Poll of the Day > I think I might try to watch Avatar: The Last Airbender

(+) Yeah! (+)

LinkPizza posted...

I have a question. Let say two families have a mom and dad both with bending abilities. And both families have kids without bending abilities. If those two kids grow up and have kids, can their kids get bending abilities because it's in their family (like genes)? Or does at least one parent have to actually have the ability?

The genetics of bending abilities isn't explained that deeply.

BlackScythe0 posted...

The genetics of bending abilities isn't explained that deeply.

Ah. I see. I kind of wish it was, though...
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in korra, there are two brothers, one has fire, the other has earth
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Krazy_Kirby posted...

in korra, there are two brothers, one has fire, the other has earth

This. Korra kinda shows what happens in a case like that.

That doesn't answer his question at all guys.

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BlackScythe0 answered it.

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That doesn't really answer the question, though. I do know that if two benders get together, they can have kids who have either bending power. That's showed when Aang and Katara have one Air Bending son and one Water bending Daughter. What I'm asking is if a child(ren) heir parents weren't bending, but all four grandparents were? Basically, can it be like a recessive gene in both parents. Or if at least one parent has to be a bender... But it sounds like they don't go that into detail. Which is fine, I guess... But thanks for trying, at least...
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LinkPizza posted...

That doesn't really answer the question, though. I do know that if two benders get together, they can have kids who have either bending power. That's showed when Aang and Katara have one Air Bending son and one Water bending Daughter. What I'm asking is if a child(ren) heir parents weren't bending, but all four grandparents were? Basically, can it be like a recessive gene in both parents. Or if at least one parent has to be a bender... But it sounds like they don't go that into detail. Which is fine, I guess... But thanks for trying, at least...

I literally cannot recall any information that would answer this question. Generally speaking most series about magic powers like this does have it so the magic powers can resurface in later generations as you are asking, but if you consider how all his grandkids from the air bender son are air benders rather than whatever ancestry his wife or mom had it suggests more of an immediate trait than one that digs deep through the hereditary line.

BlackScythe0 posted...

I literally cannot recall any information that would answer this question. Generally speaking most series about magic powers like this does have it so the magic powers can resurface in later generations as you are asking, but if you consider how all his grandkids from the air bender son are air benders rather than whatever ancestry his wife or mom had it suggests more of an immediate trait than one that digs deep through the hereditary line.

Yeah. Looking at it that way, it makes sense...
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Also, remember neither of Katara's parents were waterbenders, nor was her one surviving grandparent (Hakoda's mother). They never say whether or not her paternal grandfather was, but it seems like it would have been mentioned if he was.

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DiScOrD tHe LuNaTiC posted...

Also, remember neither of Katara's parents were waterbenders, nor was her one surviving grandparent (Hakoda's mother). They never say whether or not her paternal grandfather was, but it seems like it would have been mentioned if he was.

Oh. I never thought about that. So, if that's true, then that means it's either passed through genes (but can skip generations), or it just happens to some people (because magic and stuff)...
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I like them having a Full team. And it feels like one now. They have one of each bender (though one is also the avatar). And two warriors, as well. And a bunch of kids... Though, they have their own strengths... They even got Papa and a big guy. I also like Zuko trying to be his uncle and figure out what he would say...
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LinkPizza posted...

I like them having a Full team. And it feels like one now. They have one of each bender (though one is also the avatar). And two warriors, as well. And a bunch of kids... Though, they have their own strengths... They even got Papa and a big guy. I also like Zuko trying to be his uncle and figure out what he would say...

LOL, you're burning through this pretty fast. ^_^

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The cabbage merchant might as well be a main character...

Also, that play was ridiculous...

DiScOrD tHe LuNaTiC posted...

LOL, you're burning through this pretty fast. ^_^

Really? It's been almost a week. I feel like I've been going pretty slow...
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LinkPizza posted...

Really? It's been almost a week. I feel like I've been going pretty slow...

hoo boy, this statement reminds me of when I was younger, waiting 3 years to be able to finish the series.

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You can skip the movie.

Phantom_Nook posted...

hoo boy, this statement reminds me of when I was younger, waiting 3 years to be able to finish the series.

True. That being said, you were waiting for the newer episodes. I have them all... I think I've just been doing so much other stuff while watching... But I am at the end of part 2 of the last 4 episodes...

JoseAAV posted...

You can skip the movie.

I unfortunately saw that in theaters...
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JoseAAV posted...

You can skip the movie.

It took me a few seconds to remember that there was actually a movie. I completely forgot about it. Thanks for reminding me.

LinkPizza posted...

Really? It's been almost a week. I feel like I've been going pretty slow...

IDK, I feel like 50+ 24-minute episodes in less than 7 days is a fairly impressive pace. ^_^

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DiScOrD tHe LuNaTiC posted...

IDK, I feel like 50+ 24-minute episodes in less than 7 days is a fairly impressive pace. ^_^

I guess. Though, I watched like 4 movies (with could have been like 16 episodes) while at work on Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday. Plus, i played some games a few times. I probably could have finished within 3 days. Maybe less...
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BlackScythe0 posted...

The genetics of bending abilities isn't explained that deeply.

LinkPizza posted...

Ah. I see. I kind of wish it was, though...

I wanna say that can potentially open up a can of worms and maybe result in people trying to artificially create benders.

In Legend of Korra, Mako and Bolin's father was from the Earth Kingdom and mother from the Fire Nation. I do not recall if either parents were benders but the union resulted in Mako being a firebender and Bolin an earthbender. If Bolin have a child with Eska, I wonder if a firebending child is possible.....

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InfestedAdam posted...

I wanna say that can potentially open up a can of worms and maybe result in people trying to artificially create benders.

In Legend of Korra, Mako and Bolin's father was from the Earth Kingdom and mother from the Fire Nation. I do not recall if either parents were benders but the union resulted in Mako being a firebender and Bolin an earthbender. If Bolin have a child with Eska, I wonder if a firebending child is possible.....

I guess I kind of would like to know that, as well... While it may not be interesting to many people, I would find it at least mildly interesting to know how it all works...
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Finished it and loved it. And the ending. It's was awesome. Guess it's time to move the Legend of Korra. I heard it's not as good, but still good...

On the first episode now. But might take a nap soon for reasons...
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I don't like to rush through shows like that. I like to take my time and appreciate each episode. I think I also waited several months between finishing Avatar and starting Korra.

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keyblader1985 posted...

I don't like to rush through shows like that. I like to take my time and appreciate each episode. I think I also waited several months between finishing Avatar and starting Korra.

I wouldn't really say I was rushing. It was more like I wanted to keep on watching. I want more, tbh... But I did stop a few times. Like when watching movies at work. Or playing a game and stuff...
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GunslingerGunsl posted...

It took me a few seconds to remember that there was actually a movie. I completely forgot about it. Thanks for reminding me.

The movie wasn't terrible, it just tried to condense an entire season into 90 minutes, which was a baffling decision. The worst part of the movie is that there were no sequels, so it just exists as a standalone on top of everything else.

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LinkPizza posted...

I wouldn't really say I was rushing. It was more like I wanted to keep on watching. I want more, tbh... But I did stop a few times. Like when watching movies at work. Or playing a game and stuff...

But would you stop when you had to poop?

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SunWuKung420 posted...

But would you stop when you had to poop?

Usually. Thats because I either switched to a book or YouTube when pooping...
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Zeus posted...

The movie wasn't terrible, it just tried to condense an entire season into 90 minutes, which was a baffling decision. The worst part of the movie is that there were no sequels, so it just exists as a standalone on top of everything else.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PgtnGN3Rz04
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Oh yea did you cry when iroh sang?

Zeus posted...

The movie wasn't terrible, it just tried to condense an entire season into 90 minutes, which was a baffling decision. The worst part of the movie is that there were no sequels, so it just exists as a standalone on top of everything else.

I think the movie just felt so awkward. It didn't have the charm of the cartoon series. But yeah, it was pretty much doomed after they decided to put a whole season into one movie. I was hoping that the Netflix series might do it justice but last I heard was that the original writers have left the project due to creative differences.

GunslingerGunsl posted...

I think the movie just felt so awkward. It didn't have the charm of the cartoon series. But yeah, it was pretty much doomed after they decided to put a whole season into one movie. I was hoping that the Netflix series might do it justice but last I heard was that the original writers have left the project due to creative differences.

I have to admit that I always found the controversy over the whitewashing of some of the cast overblown. Like, no, I didn't exactly see Jackson Rathbone or Nicola Peltz, who are white, playing Sokka & Katara, who were modeled after Inuits. But the people complaining about that seemed to conveniently forget virtually every character in the cartoon was voiced by a white actor, with the only major exceptions being Zuko and Iroh. So why didn't they get bent out of shape there?

But let's be honest: the casting was the least of this film's problems.

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Instead of condensing an entire season of a show into a movie, they really should have just adapted story arcs from the season into films. That way instead of having 3 movies, they could have also done 9-12 and made more money >_> And the individual films would have been told better.

Granted, some of the largest issues were putting MNS in charge of the fucking thing and weird choices like changing character name pronunciation for no fucking reason. "Ong" is no easier to say than "Ang" (and I'm assuming that both were spelled Aang anway, to make it even more ridiculous)

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There are definitely steps you could take to trim the fat of TLA and probably do it in three movies.

The first thing that jumps to mind for Book 1 is just have Katara and Sokka be at the northern water tribe to begin with.

Having not seen the film though, the first thing that jumps to mind is how bland and depressing it all looks. Probably served as an inspiration for the Snyderverse.

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BlackScythe0 posted...

Oh yea did you cry when iroh sang?

I cried a lot. But when it comes to tv shows and movies, Im a big crybaby. I even cried when Iroh hugged Zuko when they met after he joined Team Avatar...
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DiScOrD tHe LuNaTiC posted...

But the people complaining about that seemed to conveniently forget virtually every character in the cartoon was voiced by a white actor, with the only major exceptions being Zuko and Iroh. So why didn't they get bent out of shape there?

I think its different. I never understood people who cared about voice actors. You dont see them, and maybe VAs do what they do because they can do a wide range of voices. I think love characters are different because you are seeing them. That being said, it can sometimes be hard to find people that look just like the cartoon characters, so...
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LinkPizza posted...

I cried a lot. But when it comes to tv shows and movies, Im a big crybaby. I even cried when Iroh hugged Zuko when they met after he joined Team Avatar...

That was a touching moment.

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Loosely related to Avatar (same creators, tone and themes), the Dragon Prince on Netflix is quite good though the setting is much more generic.

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Zeus posted...

That way instead of having 3 movies, they could have also done 9-12 and made more money >_>

That's absolutely absurd, cohesive film series of that length are unheard of; the closest I can think of is Harry Potter which was 7 years of events across 8 films over a 10 year release schedule. ATLA takes place within a year so a decade-long timetable does not work with young characters/actors, and nobody wants to wait 10 years to watch what amounts to rehashed material. If you can't condense the events to a reasonable span then forget about it, just watch the original show.

Blightzkrieg posted...

There are definitely steps you could take to trim the fat of TLA and probably do it in three movies. The first thing that jumps to mind for Book 1 is just have Katara and Sokka be at the northern water tribe to begin with.

Exactly. There's liberties that can be taken to cut the runtime while still working in the major events. Screenwriters do it all the time with adaptations, this notion that ATLA needs 2+ movies per season is ridiculous.

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Veedrock- posted...

That's absolutely absurd, cohesive film series of that length are unheard of; the closest I can think of is Harry Potter which was 7 years of events across 8 films over a 10 year release schedule. ATLA takes place within a year so a decade-long timetable does not work with young characters/actors, and nobody wants to wait 10 years to watch what amounts to rehashed material. If you can't condense the events to a reasonable span then forget about it, just watch the original show.

...because most film series aren't fucking handled like that. If one was, it would be cohesive. There are no problems with the idea itself, other than the potentially larger upfront investment. And on a conceptual level, it wouldn't be much different than shooting a tv show -- you'd just have a longer filming cycle where you'd shoot multiple movies at a time (ie, everything associated with one of the books).

Veedrock- posted...

Exactly. There's liberties that can be taken to cut the runtime while still working in the major events. Screenwriters do it all the time with adaptations, this notion that ATLA needs 2+ movies per season is ridiculous.

Okay, how many other movies have screenwriters creating by boiling down the events of an entire season of a show where the end result turned out good? I'll wait. Because otherwise this seems like a fucking clueless response that overlooks how different this is from a normal adaptation.

And then, the cherry on top, might be the fact that you're arguing that ATLA doesn't need 2+ seasons per book while citing a series that broke its final movie into 2 books because it had so much going on >_> If each ATLA book were an actual book, you'd probably be looking at over a thousand pages apiece.

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I wouldn't have minded more movies. It's probably would have turned out much better...
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Zeus posted...

There are no problems with the idea itself, other than the potentially larger upfront investment.

And audience engagement which I mentioned. Movies aren't TV shows and can't be handled as such. Even if it was filmed all at once to work around actor aging, post processing and editing would have to be done individually and the series would certainly die before completion as interest declines and each movie makes less than the last. Then you're left with an unfinished, unfulfilling mess.

Zeus posted...

And then, the cherry on top, might be the fact that you're arguing that ATLA doesn't need 2+ seasons per book while citing a series that broke its final movie into 2 books because it had so much going on >_>

Yeah, finales have a lot more going on as they have to wrap up loose ends. If you wanna argue season 3 of avatar needs two movies then I can see that (might be unnecessary depending on what's established in the first films) but the series at large doesn't necessitate such treatment, let alone the 3-4 movies-per-season adaptation you originally fielded.

You focused solely on the finale being split while ignoring that the first six HP books fit into single movies. Your claim that eash season of ATLA would be 1000+ pages (a claim I find ridiculous) kinda hinges on those HP movies being equivalent to their book's page count, which they aren't.

Zeus posted...

Okay, how many other movies have screenwriters creating by boiling down the events of an entire season of a show where the end result turned out good? I'll wait.

The only case I'm actually aware of is Mobile Suit Gundam. It cut the 42 episode anime into three movies which was well received, and it's a cut there weren't any creative liberties. Any other TV-to-movie adaptation I'm aware of focused on single stories/arcs with no drive towards a longer narrative or unique stories. So the one example I have is...good. Maybe give me an example that turned out bad?

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Veedrock- posted...

And audience engagement which I mentioned. Movies aren't TV shows and can't be handled as such. Even if it was filmed all at once to work around actor aging, post processing and editing would have to be done individually and the series would certainly die before completion as interest declines and each movie makes less than the last. Then you're left with an unfinished, unfulfilling mess.

You say that but:

A) We've had MULTIPLE long-running franchises with continuity. In fact, the entire MCU disproves your theory.

B) We've seen movies filmed simultaneously. All of this has been done.

C) Actors aging isn't necessarily the issue anyway.

Veedrock- posted...

Yeah, finales have a lot more going on as they have to wrap up loose ends. If you wanna argue season 3 of avatar needs two movies then I can see that (might be unnecessary depending on what's established in the first films) but the series at large doesn't necessitate such treatment, let alone the 3-4 movies-per-season adaptation you originally fielded.

No, each season needs multiples because you're cramming 13 hours down to 90 minutes.

Veedrock- posted...

You focused solely on the finale being split while ignoring that the first six HP books fit into single movies. Your claim that eash season of ATLA would be 1000+ pages (a claim I find ridiculous) kinda hinges on those HP movies being equivalent to their book's page count, which they aren't.

The HP books could have been done as multiple movies and got away with it. However, more importantly, there was less going on in each HP book than any season of Avatar. And even with the ridiculous amounts of bridging narration, it left out more plot points than were in any HP book (or any 2-3 books combined)

Veedrock- posted...

It cut the 42 episode anime into three movies which was well received, and it's a cut there weren't any creative liberties.

So basically even that had to go with multiple movies because you could only condense so much? Sounds like the 2+ movie per season approach is the way to go. And that was Gundam, which tends to have a tighter running storyline as opposed to the more episodic Avatar.

Veedrock- posted...

Maybe give me an example that turned out bad?

How about The Last Airbender? >_>

In general, this concept isn't tried very often *because* people recognize you can't condense that heavily and still come out with a great movie.

The first season probably would have worked fine as two movies. The same is true of the second season. The third they might have gotten away with just one movie, because the conclusion is a 4-part episode, you have a recap episode, and so much would have already been established. But there wouldn't necessarily be anything wrong with 2 films for season 3.

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LinkPizza posted...

I never understood people who cared about voice actors.

We never understood you either!

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Zeus posted...

A) We've had MULTIPLE long-running franchises with continuity. In fact, the entire MCU disproves your theory. B) We've seen movies filmed simultaneously. All of this has been done.

A) The MCU is not a single story, it's not comparable. Continuity is fine, multiple films is fine, but stretching out a single narrative for the sake of it is a recipe for disaster.
B) You're not addressing me at all with this. Simultaneous filming is not the secret to success, it's not a guarantee that the films ever even get released. And examples of simultaneous filming last at longest three movies (Lord of the Rings), not a whopping nine.

Zeus posted...

No, each season needs multiples because you're cramming 13 hours down to 90 minutes.

You're exaggerating hard in both directions here to suit your argument. 90 minutes the low end of movie length, I didn't know you were lobbying for TV movies here. Average theatrical film length is over two hours and it's not unheard of to go to 3 hours. If you need the runtime then use it, we don't need two movies for the sake of two.

And where in the world is this 13 hour figure coming from? Even if each episode was a full 30 minutes that'd be 10 hours, but episodes are only about 22 minutes so that's 7:20 per season. Cutting that down to 2-3 hours is not impossible, especially after you cut off all the fat that comes with filling TV runtime. Or are you really gonna argue that we just can't have an avatar film without The Great Divide?

Zeus posted...

The HP books could have been done as multiple movies and got away with it.

Hard disagree, audiences would've given up on the movies before long and they'd stop being made, leaving us with a lot of unrealized material. And Harry Potter didn't have another visual medium outside of the book, so people were more invested in the films. With ATLA if viewers don't like the movie or don't want to wait for such a long release schedule, they can watch the cartoon and get the exact same (or better) experience. Disney has been criticized for their live action remakes for this exact reason, the movies themselves are mostly fine but there's little merit to them when they are just copies of the originals.

Zeus posted...

So basically even that had to go with multiple movies because you could only condense so much? And that was Gundam, which tends to have a tighter running storyline as opposed to the more episodic Avatar.

Wtf. Ok at no point did I state all of ATLA needed to fit in one film, so this "aha gundam got three" isn't even an aha. And a tighter storyline actually works the opposite the way you think it does, as it means there's less filler that can be done without. Avatar's episodic structure added a lot of fluff and villain-of-the-week stuff that can be cut from a theatrical remake. There's no reason at all every episode in it's entirety needs covered.

Zeus posted...

How about The Last Airbender? >_>

I thought it went without saying that we're listing examples besides that, as it had issues well beyond the condensed story.

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Veedrock- posted...

A) The MCU is not a single story, it's not comparable. That's why I chose the HP films for comparison. Continuity is fine, multiple films is fine, but stretching out a single narrative for the sake of it is a recipe for disaster.
B) You're not addressing me at all with this. Simultaneous filming is not the secret to success, it's not a guarantee that the films ever even get released. And examples of simultaneous filming last at longest three movies (Lord of the Rings), not a whopping nine.

And HP isn't exactly comparable either considering that it was adapting books with a singular focus, not 13 hours of generally episodic animation with far less of a focus where the individual stories help build the characters, their relationships, etc, and when you try to gloss over all of that you get, well... terrible linking narration and a feeling that something is missing.

And you'd be doing 2-3 movies PER SEASON, not filming all 3 seasons at the exact same time. So over the course of 3-4 years you'd film 6-9 movies.

Veedrock- posted...

You're exaggerating hard in both directions here to suit your argument. 90 minutes the low end of movie length, I didn't know you were lobbying for TV movies here. Average theatrical film length is over two hours and it's not unheard of to go to 3 hours. If you need the runtime then use it, we don't need two movies for the sake of two.

And where in the world is this 13 hour figure coming from? Even if each episode was a full 30 minutes that'd be 10 hours, but episodes are only about 22 minutes so that's 7:20 per season. Cutting that down to 2-3 hours is not impossible, especially after you cut off all the fat that comes with filling TV runtime. Or are you really gonna argue that we just can't have an avatar film without The Great Divide?

You're lowballing there. For starters, not ONE episode in season 1 had a run-time of 22 minutes (or less) so I should be the one asking you where you're getting your numbers from. But sure, the episodes weren't a full half hour each. However, and more importantly, you had SEVERAL major story arcs where the multi-part episode could have easily been repackaged as a movie/OVA (which is even more true of later seasons where the 4-part series finale WAS aired as an event onto itself).

And even if you were going to remove the episodes from each season that didn't tie into the main storyline, that'd still leave you with 5-6 hours of content that you'd need to boil down.

Veedrock- posted...

With ATLA if viewers don't like the movie or don't want to wait for such a long release schedule, they can watch the cartoon and get the exact same (or better) experience.

Disney has been criticized for their live action remakes for this exact reason, the movies themselves are mostly fine but there's little merit to them when they are just copies of the originals. An ATLA movie series needs to set itself apart somehow (even if it's just runtime), else it's redundant.

First, it doesn't have to have to be a long release schedule since they can be spaced 9 months part. Second, it's silly that you argue about fans not wanting to wait around for everything to be adapted when citing HP where fans *could* have just read ahead instead of waiting years for the films.

As for Disney remakes, the problem there is that you aren't talking about adaptations, you're talking about *remakes* and, more importantly, the changes are what did the movies more harm. Mulan was mocked for its decision to turn the heroine into a superhero, getting rid of all the songs, removing characters, and heavily changing the story. Clearly change wasn't the answer. In fact, when you look at the criticisms for most of the Disney movies, it's often the changes that catch the most heat.

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Zeus posted...

You're lowballing there. For starters, not ONE episode in season 1 had a run-time of 22 minutes (or less) so I should be the one asking you where you're getting your numbers from.

Episode 2 is 20:40. The rest should be the same give or take a minute but I'm not timestamping every episode to indulge you.

Keep your opinion dude, it's bad and never gonna happen. I've already rebuffed all your points and I'm done talking in circles.

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Veedrock- posted...

Episode 2 is 20:40.

The listed times for the episodes on NF range from 23-25 minutes iirc when I checked. Not sure where you're getting that from.

Veedrock- posted... Keep your opinion dude, it's bad and never gonna happen. I've already rebuffed all your points and I'm done talking in circles.

Except you really haven't at all. You did nothing to demonstrate that it was tenable to have a movie devoted to a single season and, by your own admission, you pretty much just talked in circles.

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