Current Events > Will any blood spilled based on the events with Jerusalem be on Trumps hands?

(+) Yeah! (+)

IYO does he deserve blame if it occurs?
---

What a sad world it is when people can imagine blood being spilled over something so petty.

Ammonitida posted...

What a sad world it is when people can imagine blood being spilled over something so petty.

You must be knew to this "religion" thing. :v Plenty of blood has been spilt over petty stuff like this.
---

Morning bump.
---

People will blame Trump, but it definitely wouldn't be his fault (feels weird saying that about the idiot) that some savages react with violence.
---

I wouldn't blame him, but others will. There are people who would blame Trump if a meteor hit Earth.
---

Yes. As we all know Israel is just another state of the US and totally not it's own country with its own leaders. Trump is responsible for them moving the Capitol.
---

So what's the issue again? I'm not too familiar with this.

All i know is that Trump want's to declare Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and Muslims might be radicalized around the world because of it.

Correct?
---

more blood on Bush's hands

Ammonitida posted...

What a sad world it is when people can imagine blood being spilled over something so petty.

That sad world is called "The Middle East"
---

No. Blame rests on the hands of those using their hands. Hamas is to blame for all of Palestine's ills.
---

Ammonitida posted...

What a sad world it is when people can imagine blood being spilled over something so petty.

Only to the people of the middle east it's not petty.
---

I think the people with blood on their hands would be the ones actually killing people.
---

why would you blame Trump and not the islamic terrorists who refuse to accept Israel to the point of saying that the literal capitol of Israel where the governing body and heads of state reside and do their work is not the capitol and declaring it as such means people will have to die until governments are made to fear accepting this?
---

I've been saying since Annoying Orange got elected that, no matter how horrible things get with him in office, at least it won't be boring.

He certainly hasn't failed in that regard.
---

Here we go again where not bowing to the unreasonable demands of bloodthirsty Muslims means that it's your fault when they get violent.
---

Um Palestinians already elected a terrorist organization to lead them.
---

NINExATExSEVEN posted...

So what's the issue again? I'm not too familiar with this.

All i know is that Trump want's to declare Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and Muslims might be radicalized around the world because of it.

Correct?

The issue is that Muslims are upset that Trump is recognising Jerusalem as Israel's capital. Even though it is Israel's capital.
---

Now no I woudn't blame Trump for any attack that happens to Israel or America over this. I feel that he chose the worst possible time but really would their ever be a right time to officially make Jerusalem the capital of Israel? Honestly I don't think so. It was a risk that needed to be taken eventually and I hope it works out fine.
---

NINExATExSEVEN posted...

So what's the issue again? I'm not too familiar with this.

All i know is that Trump want's to declare Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and Muslims might be radicalized around the world because of it.

Correct?

Jerusalem is one of the holiest cities of Islam even though it has much deeper roots with the Jews. Jerusalem has already been divvied up between Israelites and Palestinians and thats not gonna change. The outrage is just over the recognition. Palestinians do NOT want Israelites in Jerusalem and this doesnt help obviously. Its not like that was gonna happen anyway but the issue is that their pipe dream kinda just ended, I guess.
---

Trump is just kicking up a hornets nest by doing this and it won't be he that suffers. It will be many innocent people.
---

creativerealms posted...

Now no I woudn't blame Trump for any attack that happens to Israel or America over this. I feel that he chose the worst possible time but really would their ever be a right time to officially make Jerusalem the capital of Israel? Honestly I don't think so. It was a risk that needed to be taken eventually and I hope it works out fine.

well, past presidents kinda tried to do it too

like Bill Clinton

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2017/12/06/in-1995-congress-reached-a-compromise-on-the-issue-of-jerusalem-trump-is-poised-to-end-it/

Ten days before he was assassinated in Tel Aviv, Israeli prime minister Yitzhak Rabin gave a speech in Washington about the city of Jerusalem.

Jerusalem is the heart of the Jewish people and a deep source of our pride, Rabin said at an event recognizing the 3,000th year of the citys existence.

We differ in our opinions, left and right, he said as the speech concluded. We disagree on the means and the objective. In Israel, we all agree on one issue: the wholeness of Jerusalem, the continuation of its existence as capital of the State of Israel. There are no two Jerusalems. There is only one Jerusalem. For us, Jerusalem is not subject to compromise, and there is no peace without Jerusalem.

The evening before his speech, the Congress of the United States passed a law echoing Rabins assertions about the city. Spurred by the desire to act before Rabins visit, the House and Senate passed a bill called the Jerusalem Embassy Act, which formally recognized the city as the countrys capital and called for the U.S. Embassy in Israel to be moved there from Tel Aviv by 1999. Support for the bill was overwhelming. It passed the Senate by a 93 to 5 vote, with four Republicans and one Democrat voting no. It passed the House 374 to 37, with 153 Democrats joining most of the new Republican majority that had swept into power in 1994.

then Muslim countries got really really mad

as well as that assassination as detailed above

With varying intensity, friends and foes of the United States in the Arab world have portrayed the call as an unfortunate sign that the United States is not evenhanded when it comes to Middle Eastern peace, the New York Times reported a few days later. America claims to be a friend to the Arabs, but it is a truer friend of Israel, one cleric told the paper.

The bill was not signed into law by then-President Bill Clinton. Clinton had made an early effort to craft a new peace agreement in the Middle East, forging the Oslo accords between Israel and Palestinians, signed in 1993 and September 1995. (Rabins support for the accords was apparently one of the things that motivated his assassin.) The Embassy Act, Clinton said in a statement, could hinder the peace process. I will not let this happen and will use the legislations waiver authority to avoid damage to the peace process.

---

It's not Trump's fault if someone else does something in anger at his opinion.

If I said "Mass Effect 1 is the best Mass Effect game."

And as a result you murdered 70 people in anger because you disagree. That's 100% on you. Not me.

Holding Trump to a different standard is insane.

Any blood spilled is 100% the fault of the sick freak piece of garbage shit ass fucking worthless moron who spills it.
---

LinksLiege posted...

I've been saying since Annoying Orange got elected that, no matter how horrible things get with him in office, at least it won't be boring.

He certainly hasn't failed in that regard.

Too damn true. Silver linings.

On topic: let's get some better conversation than "it's the right thing to do".

Instead let's talk about his approach to doing so. Was it a favorable approach? Was it necessary? Where do we go from here if things do escalate to the point of violent aggression from Palenstine. Do we send in troops?
---

No, it's absolutely not on Trump. He's not making people do terrorist things. We need to start blaming terrorists for terrorist attack. Not the "well they only do it because they are upset" narrative. I'm so sick of hearing that. It's fucking stupid
---

CrimsonRage posted...

There will never be a good time recognise Jerusalem as the capital of Israel. Might as well do it now. All the government offices of Israel are in Jerusalem anyway.

I just hate that Trump is doing it. He's not doing it to be a friend to the Jewish people. He's only doing it because people are telling him not to.

I disagree, trump rarely does things just because he's told to. He made the decision because it's unprecedented and would solidify his place in history for better or worse. It was an egocentric decision.
---

mattnd2007 posted...

No, it's absolutely not on Trump. He's not making people do terrorist things. We need to start blaming terrorists for terrorist attack. Not the "well they only do it because they are upset" narrative. I'm so sick of hearing that. It's fucking stupid

We do blame the terrorists. I'm so sick of hearing people saying we don't.
---

creativerealms posted...

mattnd2007 posted...

No, it's absolutely not on Trump. He's not making people do terrorist things. We need to start blaming terrorists for terrorist attack. Not the "well they only do it because they are upset" narrative. I'm so sick of hearing that. It's fucking stupid

We do blame the terrorists. I'm so sick of hearing people saying we don't.

Literally blaming Trump is winning the poll
---

mattnd2007 posted...

No, it's absolutely not on Trump. He's not making people do terrorist things. We need to start blaming terrorists for terrorist attack. Not the "well they only do it because they are upset" narrative. I'm so sick of hearing that. It's fucking stupid

So what you wanna do? Is it exclusive to this issue or do you have issues with giving into domestic terrorist through 2nd amendment rights? Why is one case of upsetting people different when both concern the safety of those around them?

Mainly, I wanna know if we should have made this declaration and wiped our hands clean of any fall out or if it's not our responsibility to stabilize the region the best we can. If we're not going to, what was the point of the deceleration?
---

I know this is going to sound like a really, really crazy concept to the regressive left

But maybe

Just maybe

Any blood spilled will be solely on the hands of those with literal fucking blood on their hands because they want to behave like literal fucking barbarians whenever the world doesn't bow down to their demands.

Just a thought.
---

VectorChaos posted...

I know this is going to sound like a really, really crazy concept to the regressive left

But maybe

Just maybe

Any blood spilled will be solely on the hands of those with literal fucking blood on their hands because they want to behave like literal fucking barbarians whenever the world doesn't bow down to their demands.

Just a thought.

People still focusing on one tiny pixel of a huge picture.
---

VectorChaos posted...

I know this is going to sound like a really, really crazy concept to the regressive left

But maybe

Just maybe

Any blood spilled will be solely on the hands of those with literal fucking blood on their hands because they want to behave like literal fucking barbarians whenever the world doesn't bow down to their demands.

Just a thought.

Shhh, islamaphobia!
---

creativerealms posted...

mattnd2007 posted...

No, it's absolutely not on Trump. He's not making people do terrorist things. We need to start blaming terrorists for terrorist attack. Not the "well they only do it because they are upset" narrative. I'm so sick of hearing that. It's fucking stupid

We do blame the terrorists. I'm so sick of hearing people saying we don't.

Nah, there is always some excuse with them.
---

CrimsonRage posted...

Zeeak4444 posted...

CrimsonRage posted...

There will never be a good time recognise Jerusalem as the capital of Israel. Might as well do it now. All the government offices of Israel are in Jerusalem anyway.

I just hate that Trump is doing it. He's not doing it to be a friend to the Jewish people. He's only doing it because people are telling him not to.

I disagree, trump rarely does things just because he's told to. He made the decision because it's unprecedented and would solidify his place in history for better or worse. It was an egocentric decision.

Well yes, that's what I mean. Trump is doing it to satisfy his ego, people are telling him not to do it, which makes him want to do it more (especially if told Obama would not do this).

Point is he's not doing it because it's the right thing to do or because he likes Jews so that narrative is just a spin.

Ohhh ya I totally misread that. Read it too literally, my bad.
---

Of course there will, I won't go into details why because there is a mod on here that goes full NeoGAF on you if you dare criticize Islam in any way. But let it be known, there will be blood.
---

Here's a thought: maybe caputulating to bad people out of fear that they will be violent is only going to convince them to be more violent in order to keep getting what they want.

Maybe it's time to teach them that being violent is actually going to get them LESS of what they want.
---

Mal_Fet posted...

Here's a thought: maybe caputulating to bad people out of fear that they will be violent is only going to convince them to be more violent in order to keep getting what they want.

Maybe it's time to teach them that being violent is actually going to get them LESS of what they want.

What an ambiguous and useless statement that's already been touched upon multiple times.
---

Zeeak4444 posted...

Mal_Fet posted...

Here's a thought: maybe caputulating to bad people out of fear that they will be violent is only going to convince them to be more violent in order to keep getting what they want.

Maybe it's time to teach them that being violent is actually going to get them LESS of what they want.

What an ambiguous and useless statement that's already been touched upon multiple times.

And also one that you have done your best to ignore! :)
---

Mal_Fet posted...

Here's a thought: maybe caputulating to bad people out of fear that they will be violent is only going to convince them to be more violent in order to keep getting what they want.

Maybe it's time to teach them that being violent is actually going to get them LESS of what they want.

Let's say people do die from this decision. Rockets are launched, terrorist attacks increase tenfold. Then what?
---

AmericaTheBrave posted...

Mal_Fet posted...

Here's a thought: maybe caputulating to bad people out of fear that they will be violent is only going to convince them to be more violent in order to keep getting what they want.

Maybe it's time to teach them that being violent is actually going to get them LESS of what they want.

Let's say people do die from this decision. Rockets are launched, terrorist attacks increase tenfold. Then what?

Nobody dies from this decision. People die from savages not liking a correct decision. But to answer your question, hopefully they get put down
---

Blame lies with the murdering terrorists.
---

gmanthebest posted...

AmericaTheBrave posted...

Mal_Fet posted...

Here's a thought: maybe caputulating to bad people out of fear that they will be violent is only going to convince them to be more violent in order to keep getting what they want.

Maybe it's time to teach them that being violent is actually going to get them LESS of what they want.

Let's say people do die from this decision. Rockets are launched, terrorist attacks increase tenfold. Then what?

Nobody dies from this decision. People die from savages not liking a correct decision.

^
---

Yes. donald trump, with his decision, has caused the deaths of every human being on the planet.
---

Mal_Fet posted...

Zeeak4444 posted...

Mal_Fet posted...

Here's a thought: maybe caputulating to bad people out of fear that they will be violent is only going to convince them to be more violent in order to keep getting what they want.

Maybe it's time to teach them that being violent is actually going to get them LESS of what they want.

What an ambiguous and useless statement that's already been touched upon multiple times.

And also one that you have done your best to ignore! :)

Zeeak4444 posted...

LinksLiege posted...

I've been saying since Annoying Orange got elected that, no matter how horrible things get with him in office, at least it won't be boring.

He certainly hasn't failed in that regard.

Too damn true. Silver linings.

On topic: let's get some better conversation than "it's the right thing to do".

Instead let's talk about his approach to doing so. Was it a favorable approach? Was it necessary? Where do we go from here if things do escalate to the point of violent aggression from Palenstine. Do we send in troops?

No, let's hear the obvious 50 more times Mal. If you're too afraid to address anything worth addressing in the topic then just stay out.

Edit: Mainly, I wanna know if we should have made this declaration and wiped our hands clean of any fall out or if it's not our responsibility to stabilize the region the best we can. If we're not going to, what was the point of the deceleration?

You can address that too. Some people don't need to talk about the stupidly obvious over and over and over again.
---