Lurker > PrivateBiscuit1

Wait, apparently Channel 5 Chicago NBC was able to confirm it was an NBC producer.

And the person that the producer named is currently deleting her Twitter and LinkedIn.

Uhhhhhh. This is literally criminal stuff here.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

The supposed reporter was also able to name drop someone specifically, which adds credence to their claim of working there. But we don't know for sure yet.

Judge also screwed up not sequestering the jury during this high profile case. Being sequestered for weeks absolutely sucks, but with all of these death threats being thrown around this, even if you isolate yourself entirely, you're going to catch what people are saying and how incendiary it is. And then they can hear the people screaming outside that if they must acquit. It's a god damn mess and it's close enough to jury tampering at this point, especially with someone chasing the bus now.

The Judge just seems like he's overwhelmed by this, and I think he's just a good-natured old man who is used to people telling the world that he's a biased asshole, he alluded that he lost friends because of this trial, and he knows what the reaction will be if Kyle is acquitted or he deems it a mistrial, and he must know the Prosecution had no business bringing this to the court.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Looks cool but I think it may end up like Nickelodeon that it falls off immediately.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

xp1337 posted...

This is just a terrible look regardless of the prosecution's actions.

"If the jury returns a decision I don't like well shit I'll just decide then, but if they return the decision I think they should eh we're good."

I'm pretty sure that's not how the legal system is supposed to work. Like why even have the jury at that point? From everything you've said here he should just be declaring a mistrial now and not even letting this go to the jury at all but sending it to them with the statement that you'll make your decision based on what they return is just... yikes.

It's super sad and frustrating. Mostly because I'm looking at this and this isn't how a court should operate, and it shouldn't be at the whim of caring what the media or protestors will say or do. This isn't a fair trial, justice isn't being served on either side, and Kyle, nor anyone else, should be convicted with jail time without a fair trial. And it's just not what we're getting here.

There's also a story about the Prosecution knowing who "Jump Kick Man" was because he tried to turn himself in to help them with their case, only if they promised to drop a bunch of charges and they rightfully told him to screw off. But they maintained they were never able to identify him, which is another horrible look if it's true, and maybe even more unfair of them to do than even withholding this evidence? Because that's disregarding evidence in the investigation because they know it's damaging to the case and not giving the Defense a chance to confront him.

And even if it's not true, someone was able to find his identity while the Prosecution somehow never did in their investigation, which is equally a bad look.

If there's any truth to that, the Defense will likely amend their Motion for Mistrial with that information. But given what all has happened, I wouldn't be shocked if that story is true too.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

No decision on the Rittenhouse trial yet.

But still, there's so much stuff going on in this trial during Jury deliberation. This Judge has completely lost me. You guys have probably seen me say I've mostly approved of what he's been doing, but today it's just... baffling.

So a big thing of contention today was the argument about the drone footage that magically appeared the last day evidence could be sent, and that somehow the Defense got a crappy version when the clear version shows Kyle absolutely didn't instigate anything or raise his gun like the Prosecution is claiming. Look at my other post I made if you want the full details on that.

The Prosecution argued literal bullshit, saying that he sent it through phone, and that it changed the file name on its own, and he sent it through email (which is not secure and another thing that should never happen), and then simultaneously knew and didn't know that the Defense had the bad version, and then blamed the Defense for not objecting to it even though they didn't know that a better version of it existed.

So if you watched any of this trial, you would have seen the women to the side of trial who was there the whole time. She was another attorney working with them and she handled all the discovery documents. And after windbag Kraus went through his speech and dumb story playing dumb, and trying to throw other departments under the bus, she came out and called him a liar and said that it was impossible, pulling up metadata saying that the poor quality version was made 21 minutes after the good quality version was received. Just tore this asshole's story apart.

And they ask the Judge to rule on it, he says THERE WILL BE A RECKONING and he feels awful about this evidence being in and then says that he thinks he'll have experts appear to testify and also for Kraus to testify.

And then... he doesn't actually rule on anything. The Defense, bafflingly, asks for a mistrial WITHOUT prejudice (I cannot understand the point of this) and the Judge just refuses to make a call on it and says that maybe they should wait to see what the Jury says to see if it's necessary.

My take? The Judge is scared of what will happen to him and his family if he rules it a mistrial, with how much he and his family has been threatened by terrible people already. He was already complaining about the news talking about him again. He doesn't want to be the one to make this call. He knows what will happen.

Protestors outside are getting more violent and two people were arrested already today. Meaning the Jury can't reasonably sequester themselves, and I'm sure they're scared too.

So the Judge is just... trying not to rule on anything. This should be a mistrial, no matter what. He knows this. He keeps saying he knows how damning this is. He keeps making threats. And yet he won't make the call when it would have gotten thrown out over a week ago reasonably.

We'll see what happens tomorrow I guess.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

xp1337 posted...

idk but if I had to guess they realized they blew it when they said they had a better video in said incident and went into CYA mode here.

Oh and I figured this out. It was in the motion.

One of the Defense's attorneys reached out to the DA's office and specifically had to ask for that high quality video.

Binger and Kraus can and should be disbarred for this, because honestly why would you want these two trying to do this sort of thing to convict someone in any case. However they'll probably just go "Oh we gave you the wrong video by mistake!" Even though Kraus admitted to knowing they had the worse video. And then why does such a low quality video even exist aside from making it this impossible to watch for the Defense?

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

masterplum posted...

Are you rooting for judicial malpractice because it doesnt fit the narrative?

No, I've been disgusted by their games to unfairly run this entire trial from the investigation process onward. I'm glad their lies have caught up to them and that the system will now be working to keep them in check. I've said this should have been a mistrial days ago because of what they've done. This makes it unavoidable now, no matter how high profile this case is.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

KamikazePotato posted...

Okay, that's awful, but why did they even give over the evidence at all? At that point just hide it forever lol

That much, I'm not sure. It could be the Judge had demanded they turned it over, the Defense had circumvented the Prosecution to get it when they knew it existed, or the Prosecution knew they let the cat out of the bag and were just trying to present it so they can at least say "See we still gave it to them!" I have no idea.

But you want to know the difference between it? The Prosecution gave them a 480 x 212 video of the drone footage. They had a 1920 x 844 size video of it. It was THAT vastly different. They likely didn't even act like it existed until the nth hour because a) they knew it would show Kyle didn't ever hold the gun up to him and b) the Defense's video expert could have dissected it entirely and presented it in trial.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

So uh there's a big update in the Rittenhouse case.

In a new Motion for Mistrial filed by the Defendant, there were the various things I had mentioned that the Prosecution had violated. The 5th Amendment violation (4 times), purposefully disregarding the Judge's rulings, tampering with the investigation, tampering with who could testify in court. But there's a big one added now.

I thought it was weird when Prosecutor Kraus had mentioned "We actually have a much better quality video here!" during the random spazzing over the blurry photos. And the Judge was even like "Then why aren't I looking at the better quality ones!?" I thought it was bullshit and they didn't have a better quality.

Turns out, the Prosecution did have a better quality video of the drone footage. Significantly better. And they withheld it and gave it to the Defendants AFTER the trial was over.

There's a law called the Brady Rule. This is when the Prosecutor is not allowed to withhold evidence that will help alleviate the Defendant's guilt. It's meant to put the scale back in the favor of the Defendant since, well, the scale is very uneven. And to do this is a SERIOUS violation. That other stuff I mentioned? Not even close. This is grounds for being disbarred, legitimately. And Wisconsin treats it much more seriously than others.

How seriously? This trial is a mistrial--definitively. Without question. So when Binger is busy putting out press releases saying he won't do press releases and the Defense was all laughs in the courtroom before the jury was dismissed... this is why. If Kyle somehow loses his case, he gets an appeal, no matter what. This is that serious. They withheld key evidence (considering they made their ENTIRE provocation claim based on it). The Judge is more likely to see if the Jury will say not guilty on all counts so he can avoid this and say the system works, but I'm thinking he's calling it a mistrial if it's anything but a complete non-guilty verdict.

The Prosecution absolutely fucked up here in their complete desperation. They thought they wouldn't get caught playing these games, but Kraus' big, stupid mouth couldn't keep shut about it because he can't handle a shred of pressure. So it doesn't really matter what the Jury says, Kyle is getting off. This never should have gone to trial. The Prosecution is beyond corrupt.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Jury did not come to a decision yet in the Rittenhouse trial.

But as a bit of news, Prosecutor Binger is claiming that it would be "inappropriate" for him to make a statement after the trial. Which basically means he doesn't feel too good about it, since Prosecutors always go up there to speak after.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Imagine being in the jury listening to this and being expected to decide whether or not a kid deserves to spend most of his life in prison after hearing this.

https://twitter.com/greg_price11/status/1460385796951879681?s=20

https://twitter.com/crabcrawler1/status/1460400562176987145?s=20

https://twitter.com/crabcrawler1/status/1460402703457263619?s=20

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Oh yeah, the other awful thing Binger did was go "Yeah and Balch testified that all Rosenbaum did was go 'If I get you alone, blah blah blah.'" when the blah blah blah part was "I'll fucking kill you." Grotesque stuff.

Kraus literally saying "Everyone needs to take a beating sometime!" And then acting like Kyle should have just taken a healthy beating from the mob when he was getting his face, neck, and head assaulted. And then immediately saying "He wasn't in imminent threat of serious harm!" Like mother fucker he took a skateboard to his got damn neck. And then he said the same thing about a pistol being aimed at his head.

Legitimately unhinged and no jury alive would listen to that and go "Yeah I guess that wasn't imminently dangerous."

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Worth mentioning is that he escaped "unmolested" by Rosenbaum which was a nice way to let the jurors who knew he was a violent pedophile remember that. He said the Prosecution was sounding like he was a whiner about the facts. He also reinforced that Rosenbaum had lunged at him, bringing out a ruler, and standing in front of the jury 4 feet, which is how close Rosenbaum was before being shot. He laughed at Binger claiming that they only tried to knock his hat off, not that they were attacking him with a rock. He said that he was not an active shooter, because it was something that the Prosecution made up. He wasn't actively shooting. He was trying to get away before he was attacked again.

He also pointed out that Grosskreutz is a fucking liar and lied repeatedly on the stand and showed them, and pointed out that he has a $10 million lawsuit at stake, and that he was working in tandem with the police because they refused to look through his phone, pointing out that one of the officers said they have never NOT looked in someone's phone in a situation like this.

He brought up DeBruin again, the guy with autism and a speech impediment, and Binger's face immediately got alarmed. He pointed out how they were trying to manipulate him into changing his statement and Binger's eye was LITERALLY TWITCHING.

Basically, if the Prosecution had any credibility left, he demolished it in full. But if you thought it was over then, oh no. The Prosecution gets a Rebuttal!

And Binger is too much of a chicken shit loser to go back up there and defend his corruption, no. He has Kraus go up there because he knows the case is completely shot. This dude sounded SO FUCKING ANGRY AND BITTER and like he was attacking the Jury and most of it was spent trying to defend his department. If you had any takeaway from this, it was that he was fucking livid that the Defense just blew up their argument and credibility so bad. Just complete nonsense.

One of the sticking points was him basically calling Kyle a total COWARD for not fighting Rosenbaum, and saying "Oh, he's so scared of this little man, and instead of fighting him honorably, he shot him dead!" Like mocking Kyle for having to shoot this 30 year old violent pedophile. When a fucking toddler could beat the shit out of this Kraus loser.

There was also a lot of defense for Rosenbaum again which was... bizarre and included him saying "Well, they attack him for covering his face, but you guys know there's the Covid threat, right!? There were lots of people covering their faces!" Absolutely bizarre. He sounded like a raving mad man up there, spitting out arguments on a little checklist he had and sounding like the biggest jackass you've ever seen. Unhinged behavior.

The most damning thing was him trying to bring up that they couldn't bring up the Zaminski's! Because they were protected by their 5th Amendment! The Judge immediately calls the jury out and says that they can't bring up the 5th Amendment and that they were already over this. Kraus and Binger argue "Well, they have impending cases coming up!" "Well why didn't you call Mrs. Zaminiski? Her case is over." "Well why didn't the Defense!?" "Because it was your witness to call. We can't call her." They keep arguing and digging themselves deeper until they say that Mr. Zaminski's trial is being repeatedly post-poned... by the State. HMMMM! I WONDER WHY! Is it potentially so they couldn't have him violate his 5th Amendment rights and have an excuse not to bring on a witness who would destroy their case entirely?

So the Judge says just tread carefully now. So he calls back the Jury and tells them about 5th Amendment. Please disregard that. And so Kraus immediately says, shit you not, "So the 5th Amendment rules apply to Mr. Zaminski and..." The Judge looks exasperated and then asks the jury to go back again. They were out there for no more than 30 seconds total. And this fucking idiot Kraus has to be told to just get away from that point already.

The jury hates this man. They hate him so much. If it wasn't because of his conduct being so shitty, if it wasn't because he bullied an autistic man on the stand, if it wasn't because he was literally just screaming at them because he was so upset, it was because the Judge had to dismiss them, and then he fucked up again so quickly after and made them all settle and come out, and then he had to dismiss them again. And then he's STILL attacking the autistic man and claiming he was just too confused and couldn't understand the situation. Unbelievable.

This is the worst way this could have ended for the Prosecution. The Jury cannot believe a thing they said. Everything should be dismissed. This never should have gone to trial. And the Prosecution is scum. Defense nailed it super hard today. I find it difficult that the jury doesn't find Kyle guilty, and they're completely right to find him not guilty on all charges.

I am almost free. I can't pretend I got everything notable from these closing arguments, but I tried. Too much to remember and consume.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Kyle Rittenhouse Trial Closing Arguments are done.

I said this before but there was just so much packed in these, I can't pack this with a really detailed summary. I'll try though.

First things first, the gun possession charge was dropped because he never violated it in the first place. The Judge gave the Prosecution one last chance to prove he was in violation and said "The only thing I think is pertinent at this point is the barrel length. What was it?" And Kraus, the other Prosecutor with so much dismay in his voice said the length of the barrel and the Judge said, "Alright, well I'm dropping that charge then."

The Judge also ruled that the reckless endangerment charge for the first shooting would be specifically if Richie McGinnis, the reporter who witnessed it, was in danger. It's pretty clear he wasn't.

The Judge also decided, despite saying he was likely to allow the blurry ass photos to be considered for provocation, to specifically tell the jury they wouldn't be any longer. Fair because they were bullshit and everyone alive knew it.

Binger did the Prosecution's closing argument. I said it before, but it was filled with insanity, misrepresentation of facts, and outright lying about the law. This could have been objected to many times because he made assertions that were not in evidence or testimony at all.

Particularly wild things that happened was that Binger claimed that Kyle definitively raised his gun, and that was what instigated everything. And that he was CHASING Rosenbaum. And that their evidence had proven that. What evidence?

He also claimed that there was no way that Kyle should have been afraid of Rosenbaum because he was a MANLET. This fucking guy just trashed him as a harmless idiot tiny person the whole time and said Kyle was taller than him, so why was he afraid? Hilariously, he also said "When an unarmed man attacks you, you should fight him hand to hand in combat." And he showed a picture from fucking Road House. Comedy gold. And he said that you lose the right to self-defense if you have a gun. Absolute lie. Completely. He's a piece of shit. This is what he's reduced to--misrepresenting the actual law to a jury. There was so much of this spent saying KYLE IS A COWARD FOR NOT FIGHTING HIM IN HAND TO HAND COMBAT.

Other insanity involved him saying he should have just submitted to the mob and let them turn him in rather than run away from them, and that he lied to them because he's just a dishonest person. And that he was an active shooter, and that's why mob justice was enacted, and that he can't just shoot whoever he wants because he had initially fired and lost his right to self-defense if anyone else attacked him. Again, a clear lie.

And his telling of the second shooting was, frankly, madness. He says that all someone did was knock his hat off (when they had a rock in their hand and smacked them in the head) and that was no reason for him to fear for his life. And that all of these people were just trying to disarm him, an active shooter, and they were just as afraid! That they were all unarmed (except for the skateboard, someone's Timbs in his face, and a pistol) and that he wasn't allowed to just shoot Huber when he was smashing him in the head and neck with his skateboard. And that Gaige Grosskreutz wasn't moving to shoot him in the head, he was just trying to evade him (literal video of him admitting to him only being shot when he has his gun aimed at his head), and that his gun was only aimed at his head because his arm was blown off and that this is how muscles work when they are blown to bits! No medical expert testified.

And he continually lied about Kyle having all the time in the world to de-escalate every situation, when it's been established literal seconds were involved. He even lied outright about Rosenbaum not reaching for his gun, and that Kyle callously continued to fire at him even though he MUST have known he was dead, even though it was .5 seconds between all four shots.

He said "The Defense wants you to believe Mr. Rosenbaum deserves to die because he was setting a couple fires, destroying property here and there, and yelling naughty words." And then he scoffed and rolled his eyes. SAY THE NAUGHTY WORD THEN IF IT'S NO BIG DEAL BINGER.

He also said "And Kyle did all these things like helping people who were hurt, offering medical assistance, and then putting out fires. Whoohoo! This doesn't discount that he KILLED people."

I will give Binger credit that while his Closing Argument was based in no reality, completely lied about many, many facts of the case, and outright lied about the law, he was very convincing and displayed his bullshit case well... until he went fully unhinged in the second half trying to rehabilitate Rosenbaum and present him as a poor victim when it was clear that he was a terrible, violent person all night. And the jury also knows a lot of things he said were outright lies as well, so it's... I dunno, very performative. It's like he's gaslighting the jury into believing things that did not happen.

The Defense with Richards came after this. I have been pretty critical about Richards throughout this case, and I think he's been weak on Defense. This man must have been meditating when everyone thought he was asleep because he unleashed his final form today.

He came out immediately and pointed out that the Prosecution was lying by presenting a picture of Rosenbaum having a chain weapon, which they claimed he never had. And he said they've been lying to them the whole time and that they know it, but he'll show it right now. Binger objected and the Judge immediately overruled it. lol He said that this is not something to play fast and loose with the facts and acting like Rosenbaum was a good man.

The rest of the Closing Statement from the Defense was just completely dumpstering the Prosecution. He said the owners of the car lot were fucking liars and pointed out they couldn't tell the truth for fear of being sued and that they had five people claim they were liars. And he pointed out that Kyle was asked to be there, his dad lived there, he works there, and then reminding them just how close Kenosha was to where Kyle lives, relating it to where he lives "as a far away place".

He also pointed out provocation was never brought up a single time before this, because their case blew the fuck up and this was all they had left, and that nothing in their opening statement was true. And he also pointed out that if they wanted to prove he was provoking anything, they could have brought the Zaminski's (the people hanging out with Rosenbaum all night) and then had them testify, but they know there's no truth to it. And then they said they brought out a "HOCUS POCUS OUT OF FOCUS" picture to try to prove provocation, and that is literally the only piece of evidence he provoked anything that night, saying that their doofus spent 20 hours manipulating the picture until he could get something that looked like it, and then showed the jury how it's impossible because he'd be holding it left handed and if he fired then it would have recoiled something or other into his face (I don't know guns).

From there, he went through each charge and tore them apart. And then he went through all of the witnesses and talked about how each of them helped THEM.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Binger throwing Kraus to the wolves. lmao

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

I don't know how well I can summarize the closing arguments today. Prosecutor Binger is lying about so many things, making so many gross arguments, and outright lying about the law and he intends to talk to 2.5 hours. I'll try my best though but it's just so much, I'm bound to miss some stuff.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

You said "common sense is that he violated the law".

And then I say no, he didn't violate the law.

And then you post a law and say "See, he violated the law!"

And then Wang and I explain in detail that he didn't.

And then you say "Well obviously it's just a single interpretation of the law!"

And we say no, it's the literal only interpretation of it.

And then you say "WELL IT SHOULDN'T BE THIS WAY IT'S MORALLY WRONG!"

You're fucking ridiculous dude.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

You must have missed the part during pre-trial where Rittenhouses lawyer petitioned for it to be dropped and the judge denied it. Its ok, you were probably busy getting your law degree.

And I just gave you the reason the Judge, himself, decided to wait.

Like why do you keep trying to argue with me about this? Why are you so incapable of saying "Sorry, I was wrong"?

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

What part of poorly worded so its open for interpretation are you not getting?

You really think Wisconsin law is intended to allow 16-17 year olds to carry guns around without adult supervision, as long as the barrel is long enough? How many states do you think intentionally have that law on the books?

17+, yes. Because that's how they wrote the law. I'm sorry that you don't like that, but they wrote the law like that because that's what they intended.

And I don't know, Tony. Because I'd have to look at the laws for every state, but I imagine it's a spread of even more lenient to less lenient across the board.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Also "Why didn't the Judge throw this case out by now if it was so clear?" Because this is the point in the trial where they usually drop charges because the Judge wants to hear them explain their sides entirely before it goes to a Jury.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Hey Biscuit.

You keep acting like everything is an immutable fact because you said so, but theres literally a reason the judge didnt throw out the charge until now.

The entire purpose of the case, the entire purpose of fucking trials, is to look at the law, look at the evidence, and come to a conclusion.

Youre somehow working backwards.

Anyway, heres the law for you to read and interpret for yourself:

https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/statutes/statutes/948/60/2/a

Hope this helps!

Tony, can I just put this simply, first.

You haven't watched any of this trial. You haven't seen both sides argue this gun possession. You haven't seen the law they are arguing. You googled this from someone who does not actually understand the law and then sent it here as a "gotcha". You haven't gotten a SINGLE THING RIGHT that you've tried to argue in this trial and I don't know why you keep trying to argue with me over this stuff.

You want to look at 948.60(3)(c), in which it states:

(c) This section applies only to a person under 18 years of age who possesses or is armed with a rifle or a shotgun if the person is in violation of s. 941.28 or is not in compliance with ss. 29.304 and 29.593. This section applies only to an adult who transfers a firearm to a person under 18 years of age if the person under 18 years of age is not in compliance with ss. 29.304 and 29.593 or to an adult who is in violation of s. 941.28.

This section is the important one because Kyle is under 17. Then you look at 941.28 it references:

941.28 Possession of short-barreled shotgun or short-barreled rifle.
(1) In this section:
(a) Rifle" means a firearm designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder or hip and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of a propellant in a metallic cartridge to fire through a rifled barrel a single projectile for each pull of the trigger.
(b) Short-barreled rifle" means a rifle having one or more barrels having a length of less than 16 inches measured from closed breech or bolt face to muzzle or a rifle having an overall length of less than 26 inches.

The rifle is within these length requirements, which was in contention. Which means he needed to be in violation of BOTH 29.304 and 29.593. 29.304 deals with minors 16 and under, which Kyle is not.

I hope you understand a little bit more Tony. I don't know why you keep fighting me so hard on this case when I clearly know so much more about it than you do, and you haven't put any effort to actually watching and seeing the arguments laid out by both sides.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Called it.

Common sense says he violated the law, but obviously they were gonna give this kid the benefit of the doubt with the weird wording.

Can we just declare him not guilty and move on to the aftermath now?

Hey Tony.

Like everything else concerning this case, you actually don't know anything about the law in question. He wasn't violating it and never should have been charged with it. The point of contention is the length of the barrel, in which the Prosecution had never measured in any point during the investigation but charged him anyway, and the length of the barrel did not exceed the length it was to be in violation of the law.

Hope this helps.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Haven't started watching the Rittenhouse trial stuff but so far the three big things are:

The gun possession charge has been dropped entirely.

Judge has decided the jury will disregard the blurry ass pictures entirely because the Prosecution has been unable to prove that it's reliable.

The jury instruction for reckless endangerment for the first shooting is if McGinnis (the reporter who was behind Rosenbaum and started the series of blowing up the entire Prosecution) was in danger, when he wasn't in danger since he thought he wasn't in the way of the gun shots.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

SEP has the right of it. The burden of proof is always on the Prosecution/Plaintiff. The entire reason that the appeal was successful was because the Jury Instructions were set up so the jury had to decide based on the Defendant proving that she shot in self-defense.

It's literally the basis of the phrase "Innocent until proven guilty."

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

So Marisa Alexander case. I told you guys there was probably more to it, fair or not, and there is.

Marisa Alexander was threatened by her abusive POS husband and she had admitted to firing a "warning shot" that was close to her husband's head, and it had deflected and went upwards. This could have easily been deflected down too, or any various other directions. What makes that worse is that their children were close by as well, putting them in danger. Don't fire warning shots, period.

As such, this meant that 3 people were in danger of her warning shot, which means she got three charges of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon, which would be where everyone is getting the 1 year punishment. Because of the three counts, the Prosecutor offered her a plea deal for 3 years minimum. Marisa denied it, claiming she was acting in self defense.

The trial went ahead with the Prosecutor claiming that she was acting in anger, not in self defense, and that she had intended to kill her husband and kids in anger. She argued it was self defense, but the Prosecutor argued if it was self defense then she wouldn't have shot her husband, the assailant. It took 12 minutes for a jury to convict her.

Where the 20 years comes is from a "lovely" law Florida previously had called the 10-20-Life law. It ties the Judge's hands that if a gun is involved, they must have a minimum sentence of these punishments.

10 years for having a gun with a felony
20 years for discharging a gun with a felony
Life for shooting someone and hitting with a felony

If you're looking at this and saying "This seems to lack any kind of nuance." You'd be right! Supposedly this has helped with gun violence in Florida. But since it's an awful law, they've since gotten rid of it.

So because she was found guilty of discharging a gun, and aggravated assault with a deadly weapon is a felony, she was charged for 20 years because a jury had found her guilty.

Now how did a jury find her guilty? Remember those Jury Instructions I talked about with the Rittenhouse trial? Well bizarrely, somehow someway, the instructions the jury received shifted the burden of proof FROM the Prosecution and to the Defendant (Marisa), meaning they now had to prove without any doubt that she was acting in self-defense. Since the jury felt there wasn't any concrete proof of this, they found her guilty. Complete nonsense how a Defense attorney let this happen.

However, because of this, it was appealed. When you appeal, you have to appeal that something, some way had gone wrong with the court process. So they agreed that since the burden of proof was bizarrely sent to the Defendant than the Prosecution, they would overturn the decision.

That's not it though. The Prosecutor said she would now charge each of the three aggravated assault charges separately, and that it would result in three 20-year convictions should she lose. Fortunately, Marisa got a lot more help this time around in every aspect you could and the Prosecutor had no case. Because she already served 3 years, she plead guilty for the plea deal we saw earlier for 3 years, with an added house arrest for 2 years. The alternative was going to a trial again and you never want to risk a jury deciding on it when 60 years were on the table.

So there you go. It's all basically bullshit and this Florida law was so stupid (but thankfully no longer in play), and prosecutors are some of the worst people on our planet. But to avoid any and all gun law bullshit, don't ever fire a warning shot. Shoot to kill or don't shoot at all.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

That's true, actually. The fact I forgot about it makes me feel like it's still not significant.

I dunno, I would've mostly likely more than just stand in a corner and shoot until they die.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

I feel like the only major complaint I have is that the counter times were a bit too strict. I think they could have been just a little bit more generous.

Outside of that, they kinda felt very same-y and I would've rathered each encounter feel a bit different, including how to beat them. It was find a good spot to camp and shoot for a while which wasn't great.

I do really like them conceptually though.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Okay I looked up the Marissa Alexander thing.

Jesus fucking Christ is this a mess and the law was complete bullshit there. It's not as simple as anyone else here is trying to explain it is, but it is bullshit.

I don't have the time to explain it all here, but I can go through it tomorrow for you guys. Tl;Dr is the prosecutor sucks, the laws sucked, and there's been a lot of changes since then so this doesn't happen.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Kenri posted...

So is it being too mindful or not enough? I don't disagree with the "shouldn't be handling a gun part" but it seems like doing something ineffective and dangerous is very much a thing that could happen while you fear for your life, while coldly trying to eliminate your target might imply a lack of fear. Why does the justice system only interpret it the one way?

Also I'm pretty sure "shots fired into the air can kill someone on the way down" is one of those theoretically-possible-but-insanely-unlikely things. Has that literally ever happened? No disagreement on warning shots in general being dangerous if fired e.g. to the sides though.

It absolutely has happened before, which is why this law is in place.

NFUN posted...

Good thing that there's a crime specifically for reckless use of a firearm! It just so happens to have a maximum sentence of 1 year as a first-degree misdemeanor in Florida, which is a twentieth as long as she was sentenced for. Strange!

Where was this? What were the other circumstances around it? I would look this up now but I'm pressed for time, but there's likely more to it.

For instance, a recent case of that YouTuber you may remember named Boogie went online and threatened one of his trolls to come to his house because he'd love to kill him. The troll does and then he shoots his gun in the air to tell him to leave. It was also in a school zone, so it's much more hefty charges.

Gimme time and I'll look up more of this, but the tl;dr is probably that Prosecutors are garbage people in the end.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

NFUN posted...

maybe the law is worded like that idk, but this logic is astoundingly moronic for justifying that as reasonable

You aren't supposed to use lethal force unless you absolutely think you have to. You aren't supposed to fire something that can be lethal into the air where it can kill someone on the way down.

Don't fire a gun unless you know where you're firing and you absolutely think you need to. That's gun safety and if you can't be that mindful to do that, then you shouldn't be handling a gun.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Samurai7 posted...

My understanding is in a lot of these cases being 'scared for your life' is the necessary defense. If you have the presence of mind to aim for the sky instead of at the person you've shown presence of mind that you weren't fearful for your life so you get all the unlawful discharge of a fire arm and that bs

This is pretty much it.

If you're that afraid for your life, you would fire to kill. Firing in the sky implies you don't immediately fear for your life enough to use lethal force. And that someone ELSE can be afraid for their life and attack you in that case.

Also, firing in the air is dangerous and can seriously hurt people because those bullets do go down.

I can discuss this more in length in the future if anyone is interested!

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Paratroopa1 posted...

Hmmm. I dunno what he said but should I unblock BT so he has to read my posts and maybe learn a better perspective?

nah fuck him lol

You should not.

Baku you're a good dude and I'm glad you're learning more about this and moreso that you're supportive of your kid. I was in a similar situation of trying to understand a lot about the trans community and some kind trans friends were able to help educate me a lot.

Props to everyone who politely explained things to Baku. You're good people too.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Did they mention this during the trial?

Because it looks like a hoax.

The (dead) website being linked to as proof (almost exclusively by internet shitlords) doesnt have his personal information correct, and theres no other source literally anywhere.

They weren't allowed to mention it at the trial. Nothing about any men's past. It was argued for them to allow it. It isn't a hoax. I don't care if you don't believe it. He also had his multiple DWIs removed from his record right before the trial as well.

Depending on how skeptical you want to be, this could have been done by the prosecution to ensure his cooperation.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Didnt BT of all people post his criminal record and it had no burglary charge on it?

He was charged with a disorderly while carrying a weapon and accused of prowling or some shit. Did they establish during the trial he was a convicted violent burglar? Isnt that a felony?

His felony burglary was expunged literally this year. I don't know the specifics of how it got expunged, but he was absolutely guilty of it.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

xp1337 posted...

Fair enough on the rest though. It still doesn't sit completely right with me that whether or not the victims were "good people" changes how egregious/outrageous prosecutorial misconduct should be viewed. It's bad regardless and I don't think the character of the victims should factor in how galling it is.

I think it is when the Prosecution does things like coach Gaige Grosskuertz to go onto the stand and talk about what an angel he is, or trying to make the argument that Rosenbaum didn't ACTUALLY want to hurt anyone and that he was probably just really afraid of Kyle. Or trying to bring Huber's grand aunt onto the stand to talk about how he once stopped a fire in his house.

It's more of a commentary on Prosecution, and just how gross it is the lengths they go to convict someone they're keenly aware are innocent. Prosecutors are disgusting people. Don't trust them. They suck.

Edit: Oh, sorry. I didn't want to ignore the Judge veteran's thing. Yeah, that's a lot worse.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

xp1337 posted...

Eh, the only issue I kinda have here and it's nothing I'd ever bring up if not for the fact that apparently this is what we're talking about now is I do think Biscuit's disgust for the prosecution, justified or not, seems to be bleeding in to how he's describing it. Like...

Emphasis mine. For the first, does the character of the people (I'm speaking specifically to the "vile" here, less violent) somehow act as an alleviating factor in vigilantism? This doesn't feel too far removed from "he was no angel..." takes. It's not right when the police try to influence the media narrative by bringing up past behavior and it's still not okay to do so here IMO.

The second bold section echoes the same but I'll append that in a case where discussion of Rittenhouse's actions/photos with Proud Boys is out of bounds here it kinda feels like past criminal history of a victim is too? You can say it's relevant because you see it as perjury but from the strictest, most pedantic sense... is it? I say this because I'm too lazy to look of WI medic laws and just apply my (admittedly pretty lose but probably better than person off the street) knowledge of how ambulance/EMTs work here because my family has been involved with them and like I can see how you can claim that without technically lying. I mean, whether you should be is another issue but like "issues I've seen over near two decades of watching/hearing some of the shit that has gone down at the ambulance department some of my family has been part of" that is honestly not even near the top.

But in terms of getting across that the prosecution is doing a terrible job here and may well lack the hard evidence to pursue most of the charges they had here your commentary has been informative. I think you're a little too dismissive of some of the complaints levelled at the judge but that's been a scattershot on social media and some of it I wouldn't even touch myself but KP posted that image of the judge basically leading the jury to give a round of applause for the Defense's next witness... like nah that's not a good look. "It was Veteran's Day" is not a valid defense/excuse here. Either do it without the jury present or realize the situation. That's different from saying the trial is rigged but I mean, fair or not, if you're the judge in this case you have to be aware that people are watching - and he definitely knows this, he's complained about it!

I mean, I'll join the chorus of others that while legally he may well be on the right side of the law, this whole cases just reinforces the issues with gun laws and culture in this country. That's a bigger picture issue than this case though.

tl;dr: I think your opinion of the prosecution has bled into a bit of editorializing on your part.

My point of saying the "violent, vile people" line was to drive home just how horrible of a situation this is for the Prosecution to be doing all this insanity to send him to jail for killing people in self-defense who all have histories of violence who absolutely would have killed Kyle if they had the chance.

Concerning Gaige Grosskuertz, he was previously an EMT but lost his license after being convicted of a violent armed burglary, and has continued to commit crimes leading up to that night. I'm pointing out that Gaige Grosskuertz portrayed himself, verbatim, as having a "life-long duty of helping people due to job as an EMT". It wasn't perjury, but it was intentionally dishonest. The only thing I keep bringing up Gaige is because he's going on a media circus run where everyone is acting like he's a kind, loving person, but they don't bother to show him admitting to having tried to kill Kyle and aiming the gun to his head in court, and omitting his criminal past.

And no, the Judge should not have done the Veteran's Day thing there. From what I understand he had asked who was a veteran and he stood up and they cheered. It shouldn't have happened regardless though. I actually missed that part since it was at the start of the stream and I skipped ahead to the relevant part. There aren't any other complaints that are valid at all, aside from the ones I've mentioned. There's no way you can claim the Judge is biased at all after his decisions he's made. They've been favoring the Prosecution, if anything. The things he's chewed out the Prosecution for are 100% valid and any law student above would tell you that.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ANYWAY! The Jury Instruction Rittenhouse Trial Update

For those unaware, Jury Instructions are how you explain to the jury the law they're using to decide if someone is guilty or not. It also acts as a sort of oral argument with the judge for any final chances to dismiss anything before the trial goes forward. He still has yet to review the Motion to Dismiss documents to see if any of these should be dropped pre-jury.

I'll try to burst through these pretty fast:

The first thing they discussed was the reckless endangerment charges. Despite the Prosecution's bad arguments that were so bad the Judge was just belittling him over it, he made a concession to him, but he also said at one point "They wouldn't agree with that argument because they'd be nuts!"

Concerning the gun charge, the Defense made an extremely convincing argument about the gun law and said that they didn't need to defend it in trial because the Prosecution didn't make any arguments he violated it. Embarrassingly, the Prosecution was saying "Well they didn't offer any evidence!" And the Judge correctly told him "The burden of proof is on you to show, not them. That sounds like your problem." The Prosecution made so many dumb arguments and were playing dumb with the law to try to dupe the Judge who wasn't having any of it. He finally said he thinks he'll drop it, but wants to review. The Prosecution DID drop the ball but it feels like it's more because they just couldn't drum up anything to support the illegal possession and kind of just hoped we'd all get here and the Judge would forget about it.

Then the big argument was about the murder charge towards Rosenbaum. It's an argument about intent. Defense says it shouldn't be murder. This is where the vast majority of it all was spent, because the Prosecution argued intent. The Judge got livid over most of this because he found out they were bullshitting him on the pixellation argument happening that I've gone over quite extensively already. The Defense rightfully argued that there was nothing to support this blurry image even being allowed in. The Prosecution said "Oh we have a better quality video though!" And then the Judge snapped and said why didn't they send the Defense that version instead. Just grotesque lawyering. The Defense also claimed that if they really believed that, they could have sent any video or photos they had to prove it, or they could have called Rosenbaum's friend or the friend's wife to the stand, but they obviously didn't because they are both insane people who would get torn apart on the stand, and they probably want to screw over the State as well and devastate their case.

So then the Judge said show me the best quality of the video. So they pulled out the video and then everyone is huddled around the fucking TV screen squinting at it. It looked so god damn stupid. And then the Judge is like "Where was it?" The Prosecutors couldn't even find it. They couldn't point of Rosenbaum's friend in the video. They couldn't point out anything. Their entire case hinges on this, honestly, because there is nothing else that points to Kyle NOT acting in self defense. And baffling, after all of that, the Judge calling them liars, saying he doesn't see anything, isn't convinced, he STILL let these pictures in again. This is appealable, entirely. If Kyle gets convicted, they should absolutely appeal on these grounds. Just completely appalling this evidence was allowed in. I think it may also be to avoid claims of bias and hoping that the jury also goes "What the fuck is this?" Because... this is all the Prosecution has, really. And yes, the jury may do just that, but you never want to leave it up to the jury for something like this.

Other bangers to try to prescribe that Kyle is guilty of murder was saying "Well Rosenbaum threatened to kill him a while ago, so he shouldn't have thought he still wanted to kill him now!" This even got Kyle looking at him like "What the fuck are you talking about?" Or trying to claim that Kyle couldn't shoot him because Rosenbaum didn't say whether or not he was going to take the gun. Terrible stuff.

There were many, many times throughout this that the Prosecution outright lied, much of it about Kyle's testimony, but the Judge was too smart to fall for that. Kyle did an incredible job on the stand, because he didn't get a single omission they wanted to use to argue here. That's why it was so dangerous to bring him up on the stand because during cross, they tried desperately hard to get any bullshit reason to strengthen their case here.

Oh and the Prosecution also wanted to use CNN footage in their closing argument. Can you fucking imagine right now? The absolute gall. Completely unheard of. The Judge said no, absolutely not.

So we'll find out if the Judge dismissed anything tonight or Monday.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Leafeon13N posted...

This is a bad take 7 year olds are perfectly capable of growing into bigger shitbags, especially with how politics has poisoned everyone's rational.

I think I can outright promise you that there is no way Kyle Rittenhouse would ever turn out to be even a fraction of the piece of shit Rosenbaum turned into. And considering what we know about the other two people who were shot, I find it hard to think he'd turn out as bad as them either.

KamikazePotato posted...

A large portion of the 'edgy humor' teenage crowd grew up to be current-day MAGA types and white supremacists. So no, I'm not really interested in giving people like that leeway anymore.

This is fair. I don't prescribe to this, but it's fair. You're welcome to judge him however you want, but like I said, I just want people to make their judgment based on the truth of it all.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

HashtagSEP posted...

I agree that his analysis of the trial has been very interesting to read, but I also do see how it feels like he's defending Rittenhouse kinda oddly.

If Biscuit relates with anybody for any reason whatsoever, he tends to go kinda hard on defending them, even if he doesn't necessarily mean to. He defended Richard Spencer over the whole being confronted at a gym thing in a "Dude just wanted to do his workout" because he connected over that part and it made him kinda gloss over that Richard Spencer is a piece of shit.

I don't think he necessarily means to, and I certainly don't think it means he agrees with those people on other things, it's just a trend I noticed.

This is a mischaracterization of that Richard Spencer situation--I said people shouldn't be banned from places for their politics. I still agree with that--to an extent. But Richard Spencer has turned out to be a special kind of shitbag that I can make an exception to now.

But people are literally characterizing Kyle based on actions he didn't do. They claim he traveled to some random city with intentions to murder people. They claim he instigated something. They claim he had no reason to be there. All of it completely untrue. The only evidence that night is that he was just helping people and putting out fires. There is no evidence otherwise.

The bizarre part is the amount of hatred towards this kid because he said stupid shit when he was 17. Do you honestly think he said he wished he had his gun when watching people on a TV screen looting a place because he actually wanted to kill people? How many of us have made stupid edgy jokes like that? Or had shitty politics? Or get convinced to hang out with a group of bad people? So he deserves this "Well he put himself in this situation and I don't feel bad."

Every fact in this trial paints him as a well-meaning seventeen year old with bad politics who didn't try to instigate anything that night. I mean god, the alternative is that the three people he shot would have killed them, and I don't think a Kyle Rittenhouse could do anything as awful as any one of them have ever done.

You can judge him however you want. But at least judge him based on the truth. Which is why I'm correcting things here. But the way I'm judging him myself is as a dumbass kid with bad politics that made a stupid decision, but not one that he deserves to go to jail for by any means.

And yes, I did say innocent boy, because he is innocent to the law. And my point is a 17 year old didn't seem to do anything unlawful and the Prosecution is trying so absurdly hard to the point of hinging their entire case on the blurriest picture you've ever seen as proof in order to put an innocent 17 year old in jail for life. And my point with saying that is that any Prosecutor will do whatever they can to rig the system to put someone in jail, including people you like more than a Kyle Rittenhouse.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Literally none of what I know is from a year ago, I read your long ass posts and googled for myself.

Regardless of whether you think the car dealership guys were lying, they specifically testified that they didnt ask Kyle himself to guard it, I literally saw it happen a week ago. Kyle texted one of the guys asking if he needed defending, and he didnt reply. They took pictures with the people there with guns because they looked cool, but Kyle was not personally invited by the owners, unless you think they DID invite him but not via the text he made and are now perjuring themselves to hide it?

Oh you GOOGLED it. Then I guess you must know more than me!

YES THEY ARE PERJURING THEMSELVES. Many people in this trial have done so! Fucking Gaige Grosskuertz lied his ass off and then had to tell the truth only because there was video contradicting every word he said and he had to stare at it while he answered. So either Kyle and the other people who were there were lying about being invited, or the car dealership owners were lying! And considering that they presented evidence that he was lying repeatedly about how much damage was done to the cars, and then presented with an interview a month after detailing how much monetary damage was done to the cars, he was LYING.

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Genuinely bizarre paragraph.

If a black person showed up on scene with a rifle, the situation would have been entirely different, I have no idea why youre specifically making this out that I said cops would have shot a black Rittenhouse WHILE he was being attacked.

It's getting harder to see these goal posts.

You said he would have been shot, apparently now even before the situation happened. But apparently he would have been shot just for having a rifle? Even though the cops said "The majority of people there had guns." Do you presume that not a single person had a gun who was a person of color? Even though there's proof of just that? And that the cops would just fucking open fire in this situation despite having no reason to?

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Yeah Im concluding youre so wrapped up in this you literally dont even understand my position, and are taking me as the railroaders previously mentioned in the topic, who to my knowledge havent posted here.

No, I understand your position just fine. You don't think he's guilty, but think he did all of these things he didn't do, and that for some reason he would have been shot if he were black.

My conclusion is that you're embarrassing.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Mr walls of text defending this kid and youre getting things wrong. The car dealership owners literally testified they didnt ask him to come, dude?

Unless they recanted on a different day, what are you talking about?

Also the judge specifically didnt throw out the gun possession charges, but I think the result of the terrible prosecution will get him found not guilty on those.

Lastly, I literally didnt say cops were involved, I said cops would have been involved if he was brown, so againwhat??

Excuse me, I'm getting it wrong? How much of this trial did you ACTUALLY watch?

The car dealership guys were LYING MULTIPLE TIMES ON STAND and exposed during all parts of their cross examination and then again when they were brought on a second time by the Defense. And then they had no less than five people testify that those car lot owners all asked them specifically to watch over the car lot and a couple people said THEY DROVE THEM THERE. If they admit they invited someone with a gun to watch over their place, that is insurance fraud and they will get sued (and likely will after this trial).

The Judge did not throw out the gun possession charges, but today in Court the Defense convincingly explained to the Judge during Jury Instructions why this doesn't apply and the Prosecution's response and justification was so bad that the Judge was outright laughing at his awful justifications were. It has a chance of being dismissed before the Jury, pending the Judge's ruling later today or early Monday.

So you're saying the cops would have been involved in the three minutes it happened, when they weren't aware of an active shooter situations until a full minute after it was over and he was already trying to surrender. Unless you think the police magically would have heard "THE SHOOTER IS BLACK" and someone got to the scene quicker in their gigantic armored trucks like they were trying to.

I'm actually watching the trial that is presenting the facts of what happened that night. You don't know shit about the facts aside from what you were told a year ago, a majority of which being wrong.

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

This is why those posts were so annoying, youre clearly in defend this kid mode, they read identical to Jack Posibiec and Shapiro tweets.

Ive literally said he can and should be found not guilty, so the tribalism you just want him railroaded shit that keeps getting brought up doesnt apply to me.

I dont see the benefit of harping on this trial, so im gonna be done after this.

"I don't actually know anything, and being corrected on what actually happened means you're just trying to defend him like FAR RIGHT WING LUNATICS."

I have moddable words for you.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

I have no idea why people keep saying HDT and I think he should be convicted/punished.

I literally said that I believe hes legally not guilty, my issue is ethical and one over sympathizing with a shitty kid who is gonna end up a millionaire after all this is done, just because he decided to (illegally) take a gun to a city he didnt even live in and play combat medic.

If he was brown hed have been shot dead by the cops, and a lot of the people expressing sympathy with Rittenhouse would say he deserved it.

My evidence is the trial over the Arbery murder, which Ive brought up multiple times and people would rather talk about this kid.

Legally, he's actually pretty clear of the gun charge as well because he was following every Wisconsin gun law knowingly.

He lived with his mom half an hour away. He stays with his dad in Kenosha often, has his job in Kenosha, and many of his friends are in Kenosha, and specifically his best friend lived there too, and he was very much part of the community there.

He went there because the owners of the car lot invited him specifically and others to watch over their car lot and had a gun specifically to deter people from attacking him, because the majority of people there also carried a gun, as testified by many people.

At no point were cops involved in this situation until the situation was entirely diffused and he tried to surrender in which they told him to go home, so there would be no point where he would have gotten shot by the cops.

Sorry, I'm just correcting you since you're apparently extremely confused about the facts of what happened there despite me saying it in my posts you're tired of looking at.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

HeroDelTiempo17 posted...

Nah I'm with Tony on this, the information is one thing but I'm sick of the editorializing sympathizing with a shitlord and somehow painting his aquittal as a win for the justice system and not the completely laughable failure on multiple levels it actually is. The laws are shit. The investigation is shit. The trial is shit. All of it is shit. I am over the details, and frankly I'm annoyed that people seem to be warming to Rittenhouse and reducing it all to a "fair, next."

I simply made one (1) more neutral post on the subject, skimmed the posts, and kept my mouth shut, but hey if we are now at the part where we start bitching each other out turns out I had one of those in me as well!

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Nah man, it boils down pretty simply:

Rittenhouse is a shithead who put himself into a bad situation, but evidence and precedent is largely in his favor.

He can and will be acquitted on charges of murder, the end.

I dont need 14 posts talking about how unfair it is for this kid, who is legally innocent but morally/ethically culpable.

Give him his acquittal and lets move on.

Is the media coverage lopsided depending on where you look? Sure! And thats why Im not looking at it. I saw the facts, case closed.

Then don't read it and shut up.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

KamikazePotato posted...

Yeah, we need more of what this topic is really about: responding to trolls

(I can't even see half the recent posts here)

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Yes.

Let me ask you something Tony.

We have a Prosecutor who tried to rig an investigation in his favor, is outright making up lies in opening statements, making up absurdist claims to try to convict an innocent 17 year old child who by all logic and matters of the law defended himself from violent, vile people that night. And right now, they've argued tooth and nail to let in a single picture of manipulated, zoomed in, grainy and blurry photos, contradicting all witness testimony and other video footage, to vaguely show an incomprehensible photo that may show that he raised a gun in complete bad faith.

And all of the media that you presumably follow is making up LIES about what is actually going on in the trial, and I'm provided an accurate account of what is actually going on. When media is showing clips of Gaige Grosskreutz shedding a single tear on the stand going "I am a life-long medic who just wants to help people and never would have fired a gun at this kid" when his criminal rap sheet shows him as a violent criminal who is NEVER allowed to be an EMT again, and they refuse to show the moment where he admits on the stand that Kyle Rittenhouse only fired at him, staring at a picture of it, until he aimed his pistol directly at his head, and the dozen other times he lied in his testimony and got caught on cross examination.

And presumably this makes you uncomfortable because you don't agree with a 17 year old's politics--when so many people have different politics than they did when they were 17. And you just don't want anyone else to know what is ACTUALLY happening. Like do you realize how fucked this is if he gets convicted? That they'll use this to prove that nobody is allowed to defend themselves in this sort of situation in the future, and that it provides a very difficult argument for reasonable self defense claims?

And you want to keep this topic away from that information so you can argue with right wing nutters about supposed racist things Biden has said so you can get easy dunks on them.

Congratulations Tony, you are better than people who have so little credibility half of this topic has them on their ignore list. May you keep fighting the good fight.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Just tell us the verdict, we dont need to rubberneck the trainwreck any further tbh

Hi Tony.

Thanks for your insight.

No.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

So I'm catching up on the Rittenhouse trial stuff and I'm behind.

But today they're trying to get some charges decided on before they go to Jury. And I have heard that the Judge is already completely exasperated by the Prosecution and it's only been going on for like 40 minutes.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Suprak the Stud posted...

More holes than the prosecutions story smh

(Im just joking in case that isnt clear)

Lol

Honestly, the most frustrating part about this is how it's obviously going to attract so many right wing bad actors for this, because of course, but they don't even have to try hard for any grifts.

But the left wing media has been so impossible insane about this to the point it feels like parody of what's actually happening. Like I can't even look to any left leaning sources because it's all a complete circus for anything important or clips or anything.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Suprak the Stud posted...

Yeah, as Tony and Para have pointed out, the fact you couldnt find it elsewhere would genuinely concern me in most circumstances. Hes right wing propaganda and (like theyre accusing the prosecutor of) intentionally posts misleading or incomplete information.

Tbh I just picked the first one I could find. I didn't look too hard.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

Paratroopa1 posted...

I'm not accusing you of anything here and I understand why you posted it, but in a typical situation, referring to Jack Posobiec on anything severely weakens a case, he's a very hardcore misinformationist

Good to know, I'll keep that in mind for the future. I appreciate knowing bad actors. I'll at least attest that he isn't spreading misinformation in this instance.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/

I don't know him at all, but I had gathered he was right leaning and some degree of an asshole.

But piece of shit or not, he had the only picture I could find of precisely what I was talking about with these images so I'm not deleting it.

---

I stream sometimes. Check it out!
www.twitch.tv/heroicbiz/