Current Events > WashPo: Struggling to prevent terrorist attacks, France wants to 'reform' Islam

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://wapo.st/2qDaXLo

Speaking alongside the flag-draped coffin of a police officer killed in a terrorist attack in southern France, President Emmanuel Macron last month lay blame on underground Islamism and those who indoctrinate on our soil and corrupt daily.

The attack added further urgency to a project already in the works: Macron has embarked on a controversial quest to change Islam in France with the goal of integration but also preventing radicalization.

He has said that in the coming months he will announce a blueprint for the whole organization of Islam. And those trying to anticipate what that will look like are turning their attention to Hakim El Karoui, a leading voice on how Islamic traditions fit within French culture.

Its hard to miss that the man who appears to have Macrons ear on this most sensitive of subjects cuts a similar figure. Like the president, El Karoui is an ex-Rothschild investment banker with an elite social pedigree who favors well-tailored suits, crisp white shirts and the lofty province of big ideas.

The latest of those ideas is this: that the best way to integrate Islam within French society is to promote a version of the religion practiced in peace by believers who will not have the need to loudly proclaim their faith.

But if El Karoui is the model for how Macron envisions merging Islamic traditions and French values, the reform effort may end up stumbling along a rough road.

Hes disconnected from everyday Muslims, and he has legitimacy on the question only because he happens to be named Hakim El Karoui, and thats it, said Yasser Louati, a French civil liberties advocate and Muslim community organizer.

Since 2015, more than 230 people in France have been killed in terrorist attacks, most of them perpetrated by French and European nationals affiliated with or inspired by the Islamic State. Meanwhile, as many as 1,910 French nationals have gone to wage jihad in Iraq and Syria, according to the Soufan Center, which studies radicalization.

Good luck, France. These cultural re-engineering projects don't have a great track record. But I'll give them credit for finally admitting this is a cultural problem with Islam and taking steps to address that.
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Better than the people who want to expel Muslims completely from the West.
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Religion of Baguettes
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To date, the French cultural conversion therapy centers haven't had much success:

In 2016, the government opened the first of 13 planned deradicalization centers in a converted chateau in the Loire Valley, where at-risk youths volunteered for an immersive program in French culture and history. But the approach came under criticism for being too nationalistic, for taking the youths out of their homes and communities, and for relying on questionable science. Then locals began to protest having suspected terrorists next door. The Loire center closed in 2017, the concept declared a total fiasco.

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I thought European countries where trying to spread Sufi Islam to uproot the Wahhabism (violent Islam).

Sufis are like hippies, love peace and dancing is what they're mostly known for.
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shockthemonkey posted...

Sounds like what we do in the US with kids who at at-risk to join gangs.

Yeah it seems very similar. It's crazy to me as the control of ISIS subsides and they lose more and more land the rise of radicalization of citizens and nationals seems to be a larger concern. I suppose it's part of the "I have nothing and feel worthless, they promise everything and make me feel proud" mentality that normally leads to radicalization
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Feminists have been trying to reform straight white males for decades and feminists are still pissed at us. How do they expect to reform Muslim Somali migrants that grew up with no concept of western liberal values?
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It's hard for me to get a good read on this mommy fucker. Sometimes its seems like he really does love his country and wants to protect it from getting fucked by Islam which is more than I can say for some of his European contemporaries, or is he just trying to exploit the right wing movements with toothless, naive measures like this probably is.
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Hah, that's a good one.
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Solar_Crimson posted...

Better than the people who want to expel Muslims completely from the West.

I guess the lives of innocent people mean nothing to you. Why are you SJWs so cold blooded and self centered?
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Xavius posted...

Solar_Crimson posted...

Better than the people who want to expel Muslims completely from the West.

I guess the lives of innocent people mean nothing to you. Why are you SJWs so cold blooded and self centered?

Radical Muslims =/= all Muslims
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NeonOctopus posted...

Religion of Baguettes

underrated post
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The Great Muta 22 posted...

shockthemonkey posted...

Sounds like what we do in the US with kids who at at-risk to join gangs.

Yeah it seems very similar. It's crazy to me as the control of ISIS subsides and they lose more and more land the rise of radicalization of citizens and nationals seems to be a larger concern. I suppose it's part of the "I have nothing and feel worthless, they promise everything and make me feel proud" mentality that normally leads to radicalization

Thats the formula for most types of indoctrination. But France has a cultural problem on top of that.
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The Admiral posted...

Thats the formula for most types of indoctrination. But France has a cultural problem on top of that.

Perhaps, but even if they completely closed their borders and even went as far as to completely outlaw the practice of Islam, I don't think that would come close to stopping the self radicalization and probably contribute to more people indulging in such beliefs. It's the same idea behind censoring ideas in general, it doesn't make those ideas go away, it simply drives them underground and creates an almost mystic like appeal towards them.

Same reason I had a huge issue with the left in this country trying to silence people mild people like Shapiro or even more extremists like Spencer or Jared Taylor and such. Protesting or places not hosting things or ideas is fine, but when you try to completely silence them all you're doing is not exposing them. This doesn't mean people shouldn't criticize the issues with Islam, but it's more nuanced than one extreme or the other.
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Solar_Crimson posted...

Xavius posted...

Solar_Crimson posted...

Better than the people who want to expel Muslims completely from the West.

I guess the lives of innocent people mean nothing to you. Why are you SJWs so cold blooded and self centered?

Radical Muslims =/= all Muslims

Check again.
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tennisdude818 posted...

Feminists have been trying to reform straight white males for decades and feminists are still pissed at us. How do they expect to reform Muslim Somali migrants that grew up with no concept of western liberal values?

tell us about the last time you got laid
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It's probably too late for France. When I went to Paris for the holidays, there were heavily armed military police patrolling the streets and guarding the entrances at the major public venues and such. France seems to have normalized a police state and it'll just get worse.
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So, they officially admit it.
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https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/400-current-events/76523513/899792322
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Lmao imagine how shitty of a culture it must be when when one of the more progressive nations of the world literally calls for cultural reverse engineering because of how bad things have gotten
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Kazi1212 posted...

Lmao imagine how shitty of a culture it must be when when one of the more progressive nations of the world literally calls for cultural reverse engineering because of how bad things have gotten

OK so I was wrong about the dolphin thing, but how about you be the guy that's overly obsessed with cantaloupe? We don't have a fruit loving gimmick, the field is wide open.
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A_Good_Boy posted...

Kazi1212 posted...

Lmao imagine how shitty of a culture it must be when when one of the more progressive nations of the world literally calls for cultural reverse engineering because of how bad things have gotten

OK so I was wrong about the dolphin thing, but how about you be the guy that's overly obsessed with cantaloupe? We don't have a fruit loving gimmick, the field is wide open.

What are you going on about?
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