Current Events > I'm hoping the Switch is the way console gaming trends in the next decade

(+) Yeah! (+)

But I do think consoles will be going all digital/to cartridges soon. The benefits are just too great and storage space should decrease going forward. Love how fast it is to boot up Switch compared to the others. Boots right up where you were like it was just paused, over an entire week. Faster loading and saving time. No disk drive necessary, as my PS3's disc reader broke twice. Quality of life improvements.
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krazychao5 posted...

Sega tried it and failed. That's why Gameboy destroyed the Sega shitheld.

That's my point.

krazychao5 posted...

there were no rechargeable batteries

There were but they were much too expensive to put in a mass produced handheld
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krazychao5 posted...

But I do think consoles will be going all digital/to cartridges soon.

Is this bait?
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ZombiePelican posted...

krazychao5 posted...

But I do think consoles will be going all digital/to cartridges soon.

Is this bait?

Everything is moving solid state. The era of disc media is over. Really, discs were just a formality this generation anyway.
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Coffeebeanz posted...

ZombiePelican posted...

krazychao5 posted...

But I do think consoles will be going all digital/to cartridges soon.

Is this bait?

Everything is moving solid state. The era of disc media is over. Really, discs were just a formality this generation anyway.

Yeah, I'm not sure the point of discs if it just installs the game on the console.
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Coffeebeanz posted...

Everything is moving solid state. The era of disc media is over. Really, discs were just a formality this generation anyway.

Only Nintnedo fans would advocate regressing like this.

Discs hold significantly more data than a cartridge and cost significantly less to produce than cartridges

More than two decades later and Nintendo fans still can't understand cartridges are what killed the N64, it's pretty sad
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Disc storage maxes out at 128GB.

Cartridges can now go up to 1TB.
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l Dudeboy l posted...

Disc storage maxes out at 128GB.

Cartridges can now go up to 1TB.

But still cost significantly more to produce than a disc. Which is why the same game physical on Switch cost more than PS4 or Xbone
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I hope so, too. Switch is the best designed console ever IMO.
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ZombiePelican posted...

Coffeebeanz posted...

Everything is moving solid state. The era of disc media is over. Really, discs were just a formality this generation anyway.

Only Nintnedo fans would advocate regressing like this.

Discs hold significantly more data than a cartridge and cost significantly less to produce than cartridges

More than two decades later and Nintendo fans still can't understand cartridges are what killed the N64, it's pretty sad

Discs also stream data so slowly they're no longer viable to play games from directly, which is why they have to be installed to hard drives this generation.

They literally only exist on PS4 and X1 to give gamers a sense of ownership over the game they bought. Hell, X1X versions of games are actually too big for BLU RAY discs.
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Wetterdew posted...

I hope so, too. Switch is the best designed console ever IMO.

I'm sure you'll be saying that when your screen starts getting scratches after being taken out of the dock one too many times.
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I feel bad for Pelican. Nintendo hits an overwhelming success so he can't even troll in his sig anymore, poor guy.
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ZombiePelican posted...

l Dudeboy l posted...

Disc storage maxes out at 128GB.

Cartridges can now go up to 1TB.

But still cost significantly more to produce than a disc. Which is why the same game physical on Switch cost more than PS4 or Xbone

Yeah, but in a market that is constantly demanding better and better graphics, which take up the majority of a game's file size, it's only a matter of time until discs are dead, and people have either moved on to solid state storage for games, or fully digital. It's not unreasonable to think that the development cost of solid state will have also gone down by that time.
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Hopefully this never happens. I don't want a shitty, gimmicky console that forces you to pay an extra $90 to have a regular, not garbage controller. I also like having more than 10 decent games on my console.
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LIsJustice posted...

Wetterdew posted...

I hope so, too. Switch is the best designed console ever IMO.

I'm sure you'll be saying that when your screen starts getting scratches after being taken out of the dock one too many times.

I have a screen protector on my Switch, so I'm not worried. But out of curiosity I just checked it, and it has zero scratches after over a year of constant switching. So sorry, but you're wrong
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l Dudeboy l posted...

ZombiePelican posted...

l Dudeboy l posted...

Disc storage maxes out at 128GB.

Cartridges can now go up to 1TB.

But still cost significantly more to produce than a disc. Which is why the same game physical on Switch cost more than PS4 or Xbone

Yeah, but in a market that is constantly demanding better and better graphics, which take up the majority of a game's file size, it's only a matter of time until discs are dead, and people have either moved on to solid state storage for games, or fully digital. It's not unreasonable to think that the development cost of solid state will have also gone down by that time.

BD discs neither stream fast enough not have the capacity for 4K gaming.
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ReD_ToMaTo posted...

Hopefully this never happens. I don't want a shitty, gimmicky console that forces you to pay an extra $90 to have a regular, not garbage controller. I also like having more than 10 decent games on my console.

so edgy be careful you don't cut yourself.
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So they're already outdated.
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ReD_ToMaTo posted...

Hopefully this never happens. I don't want a shitty, gimmicky console that forces you to pay an extra $90 to have a regular, not garbage controller. I also like having more than 10 decent games on my console.

What console are you describing?

Cause the Switch will have over 20 decent games on it by the end of the year, and you don't need to buy an extra controller for it because the joycons are perfect.

I assume you're talking about some other system?

Darklit_Minuet posted...

ReD_ToMaTo posted...

Hopefully this never happens. I don't want a shitty, gimmicky console that forces you to pay an extra $90 to have a regular, not garbage controller. I also like having more than 10 decent games on my console.

What console are you describing?

Cause the Switch will have over 20 decent games on it by the end of the year, and you don't need to buy an extra controller for it because the joycons are perfect.

I assume you're talking about some other system?

Switch's first year made PS4's and X1's look like the Virtual Boy's.
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Coffeebeanz posted...

Darklit_Minuet posted...

ReD_ToMaTo posted...

Hopefully this never happens. I don't want a shitty, gimmicky console that forces you to pay an extra $90 to have a regular, not garbage controller. I also like having more than 10 decent games on my console.

What console are you describing?

Cause the Switch will have over 20 decent games on it by the end of the year, and you don't need to buy an extra controller for it because the joycons are perfect.

I assume you're talking about some other system?

Switch's first year made PS4's and X1's look like the Virtual Boy's.

Haters gonna hate
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krazychao5 posted...

ZombiePelican posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

That is part of my point.

Hmmmmmm no, no it isn't

That one sentence shattered your whole point you tried to make. Nothing was stopping anyone from making a home console powered handheld for the decades since the original Gameboy.

BJ-blazkowics posted...

The technology didn't have to be SNES level for the GB to have great games (for its time)

Too bad that's not the point you were originally trying to make before getting rekt

Sega tried it and failed. That's why Gameboy destroyed the Sega shitheld. Gameboy lasted what, 4-5x the time that Shitgear was? There was a reason why handhelds were limited in power..there were no rechargeable batteries.

The Gameboy outlived the game gear AND the nomad. Good point.

I dont think purely mobile GPUs are going to carry us forward since high-performance GPUs are just too power hungry. To get something a bit ahead of the PS4(but still behind the Pro) we're currently looking at 35W~(for a mobile GTX 1050) which is roughly triple the power consumption of the entire Switch SOC. To get a mobile chip on par with the PS4 Pro, we're talking 80-100W~ which crushes laptop batteries, let alone the dinky ones they could fit in tablets.

As we move forward the power level of GPUs that fit into a tablet device will obviously go up(and Nvidia already had a better SOC(Tegra X2) than the Tegra X1 in the Switch which was 50%~ faster) but desktop GPUs will always be a more economical choice for traditional video game consoles tbh. And the way GPUs advance means that even desktop GPUs wind up being underpowered by the time the consoles launch, and neutering those even more so they can fit into a usable handheld doesnt make a whole lot of sense for a lot of people, I think.
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halomonkey1_3_5 posted...

I dont think purely mobile GPUs are going to carry us forward since high-performance GPUs are just too power hungry. To get something a bit ahead of the PS4(but still behind the Pro) we're currently looking at 35W~(for a mobile GTX 1050) which is roughly triple the power consumption of the entire Switch SOC. To get a mobile chip on par with the PS4 Pro, we're talking 80-100W~ which crushes laptop batteries, let alone the dinky ones they could fit in tablets.

As we move forward the power level of GPUs that fit into a tablet device will obviously go up(and Nvidia already had a better SOC than the Tegra X1 in the Switch which was 50%~ faster) but desktop GPUs will always be a more economical choice for traditional video game consoles tbh. And the way GPUs advance means that even desktop GPUs wind up being underpowered by the time the consoles launch, and neutering those even more so they can fit into a usable handheld doesnt make a whole lot of sense for a lot of people, I think.

Interesting take.

How powerful is the most powerful iPad compared to the switch?

BJ-blazkowics posted...

How powerful is the most powerful iPad compared to the switch?

iPad Pro is faster from what I can find. How much faster depends on some variables but it is faster. Of course, the Switch could have been faster than it currently is(and possibly faster than the iPad Pro), but it would have needed the Tegra X2, which means it would have been more expensive, later to market and possibly had worse battery life and thermals.
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halomonkey1_3_5 posted...

iPad Pro

iPad Pro is also double the cost of the Switch.
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I love Nintendo and the Switch, but damn, some of you fanboys sound like you're still 10.
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LockeMonster posted...

I love Nintendo and the Switch, but damn, some of you fanboys sound like you're still 10.

I'm not implying that the Switch is the best console; just that I'd like to see a trend towards mobile architecture in consoles whenever it becomes feasible to do so without compromising game quality.
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halomonkey1_3_5 posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

How powerful is the most powerful iPad compared to the switch?

iPad Pro is faster from what I can find. How much faster depends on some variables but it is faster. Of course, the Switch could have been faster than it currently is(and possibly faster than the iPad Pro), but it would have needed the Tegra X2, which means it would have been more expensive, later to market and possibly had worse battery life and thermals.

So perhaps in say, 5 years we could have an iPad-pro powerful porta-console?

I feel we're starting to creep on the law of diminishing returns where I comes to hardware power, so we truly don't need that much more do we?

BJ-blazkowics posted...

halomonkey1_3_5 posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

How powerful is the most powerful iPad compared to the switch?

iPad Pro is faster from what I can find. How much faster depends on some variables but it is faster. Of course, the Switch could have been faster than it currently is(and possibly faster than the iPad Pro), but it would have needed the Tegra X2, which means it would have been more expensive, later to market and possibly had worse battery life and thermals.

So perhaps in say, 5 years we could have an iPad-pro powerful porta-console?

I feel we're starting to creep on the law of diminishing returns where I comes to hardware power, so we truly don't need that much more do we?

At this point, advanced GPUs are primarily needed for 4K+ rendering. We definitely have hit diminishing returns at 1080p, though
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Coffeebeanz posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

halomonkey1_3_5 posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

How powerful is the most powerful iPad compared to the switch?

iPad Pro is faster from what I can find. How much faster depends on some variables but it is faster. Of course, the Switch could have been faster than it currently is(and possibly faster than the iPad Pro), but it would have needed the Tegra X2, which means it would have been more expensive, later to market and possibly had worse battery life and thermals.

So perhaps in say, 5 years we could have an iPad-pro powerful porta-console?

I feel we're starting to creep on the law of diminishing returns where I comes to hardware power, so we truly don't need that much more do we?

At this point, advanced GPUs are primarily needed for 4K+ rendering. We definitely have hit diminishing returns at 1080p, though

I think we're on to something here.

Have the portable just do 1080p or maybe even 4k, and then the cradle can have extra processors for the stuff that's beyond 4k or VR. The trick is you can still play any game on the portable or the cradle

Coffeebeanz posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

halomonkey1_3_5 posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

How powerful is the most powerful iPad compared to the switch?

iPad Pro is faster from what I can find. How much faster depends on some variables but it is faster. Of course, the Switch could have been faster than it currently is(and possibly faster than the iPad Pro), but it would have needed the Tegra X2, which means it would have been more expensive, later to market and possibly had worse battery life and thermals.

So perhaps in say, 5 years we could have an iPad-pro powerful porta-console?

I feel we're starting to creep on the law of diminishing returns where I comes to hardware power, so we truly don't need that much more do we?

At this point, advanced GPUs are primarily needed for 4K+ rendering. We definitely have hit diminishing returns at 1080p, though

We don't need to go over 1080p though, meaning advanced GPUs are unnecessary

Darklit_Minuet posted...

Coffeebeanz posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

halomonkey1_3_5 posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

How powerful is the most powerful iPad compared to the switch?

iPad Pro is faster from what I can find. How much faster depends on some variables but it is faster. Of course, the Switch could have been faster than it currently is(and possibly faster than the iPad Pro), but it would have needed the Tegra X2, which means it would have been more expensive, later to market and possibly had worse battery life and thermals.

So perhaps in say, 5 years we could have an iPad-pro powerful porta-console?

I feel we're starting to creep on the law of diminishing returns where I comes to hardware power, so we truly don't need that much more do we?

At this point, advanced GPUs are primarily needed for 4K+ rendering. We definitely have hit diminishing returns at 1080p, though

We don't need to go over 1080p though, meaning advanced GPUs are unnecessary

agreed

Coffeebeanz posted...

LockeMonster posted...

I love Nintendo and the Switch, but damn, some of you fanboys sound like you're still 10.

I'm not implying that the Switch is the best console; just that I'd like to see a trend towards mobile architecture in consoles whenever it becomes feasible to do so without compromising game quality.

I'm gonna take it a step further and say that I actually DO think Switch is the best console. I've played all the consoles back to the Gamecube/Xbox/PS2 generation. It has the best console design ever, and if it continues to pump out games like it has been so far then it'll cement its status as far as I'm concerned.

Its biggest problem IMO is its poor online infrastructure, but that hasn't bothered me so far and I think it will be updated this year to be improved.

*Preparing for hostile CEmen to tell me my opinion is wrong because Switch has X problems*
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I think the future of consoles is external GPUs regardless of how portable the consoles are(or arent) tbh

Thinking of the PS4 Pro and XB1X, both could have been relatively simple eGPU boxes and shaved a couple hundred dollars off the MSRP, although then you would be losing the CPU upgrades each got...but considering the price difference and that every game has to work with the base models anyway, I dont think it's terribly important

I don't think it would have made much different to the Switch hardware itself but you could have ended up with higher tier docks which could push higher resolutions

It's also much cheaper and easier to R&D an eGPU box than it is to engineer an entirely new console SKU with different thermal requirements
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Full digital shouldn't be a thing until legal power is moved away from EULAs and DRM. It will be anyway, but eh. Makes you wonder if BitCoin has any true legal worth.
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halomonkey1_3_5 posted...

I think the future of consoles is external GPUs regardless of how portable the consoles are(or arent) tbh

Thinking of the PS4 Pro and XB1X, both could have been relatively simple eGPU boxes and shaved a couple hundred dollars off the MSRP, although then you would be losing the CPU upgrades each got...but considering the price difference and that every game has to work with the base models anyway, I dont think it's terribly important

I don't think it would have made much different to the Switch hardware itself but you could have ended up with higher tier docks which could push higher resolutions

It's also much cheaper and easier to R&D an eGPU box than it is to engineer an entirely new console SKU with different thermal requirements

Good call, a dock could house a beefy auxiliary GPU

ZombiePelican posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

ZombiePelican posted...

Not at all, believing everything needs to be a piss weak console with a portable gimmick is backwards thinking

I don't really feel the Switch is piss weak. It may not be console-grade, but it could even handle Doom, which was supposed to be too much for the PS3

It's about to be TWO generations in terms of power behind the competition and is running at the level of their competition from more than decade ago. It's piss weak no matter how you try to spin it

The guy who suddenly wants a Switch because it has Dark Souls has already gone back to talking shit about the console. Lol
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i realize this topic has gone places since the OP, but I just wanted to chime in and say that mobility in my console has zero appeal to me. absolutely none.

i'd rather have more power or a cheaper product than something with "portability" that will just sit at home on my entertainment center.
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P4wn4g3 posted...

Full digital shouldn't be a thing until legal power is moved away from EULAs and DRM

Neither EULA nor DRM has any legal power.

You'll never be arrested for hacking your own console, despite the fact that it would both break the EULA and the DRM protection it has.

Darklit_Minuet posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

Full digital shouldn't be a thing until legal power is moved away from EULAs and DRM

Neither EULA nor DRM has any legal power.

You'll never be arrested for hacking your own console, despite the fact that it would both break the EULA and the DRM protection it has.

Patently wrong. One of my fellow students did a thesis on this in college. You're just brainwashed in the digital age, like most people.

Giant_Aspirin posted...

more power

Nvidia thanks you for your patronage, and in return will continue to make the video game industry it's bitch.
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P4wn4g3 posted...

Patently wrong. One of my fellow students did a thesis on this in college. You're just brainwashed in the digital age, like most people.

Surely you can back up your assertion

I've hacked just about every console I've had and I'm not in jail

Darklit_Minuet posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

Patently wrong. One of my fellow students did a thesis on this in college. You're just brainwashed in the digital age, like most people.

Surely you can back up your assertion

I've hacked just about every console I've had and I'm not in jail

I'm not going to lengths for you
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2010/09/the-end-of-used-major-ruling-upholds-tough-software-licenses/
If you want evidence it's not hard to find. Just because you can break the law or some shitty contract doesn't make it within the rules.
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P4wn4g3 posted...

Darklit_Minuet posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

Patently wrong. One of my fellow students did a thesis on this in college. You're just brainwashed in the digital age, like most people.

Surely you can back up your assertion

I've hacked just about every console I've had and I'm not in jail

I'm not going to lengths for you
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2010/09/the-end-of-used-major-ruling-upholds-tough-software-licenses/
If you want evidence it's not hard to find. Just because you can break the law or some shitty contract doesn't make it within the rules.

None of that has anything to do with someone being arrested for hacking their console.

Darklit_Minuet posted...

Neither EULA nor DRM has any legal power.

You literally said this. You're wrong. End of discussion.
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P4wn4g3 posted...

Darklit_Minuet posted...

Neither EULA nor DRM has any legal power.

You literally said this. You're wrong. End of discussion.

Not in any way that influences me.

I don't give a shit about being able to resell software

Darklit_Minuet posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

Darklit_Minuet posted...

Neither EULA nor DRM has any legal power.

You literally said this. You're wrong. End of discussion.

Not in any way that influences me.

I don't give a shit about being able to resell software

It extends fairly broadly. EULAs are basically included with all software and can include anything in them really. Waive all your rights, agree to privacy breaches, allow unreported fees, anything really. Companies extend this to their digital content as far as they can. I don't think we've even seen bad yet as far as that goes.
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