Current Events > California says suck it to GOP. Changing Tax laws so we can deduct our taxes

(+) Yeah! (+)

not__shawn__z posted...

And I'm not king crab but since we are having a civil discussion I wouldn't mind taking his place, because I feel similar to him

Hexenherz posted...

Imagine complaining about a law that actually protects the rights and safeties of sexual minorities in health facilities.

There is no right to be called a pronoun of your choosing. No such right exists. You do not have that right.

It can be construed as a form of harassment and the law pertains specifically to health care facilities while expanding the rights of literally all sexual minorities. It is not specifically dedicated to the sole topic of pronoun usage, and it does not cover the broader topic of freedom of speech in public spaces. It refers specifically to how medical staff at medical facilities treat patients.

The reason I bring up the debt - because debt is an imaginary number. It doesn't matter what the debt of a state, company or country is as long as it's being properly managed. So to bring it up in the first place is an irrelevant point if you're not willing to compare it to other states that have even worse debt-to-GDP ratios.
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KingCrabCake posted...

Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

California we believe in free speech...unless you use the wrong gender pronoun. Then well you get fined and possibly jailed.

Did you even read the law?

Yes....did you?? Lol

I did. And I think you somehow completely misinterpreted something that is completely and objectively impossible to interpret by someone with a fifth grade reading comprehension.
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Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

California we believe in free speech...unless you use the wrong gender pronoun. Then well you get fined and possibly jailed.

Did you even read the law?

Yes....did you?? Lol

I did. And I think you somehow completely misinterpreted something that is completely and objectively impossible to interpret by someone with a fifth grade reading comprehension.

Ah so insults and no discussion. I accept your defeat
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Hexenherz posted...

It can be construed as a form of harassment and the law pertains specifically to health care facilities while expanding the rights of literally all sexual minorities. It is not specifically dedicated to the sole topic of pronoun usage.

Your bolded isn't the issue. No one would have an issue with protection against discrimination in a healthcare facility. The problem is that the bill literally goes out of it's way and lists using the wrong pronoun as an unlawful action.

Let's try and find common ground. I personally feel that calling someone the wrong pronoun being unlawful is, quite frankly, absolutely fucking insane. Would you agree?

KingCrabCake posted...

Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

California we believe in free speech...unless you use the wrong gender pronoun. Then well you get fined and possibly jailed.

Did you even read the law?

Yes....did you?? Lol

I did. And I think you somehow completely misinterpreted something that is completely and objectively impossible to interpret by someone with a fifth grade reading comprehension.

Ah so insults and no discussion. I accept your defeat

Can you please clarify to me, then, what is wrong about a law that extends protection to sexual minorities in healthcare facilities? Because you haven't answered that yet.
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Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

California we believe in free speech...unless you use the wrong gender pronoun. Then well you get fined and possibly jailed.

Did you even read the law?

Yes....did you?? Lol

I did. And I think you somehow completely misinterpreted something that is completely and objectively impossible to interpret by someone with a fifth grade reading comprehension.

Ah so insults and no discussion. I accept your defeat

Can you please clarify to me, then, what is wrong about a law that extends protection to sexual minorities in healthcare facilities? Because you haven't answered that yet.

Whats being protected? Feelings?? Theres nothing else being protected. Their health isn't at risk just because someone uses the "wrong" gender pronoun. Like wtf
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not__shawn__z posted...

Hexenherz posted...

It can be construed as a form of harassment and the law pertains specifically to health care facilities while expanding the rights of literally all sexual minorities. It is not specifically dedicated to the sole topic of pronoun usage.

Your bolded isn't the issue. No one would have an issue with protection against discrimination in a healthcare facility. The problem is that the bill literally goes out of it's way and lists using the wrong pronoun as an unlawful action.

Let's try and find common ground. I personally feel that calling someone the wrong pronoun being unlawful is, quite frankly, absolutely fucking insane. Would you agree?

No, I don't agree at all. If someone tells you repeatedly that they identify as X gender and you do not treat them as X gender (which has potentially broader implications, such as which facility they ultimately go to, who sees them, the form of privacy they're afforded, etc.), then that's literally discrimination and harassment.

The purpose of health care is not to discriminate against people based on sexual orientation, race, gender, etc. This law codifies that into legislation, along with a slew of other protections.
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You shouldnt be jailed or fined in america for saying something harmless.
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KingCrabCake posted...

Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

Hexenherz posted...

KingCrabCake posted...

California we believe in free speech...unless you use the wrong gender pronoun. Then well you get fined and possibly jailed.

Did you even read the law?

Yes....did you?? Lol

I did. And I think you somehow completely misinterpreted something that is completely and objectively impossible to interpret by someone with a fifth grade reading comprehension.

Ah so insults and no discussion. I accept your defeat

Can you please clarify to me, then, what is wrong about a law that extends protection to sexual minorities in healthcare facilities? Because you haven't answered that yet.

Whats being protected? Feelings?? Theres nothing else being protected. Their health isn't at risk just because someone uses the "wrong" gender pronoun. Like wtf

Between this and the Kansas topic there's no way you aren't trolling. Have fun.
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Hexenherz posted...

not__shawn__z posted...

Hexenherz posted...

It can be construed as a form of harassment and the law pertains specifically to health care facilities while expanding the rights of literally all sexual minorities. It is not specifically dedicated to the sole topic of pronoun usage.

Your bolded isn't the issue. No one would have an issue with protection against discrimination in a healthcare facility. The problem is that the bill literally goes out of it's way and lists using the wrong pronoun as an unlawful action.

Let's try and find common ground. I personally feel that calling someone the wrong pronoun being unlawful is, quite frankly, absolutely fucking insane. Would you agree?

No, I don't agree at all. If someone tells you repeatedly that they identify as X gender and you do not treat them as X gender (which has potentially broader implications, such as which facility they ultimately go to, who sees them, the form of privacy they're afforded, etc.), then that's literally discrimination and harassment.

The purpose of health care is not to discriminate against people based on sexual orientation, race, gender, etc. This law codifies that into legislation, along with a slew of other protections.

Science > feelings
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Hexenherz posted...

Between this and the Kansas topic there's no way you aren't trolling. Have fun.

Again ill accept your defeat..

And what kansas topic
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not__shawn__z posted...

And where are you now?

Arizona, and I'm very happy about it. I lived in liberal states my whole life- NJ, NY, CA. Once your actual career gets going, you pass your college years and want to buy a nice house and all that, leaving liberal home, those 3 states in particular, is pretty tempting. I now pay a -significant- less amount of taxes, my guns aren't neutered, less weirdos, homeless (the homeless in CA/socal are fucking nuts and hostile for the non CA people wondering why I keep referencing them), and crime in general. Additionally I still get the luxury of visiting; I am an hour plane ride from pheonix to LA and SD, only a handful of hours if wanna put the dog in the car and head around big bear

I'm mad about CA because it was once my home and I was witnessing what some of these policies and laws were doing to it. The last time I was in SD, which was only a few months ago, I was watching men in hazmat suits spray bleach onto streets. Because the streets of SD are literally crawling with hepatitis A. Like a third world country.

Ya don't get me wrong, my mom moved out with her new boyfriend to Mesa last year. I've been thinking of heading out of here myself for a few years now.

I've lived in GA for a bit but other than that I've lived in SD my whole life and just traveled a lot for Hockey and work.

Calis got a lot of problems and SD itself ha s a ton. I can't defend the hep comment is extremely true. It has a lot of beauty though and unless you're in Downtown or OB most of the issues that are always mentioned about homeless and such are almost non-existent.

It's a mixed bag for sure but the culture and the diversity in everything is unrivaled. I've literally woke up in the snow to hit the slopes before going back home to surf in IB and then ended my night riding dirt bikes down in MaCain. Granted that isn't something I would do regularly but from what I hear you also can't do that anywhere else (idk if that's true though).

You've got every social group you can name, a bar for every person so to speak and some of the best attractions in the world both in the city and within a few hours drive.

I probably would leave if I wasn't in the healthcare industry. We'll see what happens though.
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Hexenherz posted...

No, I don't agree at all. If someone tells you repeatedly that they identify as X gender and you do not treat them as X gender (which has potentially broader implications, such as which facility they ultimately go to, who sees them, the form of privacy they're afforded, etc.), then that's literally discrimination and harassment.

The purpose of health care is not to discriminate against people based on sexual orientation, race, gender, etc. This law codifies that into legislation, along with a slew of other protections.

Okay, well. Let's try something else. You understand that just because you say you're a woman, that doesn't make you a woman?

Because, in a lot of circumstances and contrary to your argument, they -need- to treat you as your biological gender, not the gender you think you are

Oh you mean the one were the cop did nothing wrong. Yeah youre just a person who thinks feelings are more important than facts.
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not__shawn__z posted...

Sorry, no civil discussion to have with an irrelevant "but trump/conservatives" comment, lol

So you have no response. Got it.
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Zeeak4444 posted...

not__shawn__z posted...

And where are you now?

Arizona, and I'm very happy about it. I lived in liberal states my whole life- NJ, NY, CA. Once your actual career gets going, you pass your college years and want to buy a nice house and all that, leaving liberal home, those 3 states in particular, is pretty tempting. I now pay a -significant- less amount of taxes, my guns aren't neutered, less weirdos, homeless (the homeless in CA/socal are fucking nuts and hostile for the non CA people wondering why I keep referencing them), and crime in general. Additionally I still get the luxury of visiting; I am an hour plane ride from pheonix to LA and SD, only a handful of hours if wanna put the dog in the car and head around big bear

I'm mad about CA because it was once my home and I was witnessing what some of these policies and laws were doing to it. The last time I was in SD, which was only a few months ago, I was watching men in hazmat suits spray bleach onto streets. Because the streets of SD are literally crawling with hepatitis A. Like a third world country.

Ya don't get me wrong, my mom moved out with her new boyfriend to Mesa last year. I've been thinking of heading out of here myself for a few years now.

I've lived in GA for a bit but other than that I've lived in SD my whole life and just traveled a lot for Hockey and work.

Calis got a lot of problems and SD itself ha s a ton. I can't defend the hep comment is extremely true. It has a lot of beauty though and unless you're in Downtown or OB most of the issues that are always mentioned about homeless and such are almost non-existent.

It's a mixed bag for sure but the culture and the diversity in everything is unrivaled. I've literally woke up in the snow to hit the slopes before going back home to surf in IB and then ended my night riding dirt bikes down in MaCain. Granted that isn't something I would do regularly but from what I hear you also can't do that anywhere else (idk if that's true though).

You've got every social group you can name, a bar for every person so to speak and some of the best attractions in the world both in the city and within a few hours drive.

I probably would leave if I wasn't in the healthcare industry. We'll see what happens though.

Jersey and NY are actually similar in that regard, especially jersey. But it's a bit nicer in CA because of how beautiful it is and it's always 75, lol

Mesa, and the area surrounding it, is great. Visit your mom when you can. The great thing about AZ, like I mentioned, is that if I really missed it and wanted to do those things, I can just take a 3 day weekend and do it. So, you know, you get all the amenities of Cali without having to deal with it's laws/Illegals/insurance/taxes/etc. And California without all that is AMAZING lol

I would think the healthcare industry is broad enough that you can pretty much go wherever, especially any big city (so Phoenix), no?

not__shawn__z posted...

Hexenherz posted...

No, I don't agree at all. If someone tells you repeatedly that they identify as X gender and you do not treat them as X gender (which has potentially broader implications, such as which facility they ultimately go to, who sees them, the form of privacy they're afforded, etc.), then that's literally discrimination and harassment.

The purpose of health care is not to discriminate against people based on sexual orientation, race, gender, etc. This law codifies that into legislation, along with a slew of other protections.

Okay, well. Let's try something else. You understand that just because you say you're a woman, that doesn't make you a woman?

Because, in a lot of circumstances and contrary to your argument, they -need- to treat you as your biological gender, not the gender you think you are

They can treat you as your anatomy dictates while still respecting your identity.
I do understand your point (I think) that it can maybe cause confusion on a patient's chart but in cases like that I imagine they can just use a code to denote the person is female with male parts or vice versa.
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sktgamer_13dude posted...

not__shawn__z posted...

Sorry, no civil discussion to have with an irrelevant "but trump/conservatives" comment, lol

So you have no response. Got it.

Former President Barack Obama

Hexenherz posted...

not__shawn__z posted...

Hexenherz posted...

No, I don't agree at all. If someone tells you repeatedly that they identify as X gender and you do not treat them as X gender (which has potentially broader implications, such as which facility they ultimately go to, who sees them, the form of privacy they're afforded, etc.), then that's literally discrimination and harassment.

The purpose of health care is not to discriminate against people based on sexual orientation, race, gender, etc. This law codifies that into legislation, along with a slew of other protections.

Okay, well. Let's try something else. You understand that just because you say you're a woman, that doesn't make you a woman?

Because, in a lot of circumstances and contrary to your argument, they -need- to treat you as your biological gender, not the gender you think you are

They can treat you as your anatomy dictates while still respecting your identity.
I do understand your point (I think) that it can maybe cause confusion on a patient's chart but in cases like that I imagine they can just use a code to denote the person is female with male parts or vice versa.

Well, it can do a lot more than cause confusion. Women don't exactly walk into a men's health clinic, and vice versa. There are situations where you are not even going to be able to be treated, nevermind treated properly

In regards to the question, though, do you think someone is a woman, because they say they are, even though they were born a man?

not__shawn__z posted...

Zeeak4444 posted...

not__shawn__z posted...

And where are you now?

Arizona, and I'm very happy about it. I lived in liberal states my whole life- NJ, NY, CA. Once your actual career gets going, you pass your college years and want to buy a nice house and all that, leaving liberal home, those 3 states in particular, is pretty tempting. I now pay a -significant- less amount of taxes, my guns aren't neutered, less weirdos, homeless (the homeless in CA/socal are fucking nuts and hostile for the non CA people wondering why I keep referencing them), and crime in general. Additionally I still get the luxury of visiting; I am an hour plane ride from pheonix to LA and SD, only a handful of hours if wanna put the dog in the car and head around big bear

I'm mad about CA because it was once my home and I was witnessing what some of these policies and laws were doing to it. The last time I was in SD, which was only a few months ago, I was watching men in hazmat suits spray bleach onto streets. Because the streets of SD are literally crawling with hepatitis A. Like a third world country.

Ya don't get me wrong, my mom moved out with her new boyfriend to Mesa last year. I've been thinking of heading out of here myself for a few years now.

I've lived in GA for a bit but other than that I've lived in SD my whole life and just traveled a lot for Hockey and work.

Calis got a lot of problems and SD itself ha s a ton. I can't defend the hep comment is extremely true. It has a lot of beauty though and unless you're in Downtown or OB most of the issues that are always mentioned about homeless and such are almost non-existent.

It's a mixed bag for sure but the culture and the diversity in everything is unrivaled. I've literally woke up in the snow to hit the slopes before going back home to surf in IB and then ended my night riding dirt bikes down in MaCain. Granted that isn't something I would do regularly but from what I hear you also can't do that anywhere else (idk if that's true though).

You've got every social group you can name, a bar for every person so to speak and some of the best attractions in the world both in the city and within a few hours drive.

I probably would leave if I wasn't in the healthcare industry. We'll see what happens though.

Jersey and NY are actually similar in that regard, especially jersey. But it's a bit nicer in CA because of how beautiful it is and it's always 75, lol

Mesa, and the area surrounding it, is great. Visit your mom when you can. The great thing about AZ, like I mentioned, is that if I really missed it and wanted to do those things, I can just take a 3 day weekend and do it. So, you know, you get all the amenities of Cali without having to deal with it's laws/Illegals/insurance/taxes/etc. And California without all that is AMAZING lol

I would think the healthcare industry is broad enough that you can pretty much go wherever, especially any big city (so Phoenix), no?

Very true lol I have a lot of friends I could always crash with too for a few days if I left.

I could leave and stay in TBH but SD has a ton going on here so my passion for the people and the scene is the only thing that's kept me in so long. If I left I would just switch fields especially considering the current state of things.

I've only been to Yuma and Phoenix myself out there. I could adjust to the climate and culture (from what I've seen at least). I'm think Colorado too TBH but not because of pot or anything. That or Oregon but I'm still struggling to convince myself to really consider either lol.

I should be seeing her in a few months though, I'll have to keep what you've said in mind. Appreciate it.
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not__shawn__z posted...

Hexenherz posted...

not__shawn__z posted...

Hexenherz posted...

No, I don't agree at all. If someone tells you repeatedly that they identify as X gender and you do not treat them as X gender (which has potentially broader implications, such as which facility they ultimately go to, who sees them, the form of privacy they're afforded, etc.), then that's literally discrimination and harassment.

The purpose of health care is not to discriminate against people based on sexual orientation, race, gender, etc. This law codifies that into legislation, along with a slew of other protections.

Okay, well. Let's try something else. You understand that just because you say you're a woman, that doesn't make you a woman?

Because, in a lot of circumstances and contrary to your argument, they -need- to treat you as your biological gender, not the gender you think you are

They can treat you as your anatomy dictates while still respecting your identity.
I do understand your point (I think) that it can maybe cause confusion on a patient's chart but in cases like that I imagine they can just use a code to denote the person is female with male parts or vice versa.

Well, it can do a lot more than cause confusion. Women don't exactly walk into a men's health clinic, and vice versa. There are situations where you are not even going to be able to be treated, nevermind treated properly

In regards to the question, though, do you think someone is a woman, because they say they are, even though they were born a man?

1 - I doubt a person who identifies as a woman is automatically going to just stroll into a woman's clinic anyway... Just because she identifies as a woman doesn't mean she doesn't recognize what sort of health treatment she needs... she's not going to go to an oncologist for a tooth cleaning, you know what I mean?

2 - I respect peoples' decisions and support the law, which is rather clear in this case. It's not my position to judge and determine someone's gender. That's up to the determination of the individual and their doctor(s).
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CO is beautiful too. I'd stay away from Oregon lol. Good luck with everything man

Hexenherz posted...

1 - I doubt a person who identifies as a woman is automatically going to just stroll into a woman's clinic anyway... Just because she identifies as a woman doesn't mean she doesn't recognize what sort of health treatment she needs... she's not going to go to an oncologist for a tooth cleaning, you know what I mean?

2 - I respect peoples' decisions and support the law, which is rather clear in this case. It's not my position to judge and determine someone's gender. That's up to the determination of the individual and their doctor(s).

As far as 1, wouldn't you say that's a rough assumption? You don't think a lot of these transgenders truly believe what they are claiming to be? I mean, that's the crux of the movement. And of course she's not going to an oncologist for a tooth cleaning. That's not really what I'm referring to though. Im saying, if you get let's just say a general blood panel done. The results of a male vs a female are going to be pretty different, at a significant rate in certain vital tests

With 2, so just so I'm completely sure of what you're saying, you're saying someone's gender is determined by their own mind, and not basic biology, right?

I think it's a gross generalization to say "a lot of these transgenders truly believe what they are claiming to be". I only know a few personally... and they are all realistic, down to earth people who understand their own anatomy and bodies and what the medical treatments are. It's kind of silly to believe that someone magically forgets that they have a penis instead of a vagina just because they have gender dysphoria. I'm not saying it's impossible, but I certainly don't think that's the norm.

Regarding 2, who's to say that "basic biology" doesn't drive how they feel in their mind? I'm neither a doctor nor a psychologist and I don't claim to know the internal mechanisms that leads someone to feel as if they are the wrong gender for their body. But I understand that it happens, and I understand that as a normal human being it is not my place to judge or dictate how someone else feels.
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It could be, but in that same token, I think it'd be erroneous to assume they all don't think they are what they're claiming to be, too. I'm sure it's somewhere near the middle

Don't get me wrong, I am no doctor either. But to answer your question, science, biology and chromosomes would be the things that say otherwise. I think you're thinking a little too emotionally. You're not judging or dictating anything by stating facts

I am white. I am not black because I'm claiming I'm black. Likewise, I can't just call myself a 12 year old and have that be true. I wish I could say I was The Rock and have it be true, but sadly that's not the case

The whole transgender thing really is bizarre to me. I feel bad for them, they have a ridiculously high remorse and suicide rate. Something needs to be done, and I don't think "accept them and call them by their preferred pronouns" is anywhere close to the answer. I think any doctor or psychiatrist who is advocating that should be sued

I hesitate to assume it's "somewhere near the middle" - there is no evidence to support the idea that someone somehow becomes oblivious to their body's anatomy because they identify as the opposite gender.

I am not taking this emotionally at all. Biology (which... is science) is a lot deeper than just "I have a penis so I am a man". To simply stop there and attempt to tune everything out would be the emotional response. To push onward, study further and challenge our current conventions, that's what science is about.

"I feel bad for them, they have a ridiculously high remorse and suicide rate". Remorse based on what? And arguably the suicide rate is driven by external factors as well as internal (for instance, the lack of societal acceptance for transgenderism).

"Something needs to be done" - yet you advocate the opposite of anything remotely approaching treating them with decency and a sense of respect. I love that you throw in the "any doctor or psychiatrist advocating that should be sued" bit at the end. Why? What is the rationale? What is your magical solution?

People said many of the same things about homosexuality just a couple decades ago. People say the same thing about it to this day. Ignorance is not the answer. Ignorance is not doing something.
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KingCrabCake posted...

California is such a joke. We shouldnt give them any federal aid

Why are you on gamefaqs, Donald? Do your job
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Hexenherz posted...

I hesitate to assume it's "somewhere near the middle" - there is no evidence to support the idea that someone somehow becomes oblivious to their body's anatomy because they identify as the opposite gender.

I am not taking this emotionally at all. Biology (which... is science) is a lot deeper than just "I have a penis so I am a man". To simply stop there and attempt to tune everything out would be the emotional response. To push onward, study further and challenge our current conventions, that's what science is about.

"I feel bad for them, they have a ridiculously high remorse and suicide rate". Remorse based on what? And arguably the suicide rate is driven by external factors as well as internal (for instance, the lack of societal acceptance for transgenderism).

"Something needs to be done" - yet you advocate the opposite of anything remotely approaching treating them with decency and a sense of respect. I love that you throw in the "any doctor or psychiatrist advocating that should be sued" bit at the end. Why? What is the rationale? What is your magical solution?

People said many of the same things about homosexuality just a couple decades ago. People say the same thing about it to this day. Ignorance is not the answer. Ignorance is not doing something.

There's even less evidence to assume you can change your gender if you feel like it. And by less I mean zero

You are taking it emotionally, even if you don't realize it. You are afraid to say facts because you think it makes you ignorant or bigoted or whatever. Which obviously isn't the case

The idea that lack of acceptance leads to their suicide rate is nonsense. If you do your own research at how high that suicide rate is compared to everyone else, you cannot logically come to that conclusion by yourself. It's something the liberal media says, but it's simply not true. The evidence isn't there. If that was the case, blacks would have a ridiculous suicide rate based on decades of racism

You are once again thinking emotionally. Nowhere have I advocated not treating them with decency. I don't appreciate that misrepresentation as we are having a civil discussion here

My rationale is that, if someone with schizophrenia goes to the doctor and tells them about the voices he hears in his head, and the doctors response is "that's perfectly okay! Go about your life!" And something tragic ensues - I think that is a pretty good malpractice lawsuit

I have no magic solution, but I'd start at therapy

The constant comparisons to gays and trans make less sense than a lot of people seem to think. Gay people have a sexual preference. Transgenders think they are a different person completely. They really aren't interlinked at all, other than the "mass perception used to hate them but look we came around" talking point

Ny doing the same

Go Dems!
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not__shawn__z posted...

Hexenherz posted...

I hesitate to assume it's "somewhere near the middle" - there is no evidence to support the idea that someone somehow becomes oblivious to their body's anatomy because they identify as the opposite gender.

I am not taking this emotionally at all. Biology (which... is science) is a lot deeper than just "I have a penis so I am a man". To simply stop there and attempt to tune everything out would be the emotional response. To push onward, study further and challenge our current conventions, that's what science is about.

"I feel bad for them, they have a ridiculously high remorse and suicide rate". Remorse based on what? And arguably the suicide rate is driven by external factors as well as internal (for instance, the lack of societal acceptance for transgenderism).

"Something needs to be done" - yet you advocate the opposite of anything remotely approaching treating them with decency and a sense of respect. I love that you throw in the "any doctor or psychiatrist advocating that should be sued" bit at the end. Why? What is the rationale? What is your magical solution?

People said many of the same things about homosexuality just a couple decades ago. People say the same thing about it to this day. Ignorance is not the answer. Ignorance is not doing something.

There's even less evidence to assume you can change your gender if you feel like it. And by less I mean zero

You are taking it emotionally, even if you don't realize it. You are afraid to say facts because you think it makes you ignorant or bigoted or whatever. Which obviously isn't the case

The idea that lack of acceptance leads to their suicide rate is nonsense. If you do your own research at how high that suicide rate is compared to everyone else, you cannot logically come to that conclusion by yourself. It's something the liberal media says, but it's simply not true. The evidence isn't there. If that was the case, blacks would have a ridiculous suicide rate based on decades of racism

You are once again thinking emotionally. Nowhere have I advocated not treating them with decency. I don't appreciate that misrepresentation as we are having a civil discussion here

My rationale is that, if someone with schizophrenia goes to the doctor and tells them about the voices he hears in his head, and the doctors response is "that's perfectly okay! Go about your life!" And something tragic ensues - I think that is a pretty good malpractice lawsuit

I have no magic solution, but I'd start at therapy

The constant comparisons to gays and trans make less sense than a lot of people seem to think. Gay people have a sexual preference. Transgenders think they are a different person completely. They really aren't interlinked at all, other than the "mass perception used to hate them but look we came around" talking point

Shut the fuck up and never speak on this again.
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LMFAO that is a hard trigger. I apologize. Which part did you have a problem with? The "just because you say you're x doesn't mean it's true" jist of it? Or?

Schizophrenia is not the same as gender dysphoria though... That's like comparing HIV to syphilis just because they're both STDs even though one was more serious implications than the other.

Meanwhile, drawing a comparison between homosexuality and transgenderism is entirely valid for many logical reasons. As I already stated, many of the discussion points being covered right now applied in arguments against acceptance of homosexuals decades ago (and still in use by some people today).

You say "Gay people have a sexual preference", as if that's some special common folk wisdom that's been around for centuries. That's really only become the popular viewpoint in the US in the last decade. People continue to insist that "homosexuals are ruining the fabric of society and family values", that "homosexual parents raise their children to be homosexual", that there's a "homosexual agenda" in the media. Going back just a few decades you see actual public service announcements warning children about the danger of homosexuals (because they're pedophiles). Even in other countries that association exists and the concept of pedophile and homosexual are practically inseparable.

Now apply that logic to transgenderism. They are experiencing the same backlash today that gays/lesbians faced a couple decades ago - the basic core arguments that it's "not biologically driven" and that "it's not moral".

"I have no magic solution, but I'd start at therapy" - Do you understand that therapy is one of the basic components of a treatment plan for those experiencing gender dysphoria?
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not__shawn__z posted...

LMFAO that is a hard trigger. I apologize. Which part did you have a problem with? The "just because you say you're x doesn't mean it's true" jist of it? Or?

Your crippling ignorance.
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dave_is_slick posted...

not__shawn__z posted...

LMFAO that is a hard trigger. I apologize. Which part did you have a problem with? The "just because you say you're x doesn't mean it's true" jist of it? Or?

Your crippling ignorance.

yikes that's a melty
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dave_is_slick posted...

not__shawn__z posted...

LMFAO that is a hard trigger. I apologize. Which part did you have a problem with? The "just because you say you're x doesn't mean it's true" jist of it? Or?

Your crippling ignorance.

Ouch. The truth sliced through this boys body.
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Hexenherz posted...

Now apply that logic to transgenderism. They are experiencing the same backlash today that gays/lesbians faced a couple decades ago - the basic core arguments that it's "not biologically driven" and that "it's not moral".

Except the "not biologically driven" excuse was never valid for homosexuality because we can observe homosexuality in nature. What animals are transgendered? The closest you get are frogs that change sex, and they physically modify their DNA
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s0nicfan posted...

Except the "not biologically driven" excuse was never valid for homosexuality because we can observe homosexuality in nature. What animals are transgendered that don't actually modify their DNA?

who are you trying to bullshit?

leviamon2 posted...

s0nicfan posted...

Except the "not biologically driven" excuse was never valid for homosexuality because we can observe homosexuality in nature. What animals are transgendered that don't actually modify their DNA?

who are you trying to bullshit?

About what?
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Literally all plant and animal behavior on this planet is biologically driven. There is a function that enables it to happen because of genetics. To say that "homosexuality is not a biological issue because we see it in animals" is to display an utter lack of understanding in basic biological principles.

EDIT: I should clarify that behavior is not solely genetically driven, but it does help shape how minds are formulated and developed.
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Was giving you an example. The point was, you don't enable. You don't tell a crazy person to stay the same, a drug addict to keep it up, an alcoholic that beer is good for you, etc

And that "used to not be accepted but now is" comparison is exactly where it ends. A lot of things weren't accepted and now are. It's a loose comparison that doesn't hold much weight. Liking dick or pussy is a lot different than saying you're something you're not. In some ways, the gays are opposite of the transgendered

Propaganda and or views of gays in media seems out of place. All I was doing was saying the comparison is crappy. Yes, I get that at one point gays weren't seen the same as they are now. I understand that. No matter how much you bring it up, it doesn't make it a stronger argument

And no, I didn't, and I honestly don't believe it. All I see is attempts to normalize it and make it okay, that I can't see them soliciting therapy which would be the opposite, too hard

Don't think we will find anymore common ground here man haha

dave_is_slick posted...

not__shawn__z posted...

LMFAO that is a hard trigger. I apologize. Which part did you have a problem with? The "just because you say you're x doesn't mean it's true" jist of it? Or?

Your crippling ignorance.

I don't identify with crippling ignorance you fucking republican bigot

Hexenherz posted...

Literally all plant and animal behavior on this planet is biologically driven. There is a function that enables it to happen because of genetics. To say that "homosexuality is not a biological issue because we see it in animals" is to display an utter lack of understanding in basic biological principles.

You must have misread me. I said the old excuse of "homosexuality isn't natural" that was used in the 70s is bullshit explicitly because we CAN see it in nature. That's why the excuse isn't valid
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DontHateMe posted...

dave_is_slick posted...

not__shawn__z posted...

LMFAO that is a hard trigger. I apologize. Which part did you have a problem with? The "just because you say you're x doesn't mean it's true" jist of it? Or?

Your crippling ignorance.

Ouch. The truth sliced through this boys body.

Everyone get a load at this racist ignorant trump voter who assumed I was a fucking male

We can't find a common ground because you're not able to connect two points together. It's rather sad.
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not__shawn__z posted...

I don't identify with crippling ignorance you f***ing republican bigot

Did a transgendered person murder your family?
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Hexenherz posted...

We can't find a common ground because you're not able to connect two points together. It's rather sad.

Your attempts at misrepresenting my argument and then this are shitty. I enjoyed the convo without this. Thanks for ruining it. A guy who doesn't understand the concept of a man and a woman is accusing someone else of not being able to connect two points together. A guy who thinks you can change genders at will is calling other people sad. Lol. Right. Thanks for wanting to get the liberal insults in and ruining the discussion hexenerz. Have a good one

It's not about changing "genders at will", that's entirely where you're mistaken and unwilling to understand the basic concept of "gender dysphoria". You've already admitted you don't understand what the treatment is for it by implying that "you'd get them therapy".
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Um...No one understands the treatment for it. That's why they keep killing themselves at an astronomical rate

And it is. At will. Meaning you're a man because you say you're a man, and a woman because you say you're a woman. That is literally what you're arguing, I don't know why you're trying to backpedal now

And I don't care. Your liberal outburst was childish and ruined our discord. No longer enjoying talking with you so I'm outta here like last year

That is not what "at will" means.
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Hexenherz posted...

That is not what "at will" means.

Why are you still engaging the troll???
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It's really sad to see other people try to control other's bodies so much.

If a man wants to become a woman or vice-versa, fucking let them. Stop trying to control other's bodies because of your fucking feelings on the matter. Them going through that change will literally not affect you in any way, shape, or form. It's not like your neighbor getting a sex change automatically means you have to too.

Jesus christ people, this shit isn't hard. I don't know why the right has such a hard on for "small government" and then wants to tell people how to live their life. Hypocrites.
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