Current Events > Active shooter in El Paso; Police say to stay away from the area

(+) Yeah! (+)

RchHomieQuanChi posted...

Can we stop making this about mental health?

These are violent extremists. These are insecure White Nationalists who are scared that other races are trying to "take their country from them" and it doesn't help that the President of the U.S.A. himself is constantly spouting off his anti-Hispanic bullshit.

so you think not getting people treatment and just shunning them harder would prevent them from acting in this matter?

Its mental health when it's a white guy, race related when it's a person of color. Shit never changed and will never change.
---

Unknown380 posted...

You guys seriously need to vote next year, this shit is getting serious and it's only going to get worst under Trump, get your family, your friends and everyone to vote these Republicans out before more shit like this keeps happening, I don't care how you do it, just do it before shit gets way out of hand that more innocent people are getting killed by these right wing extremists.

You can't vote shootings away.
---

ThyCorndog posted...

this isn't about mental health. this is about ideology. these guys think they're soldiers in a cultural war. like when communism and fascism were on the rise in the early 20th century and you had people willing to die for those causes. these guys are fighting for white nationalism. whether it's this guy or the new zealand guy or one of many others. they aren't crazy. they're believers in their cause. and that's why it's important to diminish their cause and tell people who espouse those types of beliefs they're morons and need to shut the fuck up rather than giving them a platform

They arent crazy? Um they murdered a bunch of people in a mass shooting. I would say thats crazy....

BeantownHero posted...

White nationalism is the current face of domestic terrorism in the United states. between actual mass deaths carried out and those thwarted ahead of time, this can't really be denied any longer.

And the current president is responsible for stoking this violent hatred.

Literally all of this right here.
---

Antifar posted...

You can't vote shootings away.

But we can do something about gun control that Republicans are unwilling to do, that's a start if we vote Democrats in if they win.

---

Smashingpmkns posted...

Its mental health when it's a white guy, race related when it's a person of color. Shit never changed and will never change.

Why couldnt it be mental health for both.....

its like when people whine when a police officer restrains a white person calmy and they get upset.

Like do you want all people to be beat up by police or do you want them to diffuse with all people?

CruelBuffalo posted...

They arent crazy? Um they murdered a bunch of people in a mass shooting. I would say thats crazy....

At what point does that become tautology? "He did a shooting because he's crazy, and we know he's crazy because he did a shooting."
---

Antifar posted...

At what point does that become tautology? "He did a shooting because he's crazy, and we know he's crazy because he did a shooting."

Well neither of us are medical professionals....so maybe we shouldnt use declarative statements

Police say to stay away from the area

I'm in the next county in another state. Far enough?
---

CruelBuffalo posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

this isn't about mental health. this is about ideology. these guys think they're soldiers in a cultural war. like when communism and fascism were on the rise in the early 20th century and you had people willing to die for those causes. these guys are fighting for white nationalism. whether it's this guy or the new zealand guy or one of many others. they aren't crazy. they're believers in their cause. and that's why it's important to diminish their cause and tell people who espouse those types of beliefs they're morons and need to shut the fuck up rather than giving them a platform

They arent crazy? Um they murdered a bunch of people in a mass shooting. I would say thats crazy....

do you think everyone in the nazi SS was a psychopath? cause I don't. idealogy and brainwashing are the main drivers of political violence like this. do you think every islamic terrorist is crazy? I don't for the same reasons I just mentioned. these white nationalists who shoot up places might be slightly unstable, but the main driver if it's not the sole driver is their idealogy
---

CruelBuffalo posted...

Smashingpmkns posted...

Its mental health when it's a white guy, race related when it's a person of color. Shit never changed and will never change.

Why couldnt it be mental health for both.....

its like when people whine when a police officer restrains a white person calmy and they get upset.

Like do you want all people to be beat up by police or do you want them to diffuse with all people?

Uhhhhh because it's clearly not? When was the last time you saw these same people ITT, or more broadly anyone on the right, clamoring for mental health research&reform when a POC is the culprit? This is the reality of the situation. Nobody gives a fuck about the mental health of POCs.

Even further, they dont even give a fuck about mental health in general lol they vote against it at all times.
---

What does it take for people to actually realize what Trump and his right wing toadies are saying has consequences? If that manifesto going around is true, which basically says his goal was to cleanse Texas of Hispanic invasion and he wants to send them back, what does it fucking take for people to realize that the kind of rhetoric by this President, Republican lawmakers and Fox News is leading to shit like this? And for anyone talking about mental illness of this individual, fuck outta here with that, this is a racist little shit brick that was radicalized.

Oh, and while we're at it, lets take a look at one of the Senators from my home state of Texas.



Rhetoric like that is a fucking problem, white nationalism is a problem.
---

^ Taharqa_ posted...

What does it take for people to actually realize what Trump and his right wing toadies are saying has consequences? If that manifesto going around is true, which basically says his goal was to cleanse Texas of Hispanic invasion and he wants to send them back, what does it fucking take for people to realize that the kind of rhetoric by this President, Republican lawmakers and Fox News is leading to shit like this? And for anyone talking about mental illness of this individual, fuck outta here with that, this is a racist little shit brick that was radicalized.

Oh, and while we're at it, lets take a look at one of the Senators from my home state of Texas.



Rhetoric like that is a fucking problem, white nationalism is a problem.

absolutely. that whole area of rhetoric is the reason this stuff happens
---

Uhhhhh because it's clearly not? When was the last time you saw these same people ITT, or more broadly anyone on the right, clamoring for mental health research&reform when a POC is the culprit? This is the reality of the situation. Nobody gives a fuck about the mental health of POCs.

Well me for starters. Clearly the Riverside (Islamic Religious) and the Dallas (Black) shooters were unwell obviously and needed mental health treatment.

And you didnt answer my questions. Should we look at the mental health behavior of all or just be like fuck em they are just plain no good

ThyCorndog posted...

do you think everyone in the nazi SS was a psychopath? cause I don't. idealogy and brainwashing are the main drivers of political violence like this. do you think every islamic terrorist is crazy? I don't for the same reasons I just mentioned. these white nationalists who shoot up places might be slightly unstable, but the main driver if it's not the sole driver is their idealogy

So are people in cults unsavable and we shouldnt see treatment for their antisocial behavior?

as for all nazis? Im not a doctor so I cant diagnose someone as a psychopath

It isn't the border or anyone else overseas that is a problem for america. Young, insecure white supremacists who constantly shoot up public places are.
---

LightningAce11 posted...

It isn't the border or anyone else overseas that is a problem for america. Young, insecure white supremacists who constantly shoot up public places are.

I agree. We need to be better as a society at preventing and treating people with that mindset.

Social media, therapy, education, rhetoric from politicians, and access to these large scale killing devices

CruelBuffalo posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

do you think everyone in the nazi SS was a psychopath? cause I don't. idealogy and brainwashing are the main drivers of political violence like this. do you think every islamic terrorist is crazy? I don't for the same reasons I just mentioned. these white nationalists who shoot up places might be slightly unstable, but the main driver if it's not the sole driver is their idealogy

So are people in cults unsavable and we shouldnt see treatment for their antisocial behavior?

as for all nazis? Im not a doctor so I cant diagnose someone as a psychopath

you know exactly what I mean. you don't need to be a crazy person to do horrible things. you just need to strongly believe in crazy ideas to do them

i'm not talking about redemption or treatment. I think the mentally unstable need to be treated. I think another just as pressing issue is stamping out white nationalist rhetoric in its entirety
---

CruelBuffalo posted...

Uhhhhh because it's clearly not? When was the last time you saw these same people ITT, or more broadly anyone on the right, clamoring for mental health research&reform when a POC is the culprit? This is the reality of the situation. Nobody gives a fuck about the mental health of POCs.

Well me for starters. Clearly the Riverside (Islamic Religious) and the Dallas (Black) shooters were unwell obviously and needed mental health treatment.

And you didnt answer my questions. Should we look at the mental health behavior of all or just be like fuck em they are just plain no good

That wasnt your question but okay. Mental health is obviously an issue when it comes to shootings, and I'm not arguing that it isn't, but these same people do not bring it up when it is a POC. This is clear as day. It is only brought up when it's a white guy in order to move the conversation away from gun control. When it's a POC, they use race related rhetoric or blame their "culture" instead.

Is it possible that guns+fascist rhetoric can have an impact on mental health? Should mentally ill people have the right to buy guns? NRA thinks so lol
---

Smashingpmkns posted...

CruelBuffalo posted...

Uhhhhh because it's clearly not? When was the last time you saw these same people ITT, or more broadly anyone on the right, clamoring for mental health research&reform when a POC is the culprit? This is the reality of the situation. Nobody gives a fuck about the mental health of POCs.

Well me for starters. Clearly the Riverside (Islamic Religious) and the Dallas (Black) shooters were unwell obviously and needed mental health treatment.

And you didnt answer my questions. Should we look at the mental health behavior of all or just be like fuck em they are just plain no good

That wasnt your question but okay. Mental health is obviously an issue when it comes to shootings, and I'm not arguing that it isn't, but these same people do not bring it up when it is a POC. This is clear as day. It is only brought up when it's a white guy in order to move the conversation away from gun control. When it's a POC, they use race related rhetoric or blame their "culture" instead.

Is it possible that guns+fascist rhetoric can have an impact on mental health? Should mentally ill people have the right to buy guns? NRA thinks so lol

I agree that some use mental health as scapegoat for whites a way to not speak about guns or the rhetoric that radicalizes them, but that doesnt mean we should dismiss it is my point.

I just think that conversation needs to move away from dont say this about white shooters!

CruelBuffalo posted...

Smashingpmkns posted...

CruelBuffalo posted...

Uhhhhh because it's clearly not? When was the last time you saw these same people ITT, or more broadly anyone on the right, clamoring for mental health research&reform when a POC is the culprit? This is the reality of the situation. Nobody gives a fuck about the mental health of POCs.

Well me for starters. Clearly the Riverside (Islamic Religious) and the Dallas (Black) shooters were unwell obviously and needed mental health treatment.

And you didnt answer my questions. Should we look at the mental health behavior of all or just be like fuck em they are just plain no good

That wasnt your question but okay. Mental health is obviously an issue when it comes to shootings, and I'm not arguing that it isn't, but these same people do not bring it up when it is a POC. This is clear as day. It is only brought up when it's a white guy in order to move the conversation away from gun control. When it's a POC, they use race related rhetoric or blame their "culture" instead.

Is it possible that guns+fascist rhetoric can have an impact on mental health? Should mentally ill people have the right to buy guns? NRA thinks so lol

I agree that some use mental health as scapegoat for whites a way to not speak about guns or the rhetoric that radicalizes them, but that doesnt mean we should dismiss it is my point.

I just think that conversation needs to move away from dont say this about white shooters!

Treating it like it's the main cause of these types of shootings is completely misguided though. This was terrorism.
---

Smashingpmkns posted...

This was terrorism.

Exactly.

Unknown380 posted...

Smashingpmkns posted...

This was terrorism.

Exactly.

CruelBuffalo posted...

RchHomieQuanChi posted...

Can we stop making this about mental health?

These are violent extremists. These are insecure White Nationalists who are scared that other races are trying to "take their country from them" and it doesn't help that the President of the U.S.A. himself is constantly spouting off his anti-Hispanic bullshit.

so you think not getting people treatment and just shunning them harder would prevent them from acting in this matter?

Fuck that. "Help" implies that they're victims. They aren't fucking victims. They're byproducts of a country with a propensity for violence and deeply rooted racism, with a President that's successfully convinced them that the Hispanics, Muslims, blacks, and whoever else are here to ruin "their" country.

And yes I will continue to shun them because their toxic ideology has no place in a functioning society.
---

Also this shit is insulting to people with actual mental health issues.

"Crazy" people typically aren't aware of what they're doing and most "crazy" people don't go around targeting a specific demographic for their mass shootings. Most don't even commit murder.

Stop trying to lump these fuckers in with people that actually need help.
---

it is kind of funny how every time its an alt-right white supremacist people instantly run in to say "mentally ill!"...but you better believe if he was brown or muslim those same people would be saying "See! he knew what he was doing!"...This guy is a radicalized terrorist. He's not a mental patient. Lets call it what it is.

---

Gun Control doesn't work.

Hawaii has one of the strictest gun control in the nation, and we had like 6+ incidents this month involving guns.

Can't even use the "Well, criminals will just get guns from the next state over" when the next state over is across the ******* ocean.

If he threw milkshakes at 22 people I doubt wed have had this outcome. Yet reading alt righters online would have you believe otherwise.

HiddenRoar posted...

Gun Control doesn't work.

Hawaii has one of the strictest gun control in the nation, and we had like 6+ incidents this month involving guns.

Can't even use the "Well, criminals will just get guns from the next state over" when the next state over is across the ******* ocean.

Works in the rest of the industrialized world?

https://www.theonion.com/no-way-to-prevent-this-says-only-nation-where-this-r-1835173950

Its a shame, but what can we do? There really wasnt anything that was going to keep this individual from snapping and killing a lot of people if thats what they really wanted. At press time, residents of the only economically advanced nation in the world where roughly two mass shootings have occurred every month for the past eight years were referring to themselves and their situation as helpless.

---

This is not a mental health issue, this guy is a white supremacist terrorist, his manifesto talks of many of their most popular talking points. Please stop using mental illness to cover up the fact that he is a right wing terrorist with a hard on for white supremacist ideology.
---

HiddenRoar posted...

Gun Control doesn't work.

Hawaii has one of the strictest gun control in the nation, and we had like 6+ incidents this month involving guns.

Can't even use the "Well, criminals will just get guns from the next state over" when the next state over is across the ******* ocean.

It's not so much that it doesn't work. It works in places like Australia and the UK for the most part. It's more that Hawaiian Gun Control doesn't work. In which case, Hawaiians have to discover what's wrong with their approach and change it so it works.

---

Conflict posted...

There are people with mental health issues that aren't victims. Elliot Rodger is a prime example.

You're looking at it through a framework of thinking people with mental health issues are blameless for their actions, and they're not. There's truth in both that it's a mental health problem and Trump's rhetoric heavily influences these people in the worst way. It's not a one-or-the-other situation imo.

I take more issue with the assumption that all of these people are crazy. The truth of the matter is that they see a large group that they've been convinced is a threat to them (especially with Trump flagging immigrants as violent criminals) and have determined that they're at "war" with said group, leading to their violent response.

You can see the logic behind their actions. Imagine if someone breaks into your home and you have a gun. You would probably shoot them in self-defense. Nobody would call you "crazy" for doing that.

The problem is that the people they see as a threat aren't actually a threat. But their president, their government, and likely their friends and family have told them that if they don't strike first, they'll be victims.

But do I have sympathy for them? Fuck no.
---

https://imgur.com/z0lne7W

https://imgur.com/whXKzXU
---

I wish Live PD still followed the EPPD... >_>

I mean I even liked them in general (Andrea Zendeijas was a great personality to follow).

---

Ruvan22 posted...

Works in the rest of the industrialized world?

the rest of the "industrialized world" barely had any to begin with in many countries and in many cases have altered their definitions of crimes to keep numbers low. they have substantially lower populations (per capita has always meant bullshit) and have many social programs in place to cull violent out breaks.

and even then homicides =/= gun homicides. guns in most other countries tend to get replaced with other methods and increased frequency in other crimes that pick up the slack. youll hear about AU's gun ban taking mass shooting situations from 1 to 0, but you wont hear about their 50% uptick in arson death conveniently right after the ban went into effect for a number of years after.

Never understood white supremacists. They often look like snails and are complete failures, makes no sense that this would be the master race. And for much of history, it hasnt been.

Mecha Sonic posted...

https://imgur.com/z0lne7W

https://imgur.com/whXKzXU

Can't seem to find a cooorrreellation derrrr....
---

how can anyone hate mexicans
the people who created carne asada fries
---

Mecha Sonic posted...

https://imgur.com/z0lne7W

https://imgur.com/whXKzXU

Freedom isnt free, and in this case you pay for my right to keep 4 guns in my bedroom that I post an uncomfortable amount of times about not wanting to use but being willing to use with the blood of the innocent. Hoo rah.

---

Kinny100 posted...

how can anyone hate mexicans
the people who created carne asada fries

What about those big booty latinas?
---

Dark_Spiret posted...

Ruvan22 posted...

Works in the rest of the industrialized world?

the rest of the "industrialized world" barely had any to begin with in many countries and in many cases have altered their definitions of crimes to keep numbers low. they have substantially lower populations (per capita has always meant bullshit) and have many social programs in place to cull violent out breaks.

and even then homicides =/= gun homicides. guns in most other countries tend to get replaced with other methods and increased frequency in other crimes that pick up the slack. youll hear about AU's gun ban taking mass shooting situations from 1 to 0, but you wont hear about their 50% uptick in arson death conveniently right after the ban went into effect for a number of years after.

So the AU gun ban worked then? Because even if you reduce from 10 to 2 and then back up to 5, that's still less than the 10 you started at?

Ruvan22 posted...

Because even if you reduce from 10 to 2 and then back up to 5, that's still less than the 10 you started at?

Liberal Trickery!

---

Ruvan22 posted...

So the AU gun ban worked then? Because even if you reduce from 10 to 2 and then back up to 5, that's still less than the 10 you started at?

the entire point is that it didnt matter. you lose one mass shooting (which was so low before or after its impossible to know if it actually had any effect on future shootings) and pick up a number of other deaths by other means negating the entire homicide ratio.

I mean we've had shooting murders since the gun ban, but we're not losing dozens of people to some dickhead going postal with a gun every couple of months/years. Mostly because we don't have a shitty gun system, or a weapons lobby paying politicians big dollars to let them sell firearms - though they certainly tried last year with Pauline Hanson and the One Nation party.
---

Dark_Spiret posted...

negating the entire homicide ratio

That's a pretty disingenuous lie and reach. You don't have any numbers to prove that, you're going off on your feelings.

---

OmegaPillow posted...

Hes a terrorist, simple as that. Fucking geeky looking bitch too, hope they fuck his asshole raw in prison 7 times a day and starves to death

Yeah well, the current administration cut law enforcement funding for the monitoring of people like this douchebag.
---