Mario and Bowser are sworn enemies, plain and simple.
X and Zero started as Mentor and Disciple, then moved on to being friends or allies.
Samus and Ridley: Enemies (would be awkward but interesting to see interspecies rivalry though).
Link and Ganondorf: Enemies.
Alucard and Dracula: Dracula does not see his son as his equal counterpart. Same goes for Alucard. Enemies.
Cloud and Sephiroth: Mentor-Disciple complex. They become sworn enemies.
Squall and Seifer: In my little experience I had on FFVIII: I'd say this is the closest to the definition of rivalry. But falls to the overall dominance of Trainers Red and Blue
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You see, rivals are two persons who compete against each other for the same objective. Although their feelings can be strong, they don't necessarily feel the need to kill the other, but instead, to prove one's superiority over the other.
From: Gilberto | #001 You see, rivals are two persons who compete against each other for the same objective
Mario/Bowser = Peach
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Emporer_Kazbar posted... From: Gilberto | #001 You see, rivals are two persons who compete against each other for the same objective Mario/Bowser = Peach
Right, I'll concede when I see a game with Bowser going through the same levels Mario has to go for. Then, and only then, I will see them as rivals.
From: Gilberto | #008 Right, I'll concede when I see a game with Bowser going through the same levels Mario has to go for. Then, and only then, I will see them as rivals.
LeonhartFour posted... From: Gilberto | #008 Right, I'll concede when I see a game with Bowser going through the same levels Mario has to go for. Then, and only then, I will see them as rivals. Play some Mario RPGs then.
They're allies, right? Even if they're not, I fail to see them performing a better rivalry than Red and Blue
Gilberto posted... Emporer_Kazbar posted... From: Gilberto | #001 You see, rivals are two persons who compete against each other for the same objective Mario/Bowser = Peach
Right, I'll concede when I see a game with Bowser going through the same levels Mario has to go for. Then, and only then, I will see them as rivals.
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I don't think Mario has ever actively tried to kill Bowser. He just likes to throw him to the side. There is a reason he keeps coming back with more devious plan than the next.
Sorozone posted... I don't think Mario has ever actively tried to kill Bowser. He just likes to throw him to the side. There is a reason he keeps coming back with more devious plan than the next.
Come on, he's been throwing him off to the lava, that counts as intent of murder in my book. Nintendo just makes it look like it's no biggie, you know, for the kids.
Ryu and Ken fit the definition just as well as Red and Blue do. Two street fighters trying to become the strongest street fighters in the world, all the while trying to one-up each other.
Squall and Seifer: In my little experience I had on FFVIII: I'd say this is the closest to the definition of rivalry. But falls to the overall dominance of Trainers Red and Blue
Your lack of experience in VIII should just disqualify you from saying this at all in general.
VIII is a love story involving a love triangle. You should've seen that from the start by looking at the cover of the game.
From: Gilberto | #022 Sorozone posted... I don't think Mario has ever actively tried to kill Bowser. He just likes to throw him to the side. There is a reason he keeps coming back with more devious plan than the next.
Come on, he's been throwing him off to the lava, that counts as intent of murder in my book. Nintendo just makes it look like it's no biggie, you know, for the kids.
But he breathes fire, and fire it self can get hotter than lava. So it's safe to assume he can survive lava. I mean, it only makes sense.
BerkeIium posted... Ryu and Ken fit the definition just as well as Red and Blue do. Two street fighters trying to become the strongest street fighters in the world, all the while trying to one-up each other.
They can be rivals, but I'd say they share a friendly rivalry, they just trade a couple of punches and kicks (and maybe the occasional fireball), but that's it, if Bison comes up, they both go after him.
A more serious one would be Ryu and Sagat, in which one gets a lifetime scar and the other goes to the dark side.
Sorozone posted... From: Gilberto | #022 Sorozone posted... I don't think Mario has ever actively tried to kill Bowser. He just likes to throw him to the side. There is a reason he keeps coming back with more devious plan than the next.
Come on, he's been throwing him off to the lava, that counts as intent of murder in my book. Nintendo just makes it look like it's no biggie, you know, for the kids. But he breathes fire, and fire it self can get hotter than lava. So it's safe to assume he can survive lava. I mean, it only makes sense.
I doubt a living being would be impervious to combustion. But let's say you're right.. Mario still kicks something alive into the lava, still intent of murder : /
From: Gilberto | #029 I doubt a living being would be impervious to combustion. But let's say you're right.. Mario still kicks something alive into the lava, still intent of murder : /
Maybe for Bowser.
Think about it, Bowser builds his domain, his castles, around lava and fire. In Sunshine, he is in a freaking volcano. The lava is there for Mario, not for Bowser. Bowser is impervious to lava and fire.
Mario just doesn't have the heart to end the rivalry and out right murder him. Bowser on the other hand may have some murderous intentions.
Shigeru Miyamoto said himself that he views Mario and Bowser as romantic rivals. The RPGs reflect this, where Bowser isn't truly evil. He is just willing to do anything necessary in order to win Peach's heart, whether it be playing the hero or villain role.
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I think you're off base by assuming that characters that ally with each other can't be rivals. I think that actually goes against the concept of being rivals. Rivals are generally competing for the same thing (or at least they're competing on very similar terms), but that doesn't mean they don't team up for a common goal. Phoenix and Edgeworth do this all the time but they're obviously rivals.
Mario and Bowser aren't rivals in like, the Mario platformers, but they definitely are most of the Mario RPGs, albeit to be fair it's a bit of a one-sided rivalry because Mario doesn't talk. It's pretty obvious that Bowser sees Mario as a rival and not as a mortal enemy in the RPGs, though.
LeonhartFour posted... Whenever there's a fighting tournament, they compete against each other for the championship.
Just as much of a rivalry there as Red/Blue.
Ohoho.. now we're talking
Right, as soon as a championship is announced, they do stop the buddy buddy punching and might actually go serious. One of them is in it for his eternal quest for fighting, the other.. I'm not sure, for girls and cars? I don't know, I might be wrong here. Anyway, they trade some blows while there might be some one-liners in the process, and that's it, right?
Now Red and Blue on the other hand, they start of in their early childhood, they've known each other, they've played with each other, and as soon as they turn 10, both of them desire to be the greatest trainer ever, friendship is over... forever, they start in the same scenario, just one pokemon each and from there they duke it out ().
As a player, you challenge a lot of trainers in your quest, some boring ones, some stronger, like those Gym Leaders (who by the way your rival had already beaten before you got to them), but you know you're in for some serious fighting whenever time pauses, and you hear a certain theme, and along comes Blue walking in his own boss like pace. You know the feeling if you've lost to him once, I did, the only time I've ever lost in a pokemon game, I still remember that moment bright as day. I wasn't prepared to know what it really meant to be rivals, until it hit me, I turned off the game, feelings revolving, then I swore I'd never lose anymore.
His attitude, his confidence, his skills, everything about him has gained his place in my personal list not only as the greatest rival in videogaming, but as the essence and the definition of a true rival.
In my 27 years of my life, I have not found someone in real life I could call a true rival, not one with Blue's caliber.
JonthePenguin posted... Your original post was "only true" rivals, yet all your arguments are that they're the most intense rivals.
???
Well, that's because I accepted the fact that Mario and Bowser, although hollow, might share some kind of rivalry. I understood, and I moved on. You didn't expect me to be a stubborn guy who sticks to his ideas no matter what, did you?
And although they've had quite a big history of conflicts and a plethora of games to demonstrate. Nintendo has yet to emphasize such "rivalry" since they mostly go like this:
Bowser: Yarr! I captured the princess! Come at me Mario!
Mario: Okie, Dokie!
*fight ensues*
Bowser: Yarr! I'll get you next time
See? There's little emotion, Mario always wins, he sees Bowser as something to defeat to free the princess, as opposed to a rival, say another plumber with the same strength, skills, and chances to win Peach's heart.
Now the rivalry with Trainer Blue, though featured in only one game, is greater. Both of them actually grow stronger and stronger every time you meet, they defeat countless trainers, they get to the level of the Elite 4, the greatest trainers acknowledged in the region, yet they both surpass them only to be on par with each other.
Both of them are eager to prove one another that they're the greatest at what they do. There is no greater rivalry than this, nothing in the world of videogaming could surpass such mutual relation.
As a player, you challenge a lot of trainers in your quest, some boring ones, some stronger, like those Gym Leaders (who by the way your rival had already beaten before you got to them), but you know you're in for some serious fighting whenever time pauses, and you hear a certain theme, and along comes Blue walking in his own boss like pace. You know the feeling if you've lost to him once, I did, the only time I've ever lost in a pokemon game, I still remember that moment bright as day. I wasn't prepared to know what it really meant to be rivals, until it hit me, I turned off the game, feelings revolving, then I swore I'd never lose anymore.
His attitude, his confidence, his skills, everything about him has gained his place in my personal list not only as the greatest rival in videogaming, but as the essence and the definition of a true rival.
In my 27 years of my life, I have not found someone in real life I could call a true rival, not one with Blue's caliber.
This kind of sounds like a personal issue. Doesn't really invalidate other rivalries.] Not to mention, sure, "Blue" says a few wise cracks here and there when he pops up, but "Red" is just your player avatar. Any intense emotions are all you as he's even more unresponsive than Mario when spoken to. All this really means is your favorite rivalry is "you versus the challenge of your beloved hobby video games" and there's really nothing that can top that.
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