Current Events > Philando Castile Dash cam is out.

(+) Yeah! (+)

StealthRock posted...

He did ask him to not reach several times though. It wasn't conflicting

Just watched the video again. He tells him to not reach for it after he says "I have to tell you I am a legal gun owner"

He didn't say "ok, get you I.D"

Yanez said, “Okay, don't reach for it, then (THE GUN).” Castile responded, “I'm not pulling it out,” and Reynolds also said, “He's not pulling it out.” Yanez screamed, “Don't pull it out!”

Dude never said stop what you are doing don't bull anything out don't move.
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cjsdowg posted...

StealthRock posted...

He did ask him to not reach several times though. It wasn't conflicting

Just watched the video again. He tells him to not reach for it after he says "I have to tell you I am a legal gun owner"

He didn't say "ok, get you I.D"

Yanez said, “Okay, don't reach for it, then (THE GUN).” Castile responded, “I'm not pulling it out,” and Reynolds also said, “He's not pulling it out.” Yanez screamed, “Don't pull it out!”

Dude never said stop what you are doing don't bull anything out don't move.

Yea, Castile likely thought "I'm not, i'm getting my ID like you asked me to"...he's not trained in situations like that. It was high pressure, he was likely nervous...You can't expect the average citizen to act completely calm and collected and consciously break down their every move within seconds in a situation like that...we should expect that from the cops though...why people are holding Castile to a higher standard the cop is amazing to me.

The point is that Castile was not reaching for the gun. Which is what the officer told him not to reach for.

What the officer meant was "don't move". But the officer did not say "don't move". That's the fundamental issue here. Very few people, if any, are stating that the officer is a monster who really wanted to kill someone, but it was the officer who made his instructions unclear. If we are to give the officer the benefit of the doubt in such a split second decision, why would you not afford that courtesy to a citizen?

That's my problem with this, and it's relatively sad that people don't see that.
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cjsdowg posted...

StealthRock posted...

He did ask him to not reach several times though. It wasn't conflicting

Just watched the video again. He tells him to not reach for it after he says "I have to tell you I am a legal gun owner"

He didn't say "ok, get you I.D"

Yanez said, “Okay, don't reach for it, then (THE GUN).” Castile responded, “I'm not pulling it out,” and Reynolds also said, “He's not pulling it out.” Yanez screamed, “Don't pull it out!”

Dude never said stop what you are doing don't bull anything out don't move.

You're right. The office was shit and should've handled that better

In Castile's mind, he thought he was cool because he wasn't pulling out his gun. But how is the officer supposed to know that? He sees him reaching. Although he states otherwise, he could've been lying. His chick arguing with him doesn't mean a thing.

After the second, "Don't pull it out!!", he should've just stopped.

Again, not victim blaming. The cop failed to handle the situation to the point where even his partner looked visibly stunned at his reaction. The Cop should be in jail to be honest.
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AdviceMan posted...

The point is that Castile was not reaching for the gun. Which is what the officer told him not to reach for.

What the officer meant was "don't move". But the officer did not say "don't move". That's the fundamental issue here. Very few people, if any, are stating that the officer is a monster who really wanted to kill someone, but it was the officer who made his instructions unclear. If we are to give the officer the benefit of the doubt in such a split second decision, why would you not afford that courtesy to a citizen?

That's my problem with this, and it's relatively sad that people don't see that.

I don't give the cop the benefit of shit. He was a poor cop and should be legally punished for his incompetence costing someone their lives.

A doctor wouldn't get away with killing someone due to incompetence, so why does a cop?

But unfortunately Philando is not with us to defend himself.
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you cant hold trained professionals responsible for their actions when you have perfectly good civilians to blame

come on guys smh
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Mal_Fet posted...

Anyone who's outraged by this, please do me a favor: go to YouTube and search for "concealed carry police stop"

Watch one or several videos where police and other firearms experts explain how exactly to handle getting pulled over while carrying a firearm, and then go back and watch the dash cam video again.

Maybe it will change your perspective a bit.

And now a I'm still outraged because the trained professional is getting the benefit of the doubt because he was scared and the civilian didn't do the cop's job for him.

Is anyone going to address to many times different posters have asked why the onus is always put on the civilian in these encounters?

Are cops just there as executioners in case you fail at policing yourself properly?
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ClunkerSlim posted...

StealthRock posted...

After the second, "Don't pull it out!!", he should've just stopped.

I'll say it again... 7 Seconds. The whole thing went down in 7 seconds. Once Castile moved there was no time to react or change course. There was no "he should have done this." There just wasn't time. He touched his back pocket and he was dead. There was literally nothing else he could have done in that fraction of a heartbeat. If he had jerked his hand away in that fraction of a instance then he still would have been shot.

it doesnt take 7 seconds to stop moving
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StealthRock posted...

ClunkerSlim posted...

StealthRock posted...

After the second, "Don't pull it out!!", he should've just stopped.

I'll say it again... 7 Seconds. The whole thing went down in 7 seconds. Once Castile moved there was no time to react or change course. There was no "he should have done this." There just wasn't time. He touched his back pocket and he was dead. There was literally nothing else he could have done in that fraction of a heartbeat. If he had jerked his hand away in that fraction of a instance then he still would have been shot.

it doesnt take 7 seconds to stop moving

He is an untrained civilian put into a highly stressful situation. He was nervous and confused.

Wait, only police officers get to use that excuse.
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ClunkerSlim posted...

You're assuming that he didn't stop moving. We can't see Castile. He might have froze as soon as his hand was near the seat.

THe cop never said STOP MOVING.
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StealthRock posted...

ClunkerSlim posted...

StealthRock posted...

After the second, "Don't pull it out!!", he should've just stopped.

I'll say it again... 7 Seconds. The whole thing went down in 7 seconds. Once Castile moved there was no time to react or change course. There was no "he should have done this." There just wasn't time. He touched his back pocket and he was dead. There was literally nothing else he could have done in that fraction of a heartbeat. If he had jerked his hand away in that fraction of a instance then he still would have been shot.

it doesnt take 7 seconds to stop moving

There wasn't 7 seconds to stop moving. The whole time from the gun being announced to bullets flying was 7 seconds. He had a few seconds max to perform one of the limited range of actions that wouldn't result in a panicked cop with his gun already out shooting him. Even pulling his hand away could have gotten him shot. Like others have said, what the cop really wanted was for Castille to freeze completely or to put his hands on the dashboard or something.
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hockeybub89 posted...

And now a I'm still outraged because the trained professional is getting the benefit of the doubt because he was scared and the civilian didn't do the cop's job for him.

Is anyone going to address to many times different posters have asked why the onus is always put on the civilian in these encounters?

Are cops just there as executioners in case you fail at policing yourself properly?

"Why is the onus on the civilian to not reach for their gun when dealing with a police officer??"
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As someone who carried for almost ten years, anyone who thinks the cop was justified is a troll or a moron.
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A cop could shoot an innocent black man sitting on a curb minding his own business by saying to him "you're black therefore you're inherently dangerous" and you can bet your ass Mal_Fet would crawl through broken glass to find statistics of black crime to say the cop's assumption was "reasonable and justified."

That's just the kinda guy Mal_Fet is.
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Mal_Fet posted...

hockeybub89 posted...

And now a I'm still outraged because the trained professional is getting the benefit of the doubt because he was scared and the civilian didn't do the cop's job for him.

Is anyone going to address to many times different posters have asked why the onus is always put on the civilian in these encounters?

Are cops just there as executioners in case you fail at policing yourself properly?

"Why is the onus on the civilian to not reach for their gun when dealing with a police officer??"

Good thing he wasn't reaching for his gun?
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Mal_Fet posted...

hockeybub89 posted...

And now a I'm still outraged because the trained professional is getting the benefit of the doubt because he was scared and the civilian didn't do the cop's job for him.

Is anyone going to address to many times different posters have asked why the onus is always put on the civilian in these encounters?

Are cops just there as executioners in case you fail at policing yourself properly?

"Why is the onus on the civilian to not reach for their gun when dealing with a police officer??"

He didn't reach for his gun. Also, 7 seconds. Also, he isn't the professional police officer trained to handle these situations.

Why is this the one job where it is the lay person's job to control the situation ?
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shockthemonkey posted...

Mal_Fet posted...

hockeybub89 posted...

And now a I'm still outraged because the trained professional is getting the benefit of the doubt because he was scared and the civilian didn't do the cop's job for him.

Is anyone going to address to many times different posters have asked why the onus is always put on the civilian in these encounters?

Are cops just there as executioners in case you fail at policing yourself properly?

"Why is the onus on the civilian to not reach for their gun when dealing with a police officer??"

Why can't you ever acknowledge someone's actual argument? I've seen children throwing tantrums who are better at this.

Saying "the onus shouldn't be on the civilian to not behave suspiciously after revealing they have a firearm in on them in a traffic stop, the situation where most police are killed" is not an argument to be had. It is self-evidently ridiculous.
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EmeralDragon23 posted...

A cop could shoot an innocent black man sitting on a curb minding his own business by saying to him "you're black therefore you're inherently dangerous" and you can bet your ass Mal_Fet would crawl through broken glass to find statistics of black crime to say the cop's assumption was "reasonable and justified."

That's just the kinda guy Mal_Fet is.

Well I guess that guy should have known to avoid ever being seen by cops so he could never be shot by them.
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shockthemonkey posted...

"Suspiciously" as in reaching for his ID as instructed?

Suspiciously as in continuing to reach for something for 7 seconds while the officer told him to stop.

Like, did you guys seriously never get this talk when you were a kid from your parents? You know, take your key out of the ignition, turn the radio off, keep your hands on the wheel, and do what the officer says?

This was about as dumb as sticking a fork into a power outlet. Something else you should have learned not to do from your parents.
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Mal_Fet posted...

shockthemonkey posted...

"Suspiciously" as in reaching for his ID as instructed?

Suspiciously as in continuing to reach for something for 7 seconds while the officer told him to stop.

Like, did you guys seriously never get this talk when you were a kid from your parents? You know, take your key out of the ignition, turn the radio off, keep your hands on the wheel, and do what the officer says?

My parents neglected to include "Or you will be shot and killed and it will be all your fault" at the end. Also, I have screwed up the steps and not been shot because I dealt with cops that weren't incompetent fools that the force should be embarrassed to have ever handed a firearm and badge.

Do you also understand how telling people that the cops will shoot them if they fuck up might actually make people MORE nervous in police interactions?
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hockeybub89 posted...

Also, I have screwed up the steps and not been shot because I dealt with cops that weren't incompetent fools that the force should be embarrassed to have ever handed a firearm and badge.

I'm willing to bet you didn't dig around for something after you told the officers that you had a gun, after the officer told you to stop.
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shockthemonkey posted...

Maybe you need a lesson in grammar because it seems like you and the cop are confused as to how it works. See that word "it" that I just used? You'll notice how the pronoun "it" replaced "grammar." Much like how in the interaction we see, "it" refers to a gun. The officer says stop reaching for "it," but Castile isn't reaching for "it" (in this case the ID that had been demanded).

So did he stop reaching for "it"? Or did he continue reaching for "it" after the officer told him stop?
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shockthemonkey posted...

He was never reaching for it.

He was reaching for his ID, and the officer told him to stop because the police don't have x-ray vision that allows them to see if it's a wallet or gun in your pocket.
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Mal_Fet posted...

He was reaching for his ID, and the officer told him to stop because the police don't have x-ray vision that allows them to see if it's a wallet or gun in your pocket.

HE told him not to reach for the gun, and he told him to reach for the ID . You are always justifying people being killed if they don't comply. This dude was comply . Also it was not 7 seconds from the time the cop stated yelling to the time where he killed innocent man.
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Mal_Fet posted...

shockthemonkey posted...

He was never reaching for it.

He was reaching for his ID, and the officer told him to stop because the police don't have x-ray vision that allows them to see if it's a wallet or gun in your pocket.

He waa told to not reach for his gun. Civilians don't have mind reading powers.
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shockthemonkey posted...

Seriously how are you this dense? You jump through hoops to defend white peoples legally carrying. But as soon as a black man is killed for legally carrying, it's his fault.

You're not legally carrying if you're under the influence, which he was.
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I really wish people would stop engaging with Mal Fet
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Yep the dashcam proves that the shooter was rightfully found not guilty.
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StealthRock posted...

After the second, "Don't pull it out!!", he should've just stopped.

He probably thought that was a warning again to not touch the gun, which he was following"

Mal_Fet posted...

shockthemonkey posted...

He was never reaching for it.

He was reaching for his ID, and the officer told him to stop because the police don't have x-ray vision that allows them to see if it's a wallet or gun in your pocket.

why would someone tell you they have a gun in that manner if they're planning on shooting you with it?

also I thought concealed carry permit holders were basically angels that never commit gun crimes. Is there any evidence of someone with a CCL killing a cop?
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hockeybub89 posted...

Mal_Fet posted...

shockthemonkey posted...

He was never reaching for it.

He was reaching for his ID, and the officer told him to stop because the police don't have x-ray vision that allows them to see if it's a wallet or gun in your pocket.

He waa told to not reach for his gun. Civilians don't have mind reading powers.

"No officer, my gun is in my LEFT pocket. I'm just reaching into my RIGHT pocket. Trust me!"

Look, if you're reaching for something, and an officer says "stop reaching for it", you really should stop reaching and not make the dumb assumption that the officer is aware that what you're reaching for is not a gun.
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Mal_Fet posted...

shockthemonkey posted...

He was never reaching for it.

He was reaching for his ID, and the officer told him to stop because the police don't have x-ray vision that allows them to see if it's a wallet or gun in your pocket.

Jesus fucking Christ

Show me in the video where the cop says "STOP." Show me where in that exchange he actually uses the word "STOP reaching for your ID." Time stamp it. Because that phrasing is never fucking used from what I've watched.

"Don't reach for it!" was the phrase used. "It" was in reference to the gun Castille admitted to having, and he was never reaching for it. In no way did the officer tell him to stop moving or to stop reaching for his ID.

The police can fuck up too, you know, and they clearly did here. It's not that hard.
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So the people here defending the cop.

Suggest that the victim willingly waited for the cop to come.
Warn him about his gun.
Let's the cop get to place to draw.
And only than starts to remove his gun that was not fire-ready.

What type of logic is that.
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Mal_Fet posted...

hockeybub89 posted...

Mal_Fet posted...

shockthemonkey posted...

He was never reaching for it.

He was reaching for his ID, and the officer told him to stop because the police don't have x-ray vision that allows them to see if it's a wallet or gun in your pocket.

He waa told to not reach for his gun. Civilians don't have mind reading powers.

"No officer, my gun is in my LEFT pocket. I'm just reaching into my RIGHT pocket. Trust me!"

Again, he was a untrained civilian thrown into a high stress situation trying to follow the unclear orders of a scared cop pointing a gun at him. Why isn't he allowed to be confused and scared? If anyone should be allowed, it is him and not the cop.
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cjsdowg posted...

So the people here defending the cop.

Suggest that the victim willingly waited for the cop to come.
Warn him about his gun.
Let's the cop get to place to draw.
And only than starts to remove his gun that was not fire-ready.

What type of logic is that.

Maybe the daughter in the back seat was packing and just waiting for the cop to be distracted by Philando fumbling around so the three of them could murder the cop. What if that is what the cop was thinking and shot him to foil their plan? Checkmate, atheists.
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DezCaughtIt posted...

"Don't reach for it!" was the phrase used. "It" was in reference to the gun Castille admitted to having, and he was never reaching for it.

And the officer has no way of knowing this without hindsight.

You basically wish for this cop to get put in prison for murder because he's not a mind reader. That's not justice.

cjsdowg posted...

So the people here defending the cop.

Suggest that the victim willingly waited for the cop to come.
Warn him about his gun.
Let's the cop get to place to draw.
And only than starts to remove his gun that was not fire-ready.

What type of logic is that.

I dunno, why would George Zimmerman not already have had his gun drawn before the fight went to the ground if he intended on killing Trayvon in cold blood?

You can't trust in people to be 100% logical. Nobody is 100% logical.
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DezCaughtIt posted...

Mal_Fet posted...

shockthemonkey posted...

He was never reaching for it.

He was reaching for his ID, and the officer told him to stop because the police don't have x-ray vision that allows them to see if it's a wallet or gun in your pocket.

Jesus fucking Christ

Show me in the video where the cop says "STOP." Show me where in that exchange he actually uses the word "STOP reaching for your ID." Time stamp it. Because that phrasing is never fucking used from what I've watched.

"Don't reach for it!" was the phrase used. "It" was in reference to the gun Castille admitted to having, and he was never reaching for it. In no way did the officer tell him to stop moving or to stop reaching for his ID.

The police can fuck up too, you know, and they clearly did here. It's not that hard.

It doesn't matter if the 'it' in question was the wallet or the gun. If you tell a cop you're armed and they say don't reach for 'it' you stop fucking reaching for anything and show your hands

I guess a lot of people haven't seen the video where cops had a black guy stopped, he lied about having weed and started reaching in his car. They told him not to reach like 15 times, he kept saying he wasn't, then he pulled out a gun and shot them both point blank in the stomach and ran
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Mal_Fet posted...

You basically wish for this cop to get put in prison for murder because he's not a mind reader. That's not justice.

No, he should be in prison for manslaughter because he clearly didn't know how to handle the situation. Why does the citizen have to be 100% perfect but the officer is allowed to fuck up?

He didn't even look into the car as he was firing either. He turned his head and fired in. Dude's a fucking coward.
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"Can I have your ID please?"

"Yessir," while reaching for the wallet,"sir I have to inform you I have a weapon on me."

"Don't reach for it then."

"Yessir," places hands on steering wheel waiting for next direction.

It's really not that hard.
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Mal_Fet posted...

And the officer has no way of knowing this without hindsight.

You basically wish for this cop to get put in prison for murder because he's not a mind reader. That's not justice.

But killing someone for not following an order that you did not give is .

And funny you bring up Zimmerman, that guy attacked a cop before. But he is cool but not this guy following the orders that he was given.
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