Current Events > Fox News: Russia meddled to help Trump beat Clinton. Bonus live Russian trolls

(+) Yeah! (+)

SenTedCruz posted...

Mr_Biscuit posted...

Trump now wants a one on one meeting with Putin, no aides or others in the room.

HMM

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/02/politics/donald-trump-vladimir-putin-meeting/index.html

This is eminently reasonable considering the history of leaks in the Trump Administration. It's sad, some people think they they're being "heroes" but not realizing damaging our national security in the process. You're not revealing a national surveillance program like Snowden or anything of that sort when you stab our diplomats in the back and collude with a hostile press to keep us at war in countries like Syria, you're just being a dick.

This is what people seriously say
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Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Mr_Biscuit posted...

Trump now wants a one on one meeting with Putin, no aides or others in the room.

HMM

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/02/politics/donald-trump-vladimir-putin-meeting/index.html

This is eminently reasonable considering the history of leaks in the Trump Administration. It's sad, some people think they they're being "heroes" but not realizing damaging our national security in the process. You're not revealing a national surveillance program like Snowden or anything of that sort when you stab our diplomats in the back and collude with a hostile press to keep us at war in countries like Syria, you're just being a dick.

This is what people seriously say

In the words of a world-famous philosopher, not an argument.
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SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Mr_Biscuit posted...

Trump now wants a one on one meeting with Putin, no aides or others in the room.

HMM

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/02/politics/donald-trump-vladimir-putin-meeting/index.html

This is eminently reasonable considering the history of leaks in the Trump Administration. It's sad, some people think they they're being "heroes" but not realizing damaging our national security in the process. You're not revealing a national surveillance program like Snowden or anything of that sort when you stab our diplomats in the back and collude with a hostile press to keep us at war in countries like Syria, you're just being a dick.

This is what people seriously say

In the words of a world-famous philosopher, not an argument.

Nonsense

President Trump and his administration are a Russian asset

https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/8wcmz8/why_would_trump_want_to_meet_privately_with/e1uhtn7

An easy collection of articles
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Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Mr_Biscuit posted...

Trump now wants a one on one meeting with Putin, no aides or others in the room.

HMM

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/02/politics/donald-trump-vladimir-putin-meeting/index.html

This is eminently reasonable considering the history of leaks in the Trump Administration. It's sad, some people think they they're being "heroes" but not realizing damaging our national security in the process. You're not revealing a national surveillance program like Snowden or anything of that sort when you stab our diplomats in the back and collude with a hostile press to keep us at war in countries like Syria, you're just being a dick.

This is what people seriously say

In the words of a world-famous philosopher, not an argument.

Nonsense

President Trump and his administration are a Russian asset

https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/8wcmz8/why_would_trump_want_to_meet_privately_with/e1uhtn7

An easy collection of articles

Lol@you

>/r/politics as a source
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SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Mr_Biscuit posted...

Trump now wants a one on one meeting with Putin, no aides or others in the room.

HMM

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/02/politics/donald-trump-vladimir-putin-meeting/index.html

This is eminently reasonable considering the history of leaks in the Trump Administration. It's sad, some people think they they're being "heroes" but not realizing damaging our national security in the process. You're not revealing a national surveillance program like Snowden or anything of that sort when you stab our diplomats in the back and collude with a hostile press to keep us at war in countries like Syria, you're just being a dick.

This is what people seriously say

In the words of a world-famous philosopher, not an argument.

Nonsense

President Trump and his administration are a Russian asset

https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/8wcmz8/why_would_trump_want_to_meet_privately_with/e1uhtn7

An easy collection of articles

Lol@you

>/r/politics as a source

Reddit isn't the source. The easy collection of news articles are. I'm not going to shorten all those links.
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Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

This is what people seriously say

In the words of a world-famous philosopher, not an argument.

Nonsense

President Trump and his administration are a Russian asset

https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/8wcmz8/why_would_trump_want_to_meet_privately_with/e1uhtn7

An easy collection of articles

Lol@you

>/r/politics as a source

Reddit isn't the source. The easy collection of news articles are. I'm not going to shorten all those links.

That's good, because I'm not going read then either. I legitimately don't care about the stupid Russophobic conspiracy theories, because even if the worst version of all of them were true, I would still prefer Donald Trump and Donald Trump supporters to people like you.

SenTedCruz posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You%27re_either_with_us,_or_against_us

something something horseshoe theory

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SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

This is what people seriously say

In the words of a world-famous philosopher, not an argument.

Nonsense

President Trump and his administration are a Russian asset

https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/8wcmz8/why_would_trump_want_to_meet_privately_with/e1uhtn7

An easy collection of articles

Lol@you

>/r/politics as a source

Reddit isn't the source. The easy collection of news articles are. I'm not going to shorten all those links.

That's good, because I'm not going read then either. I legitimately don't care about the stupid Russophobic conspiracy theories, because even if the worst version of all of them were true, I would still prefer Donald Trump and Donald Trump supporters to people like you.

SenTedCruz posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You%27re_either_with_us,_or_against_us

something something horseshoe theory

So you have no argument whatsoever besides "I don't like your posts" and you resort to personal attacks
Just like the president!
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Stover46 posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Doctor Foxx posted...

Nonsense

President Trump and his administration are a Russian asset

https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/8wcmz8/why_would_trump_want_to_meet_privately_with/e1uhtn7

An easy collection of articles

Lol@you

>/r/politics as a source

Reddit isn't the source. The easy collection of news articles are. I'm not going to shorten all those links.

That's good, because I'm not going read then either. I legitimately don't care about the stupid Russophobic conspiracy theories, because even if the worst version of all of them were true, I would still prefer Donald Trump and Donald Trump supporters to people like you.

SenTedCruz posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You%27re_either_with_us,_or_against_us

something something horseshoe theory

So you have no argument whatsoever besides "I don't like your posts" and you resort to personal attacks
Just like the president!

"Everyone who disagrees with me isn't a real American and is secretly a foreign subversive" is a personal attack. The link to the Bush statement is just explaining why. "You're with us or you're with the terrorists/Russians" are pretty much identical sentiments, semantically and in context.
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Howl posted...

Hexenherz posted...

Jiek_Fafn posted...

So did Russia just organize shit posting on the internet or were they directly leaking secrets and handing money to Trump?

I don't know what they actually did.

No one knows fully what they did (well, the people investigating it do), but what we do know is that...

1 - They hacked 20+ state voting machines.
2 - Wikileaks is basically a Russian tool that was used to release information specifically to damage Clinton's campaign.
3 - They created an absurd "troll farm" to further divide the country's politics which created a massive amount of propaganda and pumped it into various social media outlets.
4 - They funded actual organizations, with a great example being this guy who wanted to provide martial arts courses to a community that was predominantly African-American. And then they turned *that* into a controversy about how African-Americans were training to become even more dangerous.
5 - They also orchestrated the organization of protests, even getting two opposing protests to rally at the same time in the same place.

That's in the US alone and there's probably far more here. In Europe they've also been aggressively interfering in domestic politics and foreign policy in countries such as Germany, Sweden, and the Netherlands (not even speaking about Ukraine, which I think speaks for itself).

Not saying any of this is false, but sources?

1: https://www.dw.com/en/21-us-states-targeted-by-russian-hackers-no-votes-changed/a-40650399 Sorry, they didn't compromise all of those states that they targeted but they did compromise some.

https://www.dw.com/en/us-intelligence-report-putin-ordered-targeted-involvement-in-us-election/a-37043884

Jeff Sessions also openly stated that he supported that intelligence report about Russian involvement.

2: https://www.vox.com/2018/4/25/17214724/trump-russia-wikileaks-catholic-clinton

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/4/2/17164266/trump-russia-mueller-email-hackings-dnc-clinton

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/01/world/europe/wikileaks-julian-assange-russia.html Interesting how Assange is slow to criticize Russia and yet his self-proclaimed MO is to reveal corruption and wrongdoing in government... Also interesting how he was selective in revealing information about the US candidates.

3: This is on basically every major, reputable media source around the world. And it doesn't even just affect America.

4: https://nwu.org/the-black-fist-affair-russias-failed-cointelpro-operation-against-the-black-community-in-america/

5: http://www.businessinsider.com/russia-trolls-senate-intelligence-committee-hearing-2017-11

https://www.houstonchronicle.com/local/gray-matters/article/A-Houston-protest-organized-by-Russian-trolls-12625481.php
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Nice work @Hexenherz

Of course you know it's wasted on these clowns.
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SenTedCruz posted...

That's good, because I'm not going read then either. I legitimately don't care about the stupid Russophobic conspiracy theories, because even if the worst version of all of them were true, I would still prefer Donald Trump and Donald Trump supporters to people like you.

At least you straight up admit you'd prefer people subverting our democracy entirely because you get picked on online finally. Not as bad as your "the 2016 election made me become a white nationalist" admission, but I'll take the little honesty from you I can get
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The Great Muta 22 posted...

people subverting our democracy

I'd prefer to think of it more like that I see this idea of "subversion" as more multi-faceted and multipolar than our current discourse allows for. It is probably and in all likelihood self-evidentally true that Russians and in particular, Russian intelligence play a significant role in subverting the normal operations of the United States. But, then again, I know from my own blue state public school education that these sorts of fears have long been a staple of American politics, and yet not always been as well-respected as they have been. On the other hand, I don't see any evidence that the influence of Russian subversion is any more powerful to a significant degree than any other modern state, or other significantly large entity (this can include corporations, lobbies, underground gangs, and political parties).

If any of that seems particularly extreme or provocative to you, then I don't really care, because that was as deferential and accomodating as I can possibly phrase it. I am open to a broad conversation about Russian subversion and the idea of foreign bodies intervening in our democratic processes. However, this must be phrased in a better way than "blue team good, team red bad". Because anything else is just completely disrespectful to the severity of the conversation itself and the weight of the associated accusations. If you were an enemy Russian agent or any kind of hostile troll at all, then isn't exactly what you would be interested in doing is dichotomizing serious issues like that instead of being willing to discuss them in an open-minded way?
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And, you know what, just because it's a holiday weekend, I'll ping @The_Great_Muta_22, with a request for 2nd chance and good faith discussion. Regardless of how much you may dislike me, I always prefer onteredting5 discussions to flamewars.
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BruceWayneJr posted...

Nice work @Hexenherz

Of course you know it's wasted on these clowns.

Thank you, I appreciate that!!

I get so frustrated/disappointed when I see people try to discard Russia's actions as "fake news", "russophobic", etc. There are just so many documented instances of their behavior, and it's not even just in the US.

Look at what they did in the Netherlands: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/16/world/europe/russia-ukraine-fake-news-dutch-vote.html

Look at what they did in Sweden: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jan/11/russia-waging-information-war-in-sweden-study-finds

The "Lisa case" in Germany: https://www.nato.int/docu/review/2016/also-in-2016/lisa-case-germany-target-russian-disinformation/EN/index.htm

Russian misinformation in Ukraine that has persisted since the revolution a few years ago, ranging from literal fake news of "events happening in Ukraine" (they posted blatantly false information about things like bridges being destroyed and bombs exploding to interviews with "Ukrainians" in "Ukrainian cities" where it was NOT Ukrainians in places that aren't even in Ukraine), to their takeover of Crimea, to sending military and private military companies to support the rebels in East Ukraine, to literally supplying the missile system that shot down a civilian airliner.

Literally poisoning former spies in the UK (multiple times).

Not to mention there is extremely strong evidence they've assassinated their own journalists, persecute (and even possibly assassinate) free thinking political opponents, and that the Russian government itself coordinated the Moscow bombings that served as a precursor to the second Chechen war.

Not to mention the fact that they have harassed US organizations and private corporations in Russian territory.

I wasn't even going to type this all up but I mean seriously, Russia poses a legitimate threat to the Western world. It's not really anything to joke about. The facts are out there and are clear as day, and it is so depressing when people ignore all this information and try to portray it as a "Republican vs liberals" issue when that is nowhere near an applicable context in which to judge this information.
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Hexenherz posted...

I get so frustrated/disappointed when I see people try to discard Russia's actions as "fake news", "russophobic", etc. There are just so many documented instances of their behavior, and it's not even just in the US.

It's probably more that people are confused why screaming shill/conspiracy like an infowars viewer went from something that would get you shamed and ostracized and possibly fired from your job to bipartisan dogma overnight when logically shilling is probably something that multiple different countries and other organizations do and have always done.

It's not an attack on the legitimacy of the discussion itself, just the sheer dishonesty that usually comes along with it
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Hexenherz posted...

Not to mention the fact that they have harassed US organizations and private corporations in Russian territory.

That's not vague at all, since, you know, I've also seen US organizations and private corporations get "harassed" in US territory too for basically as long as I've been alive. Remember the IRS scandal, for example?

Hexenherz posted...

I wasn't even going to type this all up but I mean seriously, Russia poses a legitimate threat to the Western world. It's not really anything to joke about. The facts are out there and are clear as day, and it is so depressing when people ignore all this information and try to portray it as a "Republican vs liberals" issue when that is nowhere near an applicable context in which to judge this information.

Do people who post hyperbolic shit like this realize that other foreign lobbying groups like AIPAC have been around for 50 years without being forced to register under FARA, like RT was? Why make this about Russia and the Republicans if you don't want it to be portrayed that way?
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Seems Hexenherz found madfoots biggest weaknesses: facts and reality

Tell me what was nonfactual about my post.
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SenTedCruz posted...

Tell me what was nonfactual about my post.

SenTedCruz (madfoot) posted...

I actually already put "SenTedCruz" on my ignore list so like my post was extremely and ultimately meaningless since... everyone else seems to be fairly well educated here >_>.
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Hexenherz posted...

I actually already put "SenTedCruz" on my ignore list so like my post was extremely and ultimately meaningless since... everyone else seems to be fairly well educated here >_>.

"I wish people would be more tolerant of my xenophobic conspiracy theories and if they aren't they're just stooopid.".
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Fox News has been against Trump from the start. I wish everybody would realize that theyre not the good guys. No media source is.

Theres 70% negative media coverage over our President and that is just disgusting. People admitting that they dislike him, so theyre just going to lie and bend the truth, try to lie about crowd size and popular vote.

We all know who won.
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SenTedCruz posted...

Hexenherz posted...

I actually already put "SenTedCruz" on my ignore list so like my post was extremely and ultimately meaningless since... everyone else seems to be fairly well educated here >_>.

"I wish people would be more tolerant of my xenophobic conspiracy theories and if they aren't they're just stooopid.".

"Stating the facts that both parties agree on that a foreign government acted to influence the US election is xenophobia"

Lol
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Payzmaykr posted...

We all know who won.

Clinton had more votes

Trump was elected

No one really won
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All I can say to @SenTedCruz is that what you're proposing is that there is a global conspiracy to frame Russia for actions that have been to a visibly demonstrated on a global stage in many instances.
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Then again... (from the topic about what a Russian MP said... in Russia to a Russian audience).

SenTedCruz posted...

Sounds like First Amendment protected speech to me.

Pretty obvious this guy's just out to get some laughs, so pretty clearly not worth any more effort.
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Payzmaykr posted...

try to lie about crowd size and popular vote.

bro, that's Trump doing that.
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Phantom_Nook posted...

Payzmaykr posted...

try to lie about crowd size and popular vote.

bro, that's Trump doing that.

No, man. My brother personally took pictures of an almost unbelievably big crowd in Colorado. They were over capacity and had to turn people away.

The press tried to get these photos of smaller groups here and there, and to press themselves in because there WAS no empty space to fill.

People got on twitter and Facebook and were like, yeahhhhhhh-no. Here are the real pix, keep trying th0!

I love when the fake news gets Rekt by social media.
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Payzmaykr posted...

Phantom_Nook posted...

Payzmaykr posted...

try to lie about crowd size and popular vote.

bro, that's Trump doing that.

No, man. My brother personally took pictures of an almost unbelievably big crowd in Colorado. They were over capacity and had to turn people away.

The press tried to get these photos of smaller groups here and there, and to press themselves in because there WAS no empty space to fill.

People got on twitter and Facebook and were like, yeahhhhhhh-no. Here are the real pix, keep trying th0!

I love when the fake news gets Rekt by social media.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prw2B_03IzY" data-time="
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Hexenherz posted...

All I can say to @SenTedCruz is that what you're proposing is that there is a global conspiracy to frame Russia for actions that have been to a visibly demonstrated on a global stage in many instances.

As opposed to the global conspiracy you're alleging that extends all the way to the highest office in the land?

Agnosticism is an intellectually defensible position on issues with no facts involved such as this.
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Doctor Foxx posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Hexenherz posted...

I actually already put "SenTedCruz" on my ignore list so like my post was extremely and ultimately meaningless since... everyone else seems to be fairly well educated here >_>.

"I wish people would be more tolerant of my xenophobic conspiracy theories and if they aren't they're just stooopid.".

"Stating the facts that both parties agree on that a foreign government acted to influence the US election is xenophobia"

Lol

If it were just "stating" facts then you wouldn't have repeatedly smeared groups of complete strangers, both on and off the website, as some kind of "fake American" foreign trolls in this thread.
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shockthemonkey posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Hexenherz posted...

All I can say to @SenTedCruz is that what you're proposing is that there is a global conspiracy to frame Russia for actions that have been to a visibly demonstrated on a global stage in many instances.

As opposed to the global conspiracy you're alleging that extends all the way to the highest office in the land?

Agnosticism is an intellectually defensible position on issues with no facts involved such as this.

He proved his point
You made shit up
Dont get the two confused

Facts and reality are anathema to madfoot

Payzmaykr posted...

No, man. My brother personally took pictures of an almost unbelievably big crowd in Colorado. They were over capacity and had to turn people away.

Really? Can you post those pictures?
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shockthemonkey posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

Hexenherz posted...

All I can say to @SenTedCruz is that what you're proposing is that there is a global conspiracy to frame Russia for actions that have been to a visibly demonstrated on a global stage in many instances.

As opposed to the global conspiracy you're alleging that extends all the way to the highest office in the land?

Agnosticism is an intellectually defensible position on issues with no facts involved such as this.

He proved his point
You made shit up
Dont get the two confused

"Everyone who disagrees with me is a Russian agent" is strong evidence.
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Its super funny watching Trump supporters squirm every time stuff about the investigations comes out.

Cant wait to see him get in legal trouble and have people be like its fake news guys! not real, SAD! or whatever stupid shit theyll say.
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sktgamer_13dude posted...

Its super funny watching Trump supporters squirm every time stuff about the investigations comes out.

Cant wait to see him get in legal trouble and have people be like its fake news guys! not real, SAD! or whatever stupid shit theyll say.

Can't wait to see the seditious conspiracy and RICO charges pile up and all the deep state swamp creatures start screaming "fascist! fascist! you're literally Hitler for treating us how we tried to treat you and your supporters for 2 years!"
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1) what the fuck are you talking about
2) nice 2 hour response time
3) what the fuck are you talking about
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SenTedCruz posted...

the seditious conspiracy and RICO charges

Huh
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Doom_Art posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

the seditious conspiracy and RICO charges

Huh

Madfoot has lost it

BWLurker posted...

Doom_Art posted...

SenTedCruz posted...

the seditious conspiracy and RICO charges

Huh

Madfoot has lost it

>implying he ever had it
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BWLurker posted...

Madfoot has lost it

I mean clearly

But in his mind that statement made sense. I'm just wondering what he thinks is going on.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seditious_conspiracy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeer_Influenced_and_Corrupt_Organizations_Act

Drain the swamp! Drain the swamp! Hold the Globalist scum accountable!
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...that didn't clear anything up. What are you referencing
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Doom_Art posted...

BWLurker posted...

Madfoot has lost it

I mean clearly

But in his mind that statement made sense. I'm just wondering what he thinks is going on.

And, yeah, you liberals don't have any credibility to stand on being condescending and accusing people of losing their marbles when you're literally a john birch tier cult who thinks the President of the United literal States is a Russian agent.
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Doom_Art posted...

...that didn't clear anything up. What are you referencing

1. Conspiring to bring down the legitimately elected government of a nation is a criminal conspiracy.
2. If Russiagate isn't true, or based on evidence that a good faith observer could have mistaken for true, then the plot to fabricate false accusations of treason againat the People and their duly elected representatives would necessarily constitite a criminal conspiracy.
3. Russiagate probably isn't true.

I'm not sure what's unclear about this. Again, you're the ones who appear so convinced that this elaborate conspiracy theory is true without any evidence that you're willing to hate and accuse people of being fake Americans simply for disagreeing with you, as OP has done repeatedly in this thread.
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SenTedCruz posted...

Doom_Art posted...

...that didn't clear anything up. What are you referencing

1. Conspiring to bring down the legitimately elected government of a nation is a criminal conspiracy.
2. If Russiagate isn't true, or based on evidence that a good faith observer could have mistaken for true, then the plot to fabricate false accusations of treason againat the People and their duly elected representatives would necessarily constitite a criminal conspiracy.
3. Russiagate probably isn't true.

I'm not sure what's unclear about this. Again, you're the ones who appear so convinced that this elaborate conspiracy theory is true without any evidence that you're willing to hate and accuse people of being fake Americans simply for disagreeing with you, as OP has done repeatedly in this thread.

Everyone else is posting their sources, feel free to post yours.
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That's not how the burden of proof works.
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