Poll of the Day > why is transracial considered to not be ok, while transgender is fine?

(+) Yeah! (+)

http://www.mirror.co.uk/tv/tv-news/rachel-dolezal-causes-outrage-claiming-10119295

i'm actually completely curious as what you all think about this, ok?

i'll keep my opinions out for now, but please let me know yours. no judgements, ok?
---

That is actually kind of interesting... I think it's because races, or at least what defines them outside of appearance, are manmade. If you did a massive child exchange, the babies would adapt to their parents and surroundings. Male and female brain functions are unique to themselves and you're born with one or the other, generally speaking.
---

Transracial (or any other trans unrelated to gender) is a mental illness, transgender is a natural thing.
---

Hop103 posted...

Transracial (or any other trans unrelated to gender) is a mental illness, transgender is a natural thing.

mind explaining further?
---

Because it implies that you think the color of your skin should affect the way you act and live your life.

Which is kinda racist.

Only race is the human race.
---

FourthDimension posted...

Being it implies that you think the color of your skin should affect the way you act and live your life.

Which is kinda racist.

would it be considered to sexist on the other shoe? especially with the big push for 'gender equality' these days?
---

It looks like Ziggi is trying to get himself suspended again.

You would think a grown man would fucking learn at some point that baiting people to talk shit about minority groups is frowned upon here.
---

Do you believe gender roles exist in society?
---

Doctor Foxx posted...

Do you believe gender roles exist in society?

Of course they do. They're defined by society. People have expectations of how people of certain genders should act.
---

Erik_P posted...

It looks like Ziggi is trying to get himself suspended again.

You would think a grown man would fucking learn at some point that baiting people to talk shit about minority groups is frowned upon here.

if you keep harassing me, i will mark you. you have been warned. please play nice, erik, ok?
---

This shouldn't be as important as people want it to be. Your "race" doesn't matter in how live.

BTW, I almost stopped reading at "...women causes outrage."
---

Zareth posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

Do you believe gender roles exist in society?

Of course they do. They're defined by society. People have expectations of how people of certain genders should act.

Do you believe racial roles exist in society?
---

Shut the fuck up Ziggi and get a job.

I can't wait for Ziggi's suspension. He never learns.
---

Go_Totodile posted...

Shut the fuck up Ziggi and get a job.

same warning i gave erik goes for you. i'm asking you nicely to stop, ok?
---

why can't weeee be friends
---

Doctor Foxx posted...

Zareth posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

Do you believe gender roles exist in society?

Of course they do. They're defined by society. People have expectations of how people of certain genders should act.

Do you believe racial roles exist in society?

Not so much racial roles as inherent stereotypes of how people of different races act normally. They're definitely less publicly tolerated than people's perceptions of gender roles, although I suspect those will be just as derided in the near future.
---

Here are a few articles about why transracial is not a real thing, not equivalent to transgender, and is insulting:

http://www.businessinsider.com/transracial-is-not-the-same-thing-as-transgender-2015-6

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jun/12/comparison-transgender-people-rachel-dolezal

http://www.salon.com/2015/06/15/rachel_dolezal_is_not_caitlyn_jenner_race_and_gender_are_not_the_same/
---

Doctor Foxx posted...

Zareth posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

Do you believe gender roles exist in society?

Of course they do. They're defined by society. People have expectations of how people of certain genders should act.

Do you believe racial roles exist in society?

they shouldn't, but they do, in the form of public stereotypes, racism, etc.
---

The reason why transracial is considered bad is because there are certain individuals with money and political clot whose entire career depends on racial issues. If race suddenly became something you could change then these individuals would be jobless. And since it endangers their job and might make them look stupid they go out of there way to demonize people who say they're transracial.


In other words race baiting is big business.
---

ZiggiStardust posted...

FourthDimension posted...

Being it implies that you think the color of your skin should affect the way you act and live your life.

Which is kinda racist.

would it be considered to sexist on the other shoe? especially with the big push for 'gender equality' these days?

No, just the racist one. Cultures aren't really a product of nature, so you basically have to think you're a stereotype. Feeling like a male or a female (and not in a stupid "boys play sports" and "girls cook dinner" way) is out of one's control. Thought processes will be a little different at a core level. Relating to another race's interests doesn't mean you're black in a white body, it means you share values commonly held by other people who look different.
---

i'd say dismissing the question based on "my shade of grey is darker than yours" doesn't hold a lot of water, though, ok?
---

TheCyborgNinja posted...

That is actually kind of interesting... I think it's because races, or at least what defines them outside of appearance, are manmade. If you did a massive child exchange, the babies would adapt to their parents and surroundings. Male and female brain functions are unique to themselves and you're born with one or the other, generally speaking.

The same is literally true of gender as well. Neither is a thing unto itself, although there are biological differences to each with significance far greater than appearance.

Hop103 posted...

Transracial (or any other trans unrelated to gender) is a mental illness, transgender is a natural thing.

Neither is natural. If it was, it wouldn't require surgery in every instance.

Doctor Foxx posted...

Here are a few articles about why transracial is not a real thing, not equivalent to transgender, and is insulting:

http://www.businessinsider.com/transracial-is-not-the-same-thing-as-transgender-2015-6

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jun/12/comparison-transgender-people-rachel-dolezal

http://www.salon.com/2015/06/15/rachel_dolezal_is_not_caitlyn_jenner_race_and_gender_are_not_the_same/

To claim that one thing is real, you have to decry other things as not being real to give yours a greater semblance of legitimacy. Honestly, if somebody feels that they were born the wrong race, why shouldn't they be entitled to equal consideration as transgenders? The bias against it can largely be viewed as bigotry as well. After all, the outrage largely follows the same course as the reaction to transgenderism.
---

Being male or female is objectively a different thing in nature, and it's not just penises and vaginas, but brain function. Even if some wires get crossed here and there, this is still true.

Cultural development (IE: what makes a race feel different from other races) is learned rather than an instinct. Saying otherwise is ridiculous and that's what makes "transracial" not a thing. At best, you could argue a white American adopting a black baby from Africa may cause the child to feel it relates better to white people, but it's not magically white now.
---

Why can't I wear makeup and a dress and ALSO identify as male?
---

Hop103 posted...

Transracial (or any other trans unrelated to gender) is a mental illness, transgender is a natural thing.

bigot
---

TheCyborgNinja posted...

Being male or female is objectively a different thing in nature, and it's not just penises and vaginas, but brain function. Even if some wires get crossed here and there, this is still true.

Cultural development (IE: what makes a race feel different from other races) is learned rather than an instinct. Saying otherwise is ridiculous and that's what makes "transracial" not a thing. At best, you could argue a white American adopting a black baby from Africa may cause the child to feel it relates better to white people, but it's not magically white now.

Being a different race is also objectively a thing in nature... However, the entire cultural development argument is complete bullshit because culture is transferred by nation rather than just race. An Asian born in America doesn't just magically have the culture of his nationality and, if he went back to his nation, he'd likely find himself out of place. Race doesn't even automatically give you language, which is the cornerstone of culture.

Trying to correlate race and culture is complete hogwash. It's a matter of wrongly conflating race with nationality. More importantly, you've also gone so far as to also conflate biological sex with somewhat imposed gender roles, because some men will inherently have a more nurturing capacity than women while some women lack that capacity altogether (Jen being one apparent example). Having certain mental traits doesn't inherently make somebody more a man or a woman.
---

TyVulpine posted...

Only race is the human race.

/eyeroll
---

Krazy_Kirby posted...

TyVulpine posted...

Only race is the human race.

/eyeroll

Cabbage is a race
---

TheCyborgNinja posted...

Being male or female is objectively a different thing in nature, and it's not just penises and vaginas, but brain function. Even if some wires get crossed here and there, this is still true.

There are differences between races too (note tall black basketball players), but you've been conditioned to ignore it because race issues are still a sore subject.
---

Doctor Foxx posted...

Do you believe gender roles exist in society?

No because gender is a social construct
---

Smarkil posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

Do you believe gender roles exist in society?

No because gender is a social construct

Which one is gender and which one is sex?
---

Lokarin posted...

Smarkil posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

Do you believe gender roles exist in society?

No because gender is a social construct

Which one is gender and which one is sex?

I...I don't know. I watched the Bill Nye show and now I'm just confused.
---

It depends on who you ask. If you ask someone with a social or political agenda, they will likely choose one or the other. Ie whatever pushes their specific political and social agenda. If you ask me .... I personally don't care what you identify as, as long as you aren't a complete dick about it.
---

Have you guys truly not learned from before? Is Ziggi leaving for a few months really all it takes for you guys to forget he's just trolling? Why are so many taking him seriously?

I take everything seriously!
---

Go_Totodile posted...

Have you guys truly not learned from before? Is Ziggi leaving for a few months really all it takes for you guys to forget he's just trolling? Why are so many taking him seriously?

this is your second warning. please stop, ok?
---

ZiggiStardust posted...

Go_Totodile posted...

Have you guys truly not learned from before? Is Ziggi leaving for a few months really all it takes for you guys to forget he's just trolling? Why are so many taking him seriously?

this is your second warning. please stop, ok?

Warning about what? I don't think reminding people you're a sad little troll is a moddable offense.
---

if that's true, how would you respond to what she says here:

"I think that 'trans-black' does suggest born under a different category but having an identity with the black community.

"In America there's a sharp line between black and white and I'm not neutral, I find myself on the black side of all of those issues."
---

I don't care what anybody wants to identify themselves as. To claim it's okay to personally identify as one thing but not okay to personally identify as another would be hypocritical.

However, I don't think anybody deserves extra rights because of what they personally identify as.
---

Gender, as opposed to sex, is performative. Race is just your skin color.
---

KroganCharr posted...

Gender, as opposed to sex, is performative. Race is just your skin color.

THAT actually is racist, skin colour is not important!
---

skin colour is clearly important otherwise there would be no racism
---

Lokarin posted...

KroganCharr posted...

Gender, as opposed to sex, is performative. Race is just your skin color.

THAT actually is racist, skin colour is not important!

Um, what? Where did I say it was?
---

Race dysphoria is a made up disorder while gender dysphoria isn't. "Race dysphorics" are dunces who live on another planet and should be treated as such. Pretty simple really.

Hop103 posted...

Transracial (or any other trans unrelated to gender) is a mental illness, transgender is a natural thing.

Sure, stretching the word natural though.

There's an ignore list Ziggi. If you're getting that butt hurt I suggest you use it. Otherwise shut the fuck up.

I dont think they are different, someday it will be normalized
---

jamieyello3 posted...

Race dysphoria is a made up disorder

Citation needed.
---

Kyuubi4269 posted...

jamieyello3 posted...

Race dysphoria is a made up disorder

Citation needed.

Can't prove a negative
---