Poll of the Day > ''The customer is always right''

(+) Yeah! (+)

Do people actually believe this anymore?

The business is providing a service to customers. Ultimately if you arent satisfied you should go somewhere else. Also its usually rude people that say this to get what they want

no, with the amount of options people can get nowadays and how understaffed restaurants are there's bound to be some form of miscommunication. People see custom drinks or secret menu items on social media and think that workers will know what it is or would be able to make it. Workers have to juggle drive through, dining room, phone, and online orders from various food delivery apps.

I dont even know where that saying started but its always been bunk

No, I dont believe it at all. The customer can request whatever the hell they want. Its up to the business to decide whether they want to accommodate them and how much they want to charge for it. The customer can accept the terms offered or walk away.

It's a dumb saying. But the full quote is "The customer is always right, in matters of taste."

kind9 posted...

It's a dumb saying. But the full quote is "The customer is always right, in matters of taste."

Makes much more sense.

Because the customer is often wrong.

The customer is "always right" if you want to retain their business.

It's not a statement of reality, it's a statement that you as a retailer need to treat your customers as if they're in the right, even if they're being assholes. If you treat them like assholes, they're going to stop giving you their money.

You need to be agreeable, polite, and patient with customers, even if they're being argumentative or stupid. Gently steer them towards the truth, but don't be blunt or insulting.

And if they want you to cook their delicious steak ultra well done until it's little more than tasteless shoe leather, and then they want to smother it in ketchup and salt, happily enable them to do so no matter how much you may be dying inside.



SinisterSlay posted...

Makes much more sense.

Because the customer is often wrong.

Sadly, the retailer/cashier/wait staff is also often wrong.

ParanoidObsessive posted...

The customer is "always right" if you want to retain their business.

It's not a statement of reality, it's a statement that you as a retailer need to treat your customers as if they're in the right, even if they're being assholes. If you treat them like assholes, they're going to stop giving you their money.

You need to be agreeable, polite, and patient with customers, even if they're being argumentative or stupid. Gently steer them towards the truth, but don't be blunt or insulting.

And if they want you to cook their delicious steak ultra well done until it's little more than tasteless shoe leather, and then they want to smother it in ketchup and salt, happily enable them to do so no matter how much you may be dying inside.

You dont need everybodys custom. Wed gladly lose customers if they demanded a well done steak in some of the restaurants I worked
in.

"The customer is always right" isn't so much a statement of fact as it is a philosophy on customer service where customer satisfaction must be your top priority as a customer service worker.

Personally though I find the philosophy to be absolutely torturous on customer service workers. It just makes you have hundreds of bosses a day and you're always the blame.

Even though I am not a fan of the phrase and not a fan of customers, I will still try to do my utmost to satisfy a customer. The saying makes a lot more sense with the 2nd bit regarding taste. Usually, it's a matter of personal taste, however illogical. In my various job positions between the ages of 15 and 33 I have probably encountered only a few people that were extreme enough to not be able to help.

Bet
https://nypost.com/2022/08/05/brooklyn-mcdonalds-worker-shot-over-cold-fries-has-died/

Glob posted...

You dont need everybodys custom. Wed gladly lose customers if they demanded a well done steak in some of the restaurants I worked
in.

The problem is, if you do that too often, then soon enough you no longer have customers or a restaurant.

Word-of-mouth used to be the only way to torpedo a business, but now it's even easier for enough negative reviews to ruin your rep.

There are a rare few smaller businesses that have established enough of a reputation to ignore all criticism and still come out ahead. For most businesses, you essentially need to work with customers even if you outright despise them.

im always fuckin right, and if you don't think so then you are wrong, because i am always right

I've worked in retail and I can say for sure the customer is not always right. Some are very selfish, entitled and simply don't know how to conduct themselves in public.

kind9 posted...

It's a dumb saying. But the full quote is "The customer is always right, in matters of taste."

That's the same bullshit where people say that the word tip is an acronym. Both are completely made up.

Glob posted...

You dont need everybodys custom. Wed gladly lose customers if they demanded a well done steak in some of the restaurants I worked
in.

Ok I believe you.

Lol no. Most customers got their heads on their shoulders but there are always a few dumbasses and karens.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FjFrAmrIX8

high end restaurants can be picky and narcissistic about their customers if that's their brand, but average food joint's objective is to satisfy the customer and make money, not protect the cook's ego

Glob posted...

You dont need everybodys custom. Wed gladly lose customers if they demanded a well done steak in some of the restaurants I worked
in.

where was this lmao

After actually working in retail. No.

agesboy posted...

high end restaurants can be picky and narcissistic about their customers if that's their brand, but average food joint's objective is to satisfy the customer and make money, not protect the cook's ego

And honestly, if the cook's ego gets in the way of satisfying the person that's going to be eating the food, it's not an ego that's worth protecting. The sole purpose of putting anything more than the barest modicum of effort needed to survive into preparing food is the enjoyment of the people eating it. If a cook is arbitrarily unwilling to ensure that, they're a terrible cook because they've chosen to fail at their only job.

ParanoidObsessive posted...

It's not a statement of reality, it's a statement that you as a retailer need to treat your customers as if they're in the right, even if they're being assholes. If you treat them like assholes, they're going to stop giving you their money.

This only applies when the business isn't a necessity. If they have no other choice or they're other options are more inconvenient than not being an asshole, then tell them to piss off. They'll be back, begrudgingly.

ReturnOfFa posted...

where was this lmao

I worked at a couple of places with Michelin stars in the UK. We were booked up in advance months at a time, had a huge waiting list and could fill tables effortlessly.

If somebody came in wanting something like a well-done steak, theyd be politely told that it wasn't something we offered. Occasionally, and it was only occasionally, theyd get angry about that and leave. On one occasion they got abusive with the waitress and I had to remove them from the premises.

adjl posted...

And honestly, if the cook's ego gets in the way of satisfying the person that's going to be eating the food, it's not an ego that's worth protecting. The sole purpose of putting anything more than the barest modicum of effort needed to survive into preparing food is the enjoyment of the people eating it. If a cook is arbitrarily unwilling to ensure that, they're a terrible cook because they've chosen to fail at their only job.

Or theyre passionate about food and dont want to waste ingredients on people that wont appreciate them. Its not always about the money.

Glob posted...

Or theyre passionate about food and dont want to waste ingredients on people that wont appreciate them. Its not always about the money.

You can be passionate about food all you want, but if you put yourself in a position where you are responsible for delivering somebody a meal they will enjoy, and you choose not to deliver them a meal they will enjoy, you have chosen to fail. By definition of the responsibility you took on.

adjl posted...

You can be passionate about food all you want, but if you put yourself in a position where you are responsible for delivering somebody a meal they will enjoy, and you choose not to deliver them a meal they will enjoy, you have chosen to fail. By definition of the responsibility you took on.

Sorry, you don't get to demand Slipknot makes more "happy" music because they're too scary for you. And you don't get to demand a restaurant make food they're not prepared to make to satisfy your personal tastes. Not everyone needs to cater to you.

Salrite posted...

Sorry, you don't get to demand Slipknot makes more "happy" music because they're too scary for you. And you don't get to demand a restaurant make food they're not prepared to make to satisfy your personal tastes. Not everyone needs to cater to you.

If a restaurant has steak on the menu then they're prepared to make it well done.

Absolutely not. As pointed out, that's not the full quote: the actual quote is referring to matters of taste, which I am prepared to agree with. If someone orders a well-done steak, grab one of the less attractive steaks and kill two birds with one stone.

But in general? No. I worked retail for 11 years, and while many customers were pleasant, the ethos that "the customer is always right" and the bend-over-backwards appeasement approach taken by my managers created plenty of entitled, abusive monsters, including people who were serially cruel to employees, and we're seeing that mindset bleed over into things well beyond traditional retail, to exclusively negative effect. It's poisonously inhumane, and I feel like it's a great example of false consciousness that encourages customers to identify with and believe that the corporation cares about them and is more like them than the flesh-and-blood people who actually do the work.

adjl posted...

You can be passionate about food all you want, but if you put yourself in a position where you are responsible for delivering somebody a meal they will enjoy, and you choose not to deliver them a meal they will enjoy, you have chosen to fail. By definition of the responsibility you took on.

As a chef, you are not responsible for making things which are not on the menu.

Revelation34 posted...

If a restaurant has steak on the menu then they're prepared to make it well done.

As Ive already stated, thats not always the case.

Glob posted...

As Ive already stated, thats not always the case.

you've stated the only thing getting in the way of a well-done steak is ego

agesboy posted...

you've stated the only thing getting in the way of a well-done steak is ego

No, Ive stated that not all restaurants have a policy of going off menu in a way that wastes the ingredients.

You can just as easily say that ego is the only reason somebody would make the order in the first place. It takes some degree of arrogance to walk into a business, demand that they sell you something they dont offer and then get upset when you get told no.

it also takes some degree of arrogance to tell someone who booked six months in advance that you can't cook their steak a few minutes longer because of your """passion"""

agesboy posted...

it also takes some degree of arrogance to tell someone who booked six months in advance that you can't cook their steak a few minutes longer because of your """passion"""

Not if the menus clearly state how the steak is served (which they did). Its not a bait and switch.

glob got their shit kicked in over this exact thing before, about steak

he then blocked over half the board about it

Glob posted...

As a chef, you are not responsible for making things which are not on the menu.

As Ive already stated, thats not always the case.

There is no menu that states how a steak is cooked when referring to preference. Not wanting to do something isn't at all the same thing as preparing. If the steak is already there then the chef is perfectly capable of preparing it that way.

You must've run out of topics to make lol. Nobody has believed this since the 90s. Social media destroyed this concept like 15 years ago with the advent of Karen videos

Revelation34 posted...

There is no menu that states how a steak is cooked when referring to preference. Not wanting to do something isn't at all the same thing as preparing. If the steak is already there then the chef is perfectly capable of preparing it that way.

Thats just categorically false. Ive already pointed out that I worked in multiple places where the menu stipulated how it would be cooked. Ive also eaten in others where thats the case.

Youre being pedantic about semantics with the rest of your post. Being prepared to do something can be used interchangeably with being willing to do something as well as any other meanings, which Im sure you know if youre a native English speaker.

Glob posted...

Thats just categorically false. Ive already pointed out that I worked in multiple places where the menu stipulated how it would be cooked. Ive also eaten in others where thats the case.

Youre being pedantic about semantics with the rest of your post. Being prepared to do something can be used interchangeably with being willing to do something as well as any other meanings, which Im sure you know if youre a native English speaker.

Ok so I get it. Chefs are absolutely incapable of preparing a well done steak.

Revelation34 posted...

Ok so I get it. Chefs are absolutely incapable of preparing a well done steak.

I find that hard to believe.

This will be my last post to you because youre behaving like an absolute dullard.

When you go to a top level restaurant, you arent just going for some food to tide you over to your next meal. Youre going for an experience in culinary excellence, and the main person providing that is the chef. With their expertise and years of experience, one of the things theyre providing is their palette. Youre not just paying for their skill but also their understanding of the food, which is, in the vast majority of cases, going to exceed that of the customer.

If you want to eat a well done steak, thats fine. You can do that at home or at many run of the mill restaurants. But if you go to Michelin starred place with award winning chefs, you dont get to tell them they have to prepare or cook food differently from their menu just because youre a paying customer, because theres no shortage of paying customers. They dont need you, and so they dont have to compromise their vision for you.

Of course, youre entitled to not like that and to take your custom elsewhere. Just dont expect them to care.

Glob posted...

Of course, youre entitled to not like that and to take your custom elsewhere. Just dont expect them to care.

you are literally the only person in this topic talking about michelin star restaurants, which can afford to offer abnormal service solely off their reputation and the organization's prestige. the rest of us are going elsewhere, to normal restaurants where normal people eat

why are you trying to make the entire conversation about you and your niche experience

I guess to be fair I do recognize that there's a difference between certain tiers of dining. A steak house like "The Keg" (Canadian steakhouse) which presents itself as a 'fancy steak house' will make a steak to your liking. It seems fancy, and is to some extent. Still, it's not like a Michelin star place where you select something from a limited menu, if there is one at all, and they're not going to change what the meal is, what's on it, in it, or how it's cooked. But also, like ages said, the majority of people are not going to Michelin star places. Even on the upper end of what the average person deems as fancy - they'd be pretty stupid to refuse to cook someone's steak a little more, especially when they always offer different levels of how 'done' it will be.

I worked at a remote fishing lodge that had menus where you didn't get to alter anything. The patrons were millionaires and billionaires. Well, some of the billionaires brought their own food for us to prepare, which was unique. But yeah, that isn't my average dining experience.

agesboy posted...

you are literally the only person in this topic talking about michelin star restaurants, which can afford to offer abnormal service solely off their reputation and the organization's prestige. the rest of us are going elsewhere, to normal restaurants where normal people eat

why are you trying to make the entire conversation about you and your niche experience

Its not that niche. If youve never experienced it, thats on you.

But regardless of how niche it is or isnt, its still applicable when people use the phrase The customer is always right.

When somebody makes a generalisation, bringing up instances where it doesnt apply is exactly how you challenge that generalisation.

If you wanted to say that some businesses need to live by the philosophy of the customer always being right, Id agree with you. It just isnt universally applicable.

Glob posted...

Its not that niche. If youve never experienced it, thats on you.

But regardless of how niche it is or isnt, its still applicable when people use the phrase The customer is always right.

When somebody makes a generalisation, bringing up instances where it doesnt apply is exactly how you challenge that generalisation.

If you wanted to say that some businesses need to live by the philosophy of the customer always being right, Id agree with you. It just isnt universally applicable.

As a personal opinion, I would call it fairly niche - and dependent on region. If you're in the UK - sure. In Canada, the Michelin Guide has only been present since 2022 - and I'm out west. Vancouver has 10 Michelin-star restaurants. This is quite a bit more niche than the majority of things people do. Fine dining is something a lot of people partake in. Michelin-star dining represents a small segment of that - which would by definition be more niche.

I only hear about people maybe considering going to a Michelin-star restaurant if they are traveling abroad, like in Europe or Japan. And usually that's a huge maybe, because it's (generally) significantly more costly than a lot of other exciting culinary fare. You mention the desire to 'experience' it - and that is a very big part of it! It's an exciting thing that people definitely have an interest in. Still, it's a less accessible experience due to economics and geography. People often have a desire to experience it which they will pass on due to these factors.

It depends on the situation.

Glob posted...

But regardless of how niche it is or isnt, its still applicable when people use the phrase The customer is always right.

the phrase, as already pointed out, is an outward attitude, not an absolute statement

things don't always mean what they read literally, which Im sure you know if youre a native English speaker

absolutely nobody agrees with that statement with no caveats or further explanation

the customer is always right including if they are murdering you \_()_/

Salrite posted...

And you don't get to demand a restaurant make food they're not prepared to make to satisfy your personal tastes.

Unless a restaurant is genuinely so close to maxing out their production capacity that leaving a steak on the grill for an extra few minutes constitutes a meaningful lost opportunity cost (which isn't impossible, but should be a fairly rare occurrence if the restaurant is designed with a reasonable amount of surge capacity), every restaurant that prepares steak is prepared to cook it well-done. We're not talking about somebody asking for ingredients that aren't available or cooking methods that aren't feasible, we're talking about doing the exact same thing they'd do to cook a steak to any other doneness, just more.

Salrite posted...

Sorry, you don't get to demand Slipknot makes more "happy" music because they're too scary for you.

The key distinction being that Slipknot isn't making music for me. If I'm ordering food in a restaurant, that food is being made for me and me alone (putting aside for now the possibility of sharing my dish with others because it's not particularly relevant). If that food does not satisfy my tastes, the chef has failed in their duty to provide me food that I enjoy. In some cases, that failure may be my fault, for example if I didn't read the menu properly and accidentally ordered something I don't like. In some cases, it may be the restaurant's fault, if perhaps the menu doesn't accurately describe the dish. If it's because the chef arbitrarily chooses not to prepare the food I want, though, that failure is entirely because the chef has chosen to fail.

Your analogy would work better if I were personally commissioning Slipknot to write something for me. In that case, I absolutely would get to demand that they make music I wanted, and if they couldn't/wouldn't do so, that would be a failure on their part.

Glob posted...

No, Ive stated that not all restaurants have a policy of going off menu in a way that wastes the ingredients.

That you're even framing it like that means it's nothing more than ego stroking. If ingredients are used to serve a paying customer a dish they enjoy, and no greater quantity of ingredients is used to achieve that satisfaction, they have served their purpose and cannot be considered to be wasted by any objective metric. You only consider it a "waste" because your ego depends on the idea that you know better than your customer what they like to eat.

Now, saying this, anyone who pays hundreds of dollars for a steak and asks for it well done is an idiot. Their money is what's being wasted, in that cooking an expensive steak well done wipes out the vast majority of the characteristics that make it expensive and they can expect a similar experience from any cheap steak. In that regard, anyone asking for an expensive steak to be cooked well done should be advised by the waiter that that's not a very good idea, for the sake of educating them about what they're trying to spend so much money on. If they still want it well done, though, that's their choice and any insistence on not satisfying that is nothing more than self-fellating elitism.

You cant acknowledge that overcooking a high quality steak ruins it while also claiming that its not being wasted.

A dog wouldnt particularly care how a steak is cooked, but most people arent feeding them A5 because it would be wasted as they will enjoy a cheaper cut/quality just as much.

Now, you might think it comes across as arrogant for a chef to think they know better than their customer, but its only arrogant if they dont know better. If somebody is ordering an expensive steak well done, then they certainly are less informed than any high level chef.

That statement isn't correct, but as has already been said, you should act as if the customer is always right.

That said, a business's pre-existing rules come first. "No shoes, no shirt, no service", and so on.

Glob posted...

You cant acknowledge that overcooking a high quality steak ruins it while also claiming that its not being wasted.

if they enjoy it, it's definitionally not being wasted. everyone's experience is unique. like, i enjoy my scrambled eggs a little too burnt for most people. that's entirely personal preference, there's not a "correct" way to cook anything