Poll of the Day > fallout vs elder scrolls

(+) Yeah! (+)

fallout
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Hmm...

ES by far, since I prefer the setting and, to some extent, fantasy in general. Plus you can play as a catperson and a lizardperson, in addition to shit like orcs and elves.
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I've only played one game from each series

I prefer elder scrolls much more. It was really annoying to have to repair stuff so often in fallout
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Elderscrolls easy

Fallout is ok, but I can never get into them.

I will say that I do really enjoy the humor in fallout

Fallout was ok but I didn't get more than an hour or so into new vegas before I got bored (if I kept playing I'm sure I would have had fun but ehh)

Ive put hundreds of hours into Skyrim on multiple play throughs

I've only played new vegas and Skyrim
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Elder Scrolls, I like high-fantasy more than Science fiction fantasy. Also Fallout 4 sucked so there's that.
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ES is better than the Bethesda Fallout games imo.
Not sure if I can pick between the original Fallout games/NV or the ES series though...

I still need to play NV. Bought it some years ago but never got around to it.
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Fallout generic.

But w mods elder scrolls has guns so they are kind of the same game
Which is good.
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I enjoy Fallout games, but I'm just not really a fan of the post nuclear apocalypse setting.
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Cruddy_horse posted...

Elder Scrolls, I like high-fantasy more than Science fiction fantasy. Also Fallout 4 sucked so there's that.

At least they got rid of the moronic karma system this time.

I prefer fantasy so Elder Scrolls. Fallout is also good though.
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I like the style and humor of Fallout more, but I kinda wish they incorporated Elder Scrolls style of experience-based skill building. I'd much rather build up my small guns skill by shooting than by dropping points when I level up.

But I'd definitely take the classic Fallout skill mechanics over the dumbed down nonsense we got in Fallout 4.

Revelation34 posted...

At least they got rid of the moronic karma system this time.

Karma didn't necessarily need to be omitted. Just reworked.

If you're going to put a morality system in, at least utilize it properly.

Snuggletoof posted...

Revelation34 posted...

At least they got rid of the moronic karma system this time.

Karma didn't necessarily need to be omitted. Just reworked.

If you're going to put a morality system in, at least utilize it properly.

"You're an evil dude because you stole that item nobody saw you steal". It was awful.

Snuggletoof posted...

I like the style and humor of Fallout more, but I kinda wish they incorporated Elder Scrolls style of experience-based skill building. I'd much rather build up my small guns skill by shooting than by dropping points when I level up.

But I'd definitely take the classic Fallout skill mechanics over the dumbed down nonsense we got in Fallout 4.

They kinda do that with non combat abilities if I remember right. It would be awesome if they combined features from both games and put them into their next games.
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Walking around by Riften feels like an alternate version of home.
i choose Elder Scrolls.
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Revelation34 posted...

Snuggletoof posted...

Revelation34 posted...

At least they got rid of the moronic karma system this time.

Karma didn't necessarily need to be omitted. Just reworked.

If you're going to put a morality system in, at least utilize it properly.

"You're an evil dude because you stole that item nobody saw you steal". It was awful.

That's what I mean, That's too simplistic. But to be fair, stealing gives you a minuscule amount of bad karma compared to murder.

Maybe instead, bad karma gives you access to more unscrupulous perks. Someone who has no qualms with taking other peoples belongings would be the kind of person who would get better at lying and stealing. Maybe categorize different types of Good/Bad karma. Maybe you'd have Violent/Nonviolent Bad Karma, or Heroic/Altruistic Good Karma.

Snuggletoof posted...

Revelation34 posted...

Snuggletoof posted...

Revelation34 posted...

At least they got rid of the moronic karma system this time.

Karma didn't necessarily need to be omitted. Just reworked.

If you're going to put a morality system in, at least utilize it properly.

"You're an evil dude because you stole that item nobody saw you steal". It was awful.

That's what I mean, That's too simplistic. Maybe instead, bad karma gives you access to more unscrupulous perks. Someone who has no qualms with taking other peoples belongings would be the kind of person who would get better at lying and stealing. Maybe categorize different types of Good/Bad karma. Maybe you'd have Violent/Nonviolent Bad Karma, or Heroic/Altruistic Good Karma.

In The Elder Scrolls, people try to kill or arrest you for stealing a carrot. :-)
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SusanGreenEyes posted...

Walking around by Riften feels like an alternate version of home.
i choose Elder Scrolls.

Where do you live that Riften feels like home? That sounds like a wonderful place to be!

Snuggletoof posted...

SusanGreenEyes posted...

Walking around by Riften feels like an alternate version of home.
i choose Elder Scrolls.

Where do you live that Riften feels like home? That sounds like a wonderful place to be!

I don't mean that Riften is like Arizona, I mean that I feel an internal sense of being home when I visit by Riften.
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talking strictly bethesda, elder scrolls is boring as hell. fallout 3 sucked, but NV was amazing and 4 was at least fun.
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SusanGreenEyes posted...

In The Elder Scrolls, people try to kill or arrest you for stealing a carrot. :-)

*accidentally pick up someone's junk when you're trying to speak to them*

"Stop right there, criminal scum!"

SusanGreenEyes posted...

I don't mean that Riften is like Arizona, I mean that I feel an internal sense of being home when I visit by Riften.

I see. I've always liked the Rift the best, too.

Snuggletoof posted...

SusanGreenEyes posted...

I don't mean that Riften is like Arizona, I mean that I feel an internal sense of being home when I visit by Riften.

I see. I've always liked the Rift the best, too.

It's not as snowy or swampy.
Markarth is pretty too.
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I just like the Autumn colors and the birch trees. And the architecture of the city is really cool.

And I love Markarth! I just don't like dealing with the Forsworn quest in Markarth.

Snuggletoof posted...

That's what I mean, That's too simplistic. But to be fair, stealing gives you a minuscule amount of bad karma compared to murder.

Except it adds up a ton if you steal a lot of stuff.
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SusanGreenEyes posted...

Snuggletoof posted...

SusanGreenEyes posted...

I don't mean that Riften is like Arizona, I mean that I feel an internal sense of being home when I visit by Riften.

I see. I've always liked the Rift the best, too.

It's not as snowy or swampy.
Markarth is pretty too.

Markarth might be my fave for the whole cliffside theme and hidden undercity. I love the player-house there. Windhelm and Solitude are my other frontrunners for fave city.
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Snuggletoof posted...

Revelation34 posted...

Snuggletoof posted...

Revelation34 posted...

At least they got rid of the moronic karma system this time.

Karma didn't necessarily need to be omitted. Just reworked.

If you're going to put a morality system in, at least utilize it properly.

"You're an evil dude because you stole that item nobody saw you steal". It was awful.

That's what I mean, That's too simplistic. But to be fair, stealing gives you a minuscule amount of bad karma compared to murder.

Maybe instead, bad karma gives you access to more unscrupulous perks. Someone who has no qualms with taking other peoples belongings would be the kind of person who would get better at lying and stealing. Maybe categorize different types of Good/Bad karma. Maybe you'd have Violent/Nonviolent Bad Karma, or Heroic/Altruistic Good Karma.

The reputation system of New Vegas was pretty good at rectifying one problem present in the Karma system.

The Karma system is just a static meter that could go either way, with no permanent consequences of going either good or bad. You could lose loads of karma from doing bad shit and sink down to "Evil" or even "Very Evil" but then if you start to amass a crapton of karma after that then you could just work your way back up to good as if nothing bad ever happened. It might be difficult, but not impossible to just wipe the slate clean.

With the Rep system the game would actually remember the good and bad things you did to a particular factions and adjust your overall reputation accordingly. It was still somewhat simplistic but it was an improvement.

A more DnD style morality system could be cool to see in a Fallout game, though. With lawful vs unlawful, good vs evil, and neutral zones for each aspect. A morality system that actually remembers your actions rather than abiding by an arbitrary meter would also be better.
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I always enjoyed Whiterun the most, as far as Skyrim environments go.

Clean, open plains with a cool climate. SImple and serene.
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K1LL3R-J31 posted...

I always enjoyed Whiterun the most, as far as Skyrim environments go.

Clean, open plains with a cool climate. SImple and serene.

As far as towns go, Whiterun just never seemed that impressive or majestic. The same is partly true of Dawnstar, although the fact it's built around a bay was kinda neat.

I did like the entrance to Whiterun, though, which has that neat winding hill with gatehouses.
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Xfma100 posted...

ES is better than the Bethesda Fallout games imo.
Not sure if I can pick between the original Fallout games/NV or the ES series though...

This more or less sums up my view. Bethesda's Fallout games are bland dreck. But the originals were awesome, and New Vegas was great (and I'd LOVE for them to let Obsidian do a new Fallout spinoff game in the Fallout 4 engine, though I don't foresee it happening).

And I say this as someone who was never really all THAT into the Elder Scrolls as a series, because it always seemed like one of the duller WRPGs available out there. So I'm not really looking at this like one of the filthy casuals who loved Skyrim or the crusty old grognards who still obsess over how much better than everything Morrowind was/is (and for the record, I thought Morrowind was hot garbage). I'm comparing the two as someone who was always "meh" about Elder Scrolls who still thinks Oblivion, Skyrim, and even ESO are easily better than Fallout 3 or 4.


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Revelation34 posted...

"You're an evil dude because you stole that item nobody saw you steal"

I'm not defending the karma system from the FO games or anything, but on a basal level that should be how karma should work. Just because you don't get caught doing something bad doesn't mean you didn't do anything bad....

Old games or new?

Old fallout
New elderscrolls

Both got beat to death by the casual stick but fallout is basically an fps now.
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Of these series I've only played Skyrim and New Vegas, and I enjoyed Skyrim more. So had to vote TES.
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Elder Scrolls. Can definitely appreciate Fallout for what it's worth, I just prefer the fantasy and greenery to the post-apocalyptic setting.

But I think we can ALL agree Bethesda games' kids are annoying as all fuck.
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Elder Scrolls for Bethesda developed games for sure.
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Nade Duck posted...

talking strictly bethesda, elder scrolls is boring as hell. fallout 3 sucked, but NV was amazing and 4 was at least fun.

NV was Obsidian though.
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Zareth posted...

Nade Duck posted...

talking strictly bethesda, elder scrolls is boring as hell. fallout 3 sucked, but NV was amazing and 4 was at least fun.

NV was Obsidian though.

yeah, but close enough.
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green dragon posted...

I'm not defending the karma system from the FO games or anything, but on a basal level that should be how karma should work. Just because you don't get caught doing something bad doesn't mean you didn't do anything bad...

So people are supposed to automatically know you're "evil" just from looking at you?
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Skyrim.
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ParanoidObsessive posted...

And I say this as someone who was never really all THAT into the Elder Scrolls as a series, because it always seemed like one of the duller WRPGs available out there. So I'm not really looking at this like one of the filthy casuals who loved Skyrim or the crusty old grognards who still obsess over how much better than everything Morrowind was/is (and for the record, I thought Morrowind was hot garbage). I'm comparing the two as someone who was always "meh" about Elder Scrolls who still thinks Oblivion, Skyrim, and even ESO are easily better than Fallout 3 or 4.

Honestly haven't seen any franchise which compares that got a console release. And Oblivion was great, but Skyrim just seemed so much better (Morrowind I couldn't get into but I was trying it *after* going through Oblivion).
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Fantasy is my preferred gaming setting. Not the biggest fan of guns, so my choice here is obvious.

Elder Scrolls.

Revelation34 posted...

green dragon posted...

I'm not defending the karma system from the FO games or anything, but on a basal level that should be how karma should work. Just because you don't get caught doing something bad doesn't mean you didn't do anything bad...

So people are supposed to automatically know you're "evil" just from looking at you?

Karma/morality isn't supposed to be how people see you, but who you are. It's weird trying to apply that to a video game, though.

They shouldn't automatically know you're evil, but that doesn't mean you aren't evil.
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K1LL3R-J31 posted...

Revelation34 posted...

green dragon posted...

I'm not defending the karma system from the FO games or anything, but on a basal level that should be how karma should work. Just because you don't get caught doing something bad doesn't mean you didn't do anything bad...

So people are supposed to automatically know you're "evil" just from looking at you?

Karma/morality isn't supposed to be how people see you, but who you are. It's weird trying to apply that to a video game, though.

They shouldn't automatically know you're evil, but that doesn't mean you aren't evil.

Yet that's the point. They see you as a bad person when you don't do anything in front of them.
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Revelation34 posted...

Yet that's the point. They see you as a bad person when you don't do anything in front of them.

That's an even bigger problem in gaming as a whole, though. RPGs that make the world revolve around your character and build them up to be a legend. You do things, and somehow the world is supposed to hear about your exploits. It's an overly simple way of making us believe our actions have consequences.

Fallout 3 and 4 were good (haven't played NV yet), but Skyrim is better than both of them, soo
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K1LL3R-J31 posted...

Revelation34 posted...

green dragon posted...

I'm not defending the karma system from the FO games or anything, but on a basal level that should be how karma should work. Just because you don't get caught doing something bad doesn't mean you didn't do anything bad...

So people are supposed to automatically know you're "evil" just from looking at you?

Karma/morality isn't supposed to be how people see you, but who you are. It's weird trying to apply that to a video game, though.

They shouldn't automatically know you're evil, but that doesn't mean you aren't evil.

The real problem is that "karma" (as used in Fallout) shouldn't be used as a Reputation system as much as a Morality system.

Which has been a problem in a lot of other RPGs (ie, how the "Reputation" stat in Baldur's Gate was often used in place of a morality Alignment).

Ideally, if you're going to play with morality scales, there should be a separate rating for "who you really are" and "how other people see you". Which would allow for more complexity (especially if you include a [Lie] dialogue option the way Baldur's Gate and KotOR did), allowing you to, say, potentially play an evil character who pretends to be good, or a good character with a more ambivalent reputation.

By that logic, stealing would give negative morality but not negative reputation, unless someone sees you stealing.

Stealing in general is always a huge problem in most games, though. Like when they include a "stolen item" mechanic and have normal merchants unwilling to buy stolen goods. As if every merchant in the world has some unnatural magical sense to know that the most generic of items has been stolen.

Sure, it might make sense for more expensive, elaborate, or clearly unique items, but when a merchant is telling me they won't buy an apple off me because it's stolen, immersion is well and truly shot to hell.


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I only played New Vegas and Skyrim, New Vegas wins in quests, character development and RPG elements, Skyrim wins in the world (Skyrim quests are so dumb holy s***).
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