and currently I lack the confidence and energy to try again) but that's just how it is.

Karovorak posted...

I also don't like it how it suddenly all wove together from "sexually inactive/unsuccessful" into a huge cloud of "failing at life / misogynist pig and asshole" with political ribbons attached to it too.

I'm also not succesfull with dating (dating plattforma gave me the worst experience in my life, and currently I lack the confidence and energy to try again) but that's just how it is.

Its mostly the online groups that led to that interpretation of it. Thats why I wouldnt use the term to just describe somebody who struggles with dating.

Glob posted...

Its mostly the online groups that led to that interpretation of it. Thats why I wouldnt use the term to just describe somebody who struggles with dating.

It's just annoying / frustrating how this fact always turns into an insult.

I mean, I'm no virgin, but #2 is just about that.

No sexual life = virgin = great insult = failure = piece of shit.

And if the discussion is less civil than it is in this topic, it's quickly full of gaslighting too.

Philip027 posted...

You might not be able to get it with the person or under the circumstances that you'd like, but that's just life. Nobody is owed that, and not getting that does not make one "celibate", it just makes you picky/entitled.

I'm guessing you are conventionally attractive? Because what you're suggesting that people can't get a date simply because they're picky is not true at all. Many people, through no fault of their own, struggle to find a partner. There are countless reasons people can have trouble getting someone lovein' . It's overly simplistic to assume that everyone who is lonely or single is just being too selective. Consider the current loneliness epidemic. If finding a partner was as easy as snapping your fingers, we wouldn't be facing such widespread isolation.

Apparently "black pilled" is the term for the shitty kind of incel who blames society for their inability to hook up with a virgin princess. It's the term they use, I should add, not a term anyone else should use.

cjsdowg posted...

I'm guessing you are conventionally attractive? Because what you're suggesting that people can't get a date simply because they're picky is not true at all. Many people, through no fault of their own, struggle to find a partner. There are countless reasons people can have trouble getting someone lovein' . It's overly simplistic to assume that everyone who is lonely or single is just being too selective. Consider the current loneliness epidemic. If finding a partner was as easy as snapping your fingers, we wouldn't be facing such widespread isolation.

Dude, unless you live in the middle of nowhere, if you cant get a date, youre doing something wrong.

cjsdowg posted...

I'm guessing you are conventionally attractive? Because what you're suggesting that people can't get a date simply because they're picky is not true at all. Many people, through no fault of their own, struggle to find a partner. There are countless reasons people can have trouble getting someone lovein' . It's overly simplistic to assume that everyone who is lonely or single is just being too selective. Consider the current loneliness epidemic. If finding a partner was as easy as snapping your fingers, we wouldn't be facing such widespread isolation.

1) No, I'm not
2) Why are you talking about getting a date? I'm talking about getting sex. That is what celibacy is referring to, no?

Glob posted...

Dude, unless you live in the middle of nowhere, if you cant get a date, youre doing something wrong.

Believe me, we know.

Strictly speaking, the lack of sex is more a symptom of a far more contemptible problem than the actual problem itself.

I'm fairly vitriolic towards incels whenever they crop up, but part of that is down to the fact that I shared similar views when I was in high school and because I eventually outgrew it, I see people who continue to hold such views as being willfully childish and immature. Recognising that you have a problem, but refusing to do a damn thing to help resolve it doesn't inspire much sympathy in me and having a laundry list of mental conditions can only help to justify it so much before you fall back into being utterly contemptible. Never had an objection to virgins (who simply haven't had sex yet, but are otherwise well adjusted), aromatics, asexuals, people who have faced a trauma that had made sex difficult or undesirable to pursue or those who are genuinely living their best life, but are simply facing a bit of a dry spell, though.

One common argument that often gets brought up is that some people find social situations of various sorts difficult to navigate. Speaking as an autistic man, I consider this to be technically true, but functionally meaningless. It may take time, but it's learnable. It's the refusal to seriously play the game and then whine that you're not winning that gets me. Hell, I have dyspraxia as well, so, I struggle to write my own fucking name at the best of times, but I'm still willing to pick up a pen when called for.

And this inability to grow up usually permeates other parts of their lives. Often jobless or at least in a particularly miserable job with no serious ambitions of improving, no social circle, whether friends or otherwise, to speak of, only hobbies tend to be escapist comfort food that, while not wrong in moderation, they absolutely don't moderate and they're just relentlessly miserable and cynical. Even beyond anything else, they are simultaneously boring and draining to communicate with.

It's not that they're failures at sex and relationships, nor is it that they're failures at life in general. The problem is that they're willful failures who are quite aware of their problems and who, in lieu of actually sorting themselves out, all but pray to the abstract concept of sex to save them. Its madness.

splodeymissile posted...

Strictly speaking, the lack of sex is more a symptom of a far more contemptible problem than the actual problem itself.

I'm fairly vitriolic towards incels whenever they crop up, but part of that is down to the fact that I shared similar views when I was in high school and because I eventually outgrew it, I see people who continue to hold such views as being willfully childish and immature. Recognising that you have a problem, but refusing to do a damn thing to help resolve it doesn't inspire much sympathy in me and having a laundry list of mental conditions can only help to justify it so much before you fall back into being utterly contemptible. Never had an objection to virgins (who simply haven't had sex yet, but are otherwise well adjusted), aromatics, asexuals, people who have faced a trauma that had made sex difficult or undesirable to pursue or those who are genuinely living their best life, but are simply facing a bit of a dry spell, though.

One common argument that often gets brought up is that some people find social situations of various sorts difficult to navigate. Speaking as an autistic man, I consider this to be technically true, but functionally meaningless. It may take time, but it's learnable. It's the refusal to seriously play the game and then whine that you're not winning that gets me. Hell, I have dyspraxia as well, so, I struggle to write my own fucking name at the best of times, but I'm still willing to pick up a pen when called for.

And this inability to grow up usually permeates other parts of their lives. Often jobless or at least in a particularly miserable job with no serious ambitions of improving, no social circle, whether friends or otherwise, to speak of, only hobbies tend to be escapist comfort food that, while not wrong in moderation, they absolutely don't moderate and they're just relentlessly miserable and cynical. Even beyond anything else, they are simultaneously boring and draining to communicate with.

It's not that they're failures at sex and relationships, nor is it that they're failures at life in general. The problem is that they're willful failures who are quite aware of their problems and who, in lieu of actually sorting themselves out, all but pray to the abstract concept of sex to save them. Its madness.

Very well put.

Its sort messed up though, people are labeled incel for the smallest criticism of a person who is female..