Lurker > TheSavageDragon

WingsOfGood posted...

Oh? So how can they beat anime?

What? Who said anything about beating anime? I'm done with you and the weirdass sideroads you keep trying to take. It's quite clear you're not capable of any sort of logical discussion.

WingsOfGood posted...

You mean me listing multiple highly rated anime you can watch entirely free legally?
One Piece, HxH, Naruto, Jojo

No, I mean the ridiculous "do you anime" sideroad you were trying to take. By trying to get me to provide info that's easily searchable for literally everyone.

WingsOfGood posted...

Yet you haven't mentioned 1 comic that I can read start to finish entirely free.
Wonder why.

Gee, maybe because I didn't claim comics are free.

WingsOfGood posted...

You (redacted) comics?
Now I think I see why you are arguing with me. But keep in mind this thread is about kids not you.

Again with the assumptions. The fact that I'm aware of things existing does not mean I partake. I'm aware heroin exists, I don't do heroin.
And you don't need to delude yourself into thinking that's why I'm having this discussion with you. I'm having this discussion because of that nonsense claim I keep going back to and you keep avoiding.

WingsOfGood posted...

Through hoops? This is info anyone into anime already knows. You claimed you did.

Again, it's information literally anyone with half a brain can acquire within 5 seconds. Not only does it prove absolutely nothing, it has nothing to do with the conversation at hand. Whether I watch anime or not does not somehow make the ridiculous claim that anime is free a reality. You can run with that goalpost to the other side of the planet and it would still not make that a fact.

mehmeh1 posted...

Can we just let "Goku came back because of fan/editorial demand" die. The buu arc was Toriyama fully unrestricted in every sense of the word, Goku came back because he didn't like writing Gohan as the protagonist.

Already commented on that. See post 59.

mehmeh1 posted...

Even the 16/17/18/Cell stuff was because of his ex-editor he didn't even work with anymore going all "nah that's lame", not corpo demands

And who do you think that editor worked for? It wasn't Toriyama they answered to. Editorial generally works in the publisher's best interests. As mentioned several times now, neither industry is about creative freedom unless you get into indies.

IceCreamOnStero posted...

-Frankly, anime and manga piracy are often synonymous with those communities, not really the case with comics.

Yup, for every pirated comics site there are several dozen manga and anime sites in existence. Though that's likely due to the fact that we weren't able to get our hands on many of them legally until relatively recently.

WingsOfGood posted...

Then name several more free anime on Crunchyroll. Can you do it? If you anime you can.

So I need to jump through hoops in order to prove to you that I watch anime? So you can continue to pretend anime in general is free? Not to mention that it's a ridiculous thing to ask as anyone can find out that info in a google search that takes all of 5 seconds.

WingsOfGood posted...

It is way more than 3.

Those are just important because One Piece is 3 months worth of content.

Naruto is also 3 months worth of content.

And Demon Slayer is a new popular one.

I think most of AoT is also still free.

Do you even anime?

Yes, "I anime". Now can you admit that anime isn't free? Or are we going to continue to pretend a multi billion dollar industry is built around goodwill and magic?

Tyranthraxus posted...

This simply isn't true. There was some editorializing but most of those things were decisions made by Toriyama because he didn't like how certain things turned out after he drew them up.

Okay, my bad. Seems like I was wrong about that. Might just be a very persistent rumor.
But the point still stands that the manga industry isn't about creative freedom or else it wouldn't be an industry to begin with. Editorial will generally trump creative freedom in both comic and manga industries.

WingsOfGood posted...

This is a stupid and pointless argument.

Yes, yes it is.

WingsOfGood posted...

Comics are vastly more expensive.

Note that I agreed multiple times in this very topic that comics are more expensive and that it is a legit issue many have with the industry.

WingsOfGood posted...

I proved you can watch the biggest titles free legally.

Saying you can watch 3 anime free online does not support the claim that anime is free. Using outliers to make sweeping generalizations isn't logical.

WingsOfGood posted...

What in the actual fuck is your goal here? Are you an out of touch exec at marvel or DC or something?

I see we have reached the point where you resort to personal attacks and assumptions rather than actually discussing the points we're making.

WingsOfGood posted...

There is no reason to refuse reality here

Then why consistently do so? I did not make the claim that an entire industry build around making money like any other industry just hands out all its products for free. That was you.

WingsOfGood posted...

The real difference is the Mangaka is the original author and so they have some pride usually in their work at least for the bigger hits.

The original authors of most American comics are long dead so they hire people who don't share the same vision or who just wants a paycheck and does what some bigwig says.

That's also only true for Marvel & DC. They are what's generally popular, but not representative of the entire industry. Like I said earlier in this topic, the comic where I got my name from has been written and drawn by its original creator for 3 decades now. And practically every single comic that tells a story from start to finish like all the comics I listed earlier in this topic are written/drawn by the same creative team from start to finish.
Everybody's currently going gaga over Invincible because of the animated series, a comic written and drawn by the same people for its entire run.

A lot of these conversations seem to stem from the fact that people are ignorant of both industries. Manga isn't some bastion of creative freedom. The most famous example being DBZ where everything after Freeza was basically an editorial mandate. Toriyama did "what some bigwig says" as you put it. We wouldn't have Androids 16,17,18, Cell, Goku coming back,.... if it weren't for a corporation telling Toriyama what they wanted to sell.

WingsOfGood posted...

That is not the logic though. The logic is parents buy these services unrelated to an anime. This is not the same as a parent buying a comic and sharing it.

That's exactly the same thing. "Parent buys thing, kid gets to use it without forking over any money as they have none"

WingsOfGood posted...

One Piece is 1000+ episodes.
The whole S1 of Demon Slayer is free.
Naruto is free.

And yet none of that supports the claim that anime is free. Those anime are free in a select number of streaming services in a select number of countries. The other thousands of anime require a fee from someone. The claim "anime is free" is radically different from "oh those 2 or 3 anime or free" as you willfully ignore the vast majority.

WingsOfGood posted...

But kids probably will go to an actual free site and watch whatever they want entirely free.

We have come full circle. Yes, anime is free when you pirate it.

deoxxys posted...

and their main focus is making good stories

Their main focus is making money just like any other industry. If making good stories was the main focus the market wouldn't be flooded with hundreds of variations on the isekai genre. It's just "this is popular, let's make more" regardless of actual quality like any other.

WingsOfGood posted...

If their parents have Netflix or Prime to them it is free.

And if their parents buy comics they are free as well going by that logic. Everything is free when you're a kid.

WingsOfGood posted...

Crunchyuroll has some that are free.
One Piece is 100% free on Crunchyroll.

So yes, anime is free.

"A few here and there" does not mean anime is free at all. Comics are also free as there is literally a day called Free Comic Book Day where free comics are handed out to people. You see how that logic doesn't work?

GranTurismo posted...

Does Mike judge do the voices?

Yup

Beveren_Rabbit posted...

comics are about $2.99 an issue

Not really, depends on the publisher. Marvel and DC do this once in a while to get good press or new readers to jump on board, but generally their comics are 3.99 to even 4.99 an issue these days. That's 4-5$ for about 25 pages. It's why many people these days just wait for the trades.
People make a good point when they say comics are expensive and manga gives you more bang for your buck. It's partially due to the fact comics are printed in color on higher quality paper.

But there are alternatives that aren't as pricy like buying trades and using the digital subscription services

__starsnostars posted...

It's humour never clicked with me and to this day I don't understand how or why it became so popular.

I'd say the commentary on current pop culture and social issues is what drove it to stardom. Them discovering what white privilege is in one of the later seasons is absolutely hysterical.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iS9Bf12Mby8

GranTurismo posted...

Why do they like doing that so much?

Because it's funny?

GranTurismo posted...

Show is still on?

It ran from '93-'97, got a new season in 2011 and has gotten a second movie along with new seasons starting in 2022.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKRx6V7bqQI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCCltsN_dxE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EG20Wn31iFY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AT8roApHV-o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPRkYWVinF0

GranTurismo posted...

they used to make fun of a ton of music videos?

They still do. At least once an episode.
It's just that they don't have the rights to do so in reruns of the older episodes unless they want to pay for them again. The new seasons have them making fun of current music videos and MTV's reality tv programming.

WingsOfGood posted...

Very simple.

Comics are EXPENSIVE.

manga at least the anime is free and you can get a whole minibook for the price of.... 2 comics.

Anime isn't free though. Unless you're pirating it.

_____Cait posted...

I think there is still a place for it.

Sure, but that would require them to do something you can't get in a dozen other games at this point. Why play DD for the style when Streets Of Rage 4 oozes it? Why play it for the multiplayer when every single game in the genre has that? Why play it for difficulty when you can play Fight 'N Rage?
Granted, I haven't really tried any of the newer ones as they all looked as basic in gameplay as the old ones.

And rightfully so as it has been surpassed by others in its genre a thousand times over.

Alteres posted...

I turned them both off in grounded and never looked back, normally wouldn't for fall damage... but that game has way too much bullshit first-person platforming.

You can go 3rd person at the press of a button though. Default is U when using a keyboard.
If you're on console it's a bit annoying, you have to select the top option in the radial menu and then select Toggle Player Camera.

Beveren_Rabbit posted...

hey now... let's not go on saying manga has better coloring than graphic novels/comics. Fully colored manga is still a rare thing and most of the time just a "special edition"

That part of their post is referring to manhwa which are generally colored in my experience. But they'd still be wrong as manhwa generally looks like somebody digitally colored it using Paint's auto-fill feature. That's not to say there aren't any impressive manhwa out there.

Take this for instance

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/d/dded6aa0.jpg

I've never encountered a manhwa with this level of coloring. It's not the standard for comics either, but at least they're out there. Any of Alex Ross' work for instance puts all the coloring I've seen from manhwa to shame. Image is not by Ross though, it's Sejic. And it's all thanks to artists coloring all of it which sadly tend to be forgotten as I don't even recall who actually colored that.

KnightofShikari posted...

someone may get interested in guardians of the galaxy because of the movies, try the comics, and be irked that they're apparently vastly different

Not really. At least if you check out the Guardians beyond the release date of the movie when they basically were turned into their movie versions save for some lore here and there.
Before that they were vastly different though.

Ivany2008 posted...

The problem I find is that there is just a barrier for entry. There is a lot of material. People may look at One Piece and say "that's too many chapters". Not realizing that Batman by itself has over 700 issues, and that's just the base story. Brave and the bold is another 200 issues. Comic writers are having to go back and create bundles just to get a starting point for new readers.

"There's 1000s of comics that don't do the things you dislike about comics"
"But Batman though"

Then don't read Batman or anything from Marvel and DC. There is literally no barrier for entry with thousands of comics. There is a wide variety of genres amongst different publishers that aren't Marvel or DC and don't do all the things Marvel/DC get rightfully criticized for. Even a whole bunch of superhero comics.

Ivany2008 posted...

I mean, if your a comic fan, its a good time to be a fan. As long as you know where to start. For me though, manga will always have an easier entry point, as its nearly always Issue 001.

Which is the exact same thing for Y The Last Man, Fables, Sandman, Transmetropolitan, Sweet Tooth, 100 Bullets, Saga, Paper Girls, Gideon Falls, Black Science, Invincible, Savage Dragon, The Walking Dead, Rat Queens, Irredeemable, Kick-Ass,...

Ivany2008 posted...

Comics, in general, have a multitude of starting points. So if you tell me to start reading Batman, I can get overwhelmed at "which" Batman to start reading. The classic Batman? Or how about the Darkest Knight? Or Batman who laughs? Or Flashpoint Paradox (which has my favourite Batman).

Again, you're attributing things from 2 companies to the entire industry. The problem doesn't seem to be Marvel and DC doing all those things, the problem seems to be people are unaware of anything but Marvel and DC. It's like saying every manga out there is a shonen isekai because that's what brings in the big bucks right now.
You're bringing up legit issues with Marvel/DC though. Also Flashpoint Paradox isn't a comic, that's the title of the animated movie. The comic itself was just called Flashpoint.

hockeybabe89 posted...

lmao nice. have they mentioned my posts?

Not that I noticed. But I just skimmed it for a quick laugh yesterday, so could be.

hockeybabe89 posted...

weird chuds that can't keep an account think Fandom's changes are good and that they can suck up to them.

That seems to have changed abruptly because those same loons are now calling Fandom fascists in their echo chamber. My guess is because of their resolute anti transphobia stance

Ivany2008 posted...

Comics in general are very static in how they pose characters, and its a hundred different stories rather than one contiguous story.

That's not so much "in general" as it is Marvel/DC's superhero comics. There are literally thousands of comics out there that tell a single story from start to finish. It's just that Marvel and DC are more prolific due to being around for a long time.
Hell, my name is from a superhero comic telling a continuing story written and drawn by the same person for over 30 years now.

Beveren_Rabbit posted...

when they do get into comics or graphic novels it's usually the old stuff like Transmetropolitan or Sandman

Along with manga's popularity already being mentioned....judging by your examples I think the fact that the internet is a thing has a hand in it as well.
When a 12 year old googles "best comics ever" they're not going to get the latest issue of Batman or Spider-Man as a result, but things like Transmetropolitan and Sandman.

MICHALECOLE posted...

Have you guys heard that the lion king snes game has a part where you play as teenage simba, because the game was being made at the same time as the movie, and that part was originally in the movie but cut, so the snes game technically has the most complete story of the lion king

Having played that game my entire childhood I don't recall any moment where you play as a teenage Simba. You go from cub Simba in Hakuna Matata to adult Simba making his way back to the Pridelands.

lilORANG posted...

Why did the gazelle worship the lions? Are they stupid?

"The lion surely won't eat my face"

Last game I played was 7 Days To Die which has no ending. So I guess I'm immortal now

Humble_Novice posted...

Did some transgender individual hurt her deeply in the past?

No, people just dared to criticize the rich person for her dumbass takes

We have finally reached the point where even adults that grew up with PCs don't remember what copy/paste is

LonelyStoner posted...

Just one, and its even worse.

By far. And it's all the more infuriating because that one actually has some awesome dino variety. It's too bad they're all stuck in the giant triceratops turd from the original JP for some reason.

I did enjoy the first one solely based on its premise. Finally seeing what the park would be like when it's operational.

EDIT: And it gave us Camp Cretaceous which is probably the best JP related thing I've seen since the original movie

CableZL posted...

Im hoping he jokes

Me too.

Shadowblade posted...

Aww haters hating on my curly fries? <__<

I'm sorry. But it just looks like you took every effort to make it look as unappealing as possible. Could probably be delicious, but if someone put that plate in front of me as is I'd give them the side-eye.

sig checks out

Antifar posted...

2. The Dutch tourists at the diner I was at tonight were struck by ice water being the default

That's because there's a difference between room temperature, cooled and iced.

The Dutch generally drink water, sodas,... from the fridge without ice added to the drink. Unless you're at a bar or a restaurant people here mostly only use ice cubes in the summer when it's scorching hot out. Been to quite a few bars and restaurants that just don't serve ice cubes at all unless specifically asked.

And then there's also the fact that the water we order here comes from a bottle in a fridge. While the water you guys order in the US generally comes from the tap, so it needs ice in order to actually be cooled.

lilORANG posted...

Is that the one with the weirdo mutants and the nuke?

Yup, I always just pretend that one didn't happen.

Johnny_Nutcase posted...

Well...she did say AMA. So I guess that's a valid question

I very much doubt the village of non combatants she was terrorizing were actively participating in the war.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


Didn't know that. You remember when that was, we might have interacted back then. Looking at the archived topics on the KH2 board, I was really active there in 2008-2009.

EDIT: Reading those topics now.... a lot of my posts back then were either cringy as fuck or needlessly antagonizing.

Zikten posted...

I've heard this before. I don't get it. I understand if you have no convenient way to chill it. But it sounds like sometimes they could do so, and still just don't bother

The average European very much prefers cooled drinks though. Maybe 70 year olds don't and the outdated stereotype stuck, but I have never met a single person in my life that actually prefers room temperature drinks. The few I know that do drink like that are those that need to because of digestive issues.