If you follow him a little bit more, the Master Fisherman will talk to various people around town. He's quite the popular guy around town! He'll go to see his "pupil," who has finally managed to get his line to land in the water! Huzzah! He'll talk with the boy and the owner of the shop about FH some more, and the shop owner will explain that it was the Master Fisherman who came up with the name of the town. Squall will ask him how he came up with it, and uhhhh....Well, it sounded like a cool name and no one really complained, so it stuck. 'whoops' No real deep meanings here! After all that's over and done with, the Master Fisherman will give you a Megalixir for your trouble, and he'll offer to have the Familiar Faces escort you back to the beginning of town and do a quick jump, heck yeah.
Anyway, once you hit the aforementioned trigger point, Irvine will tell Squall that Selphie's feeling a bit down right now, and he wants him to go talk to her since he's kind of become everyone's leader. Irvine knows he's a bit awkward when it comes to this sort of stuff, so he'll be there to back up him. Squall agrees to at least talk to her, and we're off to the Quad! When you get there, the stage that had been set up before has totally collapsed due to the Garden crashing into FH, and Selphie's all upset because it means she won't be able to have a band perform for the Garden Festival like she had wanted.
Squall can tell she's really down, and you can either try to cheer her up yourself, or you can just pass the buck to Irvine. If you try to cheer her up, Squall will say that he's sure she can still do something. Selphie will be surprised that he's being so sensitive. He was the last person she expected to try to cheer her up. Squall will wonder what's so weird about all of this. He cares just like everybody else. It's just that there are too many things that can't be helped, so why talk about them? In other words, he doesn't have a problem trying to talk to Selphie because this is a problem that can be fixed. No use in talking about things you can't control, but things you can control are fine.
Selphie will see that Squall has gone off into his "own little world," and he won't share anything. Squall will wonder why she's teasing him when he was just trying to help. You can see how much Squall really cares about what others think of him despite his protests. We've seen it on a few occasions in FH already. It bothers him that she doesn't think he cares, especially now that they're friends. He may not know how to express it, but he does care. And as much as he says he's fine with being misunderstood, it does bother him when people he cares about misread his intentions. He's fine with it with people he doesn't know or care about himself, but it bothers him when his friends don't understand him.
At this point, Cid will call for Squall over the intercom, and he'll leave it all up to Irvine, who will gladly step in. He says he'll get the technicians to fix up the stage for her so she can have her band perform on her stage. Of course, Irvine is doing this all with the ulterior motive that this is gonna get him in good with Selphie so he can sweep her off her feet and all. That sly dog, I tell ya.
If you sent Rinoa to the missile base instead, the scenario will be a little different. She will say that she missed Squall. She thought she was going to die at the missile base, and that's when she really missed him. Unfortunately, I can't find a script that actually has all the scenarios on it, and like I said, I brought Rinoa with me to Garden, so I can't really do it from memory. I usually bring her with me anyway, so I haven't seen this scene as much. The only one I can find is the positive answer where Squall says he really wanted to see Rinoa, too. Of course, hearing this will make her very happy, and she can't believe he said that. Very sweet, right? I know it's all "optional" dialogue so I can't really use it for HINTS, but hey, it's definitely there and accessible! I'll keep looking around for another script and see if I can find the other two dialogue branches, but for now, let's move on.
If you talk to the mayor, he'll say, "I guess you saved my life," and Squall will apologize for butting in. Dobe will say it's fine, but he's not thanking him for it all the same. Squall will say it's not like he has to thank him, but...at this point, you're given the option to try to explain yourself to him, or you can just drop it and go home. Squall's speech here is pretty good if you choose to follow through with it. He wishes Dobe could be a little more understanding of them and realize that SeeDs aren't just warmongers. It's hard for him to explain, but he wishes they could live in a world without violence and solve things by discussion. However, that sometimes takes too much time, especially if the other side isn't willing to listen, so fighting is inevitable sometimes. In the end, Squall says that he thinks the world needs both people like SeeDs and people like Mayor Dobe and hopes he understands that someday. He gives him the SeeD salute and heads off.
As you head back up to the lift, Irvine will be there to meet you. He'll tell you that Cid gave the okay to let the technicians into the Garden, and they're fixing it up now. Then he asks if it's okay to ask them to do a couple of side jobs. Squall doesn't really seem to understand what he's getting at, but he says it should be fine as long as it doesn't slow down the work on Garden. At this point, you can finish up the Master Fisherman sidequest, but there's a sort of unintentional humor involved. You can complete the entire sidequest with Irvine following you around, and when you head back to the Garden, you'll hit a trigger point where Squall asks Irvine why he's following him and if he needs anything else. It's just kinda funny that he asks that because he's followed you around to so many places at this point if you finish up the Master Fisherman stuff, and THEN he'll get curious about why Irvine is following him.
Anyway, if you head back to the Master Fisherman, he'll talk to you some more, and he starts to take a liking to you, so he wonders if you might like to meet him at the inn later on ("Listen dude, I appreciate the offer and I'm sure you're a fine old man, but I uhhh prefer someone a bit younger...and more female"). As disturbing as this sounds, if you take him up on it, he'll give you a history lesson on the origin of FH. The people of FH were originally pacifist technicians from Esthar who got tired of having their skills exploited for military purposes, so they left to settle their own town where they could live in peace. Dobe was a politician in Esthar at the time, and though he originally opposed the move, he eventually went with them and became their leader. The Master Fisherman just wants you to understand their culture a little better is all.
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"The great GF...Bahamut." "...GF? I...? Using my powers...It is you humans...I fear..."
After the fight, we get one of the more interesting Squall/Rinoa moments in the game, if only because you have up to six possible outcomes (Three for Rinoa coming back to Garden with you and three for Rinoa being on the missile base team). As the tank falls into the sea, Selphie and the other two party members slowly crawl out of it and onto the platform with the rest of the party. At this point, Squall is so surprised to see them and so relieved that they're okay that he actually gives a rare outward display of happiness, saying that it's good to see them again. The missile base people ask if the Garden is okay, and Squall tells them that it's safe.
Squall asks the missile base people what happened to them, but your other party members will say we can talk about it later. Squall reluctantly agrees and asks them to take them back to Garden. He's going to take a look around town first. Afterward, Rinoa will hang around to talk. If she went back to Garden with Squall, she'll say how surprised she was to see you look and sound so happy to see everyone. It was the first time she's seen him be so honest, and she thought it was really sweet.
At this point, Squall is given three possible responses. You can say that it was because you felt responsible for them, and he was worried about them. Rinoa asks if that's all it is, and he isn't sure what more she wants from him. She seems a little disappointed, but she says it's great that everyone's okay and it must be a great relief for Squall to see them safe. Then she'll leave.
You can tell Rinoa that you actually were happy to see them, and he asks if there's something surprising or wrong about that. Rinoa says of course not because they're his comrades, but more than that, they're his friends. Squall kind of mulls over the idea of them being friends in his mind, as if he hadn't really thought of it that way before. Then Rinoa will ask him if he would've been worried about her if she had been on the missile base team instead. At this point, Squall will stutter and not really know what to say, and Rinoa will tease him and say he's blushing. She says it's cute that he's taking the question so seriously, but Squall doesn't understand why she's toying with him like that (because she likes you, dummy!). Then she'll give him a little flirty wave and be all like, "Catch ya later, Squall" and leave. Honestly, I think this is the best choice out of the three, not because it's the most pro-Squall/Rinoa, but because I like the direction it takes his character as a whole, opening up to people and being a little more free with his feelings. It's a good side of him. Plus, it's the genuine, honest answer, because he really was happy to see them.
Of course, you can be a big, dull dud and tell Rinoa that it didn't mean anything, but she won't believe you. Squall will ask what she expected, and she says maybe a little care and affection. Yet Rinoa knows he's just being dishonest. She knows that he really cares about them, even if he won't admit it, but she'll leave him alone about it. It's interesting how perceptive she is of him even at this point in the game. As much as he tries to hide who he really is, she can see through him, at least to an extent.
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"Why must we always choose between certain death and probable death?" "I'm in an epic battle to the death, FIGURE IT OUT YOURSELF!"
As you leave Dobe's house, one of your party members will comment about how much the guy annoyed them, but Squall says it's better to just forget about it because you can't expect everyone to welcome them everywhere they go. As you run back up the stairs, an FH citizen will run down past you screaming about Galbadian soldiers. If you go back and talk to them, the guy will say that they arrived at the station heavily armed. Dobe says that he's acquaintances with President Deling, so he'll go talk to them and work things out. Squall tells him that Deling is dead and Galbadia is under the control of the sorceress now. If you talk to Flo, she'll say that a sorceress is still a person, so you can still reach an understanding with her, right? But Squall's like how the heck should he know.
If you run back up the stairs to head for the station, Mayor Dobe and Flo will follow after you, blaming this whole mess on you and saying you'd better take responsibility for it. However, the mayor doesn't want to rely on SeeD because they won't be able to solve this without violence, so he's going to deal with this personally. Squall realizes that this is a big mess just waiting to happen, so we'd better follow him. When we get to the station, we find Dobe talking to a Galbadian officer. I just love Zell's line here. "It kills me to help that old fart." Classic. Squall wonders why they'd bother wasting time with the mayor if they're after Garden, so he figures he'd better listen in and figure out what's going on.
We overhear Dobe saying he doesn't know anyone by the name of Ellone, which catches Squall's attention. The officer says that's fine. They're going to torch the city anyway, Edea's orders. Then he'll grab the mayor by the throat and pick him up off the ground. At this point, you can either leap to his rescue or listen for a little longer. Choosing to listen a little longer is kind of funny considering the situation, so I like picking it. Squall's like "Hmmm I wonder why Edea wants Ellone better listen some more" and everyone else is "Dude what are you doing let's go!"
When the officer sees you, he calls for the IRON CLAD and drops Dobe to the ground. It's pretty interesting that Squall takes the time to apologize to the mayor before they fight, telling him that they have no choice. I think it says a lot about him that he'd be considerate of the wishes of others, even when they've done nothing but badmouth and annoy the heck out of him the whole time he's been there. After we beat a couple of Galbadian soldiers and the officer, this...big blue tank drives onto the scene on the road above, and then it...LEAPS all the way down right in front of Squall. How in the heck does that thing have those kind of hydraulics on it?! How in the heck is this thing even functional at all?
As you know, the other three party members are tucked away inside, so it's one of those "Why would they attack you?" issues. If you read Selphie's Diary afterward, she'll say that they managed to hide away in there to survive the explosion, but then a Galbadian troop found the machine and basically dragged them along. They couldn't figure out how to make it work, and they couldn't get out. Selphie promises she wasn't trying to attack you! They just didn't know what they were doing! Honest! The whole thing feels silly and almost self-deprecating, like Square knew the whole scenario was bull and ran with it anyway. None of it really makes sense: How the tank survived an explosion that big, how Selphie and company couldn't get out, couldn't control it, and how Galbadia never figured out they were inside or anything of the sort.
Oh right, the boss fight itself is really easy, but you can steal a nice Adamantine from it, so do that before you kill it!
Also, I want people doing more than just paying attention! It's kind of frustrating to type a bunch of stuff and not have anyone say anything about it!
It's one of the reasons I stopped doing that 3-D Mario run because it was just me doing writeups!
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"I can set you free, mate." "My freedom was forfeit long ago!"
I think the NORG stuff could've been better with some proper buildup because the whole inner Garden conspiracy stuff had potential if they'd fleshed it out a bit more. But it was all thrust upon you so suddenly, and ended just as suddenly. Oh well.
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"So cold. I am always by your side." "There ain't no gettin' off of this train we on!"
From: Panthera | #274 I'm a pacifist! Acquire ultimate destructive magic power in my house!
I'm pretty sure that Ultima Draw Point is a one-time-use-only one, so there must be some sort of deep meaning behind him never using the most powerful and destructive spell in the game despite having it readily accessible!
Either that, or he puts it to more practical uses because Ultima junctions well to everything!
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"Hold on a minute! That testimony stinks!" "Witness! You can't just say 'Hello' and expect us to get anywhere! I want you to testify!"
You can head down a ladder before you get to the lift and reach the old fisherman from before, and he'll give you an Occult Fan III for speaking to him. He'll also ask you to check on his pupil down at the docks and see how he's doing. It's pretty interesting here that you meet Familiar Face #1, Familiar Face #2, and Familiar Face #3. I'm not entirely sure what the significance of naming them all that is, or why Squall can't seem to tell them apart. Maybe it's a GF side effect reference or something? I dunno.
Anyway, Familiar Face #3 in particular is not very welcoming of you. The other guys will be sociable and operate the lifts for you. One of them will ask you if you're headed to Esthar. Most people who pass through FH go there since the trains no longer run there. The third guy will ask you if you're happy being a mercenary, fighting anybody for money. Then he says it's really none of his business as long as they don't cause any trouble. Squall realizes this guy kinda sounds like him, and he notes that it doesn't sound very nice to be on the receiving end of it.
If you head to the docks, you can find the Master Fisherman's pupil, who is just some little kid in a boat. After you talk to him for a bit, he tries to show off his mad fishing skills, only to completely fail to even land his line in the water. We even get some sort of surreal display of the technical limitations of the game where the kid accidentally gets his fishing line wrapped around the store owner's neck, and he sort of levitates in the air to symbolize that he's been caught, and Squall does some weird hand motion thing to free him or something. What in the world did I just watch? Anyway, the store owner gets so angry that he starts yelling at the boy in all caps and yellow and red letters. It's pretty crazy.
When you head toward the mayor's house, you can step off to the side of his house and find Martine, former master of Galbadia Garden. He'll tell you how he was banished from Garden, and after wandering around aimlessly for a while, the people of FH welcomed him with open arms even though he had nothing to offer them in return and encouraged him to start over. If you challenge him to a card game, he'll say that he confiscated all the cards from the Galbadia Garden students. That's not a very fair way to build your deck, but whatever works, I guess!
Finally, we head into the mayor's house and meet Mayor Dobe (is it pronounced with just one syllable like "Dope," or is it pronounced "Doh-bee" like Kobe Bryant, or is it "Doh-bay" like Pokemon?) and his wife Flo, who actually does not sell insurance for Progressive. As soon as you sit down to talk, the mayor will ask you when you're leaving. Squall answers that they'll leave as soon as the Garden is capable of moving, but they don't know when that will be. They only recently learned that it was mobile at all, so they're still trying to figure out how to control it. Dobe says his technicians will be able to repair everything for them, but Squall needs to get Cid's permission to let outsiders into the Garden first.
As you get up to leave, one of your party members will ask Mayor Dobe why he's so opposed to them being in FH, which irritates Squall because there was no need to ask that question. He will say that they oppose using force to resolve conflict, and they believe any problem can be settled by discussion. If both sides reach a mutual understanding, there is no need to fight. Violence will only lead to more violence. Squall agrees that this method is preferable, but it's not exactly realistic. It's also trite and dull to boot. Before you leave, make sure you use the Ultima Draw Point in Dobe's house!
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"So cold. I am always by your side." "There ain't no gettin' off of this train we on!"
And really, this was part of the reason I wasn't really looking forward to the FFVIII part of this playthrough topic to begin with, despite how much I love the game.
Only two or three people care enough to even respond to what I'm saying because it's FFVIII and so many people don't like the game enough to follow along. There's no discussion. No nothing. Playing FFVI, FFVII, and FFT was fun because there were multiple people who actually seemed to comment every time I played the game and wrote about it. I'm sure we'll get back to "fun times" when I finish VIII because Board 8 likes IX and X.
But then we'll pretty much go dead once we hit X-2, XII, and XIII.
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"Why must we always choose between certain death and probable death?" "I'm in an epic battle to the death, FIGURE IT OUT YOURSELF!"
Heck, I don't even mind nitpicking at stuff in fun because it can be fun. But when we start taking that stuff seriously like it legitimately ruins the credibility of the game, then it's going to be hard to have a meaningful discussion because we just have two totally different mindsets regarding this game.
So yeah, feel free to post your problems and complaints about this game. Just don't expect much from me in way of reply if it's making a big deal out of something trivial. I'm not trying to come across as defensive or acting like I don't want anyone to disagree with me, but my word, there are a million different things we can talk about that are more important or more interesting than this!
I don't mind dissenting opinions. In fact, I'd much rather discuss stuff rather than post and not have anyone say anything.
However, I'm not really interested in discussing things like how you can't take SeeD seriously because of four people, three of whom just became SeeDs, and you can't even do something as basic as take Square at their word regarding the organization because of four people's failures, some of which were preventable and some of which were not.
If you want to talk about stuff that's actually pertinent to the story and to the game, then I'm all for it. This stuff about Quistis proving the incompetence of SeeD as a whole isn't really pertinent. It's a minor annoyance, at least that's how I see it. It doesn't really have anything to do with this game or with this story. But the only person who's posting in this topic who really cares about the stuff you're complaining about is probably NeoElfboy, and he doesn't even care about FFVIII enough to follow very much.
Now let's get away from nitpicking about minor plot details and complaining that Square didn't do things the way we wanted them to (because when you reject the basic trust between author and reader and refuse to take them at their word in things like this, there's really no point in arguing anymore), and get back to something that's actually fun!
As Squall wakes up from another nap, Rinoa is there to greet him again and asks him if he wants to go for a walk. He asks her why she wants to do this again, but she says that last time was a guided tour. This time, it's just a walk. Squall tells her she can go by herself. It's safe here. Rinoa protests that it's not that she wants to have a guard or something. She's doing it more for him. He's always too deep in thought, so she wants to just go for a walk to take his mind off of things. You can accept or you can refuse, and she doesn't get upset if you say no.
Also, a similar scene will occur if you brought Quistis along instead of Rinoa. She'll tell Squall that he's looking pensive, and she'll ask him if he wants to be alone. He says it's not like that. Then Quistis reminds him if the night he gave her the cold shoulder in the Secret Area the night he became a SeeD, and she asks him if maybe he understands now how she felt back then, just needing someone to talk to. Squall will concede that he thinks he understands now. Quistis offers to talk over tea, or he can just go talk to a wall, whichever he prefers. Squall says he DOES feel like talking, and off we go, although we don't actually get to have that talk. It's pretty neat seeing the difference between Squall now and Squall back then in how he reacts to Quistis here. You can tell he's changed.
Unfortunately, you don't get any scenes with Zell or Irvine along these lines. If you brought back a sausage fest to Garden, then Squall just wakes up and goes about his business by himself. When you head out into the hallway, Cid will speak over the intercom, announcing that we're finally back online! His enthusiasm is short-lived, however, as he lets out a big "WHOA!" and we cut to some old dude fishing on the wharf. Suddenly, Balamb Garden comes rolling into view just as his line gets a bite. Sadly, the old fisherman is forced to abandon his big catch and flee for his life.
Cid tells Squall to meet him in his office, and when he gets there, he lets him know that they've landed at Fisherman's Horizon. He asks him to go ashore with your other two party members, whoever they are at this point in the game, and find the local mayor to deliver an official apology from Garden. He tells him to take a look around the city while he's there, too. Squall is kind of confused why he's being asked to do something like this, and Cid catches his uncertainty and tells him that SeeD is more than a special combat force. He wants them to see the world and broaden their horizons. He has especially high hopes for Squall, so he wants him to go take care of this. And finally, I'm able to get the Seifer card from him! About time! Let's hit it!
When you step outside, some people from FH are there to meet you and give you a warning not to engage in any sort of armed conflict while they are here. They do not tolerate belligerence of any sort. Squall agrees and says that they've come in peace. The FH guys seem to find this hard to believe, but after a moment of silence, they welcome them to town and invite them to visit the mayor at the center of town. FH is a really beautiful place, I think. I really love the design, the setting, the style, especially the big...blue thing around the mayor's house, which I've always kind of assumed is some sort of solar energy panel system. Oh, and of course, the music is awesome. Orchestrated version of it is really good, too:
From: Panthera | #265 You genuinely think that someone completely ignoring their job means they're awesome as long as something else happens to make the job get done.
No wonder you don't think Quistis is a moron.
No, I genuinely think your counterexamples are stupid and pointless as far as the story is concerned, so I don't take them seriously, because you're grossly overthinking things and blowing things out of proportion.
It's a video game. I really don't give a crap about minor details like this. They obviously bother you, but I'm not really going to concern myself with it anymore.
From: Panthera | #263 They're the only ones we really see doing anything. We hear about how SeeD is supposed to be amazing, but we don't see it play out much.
I'm not entirely sure why this means SeeD isn't a successful organization, because it doesn't. SeeD is well respected, well known, and well utilized throughout the world, whether we see it or not.
So if you hire me to mow your lawn, and I run off and get drunk instead, and by complete coincidence, a lawnmower happens to roll down the hill and magically bounce around your lawn in the right pattern to leave it perfectly nice looking, I did a good job?
If the task is GET THE LAWN MOWED NO MATTER WHAT OR WE ALL DIE I DON'T CARE HOW YOU DO IT, then yes
Also, if I don't hire you and you somehow mow my lawn anyway for free, we're also all good.
(You know, because they weren't hired for this job. This is just something they did on their own)
They didn't really fail with Dollet. They succeeded in what they were paid to do, which was get Galbadia to pull out. The Communications Tower really had nothing to do with it. Not really sure how you consider the missile base thing a failure just because the missiles launched. The whole point of it was to stop Balamb Garden from getting nuked, which...well, they did. Doesn't matter if it didn't happen just like they drew it out. If we want to grade success on how much things hold to the plan, then most people in any medium fail at everything!
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"I can set you free, mate." "My freedom was forfeit long ago!"
From: X_Dante_X | #001 Do not be fooled, boko hasn't seen an episode of my little ponies in his life. In fact, I don't think anyone in the division has.
As someone in Boko's division, I can confirm this.
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Guess who I am! http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs3/1345748_o.gif