Board 8 > Fourpack of Fun: Cloud/Mario, Snake/Samus

(+) Yeah! (+)

Might as well make one for the big boys. This is probably the most debatable grouping we can get with four Noble Niners in it.
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Cloud probably doesn't belong with these guys anymore. Mighty have fallen, ect.
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Smash Bros. has risen, etc.
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I think Snake/Mario and Cloud/Samus would've been more interesting, since Snake > Samus is probably the one foregone conclusion that you can get from these four. But Snake > Mario. If the contest were held in the beginning of the year, I would've gone Mario > Snake, but the Odyssey hype has died down.
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I don't think it does much if at all, honestly.
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KamikazePotato posted...

I don't think it does much if at all, honestly.

yes I know you believe this site doesn't care about anything new anymore but I think you're wrong there especially with something as big as Smash
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KamikazePotato posted...

I don't think it does much if at all, honestly.

The character who probably benefits from Smash the most in this fourpack, oddly enough, is Snake. The reaction to his return was overwhelmingly positive, and people are hyped.
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The Martyr Factor brings Snake do a slim victory over Mario

I guess

fuck if I know anymore
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Underleveled posted...

The character who probably benefits from Smash the most in this fourpack, oddly enough, is Snake. The reaction to his return was overwhelmingly positive, and people are hyped.

I pre-ordered Ultimate the second I saw Snake was back, so it worked for me, at least.
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So Sonic/Sephy, Crono/MM next? (or soon, maybe don't wanna dry up the NN right away like that)
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I mean I don't think anyone would take Sonic OR Crono to win that. Mega Man/Sephiroth and Sonic/Crono on their own might be interesting though.

Sonic/Crono need to be used in a "Noble Nine breaker" fourpack. Maybe Sephiroth, too. I just don't know who to put them up against.
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Smash Bros is good at making characters with room to grow, stronger. It worked so well with Snake because Nintendo fans and MGS fans had almost no overlap whatsoever - and, most importantly, because he was the first 3rd-party reveal ever and it was absolutely shocking. I don't think Cloud has much room to grow on GameFAQs of all places. Everyone who wants to play FF7 already has and people here have had like 15 years to become used to the guy. He might have gotten a boost in strength if the contest was held *right* after his reveal, but that time in the sun is past. He came after Snake, Sonic, Mega Man, Ryu, and Pac-man - at that point, he's just another 3rd-party reveal, if a more nonstandard one (Snake excluded).

I also frequent Smash communities more than I would like to, and the over-time reaction to Cloud has been kind of tepid. He's used a lot but only because he's by far the easiest-to-use top tier character in the game and he never creates 'hype' or anything. Partly because the roster is so big these days. No one character can steal all the spotlight. Unless they're Bayonetta - and that was for all the wrong reasons!

If you want examples of characters that would benefit from Smash: King K. Rool, Richter Belmont, Simon Belmont, Shulk, Robin, Palutena, Rosalina. Maaaybe Ridley. Because they're either unknown or very recently revealed. Cloud doesn't need cameos. He needs FF7 Remake, and for it to be good. Who knows when that's coming.
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Underleveled posted...

KamikazePotato posted...

I don't think it does much if at all, honestly.

The character who probably benefits from Smash the most in this fourpack, oddly enough, is Snake. The reaction to his return was overwhelmingly positive, and people are hyped.

This is accurate. I watched like 20 Smash Ultimate reactions videos when it was first revealed. Cloud and Snake were revealed right next to each other, and every reaction was "Oh hey, Cloud got back in" followed by "WAIT SNAKE MADE IT BACK?" It's mostly because Snake skipped a game, but yeah.

The most consistently hype "HE'S BACK!" reaction after Snake was for Young Link, for whatever reason.
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Well we don't have any data on Richter, Robin, or (surprisingly) Rosalina to go on at all. Hell, Rosalina could be right around Peach's level and we don't know it. But it's hard to say how much Smash factors into that given just how many games she shows up in lately.

I think Simon will get the biggest Smash boost this year. He's like, mid-range fodder as it is, I could see him becoming fodder-line or even a low midcarder on the heels of this announcement.
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KamikazePotato posted...

It worked so well with Snake because Nintendo fans and MGS fans had almost no overlap whatsoever

Eh, I think this is nonsense. MGS1 doesn't become one of the most popular games on the site (nor does Snake become a Noble Niner) unless he's got a lot of people who identify as Nintendo fans behind him. E3 2006 was just the perfect hypestorm for Snake between the first huge MGS4 trailer and his Brawl reveal. I agree nothing will ever be able to match that again, but Cloud doesn't really need to match that. Either way, I don't think the hype for Snake is as big as it is if he doesn't already have a fanbase with Nintendo fans because why else would they care so much? Just being the first third party character wouldn't be enough to create hype on THAT level. Like, if Pac-Man were the first third-party character in Smash ever, it's not nearly as big of a deal.

KamikazePotato posted...

Everyone who wants to play FF7 already has and people here have had like 15 years to become used to the guy.

Which is why I think putting him in a completely separate game could actually help him because he's not getting new fans any other way at this point. If Cloud is good in the game and people use him, I think that's enough to give him something.
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We don't have data on Richter or Robin, but they don't even have a chance of making it into a contest without Smash, and if they somehow did anyway they would've been wrecked. Especially Robin, who kind of didn't exist as a character before Smash codified his name, appearance, and voice!
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KamikazePotato posted...

This is accurate. I watched like 20 Smash Ultimate reactions videos when it was first revealed. Cloud and Snake were revealed right next to each other, and every reaction was "Oh hey, Cloud got back in" followed by "WAIT SNAKE MADE IT BACK?" It's mostly because Snake skipped a game, but yeah.

I mean there's a reason why they dropped EVERYONE IS BACK when they revealed Snake

because he's popular and because no one thought he'd ever come back after skipping SSB4
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Underleveled posted...

Rosalina could be right around Peach's level and we don't know it.

Ehhhhhh, I find this hard to believe. I like Rosalina, but the Galaxy games are second tier Mario games here. I don't think Mario Kart and Smash Bros. would raise her up to that level on top of that.
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Snake not having a big Nintendo overlap is part of what made the hype so huge. He was completely unexpected. To this day it's still baffling that Snake is in Smash Bros. Everything in that reveal trailer that slowly builds up to Snake taking off the box and facing down Mario and co. was perfectly executed.

Similarly (and this is an effect that is completely unrecognized even though I think it matters), Ike got a lot of attention for being the first character to ever be revealed on the Dojo site. I remember people losing their shit when that happened, because man did Brawl make people lose their shit all the time, and except for the obvious Sonic exception I don't think any character update from then on generated so much buzz. I believe it's part of the reason why Ike did seem to benefit a good bit from Brawl, while most of the other Brawl characters...didn't.
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Yeah, the Dojo was kind of insane. Sonic didn't really seem to maintain his boost beyond 2007 though, so who knows, it might be too late for Cloud to benefit from it. Snake is just a big exception to everything Smash-related.

But Snake was completely unexpected because no one really expected ANY third-party characters. I agree that Snake was an extremely unlikely candidate, but that's mostly because he's a character from a mature-themed series, not because he doesn't have any Nintendo fans.
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also a friendly reminder of how big E3 2006 was for Snake



I love looking at this image every once in a while, along with the immediate aftermath of Mario/Crono II.
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also speaking of Mario/Crono

on this day in contest history (9/19/2005)

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/2128-tournament-final-mario-vs-crono
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Cloud > Snake don't @ me.

Cloud rocks face in Smash Bros.
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LMAO KP "I'm almost crying right now"

love it. 2006 Board 8 was such a hype beast
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also on this day in contest history ten years ago (9/20/2008)

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/3246-division-1-round-1-duke-nukem-kefka-marth-niko

Kefka hits rock bottom
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LeonhartFour posted...

also on this day in contest history ten years ago (9/20/2008)

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/3246-division-1-round-1-duke-nukem-kefka-marth-niko

Kefka hits rock bottom

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/board8/images/b/bf/Cb7-03.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20081118005107

What the hell is this Kefka picture anyway?
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Holy shit between that and lettuce and the creepy clown close-up is there any non-MGS character who can get more easily fucked by a pic than Kefka?
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Vincent
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Janus5k posted...

Vincent

Vincent deliberately got a very obscure bad pic in a match that he was probably not going to win anyway.

Kefka got.... that and lost to fucking Niko.
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Jesus christ it's so blurry.

Worst pic of all time next to solid shit.
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As far as characters that consistently got questionable pictures, we didn't even know what to do with GLaDOS until Portal 2 came out. First there was the closest thing that existed to a full torso picture, which is this.

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/board8/images/3/35/Cb7-11.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20081118005610

Then we got the idea to use the Cores as GLaDOS despite not really being her, and then they finally released Portal 2 which gave her something resembling a torso. It was actually really hilarous that we got Snake vs. Kefka vs. GLaDOS in a freeform match picture round.
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That Kefka pic is supposed to be his last boss form. It's from an FMV that came with the PS1 port in FF Anthologies.



here's a better quality picture
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also as far as characters who get consistently boned by bad pics there's Ryu Hayabusa's and Leon Kennedy's sprites

and Big Boss is one of the bigger wild cards because there's no telling whether he'll get a Naked Snake pic or an old man pic (although he hasn't gotten an old man pic in quite a while)
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On the topic of Smash benefiting Cloud, I imagine it will help him a bit, maybe enough to keep him in the upper echelons of the contest...but it won't help in a match against Mario. The majority of people whose opinions of Cloud would go up based on him being in Smash are going to be Nintendo fans who aren't likely to be swayed to go against Mario. It's a boost against most opponents, but I can't see Mario or Link being hurt by it if they face him. Snake maybe gets hurt the worst since "wow he's in Smash now?!" kind of became his calling card after Brawl but I imagine he probably still wins the Smash vote against Cloud pretty hard regardless.
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If Mega Man is thought too strong or too likely to win the poll in a fourpack with Sephiroth/Crono/Sonic, isn't the obvious alternative Mega Man X? Especially if you don't want to go with a Pokemon.
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I don't think Mega Man is a slam dunk to beat Sephiroth.

I imagine a lot of people do though.

I also don't think Mega Man X is a Noble Nine breaker.
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Is Sephiroth even a relevant dude to beat anymore
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I still think Cloud is the strongest of the four. For some reason I feel like people just don't care about MGS anymore and Snake can be vulnerable to other N9ers as well.
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Underleveled posted...

Well we don't have any data on Richter, Robin, or (surprisingly) Rosalina to go on at all. Hell, Rosalina could be right around Peach's level and we don't know it. But it's hard to say how much Smash factors into that given just how many games she shows up in lately.

I think Simon will get the biggest Smash boost this year. He's like, mid-range fodder as it is, I could see him becoming fodder-line or even a low midcarder on the heels of this announcement.

wait what the hell, rosalina's never been in a contest? the fuck? she has to be one of the strongest characters to never be in right?

Wasn't Rosalina a guru nom once?
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I'm not surprised Rosalina hasn't gotten in yet. There are too many Mario characters.

Even Toad only got in the contest once. Do we think pre-Smash Rosalina would beat Trump's penis?

but maybe she'd be interesting to get in now. I might toss her a nomination
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I did give Rosalina a nomination after seeing this topic. I can see some strength there, at least compared to a lot of others that will probably get in instead due to rallies.

I still think Cloud has enough strength here to beat Mario, but who knows. Snake would likely beat either of them.
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I have a really hard time seeing Mario losing a close match to Snake, even back when Snake was at his peak.
At least now Mario seems like the obvious winner here. I agree switching Cloud and Snake makes sense.

I really hope we do get this #2-#5 fourpack though, even if means a killer half of the bracket. It's cool how if Link wasn't in the contest, this would be the perfect four to give a quarter each. Seeing Sephiroth against Mario might be nice too, it's not in much doubt, but Sephiroth beat Mario so many times back in the days, it'd just be crazy to see that having switched completely since 2007 when they last faced.
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ctesjbuvf posted...

I really hope we do get this #2-#5 fourpack though, even if means a killer half of the bracket.

Easy to balance - put most of the high midcarders (Kirby, Bowser, Squall, Dante, Ryu, X, Tifa, etc) in the half with Link/MM/Sonic/Crono/Sephiroth.
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It's definitely Snake and Mario.

I think Snake > Mario for me but I wouldn't be surprised if it was Mario > Snake.
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Picked Mario > Samus, then I realized Snake easily beat her in the last final.

Still think Mario can take him.
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Hesitantly went Snake > Mario on the extremely shaky logic that Nintendo will be dominating and Snake will be given a boost to take him down. This kind of relies on both that happening and this being like... a Final Four match. Ideally with Link having already advanced to the finals the day before.

this is probably dumb
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MZero11 posted...

Wasn't Rosalina a guru nom once?

Youre thinking of Toadette

and I dunno if Snake retains strength to win this four pack given MGSs decline but who knows, he could win, he could actually lose to Samus
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wow I didn't realize people believed in Rosalina this much
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Snake > All