Current Events > Playing a older game console makes me realize how messed up gaming is these days

(+) Yeah! (+)

I got into the Wii part of my Wii U, have a good disc collection that I haven't touched in years and kinda felt a desire to go back to that. I picked up some of the highlight wiiware and virtual console content that is still exclusive to it, and wow it's just awesome how simple gaming used to be. I can just pick out any game and start playing it no updates or logins required.

Going to a console like my PS4, it's like I gotta log into the online network, then I gotta download and install a bunch of updates even though I just updated everything a week ago, which means I gotta delete some stuff because the updates are so large that I gotta have a ton of free space for some reason, then I gotta download those games again... after I got my console ready to use again it's been over an hour and I totally forgot about using it.

Going back to my Gamecube, which I also have a nice collection for that I haven't touched in years, it's like a night and day difference. I just insert the disc, press the power button, and bam! Game starts right up, press start screen already displayed, I press start and in less than a minute I am playing the game.

We have really gone backwards with our access to gaming satisfaction these days and it's apparently all because of how online dependent everything is.
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It's agreed TC!!

It's agreed!

I play my Jp PS2 daily. Mainly Destiny2/R.

TFW PC gaming is less complicated than current console gaming.
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Lonestar2000 posted...

TFW PC gaming is less complicated than current console gaming.

Fuck no PC gaming is the absolute worst, it takes all the problems of modern console gaming to the extreme.

Want to play a game? Gotta log into Steam, then you gotta download all your updates, then you gotta log into a completely separate service with a completely separate login that needs it's own updates, then when you do all that you still need to log into a different account on the actual game.

Combine that with all the constant maintenance and headaches of a Windows 10 operating system and it's the most annoying thing you can be doing these days.
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jayj420 posted...

Want to play a game? Gotta log into Steam, then you gotta download all your updates, then you gotta log into a completely separate service with a completely separate login that needs it's own updates, then when you do all that you still need to log into a different account on the actual game.

https://www.gog.com/
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PepsiWithCoke posted...

jayj420 posted...

Want to play a game? Gotta log into Steam, then you gotta download all your updates, then you gotta log into a completely separate service with a completely separate login that needs it's own updates, then when you do all that you still need to log into a different account on the actual game.

https://www.gog.com/

Isn't that just for classic PC gaming?

That has no shortage of it's own issues which is usually the instability of old PC games on modern operating systems and hardware.
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my xbone updates while it's shut down
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jayj420 posted...

Lonestar2000 posted...

TFW PC gaming is less complicated than current console gaming.

Fuck no PC gaming is the absolute worst, it takes all the problems of modern console gaming to the extreme.

Want to play a game? Gotta log into Steam, then you gotta download all your updates, then you gotta log into a completely separate service with a completely separate login that needs it's own updates, then when you do all that you still need to log into a different account on the actual game.

Combine that with all the constant maintenance and headaches of a Windows 10 operating system and it's the most annoying thing you can be doing these days.

lol wut. Steam is super convenient.
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UncleBourbon33 posted...

jayj420 posted...

Lonestar2000 posted...

TFW PC gaming is less complicated than current console gaming.

Fuck no PC gaming is the absolute worst, it takes all the problems of modern console gaming to the extreme.

Want to play a game? Gotta log into Steam, then you gotta download all your updates, then you gotta log into a completely separate service with a completely separate login that needs it's own updates, then when you do all that you still need to log into a different account on the actual game.

Combine that with all the constant maintenance and headaches of a Windows 10 operating system and it's the most annoying thing you can be doing these days.

lol wut. Steam is super convenient.

It's as convenient as a modern game console in it's self. The problem is Windows 10 and everything associated.
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While I agree that gaming was simpler back then, people greatly exaggerate how complicated it is now.
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jayj420 posted...

Lonestar2000 posted...

TFW PC gaming is less complicated than current console gaming.

Fuck no PC gaming is the absolute worst, it takes all the problems of modern console gaming to the extreme.

Want to play a game? Gotta log into Steam, then you gotta download all your updates, then you gotta log into a completely separate service with a completely separate login that needs it's own updates, then when you do all that you still need to log into a different account on the actual game.

Combine that with all the constant maintenance and headaches of a Windows 10 operating system and it's the most annoying thing you can be doing these days.

not to mention you need additional voice comms programs and lfg apps/sites for group gaming too
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jayj420 posted...

Isn't that just for classic PC gaming?

https://www.gog.com/game/hellblade_senuas_sacrifice
https://www.gog.com/game/the_long_dark
https://www.gog.com/game/the_witcher_3_wild_hunt
https://www.gog.com/game/divinity_original_sin_2
https://www.gog.com/game/fallout_new_vegas_ultimate_edition
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chill02 posted...

my xbone updates while it's shut down

Yeah same, but my PS4 is annoying lately because a lot of updates have been too big to download on their own.
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PepsiWithCoke posted...

jayj420 posted...

Isn't that just for classic PC gaming?

https://www.gog.com/game/hellblade_senuas_sacrifice
https://www.gog.com/game/the_long_dark
https://www.gog.com/game/the_witcher_3_wild_hunt
https://www.gog.com/game/divinity_original_sin_2
https://www.gog.com/game/fallout_new_vegas_ultimate_edition

Those are pretty old games.
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UncleBourbon33 posted...

While I agree that gaming was simpler back then, people greatly exaggerate how complicated it is now.

True, but people also really over-simplify everything involved with modern gaming, usually only presenting an ideal portrait of it when everything is all ready to use.
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jayj420 posted...

I got into the Wii part of my Wii U, have a good disc collection that I haven't touched in years and kinda felt a desire to go back to that. I picked up some of the highlight wiiware and virtual console content that is still exclusive to it, and wow it's just awesome how simple gaming used to be. I can just pick out any game and start playing it no updates or logins required.

Going to a console like my PS4, it's like I gotta log into the online network, then I gotta download and install a bunch of updates even though I just updated everything a week ago, which means I gotta delete some stuff because the updates are so large that I gotta have a ton of free space for some reason, then I gotta download those games again... after I got my console ready to use again it's been over an hour and I totally forgot about using it.

Going back to my Gamecube, which I also have a nice collection for that I haven't touched in years, it's like a night and day difference. I just insert the disc, press the power button, and bam! Game starts right up, press start screen already displayed, I press start and in less than a minute I am playing the game.

We have really gone backwards with our access to gaming satisfaction these days and it's apparently all because of how online dependent everything is.

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jayj420 posted...

Those are pretty old games.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5kPUFxXYLs
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K3lys posted...

jayj420 posted...

I got into the Wii part of my Wii U, have a good disc collection that I haven't touched in years and kinda felt a desire to go back to that. I picked up some of the highlight wiiware and virtual console content that is still exclusive to it, and wow it's just awesome how simple gaming used to be. I can just pick out any game and start playing it no updates or logins required.

Going to a console like my PS4, it's like I gotta log into the online network, then I gotta download and install a bunch of updates even though I just updated everything a week ago, which means I gotta delete some stuff because the updates are so large that I gotta have a ton of free space for some reason, then I gotta download those games again... after I got my console ready to use again it's been over an hour and I totally forgot about using it.

Going back to my Gamecube, which I also have a nice collection for that I haven't touched in years, it's like a night and day difference. I just insert the disc, press the power button, and bam! Game starts right up, press start screen already displayed, I press start and in less than a minute I am playing the game.

We have really gone backwards with our access to gaming satisfaction these days and it's apparently all because of how online dependent everything is.

It's the best part of the Wii U

...everybody know that
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It's so weird that people call Gamecube and Wii old.

I grew up on NES and Super NES.

Anyway, most of these arguments boil down to "I have fond memories of playing this game for hours, so it's way better than new games". It's a double edged sword, though. Gamers demand better presentation, then complain about how the game becomes more shallow as the game becomes more asset heavy. They want innovation, but then complain when the sequels are not the game they played before, so they make the game closer to the original, and then the gamers complain that the game is the same as the first one. They complain about casualization, but then cry when series are abandoned due to low sales. Gaming companies are still businesses, not artists, and gamers are impossible to please.

Dash_Harber posted...

It's so weird that people call Gamecube and Wii old.

I grew up on NES and Super NES.

Anyway, most of these arguments boil down to "I have fond memories of playing this game for hours, so it's way better than new games". It's a double edged sword, though. Gamers demand better presentation, then complain about how the game becomes more shallow as the game becomes more asset heavy. They want innovation, but then complain when the sequels are not the game they played before, so they make the game closer to the original, and then the gamers complain that the game is the same as the first one. They complain about casualization, but then cry when series are abandoned due to low sales. Gaming companies are still businesses, not artists, and gamers are impossible to please.

This is more of a "you have to log in and download too many things these days" kinda complaint
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UncleBourbon33 posted...

While I agree that gaming was simpler back then, people greatly exaggerate how complicated it is now.

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When I read gamecube I think of Circuit City. :(
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jayj420 posted...

Dash_Harber posted...

It's so weird that people call Gamecube and Wii old.

I grew up on NES and Super NES.

Anyway, most of these arguments boil down to "I have fond memories of playing this game for hours, so it's way better than new games". It's a double edged sword, though. Gamers demand better presentation, then complain about how the game becomes more shallow as the game becomes more asset heavy. They want innovation, but then complain when the sequels are not the game they played before, so they make the game closer to the original, and then the gamers complain that the game is the same as the first one. They complain about casualization, but then cry when series are abandoned due to low sales. Gaming companies are still businesses, not artists, and gamers are impossible to please.

This is more of a "you have to log in and download too many things these days" kinda complaint

Ah, well I appreciate the internet's effect on gaming. It used to be that a buggy game remained a buggy game for the rest of time, unless it was remastered years later. Expansions would be released that fixed the bugs, and charged the game's price again. Of course, double edged sword again, micro-transactions, and unfinished games, etc. All in all, though, bug fixes and multiplayer are worth it.

jayj420 posted...

Want to play a game? Gotta log into Steam, then you gotta download all your updates, then you gotta log into a completely separate service with a completely separate login that needs it's own updates, then when you do all that you still need to log into a different account on the actual game.

I'm struggling to think of what game requires you to log in 3 times.

Even MMOs on Steam only require two logins, and if you get the MMO straight from the publisher instead of through Steam like a putz, you only have to login once.
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I bought a burnout game for ps2 last weekend. Booted it up and was slapped by a barrage of advertising from EA games. At least some things haven't changed!
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jayj420 posted...

Those are pretty old games.

Original Sin 2 is literally early access
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The Switch is pretty snappy starting new games.

The worst consoles with this are the PS3 and Xbox One. PS4 isn't that bad tbh
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Darmik posted...

The Switch is pretty snappy starting new games.

The worst consoles with this are the PS3 and Xbox One. PS4 isn't that bad tbh

XBox One has a long cold boot time but it's insanely fast starting games that are suspended.
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Darmik posted...

The Switch is pretty snappy starting new games.

The worst consoles with this are the PS3 and Xbox One. PS4 isn't that bad tbh

The PS4 is just really terrible at managing data, the Xbox One seems to be the most efficient at updating.

The Switch is kinda like an old school console where you don't really need to do anything and rarely needs updating.
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jayj420 posted...

Darmik posted...

The Switch is pretty snappy starting new games.

The worst consoles with this are the PS3 and Xbox One. PS4 isn't that bad tbh

The PS4 is just really terrible at managing data, the Xbox One seems to be the most efficient at updating.

The Switch is kinda like an old school console where you don't really need to do anything and rarely needs updating.

I really found the opposite. The Xbox takes an ungodly amount of time to install and update, even for new games, whereas the PS4 with a corded connection takes a brief period, even for multi-gig downloads.

I thought this would be the usual "old games have more content, new games lock everything behind DLC/paywalls" kind of topic. What games are you playing that require that much effort? The only time I have to update anything, on my Xbox One at least, is when actual new content has been added to the game (like Overwatch characters or events). Plus, if you go all digital, I have the vast majority of my games right there a click of a button away, ready to play instantly. And why the hell are you logging in to the network? That shit should be instant as soon as you boot up unless there are network issues.

I do agree on the storage thing, though, games require a ton of storage these days.

"An older game"
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jayj420 posted...

Want to play a game? Gotta log into Steam, then you gotta download all your updates, then you gotta log into a completely separate service with a completely separate login that needs it's own updates, then when you do all that you still need to log into a different account on the actual game.

People make it sound like a lot of steps, and maybe it is, but at least for me, I'm logged into Steam basically whenever my computer is on since it has so little overhead, it's set to update automatically, and very few of my games use a third-party launcher so it seldom ever happens that way. It's just "Double-click installed game, it launches".

And I've legit never had to log in three separate times. Steam and the third-party launcher, which for me signs in by itself. Even those F2P Korean MMOs only require you to sign in at the launcher and not once more while in the game.
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Dash_Harber posted...

I really found the opposite. The Xbox takes an ungodly amount of time to install and update, even for new games, whereas the PS4 with a corded connection takes a brief period, even for multi-gig downloads.

I don't keep my Xbox One on stand-by often so I know that can be a huge factor. But yeah installing Halo 5 on Xbox One was a god damn ordeal. Couldn't even start the game before it was done for some reason.

But the overall worst was the PS3. Sometimes you had to wait for several updates to download. Ugh.
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I'm just thankful that I no longer need to download patches separately and patch the game manually.

*shudders at Diablo 2 & Starcraft 1 memories*
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St0rmFury posted...

I'm just thankful that I no longer need to download patches separately and patch the game manually.

*shudders at Diablo 2 & Starcraft 1 memories*

I remember those bulk 1.00 to 1.4 patches and then you'd have 1.4 to 2.0 and then another 2.0 to 2.1, then smaller patches thereafter. I think this was Company of Heroes.
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Lmao at that long post because someone didn't read anything

Also I agree it is stupid as fuck not to mention that the game you started out with is totally different when you come back to it because they tweaked every little thing about it

Or buying a system that has enough memory to hold 6 games.

And PC gaming is not really easier to set up unless you have a state of art computer. The amount of time I've spent trouble shooting booting games up or trying to get display settings manageable is insane
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iosifsvoboda posted...

Lmao at that long post because someone didn't read anything

Also I agree it is stupid as fuck not to mention that the game you started out with is totally different when you come back to it because they tweaked every little thing about it

Or buying a system that has enough memory to hold 6 games.

And PC gaming is not really easier to set up unless you have a state of art computer. The amount of time I've spent trouble shooting booting games up or trying to get display settings manageable is insane

Yeah I feel like anyone who has a lot of experience with modern consoles and PC gaming knows damn well how much time you need to spend updating things and setting stuff up, dealing with login credentials and online services, it's just a lot to keep on top of.

It seems like there is a very specific kind of person who doesn't have any issues with this, it's the obsessive fan nerd who spends so much time on their devices that they always have them up to date. Everyone else who actually has a life outside of gaming often finds all of this to be annoying.
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I never had a problem with my PS4 and downloading stuff. Hell it always downloads systems updates in rest mode, ready to install when I turn it back on.

Sounds like TC just left his off and not in rest mode hence all the updates.

Also, updates are a good thing. Remember when the only way to get a version of a game that patched a major bug was to buy it all over again?
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"I have never had a problem"

First sign somebody is cherry picking.
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jayj420 posted...

"I have never had a problem"

First sign somebody is cherry picking.

When I say that, I mean that the downloads were never obstructive enough to stop me from playing.

There are plenty of PS4 games you can pop in and play in seconds. Anything that isn't that fast usually has a one time set of updates to install. Any digital downloads automatically download the updates at the same time, so there's no extra downloading when it's all said and done.

The point is, the benefits of current updatable gaming typically outweigh the speed arguments of other consoles.
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Anyway, most of these arguments boil down to "I have fond memories of playing this game for hours, so it's way better than new games". It's a double edged sword, though. Gamers demand better presentation, then complain about how the game becomes more shallow as the game becomes more asset heavy. They want innovation, but then complain when the sequels are not the game they played before, so they make the game closer to the original, and then the gamers complain that the game is the same as the first one. They complain about casualization, but then cry when series are abandoned due to low sales. Gaming companies are still businesses, not artists, and gamers are impossible to please.

What people need to realize is that people complain much more loudly than they praise. Or in other words, screw what fans complain about because, as you say, you would have complaints either way.
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thompsontalker7 posted...

jayj420 posted...

"I have never had a problem"

First sign somebody is cherry picking.

When I say that, I mean that the downloads were never obstructive enough to stop me from playing.

There are plenty of PS4 games you can pop in and play in seconds. Anything that isn't that fast usually has a one time set of updates to install. Any digital downloads automatically download the updates at the same time, so there's no extra downloading when it's all said and done.

The point is, the benefits of current updatable gaming typically outweigh the speed arguments of other consoles.

My argument is how that is not always the case and how all the connectivity can be a bad thing.

Sometimes more complex is not always better.
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What's exactly complex about a game requiring updates occasionally before you play it? You do realize it's totally possible to ignore/delay those updates and play the game in the meantime, right?

Do you criticize Windows/ Mac OS X for needing the occasional system update? How about Steam for (constantly) needing to update the client before it opens?

The simplicity of older consoles comes with a bunch of downsides (disc-only, no firmware/security updates, no software updates in case of bugs/glitches) that are objectively worse than current gaming hardware.

And the Switch has its own share of software/system updates and downloads so idk why you think that's a positive example. Lego City Undercover has a mandatory download before you can even play, not even an on-cart game install. That's pretty bad.
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thompsontalker7 posted...

What's exactly complex about a game requiring updates occasionally before you play it? You do realize it's totally possible to ignore/delay those updates and play the game in the meantime, right?

Do you criticize Windows/ Mac OS X for needing the occasional system update? How about Steam for (constantly) needing to update the client before it opens?

The simplicity of older consoles comes with a bunch of downsides (disc-only, no firmware/security updates, no software updates in case of bugs/glitches) that are objectively worse than current gaming hardware.

And the Switch has its own share of software/system updates and downloads so idk why you think that's a positive example. Lego City Undercover has a mandatory download before you can even play, not even an on-cart game install. That's pretty bad.

I just think there is a lot to appreciate about the simplicity of retro gaming is all, why is that so hard to comprehend lol.
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Because your stance was that contemporary gaming is too online reliant and backwards, even though I provided evidence to the contrary?
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thompsontalker7 posted...

Because your stance was that contemporary gaming is too online reliant and backwards, even though I provided evidence to the contrary?

Hardly, you didn't do anything of the sort.
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jayj420 posted...

I can just pick out any game and start playing it no updates or logins required.

thompsontalker7 posted...

You do realize it's totally possible to ignore/delay those updates and play the game in the meantime, right?

jayj420 posted...

I just insert the disc, press the power button, and bam! Game starts right up, press start screen already displayed, I press start and in less than a minute I am playing the game.

PesticideDream posted...

if you go all digital, I have the vast majority of my games right there a click of a button away, ready to play instantly.

jayj420 posted...

I just think there is a lot to appreciate about the simplicity of retro gaming is all, why is that so hard to comprehend lol.

C'mon bruh

I coach kids in arguments in my spare time

And to elaborate on that last part where you mention playing the game in less than a minute, there are plenty of slow-burn retro games as much as there is quick-play modern games. Every Pokemon game since 98, for instance, has had an extended intro segment. In comparison, Puyo Puyo Tetris is so jump-in friendly that you can start playing a mode from the start screen.
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Whatever dude, that's a Switch game and we all know the Switch is the one exception this gen
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