No, they're morons for fucking themselves over because they can't psychologically handle voting for the lesser evil. They're unironically virtue signaling in that scenario.What they are doing is leveraging their power as a voter to affect a necessary change through political action. If Biden truly believes he'll lose the election because of these voters withholding their vote, and he truly believes that he must beat Trump at all costs, then surely you would agree that he MUST take action against Israel in order to meet their demands. If he doesn't do that, then it MUST mean that he either can't take any meaningful action, in which case he doesn't deserve the office, or he doesn't really believe those things.
I don't think either land back or Hamas leaving is at all realistically on the table, but it would still be better for the fighting to stop. That's why it's a ceasefire and not a peace plan for the Middle East.
I don't think either land back
or Hamas leaving is at all realistically on the table
What they are doing is leveraging their power as a voter to affect a necessary change through political action. If Biden truly believes he'll lose the election because of these voters withholding their vote, and he truly believes that he must beat Trump at all costs, then surely you would agree that he MUST take action against Israel in order to meet their demands. If he doesn't do that, then it MUST mean that he either can't take any meaningful action, in which case he doesn't deserve the office, or he doesn't really believe those things.
Also, your use of the phrase "virtue signal" in this context, where we are talking about war crimes and genocide, is absolutely disgusting, to be frank.
Threatening to not vote, as if the worse case scenario winning will usher in those supposed values you claim to care about so much.... but instead worse usher in the exact opposite far worse is not a winning strategy either.Feel like you're comparing two vastly different situations here. Either way, the only power most voters have is their vote. Biden knows that this issue is important to those that will vote for him. Not changing his stance here (to not supporting a genocide, mind you a very easy stance to take for most people) knowing that it could cost him the election is dumb.
In fact it's even worse. How'd that bright plan work for woman's rights amd civil rights supporters who stayed home in 2016. It got them a conservative Supreme Court.
What they are doing is leveraging their power as a voter to affect a necessary change through political action. If Biden truly believes he'll lose the election because of these voters withholding their vote, and he truly believes that he must beat Trump at all costs, then surely you would agree that he MUST take action against Israel in order to meet their demands. If he doesn't do that, then it MUST mean that he either can't take any meaningful action, in which case he doesn't deserve the office, or he doesn't really believe those things.Those people don't know what leverage means if they think thats a strong leverage to get what they want. You aren't leveraging anything by threatening to make your life or others peoples life worse. It's not even leverage to help Palestinians given them not voting actually makes their life worse.
Also, your use of the phrase "virtue signal" in this context, where we are talking about war crimes and genocide, is absolutely disgusting, to be frank.
Oh are we pretending CNN is not a right wing network?
Also, your use of the phrase "virtue signal" in this context, where we are talking about war crimes and genocide, is absolutely disgusting, to be frank.Scratch a liberal etc etc
What type of action would people be willing to accept for Biden regarding Israel?Why don't you ask the people making the demands? What have they said?
Are you confident that that action will win him more votes than he loses in important states?That's a political calculation for Biden to make. If he thinks he can win an election by capitulating to Israel's ongoing genocide of Palestinians, then I'm sure that's what he'll do.
Scratch a liberal etc etcYou know, even as recently as a year ago I would scoff at that saying. I'm not scoffing anymore.
Why don't you ask the people making the demands? What have they said?No more weapons to Israel, military support, or protection in the UN is what I've noticed I think.
Those people don't know what leverage means if they think thats a strong leverage to get what they want.So what would suggest they do/use as leverage instead?
No more weapons to Israel, military support, or protection in the UN is what I've noticed I think.Sounds pretty reasonable to me.
CNN supports Trump?CNN supports the status quo of neoliberalism.
Sounds pretty reasonable to me.Maybe. Like I said in an earlier post
No protection in the UN??? Wont that alienate a TON of Jewish American voters???Are you saying that Jewish American voters might LET TRUMP WIN by withholding their vote? Don't they know that Trump's policies would be worse? Why would they do that?
Are you saying that Jewish American voters might LET TRUMP WIN by withholding their vote? Don't they know that Trump's policies would be worse? Why would they do that?
CNN supports the status quo of neoliberalism.
I don't get why most people on CE also don't seem to believe in strategic messaging.
Because they are not GOP voters...so they are intellectually dishonest
Yes they would be extremely fucking stupid to let the guy who keeps accidentally quoting hitler into the WHSounds like they could get on board then. What's the issue?
Im just asking why no UN protection is necessaryIt's not necessary and it's not coherent anyway to say there's a firm list of what needs to happen for people upset about Gaza to stop talking about it. Since there's not, the interest is in getting Israel's mass killing using US taxpayer dollars to stop, and there's several avenues to that.
Ah yes, wonderful choice. Nothing will send a stronger message to democrats thandoing their part to help a dictator get back in office?This but unironically.
So when should they use that leverage? When will there ever not be a worse choice when it comes to the GOP?
Biden could earn these votes back if he did the objectively right thing and stopped providing billions of dollars worth of weapons to Israel.
CNN supports Trump?The new CEO or lead wants CNN to be nicer to Trump supporters. Or at least he did a year or 2 ago. I haven't kept up with it.
Sounds like they could get on board then. What's the issue?
many people that want to unironically see a trump presidency, and a worse fate for Palestine in this thread. yall are nutsNo one wants that.
No one wants that.lol ok
No one wants that.Aside from the usual bad faith actors in this topic (they know who they are), there are genuine left leaning posters here who definitely want to unironically see a trump presidency, and a worse fate for Palestine in this thread. Not understanding the "leverage" they think they have is actually nothing that actually helps the Palestinians given what their non vote means for the Palestinians.
Start at the local/state level and maybe not in a race that is 100% going to be a Biden vs Trump repeat. If you have democrat reps in the house/senate that do not represent the will of the people, vote them out with democrats that DO represent the will of the people.
If we start voting people out in those elections, you have a far better chance, at least IMO, to leverage tactics like this ahead of a presidential raceso long as you do it early enough, anyway. Just my $.02.
The person you quoted is right though: threatening to abstain at a time when the opposition is a fascist dictator is not a good look.
They're not even saying they refuse to vote or vote for Biden
Aside from the usual bad faith actors in this topic (they know who they are), there are genuine left leaning posters here who definitely want to unironically see a trump presidency, and a worse fate for Palestine in this thread. Not understanding the "leverage" they think they have is actually nothing that actually helps the Palestinians given what their non vote means for the Palestinians.
There are people saying that though. I dont know why you don't see this.