Current Events > What makes The Joker a powerful villian?

(+) Yeah! (+)

He has no super powers correct? And it's not like he has martial arts training like batman either?
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He has the power of not giving a single fuck.
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He is popular. Thats his power.
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He's got plot armor second only to Batman.
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he feels no pain. at least that's my theory. or he just doesn't care cause he is so crazy

hockeybub89 posted...

He has the power of not giving a single fuck.

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The writers.
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The extremes he is willing to go through and the fact that he has no limit to his cruelty. There are more powerful and dangerous villains sure, but they have some lines they don't cross and aren't as cruel and sadistic as The Joker.

-runs a powerful criminal enterprise/gang
-good at plotting
-Better at fighting than he appears
-Master of sleight of hand
-Genuinely Unpredictable
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Joker simply knows how to "get" to people. That's his biggest strength, alongside his controlled insanity.
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Why doesn't batman just page Flash or Superman to come put his antics to rest in a matter of seconds whenever he's out of prison again

I thought he was a genius lmao
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Zikten posted...

he feels no pain. at least that's my theory. or he just doesn't care cause he is so crazy

I'm going with the crazy thing. I think he actually got killed and revived at one point and captured the Bat family to make them eat their own faces as revenge.
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I vaguely remember a quote from some comic writer - maybe Alex Ross in his art book - that he's immortal. Dunno how valid that is, though it kind of would fall in line with his vampiric look.

What I always liked about the Joker was the fact that he didn't have any obvious superpowers, or was even that good of a fighter. He has his dark comedy, his immense homicidal cruelty, his schemes, and his army of thugs; that's it. It was always very satisfying for me in the first Batman movie or TAS when Batman would finally fight through Joker's traps and henchmen and plant that one sweet punch that would send Joker flying, because you could always see that 'oh shit' realization on the Joker's face when he remembers he doesn't stand a chance in hell of going toe-to-toe with Bats.

This is part of the reason that, for me, the big Joker fight in Arkham Asylum was kind of a letdown, and the big Joker fight in Arkham City was so satisfying: tacking on a Joker-hulk felt a bit bland and out-of-character, whereas the big melee played out exactly how I felt a fight with the Joker should. Sure, it was annoying getting ganged up on by a sea of henchmen, but that just made it that much sweeter when you got to cut through them and start whooping Joker's punk ass.
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Joker definitely has plot armor. Guy could be just assasinated by rival criminal with a sniper rifle, or just any gun.
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pos
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Iirc New 52 joker was joined at being immortal, but most of his powers have been revealed as being the perfect person to fuck with Batman
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Immense amounts of plot armor

He basically isn't allowed to do anything wrong until the end of the movie/game/whatever
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I don't see why Batman just don't simply snap the Jokers neck like how James Bond would.
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PrettyBoyFloyd posted...

I don't see why Batman just don't simply snap the Jokers neck like how James Bond would.

He deep down inside wants more innocent people to die just like how his parents did.
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His one opponent is a loser that refuses to kill/severely injure.

Go_Totodile posted...

His one opponent is a loser that refuses to kill/severely injure.

@Go_Totodile lmao not true
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Go_Totodile posted...

His one opponent is a loser that refuses to kill/severely injure.

Oh he'll have no issue with severely injuring someone. As long as it's not fatal he doesn't care.
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The problem is Batman is a puss and won't use excessive violence on him.
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I think his biggest strength is his unpredictability and, in a weird way, his complete lack of powers. The old Batman/Superman animated series crossover (as well as his appearance in the first Legion of Doom-esque team-up in Justice League) showed this off well. In the crossover, he nearly kills both Superman and Lois because Superman didn't take him seriously and tried to deal with him like a normal criminal. So when the Joker throws down a bag full of marbles, Supe's not really expecting them to be grenades.
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MangaFan462 posted...

The problem is Batman is a puss and won't use excessive violence on him.

That's the ultimate joke though. The Joker wants to push Batman so far that he will kill him. But it has to be elaborate and stylish or it isn't funny.
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This is one thing that the Nolan film did best: Joker is powerful in TDK because he's the only person with absolutely nothing to lose. He's an incorruptible agent of chaos.
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Calling the joker crazy is a disservice

He's probably among the smartest people in DC

The mans the walking embodiment of chaos

Everything he does has to be treated as a Major threat wether or not he's serious
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What makes The Joker a powerful villian?

As Batman's primary arch-nemesis, Joker has the same reality-dodging plot armor gimmick. Instead of "time to plan", any time Joker is off panel he can reappear with some ridiculous troll attempt of out nowhere. That's how he is written, to contrast with Batman.
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batman enabling him

unpredictability
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pegusus123456 posted...

I think his biggest strength is his unpredictability and, in a weird way, his complete lack of powers. The old Batman/Superman animated series crossover (as well as his appearance in the first Legion of Doom-esque team-up in Justice League) showed this off well. In the crossover, he nearly kills both Superman and Lois because Superman didn't take him seriously and tried to deal with him like a normal criminal. So when the Joker throws down a bag full of marbles, Supe's not really expecting them to be grenades.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sKSmFtYZ0k

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBKQHDYOgno
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solid_snake666 posted...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBKQHDYOgno

Best line is the last one huehuehue~.
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The fact he is so insane it looped back to make him a genius.
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He really shouldn't be. One of the things I liked most about Batman, The Animated Series was that it treated villains according to how much of a threat they'd logically be rather than respecting their status. The more famous adversaries had more appearances -- with the notable exception of The Riddler whom they rarely featured due to the difficulty of coming up with riddles -- but the threat the posed was based entirely around what type of threat they'd logically be. Penguin was a jobber and Batman could only beat Clayface by the skin of his teeth. Joker was a B+ threat on his best day and a flat C on his worst.

I like that approach a lot more than having a world full of demons, monsters, ninjas, mafioso, etc., and treating a clown like the greatest threat that Batman has ever had because, gasp!, he thinks on his feet instead of having a predictable pattern. It is just so forced when they try to make Joker the man to beat.

Patty_Fleur posted...

He has no super powers correct?

Neither does his archnemesis.

Patty_Fleur posted...

And it's not like he has martial arts training like batman either?

It depends on the writer; sometimes he is a capable hand-to-hand combatant. However, most of the time, his plans hinge on not fighting Batman directly. He likes taking hostages, setting bombs, giving Batman ultimatums, etc. The reason he is dangerous is because he is incredibly unpredictable and doesn't really ever have the same goal. Sometimes, he wants to murder a classroom full of boy scouts, other times, he just wants to make Batman crack a smile.

Slayerblade11 posted...

There are more powerful and dangerous villains sure, but they have some lines they don't cross and aren't as cruel and sadistic as The Joker.

Even the Joker has certain lines he won't cross.

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You know, I hated the second Christopher Nolan batman movie. I mean how did a crazy person with a Glasgow smile and dumb ass make up get a bomb in a ship and a hospital, never mind all the other places. I get that he can manipulate people but that was just too much

I think the movie was only successful because Ledger died before the movie released. I mean, RIP bit let's be real, the movie was mediocre and made no sense
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awesome999 posted...

You know, I hated the second Christopher Nolan batman movie. I mean how did a crazy person with a Glasgow smile and dumb ass make up get a bomb in a ship and a hospital, never mind all the other places. I get that he can manipulate people but that was just too much

I think the movie was only successful because Ledger died before the movie released. I mean, RIP bit let's be real, the movie was mediocre and made no sense

There is some stuff implied that he might have been a special forces guy that snapped.
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Mai wife Junko reminds me a lot of him.

We're basically just Harley & Joker but complete role reversal.


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Skye Reynolds posted...

He really shouldn't be. One of the things I liked most about Batman, The Animated Series was that it treated villains according to how much of a threat they'd logically be rather than respecting their status. The more famous adversaries had more appearances -- with the notable exception of The Riddler whom they rarely featured due to the difficulty of coming up with riddles -- but the threat the posed was based entirely around what type of threat they'd logically be. Penguin was a jobber and Batman could only beat Clayface by the skin of his teeth. Joker was a B+ threat on his best day and a flat C on his worst.

I like that approach a lot more than having a world full of demons, monsters, ninjas, mafioso, etc., and treating a clown like the greatest threat that Batman has ever had because, gasp!, he thinks on his feet instead of having a predictable pattern. It is just so forced when they try to make Joker the man to beat.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86MO-JWTNjo
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awesome999 posted...

You know, I hated the second Christopher Nolan batman movie. I mean how did a crazy person with a Glasgow smile and dumb ass make up get a bomb in a ship and a hospital, never mind all the other places. I get that he can manipulate people but that was just too much

I think the movie was only successful because Ledger died before the movie released. I mean, RIP bit let's be real, the movie was mediocre and made no sense

I'm not gonna go as far as to diminish Ledger's performance, which carried the movie and was rightfully acclaimed. But yes, in a flick that became such a success because of how real and grounded it felt compared to most superhero movies, the Joker's schemes in TDK were highly implausible. They also rob him of any credibility as far as his whole 'do I really look like a guy with a plan' schtick, because every little action and set-piece he creates would have required a mind-boggling amount of logistics and pre-planning. Which is actually fine by me, because I always saw the character (at least in TDK) as a one-dimensional liar who has zero conviction in anything he says, and would say and do anything just to keep the chaos going.
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Zack_Attackv1 posted...

Skye Reynolds posted...

He really shouldn't be. One of the things I liked most about Batman, The Animated Series was that it treated villains according to how much of a threat they'd logically be rather than respecting their status. The more famous adversaries had more appearances -- with the notable exception of The Riddler whom they rarely featured due to the difficulty of coming up with riddles -- but the threat the posed was based entirely around what type of threat they'd logically be. Penguin was a jobber and Batman could only beat Clayface by the skin of his teeth. Joker was a B+ threat on his best day and a flat C on his worst.

I like that approach a lot more than having a world full of demons, monsters, ninjas, mafioso, etc., and treating a clown like the greatest threat that Batman has ever had because, gasp!, he thinks on his feet instead of having a predictable pattern. It is just so forced when they try to make Joker the man to beat.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86MO-JWTNjo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wxz_2EdkGCE

masterpug53 posted...

They also rob him of any credibility as far as his whole 'do I really look like a guy with a plan' schtick, because every little action and set-piece he creates would have required a mind-boggling amount of logistics and pre-planning.

I am pretty sure he was talking about the big picture. He had plans, but he didn't have an endgame. He was just about the chaos.
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Hash-Brown posted...

There is some stuff implied that he might have been a special forces guy that snapped.

I doubt someone whose father abused him so much and cut his mouth would make it so far as the special forces. Even if he did, can special forces do so much as put a bomb on a ship?

masterpug53 posted...

I'm not gonna go as far as to diminish Ledger's performance, which carried the movie and was rightfully acclaimed. But yes, in a flick that became such a success because of how real and grounded it felt compared to most superhero movies, the Joker's schemes in TDK were highly implausible. They also rob him of any credibility as far as his whole 'do I really look like a guy with a plan' schtick, because every little action and set-piece he creates would have required a mind-boggling amount of logistics and pre-planning. Which is actually fine by me, because I always saw the character (at least in TDK) as a one-dimensional liar who has zero conviction in anything he says, and would say and do anything just to keep the chaos going.

Preach. The movie was mediocre, the plot was mediocre but Ledger's performance was out of this world
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Now, now, no sore losers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfiBsDZbx6E
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Come to think of it, I think I hate superhero movie that critics absolutely adore. I hated days of future past too
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awesome999 posted...

I doubt someone whose father abused him so much and cut his mouth would make it so far as the special forces.

Did you miss that he told two or three different versions of that story, thus indicating that he's just bullshitting about that?
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Why are people surprised about him plant the bombs?

He could have someone else do it, and when he shoots at the mayor, literally no one notices, or questions him being an officer when he doesn't wear his make up.
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carpediempimp posted...

Calling the joker crazy is a disservice

He's probably among the smartest people in DC

The mans the walking embodiment of chaos

Everything he does has to be treated as a Major threat wether or not he's serious

http://i.imgur.com/qwg0kgz?r
LMAO
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gf7Tbt9ewY8
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