Lurker > Kirby321

Lopen posted...

So I think 3 scum exist in

Peaf x Dumey
Kirby x FD
Ulti x Red
Lopen x Chris

Would prefer all 4 break up and collect the lost souls

Why don't you take the lead, Lopen? Set a good example

Aight. I doubt there's gonna be much of a fight between Death, Corrik, and Isquen, so let's look at the existing pairs:

Red and Ulti
Peaf and Dumey
Sultan and MZero
FD and Kirby
Lea and JC
Chris and Lopen

How does everyone feel about these? Any proposals to shuffle the pairs around?

Red and Ulti is still a stinker to me. I'd rather that Red be one of the unpaired ones here.

Hey, Ulti, I've got a deal for you.

If you break up with Red, I'll break up with FD.

Lopen posted...

You do realize he suspected you first

... He did?
I... genuinely forgot. Honestly, I just noticed he hadn't posted at all today so I put out something absurd out of left field to see how he'd react to it.

Aight, cool. Ulti took my reaction bait. An Ulti who explodes over the slightest bit of sudden suspicion is either cornered scum or town, and given that there's zero pressure on him at all, I'm inclined to believe it's the latter.

It'd be hypocritical of me to put Ulti over Red on the kill list when Red actually hasn't done anything this game. Speaking of which, Red, please convince us why we shouldn't leave you to die on D2.

Lopen posted...

I HATE the "there's day one there's nothing to go off of" cop out

You do realize we literally just had a game where the top 3 wagons were all scum day 1 right. You're not gonna tell me that was a coincidence.

There are ways to hunt scum day 1. You don't need flips or powers to find scum. I'm reasonably sure I've found at least two scum atm.

Sure, but it's easier to scumhunt when the threat of a special makes scum more willing to make riskier plays rather than simply pair up and idle out. Which could be the case right now, or it might not be. We don't know. There's no precedent to follow here

EDumey posted...

I agree with you, but I don't think you're convincing either Ulti or Red to abandon their date for D1 even if they're both town. I do think we should agree to not give either a free date for D2 for sure.

Oh, and you think you'd convince FD or me to breakup, then?

With all due respect, this is why blabbering about hypothetical final threes is useless. Skipping every step along the way to get to a theoretical conclusion is how you end up with illogical leaps like "what if we just left two people unpaired at the end of the day"

Lopen posted...

For a good example of why to suspect beyond Ulti's post cited I don't know the point of the shipping angle-- it doesn't really seem useful. Feels like a way to fake being involved without actually adding much.

You're joking, right?

It's Day 1. There's barely anything to go off of. Is discussing our tactics as a town going into N1 really that useless? This is our way of showing a majority via votes. We need to focus on working together and agreeing with pairings rather than worrying about gladiatoring whoever is leftover.

It's our responsibility as town to convince each other who to optimally pair with. Suspicions alone aren't enough; persuasion and cooperation are more important in this game than they've ever been before, because ultimately, it's the people who are unpaired that will decide the fate of each day.

I mean, sure, put me in a ring with Lopen and Chris, even if it means I end up getting the axe. I honestly couldn't care less as long as we get meaningful content from this day by the end of it.

But like... for real, have Ulti and Red even done much today? Feels like they just hooked up and are just sitting back doing nothing. I don't like that.

I disagree with the frame of mind that only the final three are relevant, though. We ought to consider which pairs give us the best synergies for the night phase. If we're unlikely to hit scum this day, especially if they're all in the early pairs, then let's play safe and opt for a strategy that puts us in a better spot for D2.

I know FD and I can likely get a lot of work done overnight, especially with a flip to go off of. I don't necessarily trust him yet, but we're both fairly analytical and can glean much not only from the game but from each other. By contrast, I feel like Lopen and I disagree with each other more often than not. I don't mind pairing up with Chris, but I feel like he's better off on the offensive with grilling someone else.

For all the peeps who are already paired up with someone, I'd like y'all to propose your own pairings of the remaining unmatched as well.

Don't think that just because you're likely safe for today that you can just cruise on by without doing anything. Looking at you, Red!

EDumey posted...

it's rare to meet someone with so many fucks to give.

or maybe they're just not as vocal as the ones with none.

S-tier post lmfao

htaeD posted...

I dont know if I even know JC all that well

Maybe, but I get the feeling you two would at least try to figure each other out.

Do you have any better options for who you want to pair up with?

Lopen posted...

Lopen
Lea
Corrik
Death
Sir Chris
JC
Isquen

My proposals for pairings:

- Lopen and Lea
- Chris and Isquen
- JC and Death

Though Isquen and JC can be swapped. Chris probably gets way more out of JC than with Isquen, but JC and Death both can get a lot out of each other.

PeaceFrog posted...

You WHAT

He's my only town read!!

I can be convinced. I just don't remember much of what all Ulti has done this game, so lay it on me.

EDumey posted...

So the people likely to be left out in the cold are probably you two, Death and JC, and Lopen.

Oof, I don't think I like that pool of potential deaths. I propose we throw Corrik to the wolves or forcibly split up Red and Ulti and leave Ulti to die.

The only person who has gotten major heat so far has been Dumey. Though both Dumey and Lopen have been shading Chris a bit.

But I think by far if we were going to force a claim out of anyone, it'd be Dumey. But he has no pressure to claim unless Peaf breaks up with him.

I'm more inclined to let the day play out and the date pool dwindle even further. I wouldn't discount a scum trying to blend in with town by not appearing too desperate for a date. If anyone's going to claim, the pressure will be on peeps who haven't agreed to a date yet.

Oh sorry I almost forgot

##Date: FD

Forceful_Dragon posted...

Wouldn't mind if they couldn't find a room:
Dumey - Not necessarily because I hard read him as scum, but he might be scum and the fact that so many interactions today have involved him I think it could provide a useful data point.
Corrik - He hasn't done anything yet. He's welcome to change my mind, but he needs to realize that his standard "see you on day 2 meta" isn't going to fly in a game like this.

Not sure about a 3rd at this time. Maybe red for idling safely? Maybe ulti for giving red a bed to sleep in? Either way they protect each other today, but they bear looking at moving forward.

Keep alive:
Lopen - Don't have a scum read on him yet and when Lopen is active there is a certain level of sharpness that he brings to a game that I think is positive and forces people to be more committal and less wishy-washy.
Kirby - I wouldn't be willing to share a room with you otherwise. This doesn't mean it's a 100% full town read and I would still be trying to read you during the night phase, but I hate the notion of being personally responsible for scum not dying and will be trying my hardest to not cause that.

And again a 3rd is hard to find. Maybe Chris for similar reasons to Lopen. But I don't love how quickly he offered me a room after starting the game saying we shouldn't be hasty. I know he explained it by saying he wanted to "calm my rage", but then he should know that it was the fact that it was ulti specifically that contributed to my outburst.

Really there's a lot of people I still want to see more from today and maybe that will help clarify who else deserves to live :D

Good post. I'm in full agreement with your kill list.

Unfortunately, you're not on my "absolutely must save" list. That being said, you're not on my "leave in the dust" list, either. But as for saves, I'd add Chris on there simply because it's difficult to figure out his alignment this early on. Would rather not gamble on someone who could potentially be a vital townie, not until D2 at least.

I'd also add JC to the list. He hasnt done much of anything, and that's why I want someone to prod him all night long. Same can't be said for Corrik, who I feel you're not gonna get much out of anyway even during the night.

Arguably, same could be said for Red and potentially Isquen, but Red's thoughts are worth having a record of in case he's town... and uh... I just want to see Isquen live to D3 for once lol

We stand very little to gain from claiming tonight. In the unfortunate scenario where one scum is paired with one town, scum would have info on three town claims and could narrow down a kill pool very easily.

Don't claim privately unless the person you're with is confirmed town.

htaeD posted...

Kirby always has an annoying habit of saying the obvious as town and seeming redundant yet never awful.
Thats what I got out of him from his last game at least

... You know, I don't think anyone has ever described my playstyle so honestly like that... and now that I think about it, you're totally on the mark

I guess I just tire of random nonsense bogging down points that I feel need reiteration.

Forceful_Dragon posted...

But speaking of Kirby. Kirby, would you consider being my date tonight?

I didn't even realize you were available. Sure, I think we'd be a good pair. But before I accept, let me ask you... name up to three people who you wouldn't mind biting the dust today, and up to three people who you think should be safe and hooked up with someone tonight.

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

Talk to me Kirby what's sup? What do you want to know?

It's more like I can't tell if your reactions are genuine or if they're being faked.

But Chris is willing to bat for you, so I'll take him up on that if these are really town tells for you.

MZero, I know you're not around right now, but I'd like your earnest thoughts on whether you think Sultan is town or trying to emulate his town self as scum.

Because I'm really on the fence with Sultan here

My proposal to Corrik: you're better off dating anyone else besides me. I don't think we'd have much interesting to talk about. So I'll date you if you're at the end of your rope

htaeD posted...

Uh
Those last 2 sentences counter each other, dont they?

I didn't phrase that well.

I was trying to express frustration that Dumey has been monopolizing the conversation and would happily let him die so we can refocus on broader efforts... but I also recognize that Peaf can get a lot of analysis from a night with Dumey.

Enchantress posted...

I'd do Lopen or Kirby - clear communicators, fun vibes.

I'd do JC or Isquen - passive but would benefit from a one on one boosting their reads or taking the time to read them in depth, fun vibes.

Not to say that anyone outside of that 4 pack doesn't have fun vibes, many are taken or have other factors. Also, lists should be rule of three in the form of fuck/marry/kill tbh. It actually applies this game - would neighbour once, town lock, scum.

If I might make a suggestion, I think there's a lot to gain from you and Lopen being paired up. I trust that you two would actually listen to each other and use that info well into D2. Which could just as easily backfire if one of you is scum, but it's hard to tell until we actually have a night phase play out.

I'm thinking about all these pairings with the mindframe of "which pairings optimize the amount of info we can extract for D2?"

And so far, I'm content with the pairings that are currently set. I was shakier on Peaf and Dumey, but I'm liking it better now.

Lopen posted...

Chris immediately accepting Dumey's explanation after he's been needling him forever feels super theatre to me.

I mean, Dumey's explanation makes sense. Plus, the dude is obviously getting worked up, and Chris is naturally trying to keep peace. Whether he's being genuinely empathetic or doing it to keep up a faade as scum, that's up in the air. But "theatrics" ain't the word I'd use. If it's feigning kindness, it's not an obvious ruse to me.

Though honestly, I wouldn't be opposed to letting Dumey die today just so we can move on to a different conversation. Realistically speaking, with the knowledge of Dumey and Peaf being RL friends, I imagine Peaf is the perfect person to grill Dumey 1-on-1, which would be super helpful for D2.

PeaceFrog posted...

But yeah i felt that kirby's question and lopen's reasons to it all absolutely fluff. Excuses for them to not do anything except be mad.

Honestly I don't have much to talk about. Dumey tilting at Chris is just making my brain turn to mush.

Would rather gauge what everyone else is thinking right now to get an idea of where town is heading. Because quite frankly, we all should start to have some idea of who to leave unpaired by the 24-hour mark if we intend to get anything productive today. And I don't yet have the faintest idea for a tangible list of player alignments yet

Lopen, are you eyeing anyone in particular to room with tonight?

Corrik7 posted...

Gimme a run down at what has happened so far.

Not much aside from a lot of discourse between Dumey and Chris, really.

That being said, it's Day 1, and true specials are gonna be damn near impossible in this game. I'll be laissez-faire about who I get paired up with.

Also have we heard anything from JC since the game started?

I like Peaf's answer more than Dumey's. Feels more authentic and less wishy-washy even if the general sentiment is the same as Dumey's response.

But also, I can relate. I want to adopt the Lea method of pairing up with the person who'd be the most fun to talk to at night (so I'm sadge that Ben and Wallz aren't in this game); however, I'm more wary of saving scum by shacking up with them.

And Dumey, how confident are you that Peaf is town?

Hey, Peaf, how confident are you that Dumey is town?

MZero posted...

I volunteer Lopen as tribute

LMAO

That would be something. I ship it

EDumey posted...

Did a reread of the day before going to bed, and I'm feeling worse off about Chris. Not sure how much is just Chris poking and prodding, versus actual beliefs.

I'm feeling uneasy about Chris, too. But I also have a natural paranoia about good players being scum. Han, Lea, and Chris tend to be on the opposing end of that irrational fear >_>

But Chris in particular is a tough nut to crack. You never know when he's deliberately saying weird things as Town just to see who takes the bait. I feel like Scum Chris doesn't make himself this obvious early on unless it's a deliberate sacrifice like in Star Trek (which is a much harder stunt to pull off here given the nature of the game).

So I'm not totally sold on Chris being scum just yet. I am, however, keeping a close eye on him.

Aight. I'm caught up now. My only thought is...

Ayo, FD, got a spreadsheet to keep track of all the open date requests and all that? I'm getting confused already...

There might be merit in scum pairing up early (and not necessarily with each other) to ensure they make it out of Day 1 alive, but it's also Day 1. There's memery and it's hard to tell what's desperate and what's not.

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

Anyways Kirby is my option to leave out in the cold. Seemed Way to opportunistic to find a date

For real? My guy, I was dating Red as a complete meme, to the point even the host called me out for my chicanery lol

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

I HAVE NO IDEA! This game is already wild

Not to harp on the guy shading me, but I can't tell if Sultan is being dramatic on purpose for hamming it up or if he's faking this to appear genuine. Does Sultan actually believe Ulti posting a wolf picture actually means anything, or is this some B8 Mafia meme that completely went over my head lol

I walk away to work on a personal project and come back to 234 new messages hot damn. We might need a new topic by the end of the night already lol

Posting thoughts as I go along...

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


Damn. I knew I was unlovable. /s

Forceful_Dragon posted...

And so I make a joke about maybe dumey didn't ACTUALLY read the rules and somehow that r/whooshes over everyone's head? I need someone to assure me that I'm not crazy here because I feel like the path from A to B was pretty dang obvious.

You're not crazy. I got the joke

Isquen posted...

I made an error starting this on raid night. Rubicante already got my group hot and bothered

It's okay, Isquen; I'll be your raid buddy. Rubicante fucking blows lmao

So far I'm seeing just the usual Day 1 headless chicken schadenfreude going on. Ulti taking FD's joke too seriously, Lopen raising suspicions over the usual analytical people poring over this game's unique mechanics, Peaf coming in surprisingly aggressive, Dumey doing Dumey things, etc.

red13n posted...

Oh, well thats a dumb rule.

I was just morbidly curious. Feel free to repost all of your open dating invitations again if you want lol

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

Though dating red would be an interesting start to the game I'll take on red if no one rejects my doing it but Kirby being so quick I didn't like that

I mean, he's still yours if Red consents. I immediately broke up with him after all

red13n posted...

No it requires both players to breakup to cancel a date.

Monsieur, that only applies during the last six hours of the day. Until then, I'm an independent puffball who can break up as I please

And then you have Red flagrantly ignoring Chris's idea lmao

Though... I'm curious. Sorry for trying to break your game when it hasn't even been an hour yet, Chang

##Date: Red

...

##Breakup

Does that automatically cancel all of Red's proposals?

What if we just had 15 people unpaired by the end of the day

EDumey posted...

Two love triangles.

Hypothetical scenario, both Kirby and MZero try to date me, it's up to me to choose one of them, and leave the other dead.
Then Sultan and Ulti both try to date Chris, and it's up to Chris to choose one of them, and leave the other dead.

It would be possible for both of the people unpaired to save themselves by dating each other at the last moment, but with deadlines and everything, not always easy to pull off.

Hmm... fair point, but I don't see any merit to that since, in the worst case (depending on Chang's ruling of what happens if more than one person is single by the end of the day), that could potentially result in six players all dying.

Forceful_Dragon posted...

Yes and no. We can't just date and break up freely because as SOON as every person (sans one) has a partner the day will end and it will effectively only be decides by whoever makes the last pairing. It's like an early hammer that doesn't even require half of the players to agree, but will simply happen as soon as everyone just does their own thing.

I think Chris is right and we should be more intentional about deciding who should NOT be dated. If we select correctly then it would take an overt act for one scum to save another.

That's half-true. The day will only get ended early at the 12-, 24-, and 36-hour marks if everyone is paired off. Nonetheless, point taken.

My only real concern about stifling the dating scene is that votes are typically how we get stuff to happen around here. And ngl, I'm already a little wary of Chris taking charge so early on and proposing this idea. It's not alignment-indicative, but in the worst-case scenario where he's scum, then he's in a good position to control the game, especially when this format leaves us all clueless on how to approach the first day.

I'm not trying to spread Chris fear already, but I just want to make sure we're all actually on the same page here and discuss this tactic at length before we commit to it. Not that much really comes out of Day 1, but still.

UltimaterializerX posted...

##Date: Lopen

You're under 25 years old, right?

Ain't no way Lopen is younger than me. Sus

EDumey posted...

One, the idea of confirming only one night kill per night to ensure there is always an odd number alive during the day seems easy to play around if we simply leave two people undated at end of day.

Pray tell how do you intend to do leave two people unpaired when the rules basically state that every day will always have an odd number of players... and thus there can only ever be an odd number of players without a partner.

Though I do wonder what happens if more than one player ends up single at the end of the day.

Bodyguard would be a pretty fitting role for a Mafia game about love.

Hey, MZero, how well does this game's deadline work out for you? There's protections in place to help out folks who can't make it to deadline, but if you never get paired with someone to begin with, that could be problematic as you'd by default be the sole person left alone. Unless you're scum, then that'd be good for us.

SirChris posted...

So I have been thinking about this. I think we should avoid pairing up early and just kind of get a feel for everyone and who we might want left out in the cold.

If we have a wolf in a tough spot and someone goes against the grain, it could be a wolf partner saving them.

In this setup it's going to be tough to get wolves out the first two days because wolves can save each other. However, the game has a minimum of five days so they probably won't want to be too blatant about this. Something to keep in mind.

Hasty plays muddle the waters and favor wolves much more than town, so we should keep that in mind.

Good post. #%Date: Sir Chris

Please accept my love and affection.

Nah, in all seriousness, I kinda agree. There's currently an odd number of scum, so one of them is gonna be looking for love to try and survive. On the other hand, we can still Date and Breakup freely and fluidly at this stage of the game. Once the 42-hour mark hits, though, Breakup becomes much harder to do. So we should be cognizant of that, as well.

You don't know how long I've been searching to find out when the next mafia game would be x_x
Well, now I have this topic and the queue topic both tracked so hopefully that shouldn't be a problem anymore.

This game sounds like it'd make for a very fun and goofy Day 1. Sign me up!

Good stuff, town! Y'all played out of your minds this game.

And I'm very glad Ben picked up on what I was putting down. Fun game to be a part of and to watch from the afterlife! Thanks for hosting, Sultan and BCT!