Current Events > I went to see urgent care for chest pains recently...

(+) Yeah! (+)

It's just ridiculous. How many other industries where they ask you buy the product before knowing the price? Healthcare in the US is so broken
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JustMyOpinion posted...

konokonohamaru posted...

It's just ridiculous. How many other industries where they ask you buy the product before knowing the price? Healthcare in the US is so broken

Even when you ask sometimes they get it wrong and you're stuck paying more. You can ask if they're in or out of network and a reasonable person would accept their answer, but if they say in network and they're out of network, well then you get that extra cost.

This too. Most of the time the provider doesn't even know how much it will cost you.
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lww99 posted...

I have insurance.

They did a breathing treatment, an EKG(on a cart), and checked my blood pressure.

Literally cost me $950

What in the actual fuck. Fuck healthcare in the US. holy shit

Yes, I fucking hate it.
The whole point of insurance was not to have to spend an arm and leg in case you need a heath service. But once most people have insurance they jacked up the prices so you have to spend it anyway.

"Oh? You need an aspirin? That will be $200, motherfucker. For a single pill".

This should be a crime

Honestly it does sound like you have a lot to be anxious about. It may seem like its just the same as ever, but over the years financial issues will chip away at you.

I know you had a topic earlier on about being frustrated with feeling stuck at your job. Maybe sit down, do some research and draw up a list of objectives for yourself on what you want to achieve and what it will take to get there. Thats what I do when I feel overwhelmed and want to take control of the things I need to get done. I sit down and write a plan of action. Just that act alone helps ease my anxiety.

For urgent care? Jesus Christ. Fuck American healthcare tbh
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Medical debt shouldn't affect your credit score.

No it shouldnt. And I have really good credit right now, not trying to mess that up
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Awesome posted...

its crazy how the middle class just gets screwed over, im extremely poor and on medicaid and get everything covered for free except for once in a while have to pay $1-3 for medication.

Somebody has to pay for everything, and it sure as fuck isn't going to be the rich.
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mybbqrules posted...

Somebody has to pay for everything, and it sure as fuck isn't going to be the rich.

Just think of the poor rich people, the middle class still has money and the rich want it

I had to go to the ER twice last week, I'm afraid I owe out of pocket too.I have blue cross even. It is such a scam.
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Parappa09 posted...

lww99 posted...

Thats the kicker. They told me everything was fine. But here I am, weeks later, with the same symptoms.

But I cant go get checked out again because I clearly cant afford it. Fucking blows

i mean then it should go back to them to do other tests and investigate further to see whats wrong

unless its stress or anxiety induced?

*laughs in American*
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modena posted...

I had to go to the ER twice last week, I'm afraid I owe out of pocket too.I have blue cross even. It is such a scam.

Yeah, that's what I have. Bluecross/Blueshield or Anthem
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@Cleo_II posted...

Maybe sit down, do some research and draw up a list of objectives for yourself on what you want to achieve and what it will take to get there. Thats what I do when I feel overwhelmed and want to take control of the things I need to get done. I sit down and write a plan of action. Just that act alone helps ease my anxiety.

That's a really good idea, gonna start doing this
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my dad had an operation a few years ago. it was fairly straight forward so he only spent 2 days in the Hospital. Went in one morning, had the operation, stayed there that night and then the Hospital kept him one more night to make sure he was ok. They sent us a bill in the mail a little while later. Thankfully his insurance covered the majority but his overall bill was over 100k.....What in the fuck...

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TheVipaGTS posted...

my dad had an operation a few years ago. it was fairly straight forward so he only spent 2 days in the Hospital. Went in one morning, had the operation, stayed there that night and then the Hospital kept him one more night to make sure he was ok. They sent us a bill in the mail a little while later. Thankfully his insurance covered the majority but his overall bill was over 100k.....What in the fuck...

Ugh that's disgusting.

My fiance had to have emergency surgery a couple years ago, and she only working two part time jobs at the time(40 hours combined), and had no insurance.

She initially owed over 30k, but they forgave a majority. Ended up paying about 9k
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My doctor told me he'll have me on my feet in two weeks. He was right. I got his bill; I had to sell my car.
- Rodney Dangerfield
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cold: runny/stuffy nose, sneezing, coughing

flu: fatigue, runny/stuffy nose, sneezing, coughing (there's probably more) but it's the main bulk of the symptoms plus you'll be in goddamn misery until it ends and not being 100% when it's over.
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TheVipaGTS posted...

my dad had an operation a few years ago. it was fairly straight forward so he only spent 2 days in the Hospital. Went in one morning, had the operation, stayed there that night and then the Hospital kept him one more night to make sure he was ok. They sent us a bill in the mail a little while later. Thankfully his insurance covered the majority but his overall bill was over 100k.....What in the fuck...

It's super f***ed up. Doctors and hospitals just charge whatever s*** they want hoping the insurance company will pay.

My advice: Don't pay that $100k bill if your insurance won't cover it. Hospitals actually build non-payment into their systems and their forecasts. Someone I know who works in health administration actually says that hospitals don't want 100% repayment coz if that happens, many will lose their non-profit status.

Just f***ed up beyond belief our s****tty health care system.
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konokonohamaru posted...

It's super f***ed up. Doctors and hospitals just charge whatever s*** they want hoping the insurance company will pay.

Before the circle jerk gets worse, let me clarify doctors don't charge shit. In fact, unless you're a private practice cash-only shop (very rare), the vast majority of doctors are completely insulated from the billing process.

They chart the encounter and bill for what they did clinically, and then hospitals and offices have separate groups that strictly just handle medical coding. They use what is called ICD10 and CPT codes to translate discreet things done, like say stitching up someone's laceration, and convert it to something called an RVU, or relative value unit. This RVU is standardized for a specific reimbursement rate, which insurance can approve or deny based off of supporting documentation (the more detailed it is, with included verbiage they look for, the more likely it is to be approved).

While doctors may be privy to how many "RVU's" they generate, it's hard to even quantify that into a discreet reimbursement because insurance paying out doctors and hospitals is often delayed and fragmented based off of enormous bureaucracy. And it really depends on the model the physician is working under. If they're employed, they're even more insulated from the billing aspect. They see patients and do their work, but it isn't directly correlated with how much they do or how many patients they see. Their employer pays them a salary, with some incentive based model depending on how many RVUs they generate. This salary is relatively stable, regardless of how little or how much you work. Then there are value-based reimbursements where insurance will have you take on a patient population and says "we'll pay you x up front to cover everything" but this isn't contingent based upon how much care they actually need. If someone ends up staying in the hospital for an extra week or two after surgery because of an unforseen complication, that eats into the "bottom line" of that lump sum payment. A lot of private groups are going out of business because they simply don't have the resources to evaluate whether the population the insurance company is offering them is "worth" what they're paying and so they're taking a stab in the dark to see if that amount of money actually covers what these patients truly need. And what happens is these massive hospital systems are buying out these private groups and converting private practice primary care into part of their referral system so that patients who end up in the hospital go within their network for follow up. This outcompetes small private physicians and reduces overall competition in the market.

I haven't even begun to talk about the dynamic of medicare paying only ~80 cents to each dollar private insurance reimburses, which at the end of the day, if a hospital takes on too many medicare patients they'll go in the red and literally close down because they start hemorrhaging money to take care of patients. So this deficit is offset by private insurance reimbursing slightly higher than "true market value" for any particular care.

But it's certainly nowhere close to your scenario of some doctor sitting at a desk just charging some random number.
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BlameAnesthesia posted...

But it's certainly nowhere close to your scenario of some doctor sitting at a desk just charging some random number.

^

I know, I was just blowing off steam. But I'm just trying to figure out why we tolerate this kind of opacity in medical billing. I guess, in some sense, we don't. Everyone is yelling about it and my understanding is that doctors hate it too. But why does it seem like we can't do anything to fix it, and it just seems to be getting worse and worse over time?

In a world where I can click once and transfer money to the other side of the world to have some random product delivered to my doorstep, why can't the medical industry figure out better practices for price transparency?
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konokonohamaru posted...

TheVipaGTS posted...

my dad had an operation a few years ago. it was fairly straight forward so he only spent 2 days in the Hospital. Went in one morning, had the operation, stayed there that night and then the Hospital kept him one more night to make sure he was ok. They sent us a bill in the mail a little while later. Thankfully his insurance covered the majority but his overall bill was over 100k.....What in the fuck...

It's super f***ed up. Doctors and hospitals just charge whatever s*** they want hoping the insurance company will pay.

My advice: Don't pay that $100k bill if your insurance won't cover it. Hospitals actually build non-payment into their systems and their forecasts. Someone I know who works in health administration actually says that hospitals don't want 100% repayment coz if that happens, many will lose their non-profit status.

Just f***ed up beyond belief our s****tty health care system.

Debt collectors pay them and then it fucks up your credit score. This is terrible advice.

konokonohamaru posted...

I know, I was just blowing off steam. But I'm just trying to figure out why we tolerate this kind of opacity in medical billing. I guess, in some sense, we don't. Everyone is yelling about it and my understanding is that doctors hate it too. But why does it seem like we can't do anything to fix it, and it just seems to be getting worse and worse over time?

In a world where I can click once and transfer money to the other side of the world to have some random product delivered to my doorstep, why can't the medical industry figure out better practices for price transparency?

Yeah, I hear you. It's just a clusterfuck for everyone involved.

To be honest, I don't have a good answer. I think a lot of it comes with the bloat involved in a private system. It's so disjointed and there is no streamlined process to communicate between various private entities. So you hire more and more administration to navigate increasingly complicated bureaucracy and regulations. It's not so much the cost of a single service that's the issue, it's the bundled payment of all the behind-the-scenes work that goes into care.
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EdwinNcarnacion posted...

Debt collectors pay them and then it f***s up your credit score. This is terrible advice.

I dunno. I heard it from a hospital administrator himself. "My advice to someone who can't pay is don't pay, we expect that and it's built into the system" in reference to someone I knew who got hit by a surprise bill that couldn't really afford it.

I've always paid my medical bills but I have decent insurance. But if I get hit by $100,000 out of pocket? I think I'd rather take the credit hit than pay that.

Reading up further, credit agencies penalize you less for unpaid medical debts, and it only gets counted against your credit score if the hospital chooses to send it to debt collectors, which I'm not sure if they always do or not. (Remember, hospitals actually rely on some non-payment to get non-profit status)
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Lol, this literally happened to me, though I didn't get covered at all because I didn't reach a deductible.

Get 500 bucks on a card every year for medical purposes though.
My bill was around 1200 and became around 700.
For about the same stuff, and a couple x rays and medication.
No breathing test though.
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Im not saying that health care in America isnt ridiculous, but Im kind if wondering how its so expensive for some of you guys. I spent a bit over 2 weeks in the hospital after my third pleurodesis and it only cost about $60k total, of which I had to pay around $1,200. Like is it an insurance thing? Or a corrupt billing thing?
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YugiNoob posted...

Im not saying that health care in America isnt ridiculous, but Im kind if wondering how its so expensive for some of you guys. I spent a bit over 2 weeks in the hospital after my third pleurodesis and it only cost about $60k total, of which I had to pay around $1,200. Like is it an insurance thing? Or a corrupt billing thing?

Sometimes it's in-network / out-of-network bull that is hard to figure out ... also your insurance contract has so many terms and conditions that it's fairly easy to think something's covered when it's not.
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Oh yeah, that out of network can be a killer.
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ArchiePeck posted...

Imagine living in a first world country where this happens to people.

well alot of people that have these complaints are the same people who would rather deal with high medical bills as long as they get to keep their assault rifles, prevent other people from getting abortions, and help make the rich richer. Its americans' priorities unfortunately.

Anyways, this is why i'm so glad my wife and I are both in the medical field, and this is also the reason I pay a bit extra for really good insurance. I pay a high premium for a low deductible, great coverage nation-wide. So I have zero stress over all this stuff. On top of that, because we're in the medical field, we only really go to the doctor if we really need to go. (Other than routine visits and bloodtests and stuff).

Not seeing the point of paying for medical insurance if it doesn't cover anything.
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Inferno Dive Dragoon posted...

Not seeing the point of paying for medical insurance if it doesn't cover anything.

Oh I know
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bro we need to sort you out a gofundme to find out what those chest pains are

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If you're having money problems, then just get a job that pays you more.
-Ben Shapiro
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Dang why didnt I think of that
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