Current Events > Poison status effect in RPGs is interesting

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In some games, getting poisoned is terrible and you need to get rid of it ASAP (Gen 1 Pokemon games). In other games, poison can be kinda ignored. You can just heal through it. Some games let you poison bosses for big damage. Some for small or no damage
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I cant recall a game where it was really all that beneficial to use poison. In the end most bosses are completely immune to it and the time spent trying to apply it might as well be spent just dealing better damage.
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Any game mechanic that can be defeated by a cheap and common item or whatever is probably a waste of time.

Status effects in general are an interesting feature.

Games rarely incentivize a player to use status effects offensively, since it's usually just a slower way to achieve the same outcome: deal damage > enemy hp

I'd like to see a game that really incentivizes or forces to use status effects offensively in some parts
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Damage Over Time is an interesting mechanic because it forces the player to do something they otherwise wouldnt. It also by its nature increases the consequence for not acting to counter it the longer one waits to act on it.

There are multiple methods of handling and labeling Damage Over Time, and typically the use of multiple different types is to require them to react in different ways.

The game I enjoyed the poison mechanic the most was Darkest Dungeon. That game handles status ailments very well.

konokonohamaru posted...

Status effects in general are an interesting feature.

Games rarely incentivize a player to use status effects offensively, since it's usually just a slower way to achieve the same outcome: deal damage > enemy hp

I'd like to see a game that really incentivizes or forces to use status effects offensively in some parts

FF 13 did a good job with it imo
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DOTs and poison effects have only ever been effective from my end in MMOs.

In most traditional RPGs as people have said, it is largely useless.
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konokonohamaru posted...

I'd like to see a game that really incentivizes or forces to use status effects offensively in some parts

dragon quest xi on hard is like this. there's a lot of rng involved in them landing but there are a lot of battles where i would have gotten crushed without them. there's also a character that revolves around setting poison/sleep on the enemy to get huge damage with a follow-up skill.
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Pissed me off in Final Fantasy Tactics Advance where every move your character would continuously get hurt by the poison until they just died.

konokonohamaru posted...

Status effects in general are an interesting feature.

Games rarely incentivize a player to use status effects offensively, since it's usually just a slower way to achieve the same outcome: deal damage > enemy hp

I'd like to see a game that really incentivizes or forces to use status effects offensively in some parts

In my experience Persona does this well enough. Enemies can ream your party if youre not careful, so using stuff like Charm, Confuse, and Paralysis can really save your skin. Especially since the dungeons are designed in a way that you want to conserve party HP and SP to get as far as possible in one attempt.
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konokonohamaru posted...

Status effects in general are an interesting feature.

Games rarely incentivize a player to use status effects offensively, since it's usually just a slower way to achieve the same outcome: deal damage > enemy hp

I'd like to see a game that really incentivizes or forces to use status effects offensively in some parts

There were a few times in Pokemon where status effects helped against a gym leader or other powerful foe. I recall if you paralyzed Whitney's Miltank, you could interrupt her increasingly-powerful Rollout. Paralysis was also great against speedy, one-hit kill glass cannon enemies if you could manage to slow them down enough. Poison was also good for whittling down tanks (specifically Toxic).

I never did find good use for Sleep, Burn, or Frozen. Sleep because it was unreliable and ended too quick, frozen because it was too hard to actually achieve, and burn because I didn't ever have enough pokemon that had the ability to do so, so I didn't really get a chance to try it out. Though the lowered attack would have been helpful at some points, I imagine.

EDIT: I forgot confusion. That was a very hit-or-miss one. At times, you'd confuse them enough to have them kill themselves. Others, they'd snap right out of it within a turn.
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konokonohamaru posted...

I'd like to see a game that really incentivizes or forces to use status effects offensively in some parts

There's always Etrian, I guess.

konokonohamaru posted...

I'd like to see a game that really incentivizes or forces to use status effects offensively in some parts

Etrian Odyssey rewards status effects in various ways,

- bosses are susceptible,
- in addition to the usual ones (poison, sleep, paralysis, blind, etc) it has leg, arm, and head binds, which effect which moves can be used.
- there are classes built around manipulating ailments and/or having extra effects against enemies who have them
- enemies often have conditional material drops based on killing enemies in certain way that include the effects of ailments.
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SwayM posted...

I cant recall a game where it was really all that beneficial to use poison. In the end most bosses are completely immune to it and the time spent trying to apply it might as well be spent just dealing better damage.

I mean if the game makes a status effect useless, it will just be useless. I can't recall a time where I ever thought poisoning someone in FF4 was a good idea, however, it's pretty strong in FF13.

Status effects, in my opinion, work out best when:

1. They are guaranteed to take effect
2. They have extremely temporary durations
3. Before the duration expires, they have a net effect that is far greater than an individual instantaneous action.
examples:
1-turn invincibility shields
guaranteed-crit buffs
high damaging poison
stuns / flinches

OR

4. The status effect is applied in addition to other actions.
examples:
"attack has chance to confuse"
deal damage and poison target enemy

OR

5. They are extremely cheap to use and allow efficient clearing of "trash" enemies so you have a lot of resources when arriving at the boss.
examples:
Final Fantasy 4 Mini / Silence trivializes most normal encounters
Final Fantasy 6 Edgar's Noiseblaster


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In Etrian Odyssey 1, the first major boss has a conditional drop based on it dying to poison damage. In fact, if you max out the poison skill first, it's probably the hardest hitter you'll have at that point

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SwayM posted...

I cant recall a game where it was really all that beneficial to use poison.

The Disgaea series say hi.

Up to 60% TOTAL Health can be taken away from basically every enemy as long as they're around your level. It lands fairly often. 20% Total health per turn.
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I know in Monster Hunter, poison is particularly effective at negating Kushala Daora's strong wind based AoE attacks that make it an extremely annoying fight.
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HagenEx posted...

SwayM posted...

I cant recall a game where it was really all that beneficial to use poison.

The Disgaea series say hi.

Up to 60% TOTAL Health can be taken away from basically every enemy as long as they're around your level. It lands fairly often. 20% Total health per turn.

You're still better off just going directly for murder.

konokonohamaru posted...

Status effects in general are an interesting feature.

Games rarely incentivize a player to use status effects offensively, since it's usually just a slower way to achieve the same outcome: deal damage > enemy hp

I'd like to see a game that really incentivizes or forces to use status effects offensively in some parts

Etrian Odyssey does a pretty good job at making status a devastating tool for both player and enemy alike.

At least the 3DS entries do.

Except curse. Curse is a joke status for the player except for like...three enemies in the series where it is useful.

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Zanzenburger posted...

There were a few times in Pokemon where status effects helped against a gym leader or other powerful foe. I recall if you paralyzed Whitney's Miltank, you could interrupt her increasingly-powerful Rollout. Paralysis was also great against speedy, one-hit kill glass cannon enemies if you could manage to slow them down enough. Poison was also good for whittling down tanks (specifically Toxic).

I never did find good use for Sleep, Burn, or Frozen. Sleep because it was unreliable and ended too quick, frozen because it was too hard to actually achieve, and burn because I didn't ever have enough pokemon that had the ability to do so, so I didn't really get a chance to try it out. Though the lowered attack would have been helpful at some points, I imagine.

EDIT: I forgot confusion. That was a very hit-or-miss one. At times, you'd confuse them enough to have them kill themselves. Others, they'd snap right out of it within a turn.

Burn is supremely useful for crippling physical attackers.

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One thing I hate about most RPGs is that bosses are generally immune to status effects, rendering them generally pointless in the whole game because who's going to poison generic enemy #1
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I found that divinity: origin sin does a good job of status effects. I can't count the amount of tines I'm outnumbered and have to charm some dudes, then blast the area with a poison cloud, then set it on fire right before it expires.

Same deal with frozen and tripping. They can turn a fight in your favour.
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PatrickMahomes posted...

One thing I hate about most RPGs is that bosses are generally immune to status effects, rendering them generally pointless in the whole game because who's going to poison generic enemy #1

Final Fantasy 4 using Mini on "generic enemy #1" makes a majority of the early game super easy.

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Eat More Beef posted...

I found that divinity: origin sin does a good job of status effects. I can't count the amount of tines I'm outnumbered and have to charm some dudes, then blast the area with a poison cloud, then set it on fire right before it expires.

Same deal with frozen and tripping. They can turn a fight in your favour.

Good point. DOS2 did it well, anyway.

I like how they made it so that status effects have a 100% chance to hit, but only after you've taken down enemy armor
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haste and slow are probably the most consistently useful

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Questionmarktarius posted...

HagenEx posted...

SwayM posted...

I cant recall a game where it was really all that beneficial to use poison.

The Disgaea series say hi.

Up to 60% TOTAL Health can be taken away from basically every enemy as long as they're around your level. It lands fairly often. 20% Total health per turn.

You're still better off just going directly for murder.

Oh, definitely, since it's easy to break the game by just going through a couple items to level them up. But I was talking both ways. I've been killed by Poison in Disgaea 2 Item World more than I'd like to admit.
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Zanzenburger posted...

and burn because I didn't ever have enough pokemon that had the ability to do so, so I didn't really get a chance to try it out. Though the lowered attack would have been helpful at some points, I imagine.

Scald and will-o-wisp are both extremely common in competitive play. Scald is probably one of the single most common offensive moves used at all
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