Board 8 > Leonhart plays lots of Final Fantasy games! [spoilers] [nostalgia] [squall]

(+) Yeah! (+)

Yeah, having to follow FFVII probably hurts FFVIII a fair bit, too. Lots of expectations to live up to. I think MGS2 suffers from some of the same problems, although like FFVIII, it has problems of its own, too.

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It really doesn't.

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SuperNiceDog - 1, pjbasis - 0

Well, that's an awfully vague statement.

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FFX gets a lot of ridiculous criticism from fools because of the Spoony "review" nowadays, too.

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Who knew the Rivalry Rumble would be so predictable? SuperNiceDog, that's who.

Well, people like to pile onto internet memes.

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"I can set you free, mate."
"My freedom was forfeit long ago!"

It should be obvious the only thing I would disagree with is the only insult to MGS2!

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SuperNiceDog - 1, pjbasis - 0

What, that MGS2 has problems of its own?

uhhhhh

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uhhhhh

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SuperNiceDog - 1, pjbasis - 0

uhhhhhh indeed

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"Hold on a minute! That testimony stinks!"
"Witness! You can't just say 'Hello' and expect us to get anywhere! I want you to testify!"

uhhhhh gonna play

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I do because I can.....and because I'm bored.
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Sorry, been a pretty busy week. I'll try to play tomorrow night.

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LeonhartFour posted...
Ganging up on FFVIII like it's the worst game in the series is one of those weird sentiments that I feel like results from people blowing its flaws out of proportion. Then again, I'm not an orthodox RPG player. My first RPG was Super Mario RPG, and FFVII was my second, so I'm hardly what you'd call an RPG traditionalist. I can understand why RPG traditionalists would dislike FFVIII because it breaks so many RPG norms (No MP, enemies leveling up with you, getting paid a salary instead of winning money from battles, etc.), but again, that's not a problem for me because FFVIII doing something out of the ordinary doesn't bother me because I had no sense of "ordinary."

Agreed. The idea of "RPG norms" is just plain silly. It's like these people have forgotten what the letters RPG stand for! Nowhere in the name does it mandate that there are experience points and levels. When you read interviews with the creators of the Legend of Zelda series and you see things like "we're still not going to give him a proper voice because he's supposed to be the player's avatar and it just wouldn't be right to have someone else's voice coming out of his mouth" and "the name 'Link' is supposed to symbolize that he's the player's link to the game world", it's pretty clear that by the original definition of an RPG, which is to say a role-playing game, the Legend of Zelda series is intended to be one. Yet the only game in the series that even remotely resembles what most gamers think of as an RPG is Zelda II: The Adventure of Link, which commonly suffers that same fate as FFVIII and MGS2, precisely because it's different from the rest of the series.

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I'm a cat person, but I can still appreciate a SuperNiceDog.

Also, Nintendo should totally make a more "traditional" Legend of Zelda RPG. It would be huge, wouldn't it?

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I'm a cat person, but I can still appreciate a SuperNiceDog.

What makes you think it would be huge?

No reason why it would be a flop but...the series isn't as malleable as Mario.

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SuperNiceDog - 1, pjbasis - 0

Okay, I'm not sure if this is hilarious, just plain sad, or a combination of both.

Regardless, I am convinced that this is one of the most amazing topics I've ever read.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/197343-final-fantasy-viii/62075642

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You have to admit, the idea of being able to control your character's movement while a dialogue box is open is kind of counterintuitive.

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I'm a cat person, but I can still appreciate a SuperNiceDog.

Sort of, but the fact that he went to such lengths thinking the game was busted without even attempting to move the character forward is what makes it so great.

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I would think it was a troll if not for the responses.

How do you find a place that has multiple physical copies of PS1 games?

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SuperNiceDog - 1, pjbasis - 0

Independent game store, I guess.

Or online.

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"Stay with me until the end. Please."
"Not until the end. Always."

From: LeonhartFour | Posted: 2/27/2012 2:14:23 AM | #065
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/197343-final-fantasy-viii/62075642

wat

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I do because I can.....and because I'm bored.
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I perused this since I saw hardly anything had been played. Still haven't gotten around to going over your HINTS in previous topics but figure I'll answer the questions.

1. What is your favorite part of Disc 2 and why?

The battle of the gardens I guess.

2. What is your least favorite part of Disc 2 and why?

Most people will say Orphanage, but the inanity of that didn't bug me too much. I'm going with the concert.

3. What is your favorite boss battle in the game?

Probably the final boss actually. It's just done really well. Especially when Ultimecia starts doing the creepy "reflect upon... your childhood" stuff.

4. Do you prefer Disc 1 or Disc 2? (Figured I'd go ahead and ask this now since I doubt anyone's going to say Disc 3 or 4 is their favorite!)

Disc 1 pretty easily, though Disc 2 is also decent. Disc 1 has the better climax and doesn't have the silly plot twists that 2 has.

5. How would you rank the characters up to this point in the game?

Uhhh. Squall > Zell > Laguna > Fujin > Seifer >> Edea > Kiros > Raijin > Ward > Quistis >> Irvine > Selphie > Headmaster Cid >> Rinoa

I don't actually like anyone below Seifer though and dislike everyone below Quistis to varying degrees. This inequality doesn't change much over the course of the game. I think Seifer moves up above Fujin for the moment with Odin and Squall drops below Zell and Laguna because lol disc 3 (though overall I still like Squall best because of Kingdom Hearts)

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No problem!
This is a cute and pop genocide of love!

Fithos

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SuperNiceDog - 1, pjbasis - 0

Lusec

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LeonhartFour posted...
Sort of, but the fact that he went to such lengths thinking the game was busted without even attempting to move the character forward is what makes it so great.

Yeah, good point. That was pretty stupid.

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I'm a cat person, but I can still appreciate a SuperNiceDog.

All right, finally got a free evening to get some play time in, so let's do this.

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"I can set you free, mate."
"My freedom was forfeit long ago!"

Got some good playing in.

Will write about it tomorrow.

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What a tease.

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SuperNiceDog - 1, pjbasis - 0

It's what I do.

I also don't feel like starting so late because I know how long this usually takes.

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"Stay with me until the end. Please."
"Not until the end. Always."

Big update incoming.

Hopefully I can finish this up in the next few days before ME3 gets here. Should be doable. Disc 3 isn't that long as long as I don't bother with sidequests.

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"So cold. I am always by your side."
"There ain't no gettin' off of this train we on!"

Okay, Disc 3 opens with Squall lying on his bed wondering if it's all over and wondering what happened to Rinoa. He heads for the infirmary to check on her, and while he's there, Quistis comes over the intercom asking him to head to Edea's house. If you wander around Garden, you can get some NPC dialogue about the battle of the Gardens. Some of it's kinda neat and some of it's kinda humorous.

When you arrive at the orphanage, everyone's kind of uneasy about meeting Edea like this. Cid appears and thanks you for your hard work. He says he doesn't blame them if they got angry with him for running away (I didn't even realize he wasn't there during all that stuff until he says something about it, but whatever). It was a no-win situation for him. Either he would lose them or he would lose his wife, and he couldn't bear to face either outcome. He says he doesn't care if they forgive him or not, but he begs them to forgive Edea.

When you get a chance to talk to her, she'll ask for your forgiveness for fighting them even though she raised them like they were her children. Squall says he understands, and they all feel the same way. At this point, she'll begin to explain the situation. She's been possessed all this time by Sorceress Ultimecia, a sorceress who lives many generations in the future. Her objective is to find Ellone so she can use her mysterious power. Edea says that she is a fearful sorceress, full of anger and hate, so she couldn't let her get her hands on Ellone. The only thing she could do to protect Ellone was to surrender control of her mind to Ultimecia. I assume she means she allowed Ultimecia to possess her so she wouldn't possess Adel instead, who would have no issues cooperating with her plans for destruction and world domination.

Edea says that Ultimecia has yet to achieve her goal, and she fears she may try to possess her again. She plans to make some sort of stand against the evil sorceress, but if she can't, she asks Squall and company to handle the situation accordingly. I gotta admit, even playing this game at the age of 13, the whole story sounded so...fishy. It seemed to be a little too convenient, and I was surprised everyone just jumped on board so quickly without question. I guess they're giving Edea the benefit of the doubt based on their past relationship with her, but there was a part of me that suspected she was just lying to save her skin. It was a bit hard to swallow. Then again, they do say Ultimecia's name with BLUE TEXT, so I guess she must be a real person, and that's their way of showing it (since they talk about Adel in YELLOW TEXT) during the same scene. What is this all of a sudden, Umineko? Where's the Red Truth?

Speaking of Adel, Edea asks us if we know who she is. Zell says she was the leader of Esthar during the last Sorceress War, but she disappeared at the end of the war and no one knows what happened to her. Edea says that the Galbadians believed that she was the one who received Adel's powers, but that was not the case. She has been a sorceress since she was 5 years old (Note that she was already a sorceress when she receives Ultimecia's powers in the ending, so this is talking about a different occasion, obviously, since she's clearly not 5 years old in the ending unless she ages like that guy in the Robin Williams movie, "Jack," which I guess would make sense since Cid looks like him). Edea believes that Adel is still alive somewhere, and Ultimecia released control of her in order to try to possess Adel.

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"Why must we always choose between certain death and probable death?"
"I'm in an epic battle to the death, FIGURE IT OUT YOURSELF!"

When you try to leave, the rest of the party will stop you, telling you that Edea has more she wants to say. Squall says he's heard enough. He understands that listening to what she has to say is important, but he's worried about Rinoa. He decides to ask Edea if she knows what happened to her, and he explains the situation to her. She doesn't think she can be of any help though. Cid understands how Squall feels, but he reminds him that he's in a position of leadership. The other students at Garden have a right to know what has happened and what's to come. Rinoa wasn't the only one who fought.

The next scene is pretty interesting because the way it's presented shows us Squall's mindset at this point in time. The entire screen is black, so you can't see anyone. You can see speech boxes, but no names are shown to indicate who's speaking, and they're placed in the corners of the screen. Squall's thoughts about Rinoa take front and center in the screen. In the background, the party will talk about how Ultimecia's objective is to find Ellone. One of them deduces that she must want to send her consciousness even further back into the past. When asked what Ultimecia wants to do in the past, one of them says that she must be trying to achieve time compression. It's powerful time magic that compresses the past, present, and future. Someone asks what would happen to the world and why Ultimecia would want to do something like that, but at this point, they realize Squall isn't paying much attention, so they cut off their conversation there to snap him back to reality.

The game says that Ultimecia hasn't gone far enough into the past to use time compression, and she needs Ellone's help to get back as far as she needs to go. Is there some sort of "minimum" barrier of time you have to cover in order to use it? I guess there must be. I used to think that Ultimecia needed to have three points in time (one representing the past, one representing the present, and one representing the future) to use it, but nothing in the game really points to that, so whatever. I'm wondering how in the world they even know about time compression, considering time travel doesn't really exist up to that point in time. Perhaps the spell exists in some form and they're aware of its existence even though it can't really be used. But then again, why would it even exist at all if no one could use it, and how would they know it would work? Maybe something passed down from Hyne or something? I admit that this is one area of the plot that desperately needed some elaboration because there are way too many unanswered questions and logic leaps. Anything involving time travel in any medium is a delicate matter, and it's hard to handle correctly without creating any sort of gaps, loopholes, contradictions, etc. FFVIII definitely could've handled this aspect of the game better, and I can understand people coming down hard on the game for it since the last third or so of the game deals with it, so that's a big chunk. I've learned to deal with it and accept it for what it is even if I don't completely like it, so it's not really a problem for me. The game says this is what happened, so that's what happened. I know some people can't be so readily accepting like that, but I can, so...*shrugs*

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I'm wondering how in the world they even know about time compression, considering time travel doesn't really exist up to that point in time. Perhaps the spell exists in some form and they're aware of its existence even though it can't really be used. But then again, why would it even exist at all if no one could use it, and how would they know it would work?

I always assumed it was Edea saying this stuff and that she kept some of Ultimecia's knowledge from being possessed by her. That makes some sense, right?

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Anyway, going back to Squall's inner monologue during the blacked out screen, he recalls the first time he met Rinoa on the day he became a SeeD and then meeting her again in Timber. They had a lot of arguments at first, but over time, things began to change. He remembers Rinoa looking at him and smiling when their eyes met. Squall remembers the calm and tranquil feeling it gave him when she did that. He asks her to give him another chance, but then the rest of the party snaps him back to reality.

They all say that he's not even listening, but Squall frankly summarizes it all by saying that all they have to do is prevent Ultimecia from getting her hands on Ellone. That's the gist of it in a nutshell, sure, but the party is concerned that he's missing the bigger picture here because he's so worried about Rinoa. Squall says that they're heading back to Garden to let everyone know. Irvine says that they're all worried about Rinoa, too, and Squall begins to tell him that maybe he should do something about it then, but he stops himself.

Back at the Garden, Squall makes an announcement over the intercom that their current task is to find Ellone, who's on the White SeeD Ship. They'll be gathering information for a while, but they should be ready for battle at any time. Finally, he says that Sorceress Edea is back at her home, but she's probably not their enemy anymore, so they should just leave her alone. Make sure you head back to Edea's house so you can win the Edea card from her (She's the only person in the game who carries her own card). You have to deal with Centra's bad rule set (which includes Random, of course), but I actually had a pretty easy time of it this time around. Only took me a few tries to get it and didn't lose any of my own rare cards in the process.

After that, I decided to go ahead and take care of business at the Centra Ruins. I was gonna go on Disc 2, but I didn't have Enc-None until I was in the middle of the Battle of the Gardens, so I decided to wait so I didn't have to deal with random battles along with the time limit. I love the design of the Centra Ruins. It looks really cool. I wish the game could've given more backstory on this place or given you other places to explore, but oh well. In the first big area, there's a statue of a sorceress and her knight, which is cool (If you go back and check Sir Laguna's page after doing this sidequest, Selphie will actually make a little note about it there). For the most part, it's a pretty straightforward dungeon of hitting switches and stuff. The only kinda tricky part is the two statues. You have to take the two eyes (one is found in each of the two statues) and put them into the statue on the top level. Once you do that, it'll give you the pass code. Take the two eyes back and put them in the other statue, and then you input the code you got from the first statue to open the way to Odin's chamber. In holding to FF tradition, Odin doesn't actually attack you during this battle. You just have to beat him before time expires. He has some excellent spells to draw, including Triple, and if you have Enc-None, you should have plenty of time to draw to your heart's content before beating him, if that's your kinda thing.

I also did the Tonberry King sidequest. It's not very difficult. It's more time-consuming than anything. You have to beat 20 Tonberries in the Centra Ruins, and after you beat the 20th, the Tonberry King will automatically replace it and begin the battle with no break in between. None of them are a match for Renzokuken + Armageddon Fist, and they usually don't use Everyone's Grudge in response to a Limit Break, so it's not too bad. Tonberry is a great GF, too, in terms of his abilities, especially his ability to let you call shops from anywhere and the ability to buy low and sell high. He also has the ability to raise or lower enemy levels if you're into that kinda thing.

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From: Ultimaphazon | #082
I always assumed it was Edea saying this stuff and that she kept some of Ultimecia's knowledge from being possessed by her. That makes some sense, right?

I suppose so. The game doesn't really identify who's speaking, so it could be Edea. For some reason, I've always assumed it was someone else, but I think it's the way the script words it. The person who describes the whole thing about Ultimecia wanting to go further back into the past begins by saying "I get it," as if they just figured it out.

But then again, there's a break in the conversation before time compression is mentioned, so it could be different people there, the latter of which being Edea.

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Guess who I am!
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After doing the Centra sidequest, I headed back to the Infirmary to check on Rinoa. Squall will kneel down and put his hand on her forehead, remarking how cold she feels. He's frustrated that he's not able to do something to help her. He's not used to feeling like things are out of his control and he's utterly helpless. Squall says that she was so full of life, but now she doesn't even make a sound. He wants to hear her voice, and he asks her to call his name, but a sudden familiar sensation lapses him into unconsciousness. If they ever do have an FFVIII remake (or they put Rinoa into the next mainline Kingdom Hearts game, if there is one), Square had better make sure she has a really nice voice since Squall comments about it on multiple occasions from Disc 3 and on. I'm sure you Rinoa-hating weirdos want her to have an annoying voice or something, but phooey on that!

Now it's time for the next Laguna flashback. Fun Fact: There is an item that will prevent Ward from appearing in this dream sequence if you collect it beforehand. It's the Timber Maniacs magazine that you find in Shumi Village. If you read Selphie's "Sir Laguna's Page" thing, the one you find at Timber Maniacs will reference this dream sequence, but Ward won't be in the picture with Laguna and Kiros, and Selphie will wonder where he is. So if you've ever had Ward not appear and wonder why the heck he wasn't there, then there's your answer. I mean, you don't really lose anything in the story itself other than a few "..." lines, but it's nice to have a full party for the Ruby Dragon fight, I guess.

Anyway, Laguna and company are apparently flat broke because they stayed at a hotel too many times (Another Timber Maniacs magazine indicates that it was the Balamb Hotel, although they never got the opportunity to try the famous Balamb Fish), so he's resorted to becoming an actor in an amateur film so they can make whatever cash they can to get into Esthar. Laguna protests that he's not cut out to be an actor, but Kiros knows he's pretty excited about this gig.

Then Laguna changes into costume, wearing some knightly armor and touting a gunblade. The director introduces him to his co-star, playing the part of the sorceress (Does this plot line sound familiar to you?). However, the director is in a bind because the guy playing the dragon is sick, but once he spots Kiros and Ward, he asks them to fill in and offers to pay them. Nice, some extra cash. Once the filming begins, Laguna is ridiculously nervous and stutters through his lines. He thinks to himself that he hasn't used a gunblade since training, and he swings it around a few times (in a very familiar manner, if you catch my drift) to get the feel of it. The director says that it looks pretty good, and he'll put in some voiceovers later.

The director calls for the dragon, and after an awkward pause, a giant Ruby Dragon walks down the pathway. It's not until it attacks Laguna that they realize it's not a costume, but it's the real thing. That must've been quite the costume for them not to be able to tell the difference! The director and the sorceress run off, leaving Laguna to fend for himself against the dragon, assuming a very familiar stance. Apparently, gunblades are very adept at defense because you can parry a fierce lunge from a dragon without flinching, but you'll take some serious damage if you get hit unguarded. The mini-game isn't too hard here as long as you don't get TOO aggressive. The dragon attacks at three different speeds, and it usually leaves itself open for a couple quick slashes after its slowest attack.

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By the way, did you guys catch on to my hints about the movie and which character in the game is probably a huge secret Laguna fanboy and derived a certain ROMANTIC dream from watching this movie? Pretty neat, huh?

Anyway, Kiros and Ward will catch up to Laguna and give him his machine gun back, just in time for the Ruby Dragon to catch up to you. You can charge straight into the battle or take some time to prep. Just be mindful of the fact that the game conveniently stripped whatever Junctions you may have equipped to Kiros and Ward (which makes no sense to do considering the game lets you PICK which two characters you want to be Kiros and Ward for this sequence, so it's not like you're gonna get stuck with characters you didn't have Junctions for). I'm not sure why they even give you the option to go straight in because your Junctions are always stripped. I mean, I guess if you're doing a No Junctions playthrough or something, but I imagine 99% of people don't! The Ruby Dragon is nice enough to wait for you to get ready, too.

After you beat up the dragon, another one follows behind, and Laguna and company decide to book it. In the next screen, we see Laguna staring at some glowing object in the far distance. This object is Lunatic Pandora. By the way, the place where they're filming this movie is in Trabia. If you've ever tried traversing Trabia on the Garden, you may have noticed there's some weird crater thing that you can't cross, and Nida will tell you there's some weird energy reading or something. They used the Lunatic Pandora in an experiment here to test out its ability to call forth a Lunar Cry. I'm guessing they did so here because Trabia is a relatively uninhabited continent, so the odds of casualties were much lower.

After this, the screen will fade to black, but Squall won't return to reality. We hear Ellone's voice saying that she can't disconnect, and Squall asks her what this "Connect" thing is. She says it's just what she calls her special power. She says she must have fallen asleep, which is why she can't disconnect yet, so she asks Squall to let her use his spirit for a little longer. We cut to a scene between Laguna and Edea at the orphanage where he's on the search for Ellone. Man, he really went all over the place looking for her, huh? From Trabia to Centra, man.

Edea asks Laguna what happened to Ellone, and he tells her that she was kidnapped by Esthar soldiers. He's been traveling to find a way to get into the country, but no luck so far. Edea asks if they're looking for a successor to Sorceress Adel, and Laguna says that's right. She asks if Ellone is his daughter, and he says she isn't, but she's just so cute. He says that he wishes he could hear her voice, and Squall in the background wishes that he could hear Rinoa's voice, which catches Laguna's attention and makes him realize that the "faeries" are around.

Squall says he doesn't care if it's in the past or whatever. He wants to hear Rinoa, wants to see Rinoa. If he can, there might be a chance to save her. Ellone tells him that you can't change the past, which is something she recently discovered. When she was kidnapped, Laguna went on a journey to save her, but because he did, he wasn't able to be by Raine's side when she died. She wanted to show him their newborn baby (Squall, if you can't connect the dots). The whole point of Ellone sending Squall into the past was to try to prevent Laguna from ever leaving Winhill at all, but she couldn't do it.

You know, I've never really thought about it until now, but the implications of this are pretty...crazy, I guess. If Laguna never leaves, then that means Ellone never gets rescued. Then what would have happened to her? Yet Ellone was willing to take that risk in order to keep Laguna and Raine together. It must've been pretty important to her if she's willing to take that kind of risk to keep them together.

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Ellone says that she can no longer make it back to that moment when Laguna left, so she's run out of opportunities to stop him from leaving. Before disconnecting, she tells Squall that she can only send him into the consciousness of someone she's met before, so she can't help him with Rinoa. After waking up, despite what Ellone just said about not being able to change the past, Squall is insistent on trying anyway. He wants Ellone to send him back into the past to see Rinoa and maybe see if he can change something. You can sense his desperation here as he's throwing reason to the wind and holding on to whatever faint hope he can muster. He can't lose hope in being able to save her because he can't accept losing her, even if what he's hoping in doesn't make logical sense to believe in.

Squall has to find Ellone somehow. He knows she's on the White SeeD Ship, and that they're Edea's SeeD, so she might know where they are. In a cruel twist of fate, I actually managed to stumble upon the White SeeD Ship by accident as I left the Centra Ruins trying to get back to Edea's House. Of course, I didn't have Edea's letter, so they kicked me out, but man. Nevertheless, realizing that it's near the Centra Ruins will actually be very helpful to me in the future. I used it to get back to the White SeeD Ship in short order after getting the letter. Also, if you want a sick and twisted "Infinite Gil" trick, you can sell Edea's letter for 125 Gil (or more if you have Tonberry's Familiar ability learned) before going to the White SeeD Ship. No matter how many times you sell it, Edea will always give you another one! I can't imagine anyone being THAT desperate for Gil in FFVIII though, but hey, it's there if you want it.

When you board the White SeeD Ship, they'll recognize you from before and ask you to state your business. Squall says that he wants to see Ellone, which shocks them. He assures them that they pose no threat to them, and that Edea told them that they would be here. They don't understand, but Squall explains the situation to them. However, they see no reason to believe them (Finally, some bonafide skepticism from someone about this Ultimecia stuff!), and they ask them to leave. Oh by the way, after you clear up everything with the leader about Edea and Ellone, one of the White SeeD on board the ship will tell the legend of Hyne to a couple of the kids there. It's pretty neat. All sorts of messed up, but neat.

Unfortunately, the game script doesn't have the dialogue handy, so I'll have to wing it. Apparently, Hyne created the world and the people on it, and the act wore him out so much that he decided to take a nice, long nap. When he woke up, the population of humanity had grown rapidly, much to his astonishment. Humanity came to desire the power that Hyne had and somehow found a way to trap him. In exchange, he agreed to give them half of his body, which contained great magical power, and afterward, he disappeared and was never seen again. Unfortunately, he tricked humanity by giving them the weaker half or something. This is supposedly where sorceresses come from, that power that was in half of Hyne's body. Also, only women can actually inherit the power, for whatever the reason. There are no sorcerers, only sorceresses.

When you head to the next screen, Zone and Watts will be there to meet you. Apparently, the White SeeD picked them up while they were on the run from Galbadia. They ask how Rinoa's doing, and when Squall explains the situation, Zone goes into a frenzy, yelling and cursing at him. Watts tries to remain level headed and reminds Zone that she's not dead. They just don't know what happened to her, and Squall won't give up on her. He tells them that they came to find Ellone because she might be able to bring Rinoa back, which calms Zone down.

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You can ask Watts for some general information, but the only real topic of interest is Ellone. He'll tell you that she left with some Esthar ships, and she was smiling when she left. Hmmm...Very confusing indeed! Oh right, you can win the Angelo card from Watts if you haven't done so yet. If you talk to Zone upstairs, he won't have much to say unless you happen to have The Girl Next Door with you. You can be a nice guy and give it to him for free, or you can sell it to him for 25,500 Gil. If you give it to him for free, he'll give you the Shiva card in exchange, so yeah.

When you head into the captain's quarters, Squall will give him Edea's letter, and he'll recognize her handwriting. He'll explain that they've been raised by her since they were little, and they call her Matron as well. The leader thanks Squall and salutes him, who comments that their salutes are the same. The leader will remark that Edea said the SeeD salute hasn't changed since Garden was established (which makes sense considering Edea learns the salute from Squall in the ending).

Anyway, the leader will then explain what happened to Ellone. They tried to get as far away from Galbadia as they could, but eventually, their navy caught up to them. Unfortunately, their ship also broke down, so they decided to prepare for battle. However, Esthar ships soon arrived and began fighting the Galbadians. In the middle of the battle, some Esthar soldiers came aboard the White SeeD Ship and told them to get aboard their ship. Naturally, they didn't trust Esthar any more than they trusted Galbadia, so they refused. Ellone, however, chased after them. As their ship was pulling away, she yelled out something and then jumped on board. After that, both sides withdrew from the battle, and that was that. The leader says he intends to head to Esthar once the ship is repaired.

When we get back to Garden, Squall tells Nida that he wants to go to Esthar, but apparently, the rough terrain on that continent isn't really suited for the Garden's flight capabilities. The only way to get there is to walk from FH, since the Horizon Bridge connects to Esthar. We land the Garden at FH, and Squall decides he's had enough, and he's gonna take things into his own hands. He picks up Rinoa onto his back and heads off toward Esthar. I guess he thinks he's being sneaky or something, but it's not hard to figure out why they'd be at FH, and they already said they wanted to go to Esthar to find Ellone, so...I dunno why he felt like he had to go off on his own. Or maybe the general thought process was that they had decided to abort the plan to go to Esthar when they heard the Garden couldn't fly there, but again, why go to FH? I'm also not sure why he feels like he can't trust the rest of the party with this, but then again, this is more of a personal thing than "official business" in his mind, I guess, so he doesn't want to feel like he's abusing his authority or something. I dunno. Hard to say.

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After a lot of walking on the Horizon Bridge, Squall has some time to think, and it really begins to settle in his mind what he's doing. He's not used to acting off of impulse, so now that his brain has had time to process everything, he begins to go through this rationally. He realizes that even if he does get to see Ellone, that doesn't mean everything will get fixed. Even so, he realizes that he's changed quite a bit.

He decides to take a break and places Rinoa gently down on the bridge as he sits down and gazes out over the water. He wonders what everyone's doing, if they're laughing at him or if they're mad at him. Then he turns and addresses Rinoa aloud, and even though she can't actually hear him, the fact that he's trying to vocalize his feelings out loud to another person is a big step for him. Squall tells her that he actually cares way too much about what others think of him. He hates that side of him, and that's why he didn't want anyone to get to know him. It made it easy for him to keep his distance when everyone thought he was just an introverted, unfriendly guy, so that's the image he strove to maintain. He thought people would keep their distance if they thought he didn't really care.

After a while, Squall encounters Zell and Quistis. Looks like they'd already set out before he got a chance to leave with Rinoa! They tell him that they're escorting Edea to Esthar, and she walks on screen. When did she even get onto the Garden anyway? Eh, whatever. When Squall asks her what business she has in Esthar, she tells him that she needs to see Dr. Odine, who is the number one guy to talk to when it comes to sorceresses. He knows more than anyone. Edea wants to find a way to protect herself from Ultimecia, and she figures the best way to do that is to get rid of her sorceress powers. Odine may know a way to do it.

At this point, Selphie and Irvine return from scouting the area. Esthar's supposed to be huge, but they can't find it anywhere. They've checked north and south, so let's head east next, which leads us to the Great Salt Lake. I like the design of this place, and the music kind of gives it an eerie, mysterious feeling. I love the giant, dinosaur-esque skeletons everywhere. Looks cool. Before they head out, Edea warns them that they must be alert, even in her presence, because they don't know when Ultimecia will try to possess her again. If that happens, they all know what to do.

Of course, thinking about this gets them all into a very somber mood. Squall says that someone once told him that if you mention bad things, they'll come true (That someone is Laguna, by the way. He says it at the end of the second dream sequence). While it's just a silly superstition, he wants to believe it for now, so they decide not to talk about it anymore. The Great Salt Lake isn't a very big area. You can find a shortcut on the first screen if you walk up the giant skeleton to the right, which also leads to a Meteor Draw Point, which is nice. After a while, you'll run into Abaddon, an undead boss. An elixir or the Recover command make short work of the thing, so I don't bother fighting the thing "traditionally" too often. It has pretty high defense against virtually everything but curative stuff, so it's just easier to kill it with an elixir or Recover.

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On the next screen, the party will notice the...air flickering and a hole will open seemingly in midair. Squall will reach out and feel that there's actually something there even though they can't see it, so they climb up into the hole. At a certain point in the tunnel, you can examine some of the transparent panels and realize the reason you couldn't see anything is because these panels have a "Camouflage" option that put up an image of a blue sky.

As you progress, everything eventually clears up and the humongous city of Esthar comes into view. We're treated to a nice FMV of the city as the lift flies you through it. Once we get off, Squall says that Esthar must know that they're here, so he warns them to stay alert in case of hostility. Of course, the best way to remain alert is to be unconscious, so Ellone conveniently decides to "connect" them to the past at that moment.

We cut to Laguna and company at the Lunatic Pandora Laboratory. They've found their way into Esthar, but they've apparently been arrested and forced to do slave labor. The opening scene doesn't have too much notable going on other than Laguna having some cool interactions with a Moomba. His kindness for the Moomba catches the attention of the other guy in the room, and he tells Laguna he might be a perfect candidate to be the leader of the Adel Resistance. They have a decent sized resistance and they've been doing some behind the scenes work, but they haven't really found anyone capable of leading the charge against her and removing her from power.

At this point, an Esthar soldier will come in and see them talking, and he'll resort to violence. Laguna will handle him, and then he'll offer to keep the soldiers at bay while the Moomba and the other guy escape. At that point, Kiros and Ward will enter to help him out. Once again, the game has conveniently stripped whatever Junctions they may have, so make sure you check on them. Of course, if you brought Edea with you into Esthar and you have stuff Junctioned onto her, too bad. The game won't let you use her for this dream sequence, and it won't let you switch her Junctions before it begins either. Oh well.

Before you escape, you can eavesdrop on a conversation between Odine and his assistant. Part of the conversation involves a Weapons Monthly that Odine borrowed from his assistant, which he's since lost. If you come back afterward, you can find it on the ground, which will show you how to form some of the very best weapons in the game, including Lionheart. After you leave, you'll discover that Odine's assistant is also part of the Adel Resistance, so he offers to help you find Ellone. Odine is probably the guy to ask about that though since she's his new favorite toy.

Before you head off to find him, you can get a neat conversation about Ellone. If you talk to that other guy, he'll ask Laguna if she's his "special someone," and he'll reply that it's something like that. Kiros will say that's ridiculous because she's like a daughter to him. Laguna says that Ellone's still a "lady," so he calls her that out of respect...and fear. Then he recalls "The J Disaster," an incident in which she got angry with him and put fruit jam in his shoes, which nearly brought him to tears.

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Laguna agrees to join forces with the Anti-"Azel" movement or whatever. Kiros tells him to pay more attention before speaking because it's embarrassing, or at least that's what he's reading from Ward's expression. Laguna says it doesn't matter because he speaks with passion from the heart, and that's what matters most! When you head back into the lab, the three of them will confront Odine, who will tell them that Ellone is in O Lab, his personal laboratory. After doing some investigating in O Lab, Laguna is finally able to rescue Ellone, and thus the final dream sequence ends.

When the party comes to, a car approaches them, and a man steps out and asks them what business they have in Esthar. Edea tells him that she came to see Dr. Odine. The man asks what this is regarding, and Squall interjects and says he wants to see Ellone. Upon that, the man will invite you to come with him, and we get to ride through the city while "Silence and Motion," a delightfully quirky theme, begins to play.

We cut to the Presidential Palace, where Edea is explaining her situation and her wish to be free from Ultimecia's control, and Odine says that he can exorcise the sorceress. The presidential aide asks them if they want to see Ellone, and Odine gives them the permission to go on one condition: They allow him to observe Rinoa. Squall accepts their offer, and they tell him to meet him at Lunar Gate when they're ready. You can win the Ward card from Odine while you're here, too. Esthar is a huge city, but thankfully, there are lifts that will carry you wherever you want to go, which is nice. Unfortunately, after all the Lunatic Pandora stuff, those lifts break, and there are random battles in the city, which is annoying. It's a shame because Esthar is such a cool place.

Anyway, that's a good deal of progress. We're probably already halfway through Disc 3. We're gonna try to fly through the rest of the game over the next couple days, so try to keep up!

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"The great GF...Bahamut."
"...GF? I...? Using my powers...It is you humans...I fear..."

I'll try!

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SuperNiceDog - 1, pjbasis - 0

At least someone will!

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Spring Break is probably lowering attendance.

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SuperNiceDog - 1, pjbasis - 0

I'm reading, but the posts are actually TOO in-depth for me.

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whoops forgot about this topic >_>

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I do because I can.....and because I'm bored.
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From: Ultimaphazon | #095
I'm reading, but the posts are actually TOO in-depth for me.

It's difficult to avoid because I love talking about FFVIII so much. FFIX will probably be a little lighter on the commentary.

But then FFX oh dear

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I hope you never shut up about FFIX. It's so good dammit

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"Mr. Paris, I assume you've had a great deal of experience being rejected by women." ~SCP~
http://img.imgcake.com/Jeffzeropngus.png

One of the most overrated games on Board 8.

Still really, really good game that I've beaten multiple times over, but my word, Board 8 overrates this game.

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"Hold on a minute! That testimony stinks!"
"Witness! You can't just say 'Hello' and expect us to get anywhere! I want you to testify!"

LeonhartFour posted...
One of the most overrated games on Board 8.

Still really, really good game that I've beaten multiple times over, but my word, Board 8 overrates this game.

Why are you bringing Tales of Symphonia into this conversation?

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"Mr. Paris, I assume you've had a great deal of experience being rejected by women." ~SCP~
http://img.imgcake.com/Jeffzeropngus.png