From: Jeff Zero | #048 ZFS posted... Jeff Zero posted... Smith is good. He just got carried away.
He didn't work on FFT. He handled FFXII.
I am aware he had nothing to do with the original fft.
No, he had nothing to do with any FFT. He did Vagrant Story, but not War of the Lions.
From: tereziWright | #047 I was unable to tolerate getting far enough into WotL to get to Mustadio, does he have the same overly verbose unnecessary flowery dialogue? That's one character that I don't think anyone could possibly defend talking like that.
See for yourself:
Mustadio: Baert's curs are nowhere to be seen. Yet there's no sign of a battle with Lionel's Gryphons. Something's amiss. I'm going to see what I can find out. We'll meet afterward.
Ramza: Where will I find you?
Mustadio (pointing): The Goug lowtown is just down this road. We're not like to draw much attention there.
I wanted Algus gone because he's a despicable human being. FFT's original translation did a good enough job of conveying that regardless of your feelings on punctuation.
--
"I couldn't stand a day without a past or future. I need to live each moment to keep fighting here and now."
KanzarisKelshen posted... From: LeonhartFour | #042 Also you're supposed to be glad Algus is gone
He's the scum of the earth This is pretty much the point, yes, and why I'm not bothered by Miluda and Algus being incoherent. They're both idiots who believe fervently in their ideals, but are really lapdogs of people with better heads on their shoulders. The 'pot kettle black' vibe of that exchange is exactly the point of it - they're really no different in their zeal and methods, just the sides they pick.
See, I never felt that with Milleuda. I always felt these were people forced into a situation by people like Argath. It's what makes Wiegraf a tragic figure: he once had a noble cause that he and Milleuda would follow to the end. By the end, he had completely abandoned that ideal and even openly stated so, essentially desecrating the promise he made to Milleuda shortly after her death.
I think taking away the tragedy of the commoner in this game and labeling them as stubborn radicals does more to hurt the class struggle going on and serves to make Wiegraf's fall a lot less interesting.
-- TheRock ~ Slow dramatic zoom-pan. Doesn't phase the hooded man. "You have issues." - MWC. Pot. Kettle.
Miluda is every bit as close-minded as Algus, just in the other direction. Granted, I don't blame her for her attitude toward the nobility, but she essentially tells Ramza that she doesn't care if he's technically a good person. He's a noble, and she hates him because he's a noble.
--
"I couldn't stand a day without a past or future. I need to live each moment to keep fighting here and now."
Mustadio: Baert's curs are nowhere to be seen. Yet there's no sign of a battle with Lionel's Gryphons. Something's amiss. I'm going to see what I can find out. We'll meet afterward.
Ramza: Where will I find you?
Mustadio (pointing): The Goug lowtown is just down this road. We're not like to draw much attention there.
From: LeonhartFour | #054 Miluda is every bit as close-minded as Algus, just in the other direction. Granted, I don't blame her for her attitude toward the nobility, but she essentially tells Ramza that she doesn't care if he's technically a good person. He's a noble, and she hates him because he's a noble.
This. Read this, from the WotL translation, and tell me she isn't an idiotic zealot:
Ramza: Why this struggle? To what purpose do you fight? Have we wronged you? Have we somehow made you to suffer? I do not understand what fuels your hatred.
Milleuda: It is enough that you can stand there before me in ignorance of the misdeeds done us. You may not see the world beyond your high walls, but that does not mean they mark its boundaries. It may well be you've done no wrong. It is your place in the world that drives my hatred on. You bear the name Beoulve, and that name is my enemy.
The bottom line of FFT isn't 'commoners are oppressed, pity the poor bastards'. It's 'commoners are oppressed, but in their attempt at overthrowing their oppressors, they become as bad as the people they fight. Just because you're more right than the people you fight doesn't actually put you in the right.'
From: pjbasis | #060 Reading these excerpts really makes me want to play this game.
Do it. Any gripes I might have with the WotL translation aside (such as the super stilted way that Mustadio convo goes), FFT is an amazing game and you should go out and enjoy it. Both translations will serve you well, just pick the one that looks better and enjoy one of the finest games of the PSX generation.
PS: Playthrough topic if you go through with it IMO. Would be nice to see one!
LeonhartFour posted... Miluda is every bit as close-minded as Algus, just in the other direction. Granted, I don't blame her for her attitude toward the nobility, but she essentially tells Ramza that she doesn't care if he's technically a good person. He's a noble, and she hates him because he's a noble.
That's what I said, though: people like Argath FORCE people like Millueda into this situation. That doesn't mean everything they do is perfectly justified. But the commoners have been so mistreated by the nobility that even the good nobles end up having to bare the blow.
-- TheRock ~ Slow dramatic zoom-pan. Doesn't phase the hooded man. "You have issues." - MWC. Pot. Kettle.
an FFT retranslation topic I'm not a part of? let me get in on this
the thing about why FFT PSP is bad is because it's made up. that's not how the game was written. yeah FFT vanilla is poorly translated but the meaning is the same. FFT PSP was just made up stuff that made the game harder to read. FFT PSP retranslation is an invented work by the translator that in barely conveys what the original text was saying.
another positive thing about the old translation is that it's hilarious. some of the mistranslations are so awful or so inappropriate, they make me smile every time.
is that it does this make the planet livable again
And edit 'all right' to 'alright'. And rework Mustadio's first line into this:
Mustadio: Baert's curs are nowhere to be seen, yet there's no sign of a battle with Lionel's Gryphons...
...Something's amiss. I'm going to see what I can find out. We'll meet afterward.
But then, that's a substantial amount of rewriting for such a brief exchange, isn't it? That's kind of the point of the complaints with WotL. People don't speak that way.
Absolutely play FFT. The WotL translation is really bad, but it's still FFT I guess. I do recommend the original by far, though. The PSP version also has awful lag, REAL bad, but I heard there was a mod for that. Apparently it was a very easy fix SE could have done but didn't for some reason? I never really looked into it, just going by hearsay.
From: OmarsComin | #069 an FFT retranslation topic I'm not a part of? let me get in on this
the thing about why FFT PSP is bad is because it's made up. that's not how the game was written. yeah FFT vanilla is poorly translated but the meaning is the same. FFT PSP was just made up stuff that made the game harder to read. FFT PSP retranslation is an invented work by the translator that in barely conveys what the original text was saying.
another positive thing about the old translation is that it's hilarious. some of the mistranslations are so awful or so inappropriate, they make me smile every time.
"I'm saving Agrias! Geronimo!!"
Real talk: A reworked version that added some extra badass and kept the Geronimo line would be amazing, no kidding.
Eh, I still don't have much sympathy for Miluda regardless. Ramza gave her a chance to escape with her life, but she went "no I hate nobles" and died for it.
--
"I couldn't stand a day without a past or future. I need to live each moment to keep fighting here and now."
From: TheRock1525 | #071 A topic with LtM and Ulti turning into hyperbole.
Shock.
Do you think I'm being hyperbolic though, Rock? I'm curious as to what your rebuttal to my posts would be. Do you think my 'rework' of Mustadio's lines doesn't feel more natural? How about my comments about Miluda?
From: OmarsComin | #069 an FFT retranslation topic I'm not a part of? let me get in on this
the thing about why FFT PSP is bad is because it's made up. that's not how the game was written. yeah FFT vanilla is poorly translated but the meaning is the same. FFT PSP was just made up stuff that made the game harder to read. FFT PSP retranslation is an invented work by the translator that in barely conveys what the original text was saying.
another positive thing about the old translation is that it's hilarious. some of the mistranslations are so awful or so inappropriate, they make me smile every time.
"I'm saving Agrias! Geronimo!!"
Also what the hell, I forgot to mention it before - is it seriously true that WotL is a made up translation? If so, that's ridiculous and stupid and AAAAAAAAAARGH
From: ZFS | #028 Haha, yes. !!!!!! is Suikoden tier.
This best be an indictment of the 1st (and arguably 2nd) game's translation on not one on the series as a whole. Otherwise there will be threats. Over the internet.
From: ZFS | #033 Algus: You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!
so good
--
"Oh God, maplejet's trying to be cool again. I'll call the ambulance." - Wylvane [NO BARKLEY NO PEACE]
To be fair, Ramza is very ignorant to what the nobles have done to the commoners.
It's like a guy wearing a Nazi SS outfit coming up to a Jew and telling him to surrender. Sure, he can mean well and he might be a good human being, but he's also wearing a Nazi uniform. Just like Ramza wears the Beoulve name.
-- TheRock ~ Slow dramatic zoom-pan. Doesn't phase the hooded man. "You have issues." - MWC. Pot. Kettle.
From: KanzarisKelshen | #072 Real talk: A reworked version that added some extra badass and kept the Geronimo line would be amazing, no kidding.
You would think after keeping "You spoony bard!" through so many retranslations in FFIV that they would try to keep some of the good original lines in the PSP FFT translation.
--
Congrats to 2011 Rivalry Rumble Guru winner, SuperNiceDog http://backloggery.com/articuno2001/sig.gif
From: TheRock1525 | #078 To be fair, Ramza is very ignorant to what the nobles have done to the commoners.
It's like a guy wearing a Nazi SS outfit coming up to a Jew and telling him to surrender. Sure, he can mean well and he might be a good human being, but he's also wearing a Nazi uniform. Just like Ramza wears the Beoulve name.
I fully agree that Ramza is kind of a derp, but I don't think this comparison is good because seriously, Delita isn't a noble and Miluda just laughs at him. She's really, really crazy.
is it seriously true that WotL is a made up translation? If so, that's ridiculous and stupid and AAAAAAAAAARGH
yup. IIRC when the PSP re-release was getting brought over, Square was like "let's strengthen the ties with FF12 and make the script more like 12's script." so the retranslation and all the flowery stuff was invented in the translation process.
there's a FAQ someone wrote here a few years back before the PSP rerelease where he retranslated the actual work. it made a lot more sense than either of the translations we got.
As far as I know there is no Japanese version of the script that resemble what we got with WotL.
Do you think I'm being hyperbolic though, Rock? I'm curious as to what your rebuttal to my posts would be. Do you think my 'rework' of Mustadio's lines doesn't feel more natural? How about my comments about Miluda?
LtM says the WotL is one of the worst things ever done, "mind-numbling atrocious", and "in-f***ing tolerable."
Ulti says "Anyone who prefers the PSP translation of FFT is someone I know I never need to take seriously on any subject."
You've never said anything to that effect. You're having an actual discussion about this and making note that this is more person preference than a statement of fact.
So no, you're not being hyperbolic.
-- TheRock ~ Slow dramatic zoom-pan. Doesn't phase the hooded man. "You have issues." - MWC. Pot. Kettle.
Yes, Ramza is naive to the max, but Miluda still doesn't warrant much sympathy. Teta is a commoner who warrants sympathy.
Also it would be more akin to a Nazi finding a Jew in hiding and saying, "Look, I won't turn you in, just go," and the Jew refusing. Of course, there would be a natural doubt that he would keep his word, but still, the Nazi is traveling around with a Jew, to boot.
--
"I couldn't stand a day without a past or future. I need to live each moment to keep fighting here and now."
KanzarisKelshen posted... From: TheRock1525 | #078 To be fair, Ramza is very ignorant to what the nobles have done to the commoners.
It's like a guy wearing a Nazi SS outfit coming up to a Jew and telling him to surrender. Sure, he can mean well and he might be a good human being, but he's also wearing a Nazi uniform. Just like Ramza wears the Beoulve name. I fully agree that Ramza is kind of a derp, but I don't think this comparison is good because seriously, Delita isn't a noble and Miluda just laughs at him. She's really, really crazy.
Delita is like those Jews who worked as slave drivers in the death camp. They're seen more as traitors than anything.
Considering during their last confrontation, Delita couldn't stammer out an accurate response to anything she said, he didn't do much to help his cause.
-- TheRock ~ Slow dramatic zoom-pan. Doesn't phase the hooded man. "You have issues." - MWC. Pot. Kettle.
Yeah, the translation is definitely an imitation of FFXII, but without as much skill in writing. FFXII is one of the best RPG localizations ever, but that's not the case with FFT PSP.
-- "When I was a young man, I had liberty, but I did not see it. I had time, but I did not know it."
From: TheRock1525 | #082 Do you think I'm being hyperbolic though, Rock? I'm curious as to what your rebuttal to my posts would be. Do you think my 'rework' of Mustadio's lines doesn't feel more natural? How about my comments about Miluda?
LtM says the WotL is one of the worst things ever done, "mind-numbling atrocious", and "in-f***ing tolerable."
Ulti says "Anyone who prefers the PSP translation of FFT is someone I know I never need to take seriously on any subject."
You've never said anything to that effect. You're having an actual discussion about this and making note that this is more person preference than a statement of fact.
So no, you're not being hyperbolic.
OK, s'long as I'm not getting lumped in with the blanket statements I'm good. I just feel like this is a really cool subject to debate and it's a shame it's kinda getting drowned out a bit.
From: OmarsComin | #081 is it seriously true that WotL is a made up translation? If so, that's ridiculous and stupid and AAAAAAAAAARGH
yup. IIRC when the PSP re-release was getting brought over, Square was like "let's strengthen the ties with FF12 and make the script more like 12's script." so the retranslation and all the flowery stuff was invented in the translation process.
there's a FAQ someone wrote here a few years back before the PSP rerelease where he retranslated the actual work. it made a lot more sense than either of the translations we got.
As far as I know there is no Japanese version of the script that resemble what we got with WotL.
Oh man, do you have any idea what the name of that might be? Because I really wanna give it a look-see and find out what the actual japanese script was like.
PS: Also, Squeenix the worst for butchering FFT to make XII, which is obviously disconnected from it, look better by comparison. That's just disgusting.
SemiFinal vs Belarus posted... From: KanzarisKelshen | #068 And edit 'all right' to 'alright'. Never! "Alright" is an abomination that has no place in the English language!
Whoa, I had no idea someone else shared my distaste for that "word."
--
"I couldn't stand a day without a past or future. I need to live each moment to keep fighting here and now."
LeonhartFour posted... Yes, Ramza is naive to the max, but Miluda still doesn't warrant much sympathy. Teta is a commoner who warrants sympathy.
Also it would be more akin to a Nazi finding a Jew in hiding and saying, "Look, I won't turn you in, just go," and the Jew refusing. Of course, there would be a natural doubt that he would keep his word, but still, the Nazi is traveling around with a Jew, to boot.
Actually, it's more like the Nazi found the Jew, beat the Jew up for a while, then let the Jew go because he felt kinda bad about it.
Then the Nazi ran into the Jew again and wanted her to surrender.
-- TheRock ~ Slow dramatic zoom-pan. Doesn't phase the hooded man. "You have issues." - MWC. Pot. Kettle.
Yeah, the translation is definitely an imitation of FFXII, but without as much skill in writing. FFXII is one of the best RPG localizations ever, but that's not the case with FFT PSP.
yup
I don't think ill of the dude, I just think they dropped a stinker on WotL. FF12, CTDS, those were both quite good I thought.
From: Erugios | #088 Wow, every single facet of FF13's development sounds just absolutely terrible. They really need to restructure their management system
Apparently this got fixed a bit for XIII-2. Which explains why that game turned out so much better!
Oh man, do you have any idea what the name of that might be? Because I really wanna give it a look-see and find out what the actual japanese script was like.
From: UltimaterializerX | #093 Man I'm not being hyperbolic at all, but you act like I won't defend my favorite game. FFT PSP is an abomination. The only thing worse would be putting FFT 1.3 on it.
Is 1.3 that bad? I thought it was the hack that was actually pretty decent? Or is that another one?