Current Events > Fire Emblem Echoes is freaking incredible

(+) Yeah! (+)

Oh my god I'm so freaking in love with this game. Like it just hits all the right spots for me. The storytelling is impeccable. There this very nicely paced VN style storytelling with SMT4-esque NPC and other character expositions and characterizations. The game rewards you for going back and talking to people. The support conversations happen in the field again, but they make a lot of sense, and surprise, just because they fight together, they aren't automatically friends.

Also it benefits a lot from having a base of the story already written. They simply just have to expand upon everything else and make the story more modern and polished. Alm and Celica are freaking adorable together, and even at the end of Act 2 where they realize they have differences was done so freaking well, I was just freaking OUT MAAAAN

Seriously I'm freaking out. This game is so good.

The battle system is something that was in big contention. The reviews either tend to really love it or really hate it. I think it's good. It requires a more role based strategy. You guard your long ranged guys with units like Alm or Celica able to be both. Just beef the fuck out of one unit defense wise, put him in a good terrain, send the rest to destroy. Mages have a very good risk vs reward balance about them, and you NEED them because magic ignore terrains, which add freaking 20~60 evade. But physical units also have various weapon skills that let them ignore parts of terrain. You'll never have felt that happy to have found an iron sword. Also, I've not needed to grind so far, but they make it easy to do so

This game is terrific. Two things that some reviews pointed out: There are no custom pairings, which means most supports are not romantically charged, just a means to expand on their characteristics. No weapon triangle, but that means you don't get bullshit map design that somehow expects one unit in a choke point to be able to deal with every weapon type in the fucking game like a few maps in Fates did.

And yes, Act 2 of Celica has too much water. 7.8/10 IGN is still memeing this game so hard. But despite the fights happening in very similar scenarios, there are 2 giant parts of the game that are not on boats to balancing things out. And the boat maps aren't really all that bad either, since mages benefit from sides of the boats acting as walls
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I've heard it's good
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That's encouraging. I'll probably pick it up next week or so.
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Are the waifus good?
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I was hoping to beat Fates before this game came out, but life took over. Oh well, I may pick it up anyways.
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Turbam posted...

Are the waifus good?

Yeah if you want your waifus, they're all there. They're not pandering whatsoever, and there's no dating sim mechanic to evoke gross self-inserts. I might be wrong about the pairing endings though. I did hear Alm and Celica are no longer strictly canon... which disgusts me. As much as I love Clair or Faye, Celica just is like miles better for Alm, and most of the story revolves around their relationship so...
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Slaya4 posted...

I was hoping to beat Fates before this game came out, but life took over. Oh well, I may pick it up anyways.

Yeah... you might wanna just play this one. I love Fates for its very great base FE gameplay and map design, but Echoes just feels better
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Definitely want to pick this up, but it's probably going to be a while sadly. New Guilty Gear and (imported, more than likely) Under Night take priority.
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I feel like there are like no unlikable characters in this game. Jesse I thought I wouldn't like based on the design, but yeah he's funny as hell, and his side story with Slique is pretty touching and hilarious as well. Seriously, I'm freaking loving all the character driven storytelling
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Thats good to hear

Fire Emblem Heroes has really made me want to play a new Fire Emblem game
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legendarylemur posted...

They're not pandering whatsoever, and there's no dating sim mechanic to evoke gross self-inserts.

Oh really? Interesting. I couldn't get in to Awakening or Fates because of that shit, but maybe this could help the series recover
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DarkChozoGhost posted...

legendarylemur posted...

They're not pandering whatsoever, and there's no dating sim mechanic to evoke gross self-inserts.

Oh really? Interesting. I couldn't get in to Awakening or Fates because of that shit, but maybe this could help the series recover

It's a remake of a game that was never released in the US. I wouldn't say this is a good indicator of whether or not the series will continue to have avatars.

Now if Echoes does well, we might see more remakes of older fire emblem games that the US audience never got to experience.
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The negative critic reviews infuriate me... I mean this kind of game should be praised. It does so many things right in this sandbox-centric game culture. It's honestly a really good game, and I literally pretty much got anybody I know IRL to buy this game XP. They all enjoy it as much as I do, and we're talking some serious strats.

I feel like I didn't really make the most perfect choices in villager promotions but... eh I'm not bothered
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Look, I like Fates, but seriously, just skip it and go to Echoes. It's reeeeeally good. I had my doubts, but I think this is a game everybody can enjoy.

I can see where reviewers faltered though. But... the solution is to just use the gay archer and kill everything lul.

There's one where you invade an archer infested fortress, but yeah, I can see where some lesser players would have trouble with it. But just spam the hell out of Leon. He's legit one of the best characters in Celica route.
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Shadows of Valentia has some really awful maps design wise. Large open maps with a lot of empty space.
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Yeah the maps aren't great, but boy does castle sieging actually legitimately feel like castle sieging. And the goddamn quantity of units you get to control. It's more like an army vs army than the other 3DS titles which were smaller core unit skirmishes.

In such sense, I really don't think the bad map design hurts this game. Awakening had even worse map design and a gameplay that wasn't built around it
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~8 is not negative by any means. You seem to be exaggerating a bit there lol.

But this topic was very informative so thanks for that TC. I pre ordered the LE as soon as it went up, but I cancelled it about two weeks ago after realizing I wasn't even hyped for Echoes anymore after how much of a departure it sounds like it is from prior games. FE is one of my favorite series of all time, but I'm still left unsure.

How many other FE games have you played TC?
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Terra-enforcer posted...

~8 is not negative by any means. You seem to be exaggerating a bit there lol.

But this topic was very informative so thanks for that TC. I pre ordered the LE as soon as it went up, but I cancelled it about two weeks ago after realizing I wasn't even hyped for Echoes anymore after how much of a departure it sounds like it is from prior games. FE is one of my favorite series of all time, but I'm still left unsure.

How many other FE games have you played TC?

I've played all the GBA ones, including FE6, Radiant Dawn (yeah but not the GC one...), and all the 3DS ones. I've also seen Shadow Dragons, not even gonna dive into that one.

8 is not negative. But ones people read the most gave it horrible reviews. Especially that view grubbing site Polygon... and that review in particular (6.5/10) now I know is just a bad gamer blaming the game for his own problems. I think other sites had almost legitimate complaints, but I don't agree with the replayability complaints.

I totally get why some would complain about the super hard castle sieges tho lols... cuz yeah they are hard if you're not doing patient strats
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Interesting. Aside from FE6 you sound like you're in the same boat as me (even to the point of only playing RD but not PoR) so I may give it a shot.

But my backlog is pretty hefty as is anyway so I might just get it pre owned sometime down the line. ARMS is coming out soon and I have that pre ordered, and I just got Injustice 2, so between those then eventually Splatoon hopefully I'll be able to find it for cheaper somewhere.
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Yeah I got a lot of games coming as well (includes ARMS and Splatwo). And because of my friend, I got super peer pressure into getting Disgaea 5... so I have no fucking clue how I'm making time for that.

Oh, but Echoes is super non-RNG based (even skills are just selectable rather than activating on a random chance), and Mila's Gear let's you save scum... so yeah it's actually not a time consuming game. I'd wager you can beat it in less than a dedicated week.
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legendarylemur posted...

even skills are just selectable rather than activating on a random chance

W-what? No joke? Wow how did I not hear about this? I need to do some more research into this game.

Is that a first? The closest I can remember is the Shove action in prior games.

Also how does the lack of a weapon triangle feel?
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legendarylemur posted...

so I have no fucking clue how I'm making time for that.

You wont, you will play 1-2 maps a day a week if lucky, then eventually you will find yourself sucked into grinding multiple characters to level 9999 and wondering where your life went wrong.
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I'm beating Fates DLC and the last chapters of Revelation before starting it. Got my limited edition on Friday :D
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Terra-enforcer posted...

legendarylemur posted...

even skills are just selectable rather than activating on a random chance

W-what? No joke? Wow how did I not hear about this? I need to do some more research into this game.

Is that a first? The closest I can remember is the Shove action in prior games.

Also how does the lack of a weapon triangle feel?

It's ultimately less frustrating. Some stuff in Fates would require you to have a unit that can pretty much counter all three triangles by itself because the map would be designed so that more than 5 units can attack a single unit on a choke point. In here, you can actually have units that can physically tank anything by themselves. They can falter against magic, but it ends up being a lot easier to have a situation where you can tank safely at a 100% rate, whereas Fates, a unit surviving a big choke point would boil down to certain %. Not having pair ups also gets rid of a lot of volatility. It's also made up by having your long ranged units get 3+ ranges, which ends up feeling like a superior pair up. If you think the range is broken, the single ranged units have far better stats to compensate, and both sides have access to big ranges, so it ends up also being balanced. It's much better thought out than the reviews implied
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ryuma in birthright is the best tank in the series. nothing can touch him especially during pair up
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Ryoma in Birthright Lunatic loses to Ninjas actually. Poison Strikes, debuffs, and not always being able to double will definitely kill him. In Conquest Lunatic, Effie and Xander can both tank most things, but they can also die, and Xander gets doubled. Effie hilariously almost always has more speed than Xander, except very biased class match ups
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Aren't fire emblem 4 and 5 the only ones missing from a us release?
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Tadamoto12 posted...

Aren't fire emblem 4 and 5 the only ones missing from a us release?

FE3 and 6, too, but we're definitely never ever getting FE3.
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Tadamoto12 posted...

Aren't fire emblem 4 and 5 the only ones missing from a us release?

Thraccia 776, Genealogy of Holy War, and Binding Blade are pretty much the only ones that haven't been released in North America. Those are the SNES ones, and I want to play them. Hopefully they got a North American release at some point.
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Hmm. I played the fan translation of fire emblem 6 for gba. It was really good. I actually forgot it wasn't an official release. Didn't fire emblem 3 get remade as fire emblem 12 for DS? I played the translation of that one too. Once again, it was so good, that it felt like an official release.
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As far as I know, the first Fire Emblem game got remade as Fire Emblem Shadow Dragon for the DS. I don't recall Fire Emblem 3 getting a North American port and release. FE6 was Binding Blade. It got a GBA port?
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Hmm. I thought the gba version of FE6 was the only version. Did it come out for snes as well? Fire emblem 3 never got a North American release. Neither did 12. Which was a remake of 3. I don't understand why 12 didn't get released in US. Since it's a direct sequel to 11 (shadow dragon). Which was released in the US
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play one srpg, you've played them all.
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Found them

http://fireemblem.wikia.com/wiki/Fire_Emblem:_The_Binding_Blade

http://fireemblem.wikia.com/wiki/Fire_Emblem:_New_Mystery_of_the_Emblem
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Yeah those are FE3 and FE6. FE3 is FE12, which we will never get. FE6 has a chance of getting a remake, but most likely we'll get FE7 and then FE6, because... I mean there's no real reason to reverse the order again. If they're feeling risky, maybe they'll make it one game, though I think the quality might suffer
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I miss when Fire Emblem was good, and not some weird, casual baby's first Nintento RPG thing.

Not to mention its become some extremely off putting, waifu rapey sim.

Eliwood & FE7 ftw. Ike & FE 9&10 ftw.

In terms of NA releaes, thats all that matters.
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I finished the first act and one thing I do enjoy about the game is that it feels far more cohesive, from the dialogue to the gameplay, to how skills and other gameplay mechanics are implemented to even the supports taking place on the field and being aware that they're in the middle of a battlefield.

One thing that sort of irked me in Fates was that when I'm playing Conquest, I could reclass into a traditional Hoshido class. It doesn't make sense that someone of the Nohrian army would have the garb and look of a Hoshido soldier. But it was a good gameplay element so I couldn't complain. In Echoes, what really impressed me was that in your hometown, you would find remnants that subtly hint at what your recruitable friends would be proficient at. Like you'd see scorch marks and Alm would think to himself "Oh, Kliff must have messed up a spell here" or you'd see arrows and he'd remark "Oh, he must have been practicing again". I'm an absolute sucker for seeing these gameplay elements pop up as story elements even if they're little details so I already hold this game in high regards.

Terra-enforcer posted...

~8 is not negative by any means. You seem to be exaggerating a bit there lol.

It's an issue when we want Echoes to succeed and be more successful than Awakening or Fates to prove a point to IS that this is the direction FE should go.
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ArtVandelay posted...

I miss when Fire Emblem was good, and not some weird, casual baby's first Nintento RPG thing.

Not to mention its become some extremely off putting, waifu rapey sim.

Eliwood & FE7 ftw. Ike & FE 9&10 ftw.

In terms of NA releaes, thats all that matters.

Funny, because some people would call you a casual for viewing the Tellius games so highly. That's why I've never been a fan of most elitism in gaming in general. There's always someone who has to look down on "newer" or different games in the series. You can like the games you do without feeling the need to bash on the others.
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Tadamoto12 posted...

Since it's a direct sequel to 11 (shadow dragon). Which was released in the US

Because Shadow Dragon honestly kinda sucked, so they decided to not release its vastly superior sequel here.

Sad_Face posted...

I finished the first act and one thing I do enjoy about the game is that it feels far more cohesive, from the dialogue to the gameplay, to how skills and other gameplay mechanics are implemented to even the supports taking place on the field and being aware that they're in the middle of a battlefield.

One thing that sort of irked me in Fates was that when I'm playing Conquest, I could reclass into a traditional Hoshido class. It doesn't make sense that someone of the Nohrian army would have the garb and look of a Hoshido soldier. But it was a good gameplay element so I couldn't complain. In Echoes, what really impressed me was that in your hometown, you would find remnants that subtly hint at what your recruitable friends would be proficient at. Like you'd see scorch marks and Alm would think to himself "Oh, Kliff must have messed up a spell here" or you'd see arrows and he'd remark "Oh, he must have been practicing again". I'm an absolute sucker for seeing these gameplay elements pop up as story elements even if they're little details so I already hold this game in high regards.

Terra-enforcer posted...

~8 is not negative by any means. You seem to be exaggerating a bit there lol.

It's an issue when we want Echoes to succeed and be more successful than Awakening or Fates to prove a point to IS that this is the direction FE should go.

Yes, and the game keeps all that up.
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Act 3 is seriously like freaking high ass quality Fire Emblem. I mean yes, lots of open fields, but also a lot of castle sieges that require some serious brain squeezing. Saving Mathilda is probably one of the hardest freaking chapter of FE I've done in a while. I'd recommend Act 3 Celica first, so you get more cogs for that super useful and the greatest thing ever, Mila's Gear
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Only thing putting me off is the DLC prices.
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They're not necessary, but this game deserves to get more money. I heard using the superclasses are really fun as well, with the Cleric super class granting the skill to summon zombie dragons. And any expansion of such a good story and storytelling deserves a lot of attention
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legendarylemur posted...

They're not necessary, but this game deserves to get more money. I heard using the superclasses are really fun as well, with the Cleric super class granting the skill to summon zombie dragons. And any expansion of such a good story and storytelling deserves a lot of attention

I support the game getting money, but not how they handle the DLC. idk. the way I'm going about it I'll have to "redownload" all DLCs for free onto another 3DS system anyway. I might as well kill two birds with one stone and not have the "first download" part.
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Yeah you don't need to dl it yet. I think most of them are geared towards after you beat the game, except the training pack of course
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I wanted to pick it up. Still haven't finished Fates, though.

Dash_Harber posted...

I wanted to pick it up. Still haven't finished Fates, though.

Oh yeah, I downloaded all the DLC for that onto my Main system but I'm going to have to redownload them onto my "alt" system which can't access the internet.
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I wish it released on Switch too or something. I wanna be done with my 3DS. I've still gotta play Birthright and Revelations lol. I quite liked Conquest but Echoes does look to be more up my ally since I really couldn't care less about all the dating elements and children stuff. But the map design does seem like a concern. Conquest was rather tight in that way.
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I don't wanna go into too much detail, but the map designs in this game work for how the game is designed. It's meant to be more of an army vs army action rather than ultra units soloing large parts of stages. Though I suppose Alm or Celica does fill that role
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