Board 8 > There are people who think Woodrow Wilson ISN'T the greatest president?

(+) Yeah! (+)

What's wrong with them

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He hated Yo-Yos

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they are probably German

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literally caused world war 2

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My highschool was named after him.

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*Waits for Smuffin to arrive and denounce Woodrow Wilson as the worst president*

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Eisenhower, duh

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He's the best President to date Edna Krabapple.

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From: foolm0ron | #007
Eisenhower, duh

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Teddy was pretty awesome

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Who the hell's Woodrow Wilson?

Yes, I'm American. Yes, I know of Woodrow Wilson. No, there's nothing about his presidency that is at all memorable to me as being attached to the man even though he was in office during WWI. Yes, I'm a horrible student of history. I also grew up in a development with streets named after random irrelevant Gilded Age presidents, so anyone not named Washington or Lincoln that wasn't in the last 80 years just kinda blurs together.

Who the hell's Woodrow Wilson?

League of Nations brah, pretty important.

And Wilson is a lot like Obama: incredibly intelligent, but a largely ineffective leader.

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From: Westbrick | #012
Who the hell's Woodrow Wilson?

League of Nations brah, pretty important.

And Wilson is a lot like Obama: incredibly intelligent, but a largely ineffective leader.

Let's be honest.

The League of Nations was not actually that important.

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From: foolm0ron | #007
Eisenhower, duh

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Let's be honest.

The League of Nations was not actually that important.

das da joke

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Not too many Presidents who can safely lay claim to being both a fascist AND a racist. So Wilson has that going for him!

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[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

Eise

From: foolm0ron | #007
Eisenhower, duh

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From: SmartMuffin | #016
Not too many Presidents who can safely lay claim to being both a fascist AND a racist. So Wilson has that going for him!

Abraham Lincoln, for one.

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Lincoln was more of a communist than a fascist, I think. Though I guess there really isn't a difference at the extremes.

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Lincoln was more of a communist than a fascist, I think. Though I guess there really isn't a difference at the extremes.

There's a huge difference between communism and fascism!

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From: Westbrick | #021
Lincoln was more of a communist than a fascist, I think. Though I guess there really isn't a difference at the extremes.

There's a huge difference between communism and fascism!

Lol yeah, kind of the biggest possible difference at least in theory.

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From: Jeff Zero | #022
Lol yeah, kind of the biggest possible difference at least in theory.

That's what I'm saying. A theory is that the political spectrum is not a line, but a circle. So at the most extreme points (communism and fascism), your policies are nearly indistinguishable

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yo man this guys got DA FOURTEEN POINTS

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You beat yourself up with your past. Don't blame yourself, blame the world. Blame God. Blame me.

That's what I'm saying. A theory is that the political spectrum is not a line, but a circle. So at the most extreme points (communism and fascism), your policies are nearly indistinguishable

I was taught this back in middle school, and I still don't see how it makes a lick of sense. The only similarity between communism and fascism is that they're both collectivist.

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plus he wrote the most ballin books about the history of the british parliament EVER

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From: Westbrick | #025
I was taught this back in middle school, and I still don't see how it makes a lick of sense. The only similarity between communism and fascism is that they're both collectivist.

It makes sense, at least in the context of Nazism vs. Stalinism. Both have a focus on the working class, both use nationalism to gain power, both pretend to give equal power to all the people, when in reality they both greatly restrain personal liberties in order to have a strong central government of elites. Though of course Stalinism isn't actually Communism, but it is extreme left.

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red sox 777 posted...
*Waits for Smuffin to arrive and denounce Woodrow Wilson as the worst president*

Wilson can't be the worst president. We still have Warren G. Harding, James Buchanan, Andrew Johnson, Franklin Pierce, and all of the Whig presidents.

People really overlook just how wretched most of the presidents were in the mid-1800s with, like, one notable exception (James K. Polk).

woodrow

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HE GOT WOOD!

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Wilson is a perfect example of why academics should stay out of leadership positions; they often don't understand that there is a huge disparity between theory and practical execution.


That being said, I still think he was a good President. He does not quite reach Great tier (Eisenhower, Teddy, etc), nor does he reach GOAT tier (Washington, Lincoln, GW Bush).

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Wilson basically caused World War 2 by handing Germany over to France to screw up after World War 1. Go him

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Wilson can't be the worst president. We still have Warren G. Harding, James Buchanan, Andrew Johnson, Franklin Pierce, and all of the Whig presidents.

I'm not seeing what was so bad about those presidents. They didn't do very much. So they can't have done very much that was bad.

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red sox 777 posted...
Wilson can't be the worst president. We still have Warren G. Harding, James Buchanan, Andrew Johnson, Franklin Pierce, and all of the Whig presidents.

I'm not seeing what was so bad about those presidents. They didn't do very much. So they can't have done very much that was bad.

Buchanan basically let the Civil War happen and Johnson basically precipitated 100 years of segregation and disenfranchisement for blacks

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red sox 777 posted...
Wilson can't be the worst president. We still have Warren G. Harding, James Buchanan, Andrew Johnson, Franklin Pierce, and all of the Whig presidents.

I'm not seeing what was so bad about those presidents. They didn't do very much. So they can't have done very much that was bad.

Pierce signing the Kansas-Nebraska Act exasperated the situation between the North and the South, Buchanan's ineptitude and dismissal of the territorial issue made the Civil War a certainty, Johnson's handling of the Reconstruction of the South after the Civil War led to him being despised so much by both parties that they absolutely refused to work with the guy, Harding ran possibly the most corrupt administration in our country's history, and the Whigs are low because of their general ineffectiveness.

Tagging this

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PrivateBiscuit1 posted...
James K. Polk

Polk is a favorite of mine. Came in with clearly stated goals and left having accomplished everything he set out to do.

red sox 777 posted...
Wilson can't be the worst president. We still have Warren G. Harding, James Buchanan, Andrew Johnson, Franklin Pierce, and all of the Whig presidents.

I'm not seeing what was so bad about those presidents. They didn't do very much. So they can't have done very much that was bad.

Buchanan doing nothing is exactly what made him a terrible president.

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So basically, Buchanan and Johnson were too nice to the South? And Buchanan didn't make the Civil War a certainty, Lincoln did. As for Harding, sure he was corrupt, but presidents can do a lot more damage to the country than that kind of corruption.

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Bidoof posted...
PrivateBiscuit1 posted...
James K. Polk

Polk is a favorite of mine. Came in with clearly stated goals and left having accomplished everything he set out to do.

Then he died two months later like a boss, knowing he did what he needed to do

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red sox 777 posted...
So basically, Buchanan and Johnson were too nice to the South? And Buchanan didn't make the Civil War a certainty, Lincoln did. As for Harding, sure he was corrupt, but presidents can do a lot more damage to the country than that kind of corruption.

No, Buchanan sat on his hands instead of trying to mollify what almost destroyed our country. And Johnson completely f***ed up Lincoln's plan for Reconstruction, which essentially allowed racial discrimination, lynching, and injustice to reign there until the 1960's.

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Of course he is better then one of the only men in history to ever be offered a dictatorship and turned it down, stating it wasn't the right thing to do. Nah, that guy would be far worse


>_>

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To be fair to Johnson, what he did was a reaction to Congress being ridiculous and wanting to implement martial law in the South, among other things. They had it coming

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No, Buchanan sat on his hands instead of trying to mollify what almost destroyed our country. And Johnson completely f***ed up Lincoln's plan for Reconstruction, which essentially allowed racial discrimination, lynching, and injustice to reign there until the 1960's

If Buchanan's goal was keeping the Union together, then he did a terrible job, yes. But if he was content to let the South walk away if it so chose, then his actions fit his goal pretty well too. When Lincoln became president, he could have kept the Upper South states in the Union and averted a war simply by not going to war. Instead he decided on war, and ordered those states to provide soldiers for the Union, at which point they seceded too. I'm not going to categorize either of them as worst president ever or close to it based on those decisions.

Johnson's plan seemed closer to Lincoln's than that of the Radical Republicans. Only he didn't have Lincoln's political capital, so he couldn't get anything done well. And the blame for civil rights making no progress in the South from 1876 to the 1960s cannot be put on Johnson or the Radical Republicans or even the 1870s Democrats alone. A transition from slavery to full equality in just a few years was not very realistic. There was almost a century after Reconstruction when further changes should have been made, and were not.

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Buchanan didn't have any plan, "let the Confederacy go" or otherwise. He was an idiot in a bad situation who simply did nothing for long enough for someone to replace him, and his doing nothing caused things to get worse than they had to be.

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red sox 777 posted...
If Buchanan's goal was keeping the Union together, then he did a terrible job, yes. But if he was content to let the South walk away if it so chose, then his actions fit his goal pretty well too. When Lincoln became president, he could have kept the Upper South states in the Union and averted a war simply by not going to war. Instead he decided on war, and ordered those states to provide soldiers for the Union, at which point they seceded too. I'm not going to categorize either of them as worst president ever or close to it based on those decisions.

Are you for real right now?

So because Buchanan's goal wasn't to preserve the union (which is in the f***ing OATH OF OFFICE), he was not a bad president? When I become president I am going to state that my goal is to sink the military and then order my generals to nuke the Pentagon. That way I will become the greatest president ever in your mind because I succeeded in my goals.

Johnson's plan seemed closer to Lincoln's than that of the Radical Republicans. Only he didn't have Lincoln's political capital, so he couldn't get anything done well. And the blame for civil rights making no progress in the South from 1876 to the 1960s cannot be put on Johnson or the Radical Republicans or even the 1870s Democrats alone. A transition from slavery to full equality in just a few years was not very realistic. There was almost a century after Reconstruction when further changes should have been made, and were not.

Yeah, no kidding. But the time to set a precedent was immediately after the war when the North had all the power.

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Bidoof posted...
red sox 777 posted...
*Waits for Smuffin to arrive and denounce Woodrow Wilson as the worst president*

Wilson can't be the worst president. We still have Warren G. Harding, James Buchanan, Andrew Johnson, Franklin Pierce, and all of the Whig presidents.

People really overlook just how wretched most of the presidents were in the mid-1800s with, like, one notable exception (James K. Polk).

James K. Polk is the greatest president of all time. Damn skippy.

Are you for real right now?

So because Buchanan's goal wasn't to preserve the union (which is in the f***ing OATH OF OFFICE), he was not a bad president? When I become president I am going to state that my goal is to sink the military and then order my generals to nuke the Pentagon. That way I will become the greatest president ever in your mind because I succeeded in my goals.

To uphold the Constitution of the United States. In 1860, it was an open question whether that allowed for secession or not.

Yeah, no kidding. But the time to set a precedent was immediately after the war when the North had all the power.

Which makes Johnson an ineffective president, but doesn't make a strong argument for worst ever.

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