Board 8 > Final Fantasy 7: Remake Spoiler Discussion Topic

(+) Yeah! (+)

DeathChicken posted...

Regarding the seven seconds thing, yeah, I get the feeling Cloud is going to make a heroic save there since that is very much the time it took Sephiroth to kill Aerith. Which...well, it sure would be a thing if he killed Cloud instead, wouldn't it

I didn't really follow this as it was happening, but my friends were saying that Cloud saved Zack in his last stand during the 7 seconds or whatever. But they might be misinterpreting it.

I guess they are assuming that what he did directly caused the things we immediately saw were different, but your suggestion implies we have yet to see the result and we'll find out later.... I think both concepts are cool with me.

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LOL comparing this to MGS2

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What really makes me buy into the seven seconds referring to Aeris is the music.

Original game (you can also see the seven second drop from 1:50 - 1:57):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wx3duFYCcho

Remake:
https://youtu.be/tZcZcPxKeuI

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so the entire game is a dream/vision as she is dying after Sephiroth murders her in the original.

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It's all taking place inside an autistic kid's materiaglobe.

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pjbasis posted...

LOL comparing this to MGS2

in terms of the hype and expectations, its pretty much the same thing yes.

and yes, most likely i dont trust square, but well see

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Man the way people were talking, I figured the ending would be way more incomprehensible than it actually was! But I was prepared for some of the major changes so the weirdest thing was the final boss rush ripped straight out of Kingdom Hearts

Anyways I'm pretty excited for the next parts now, way more now that I've played the game. The did a good job with the new content here and I'm assuming it's gonna follow the similar formula of being mostly the same with a few big shakeups. Zack HYPE.

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I've been watching several Wall Market streams and every single one I've seen got the Chocobo Sam route. I got Madam M route and not sure what was different because I can't remember if I said yes or no to Johnny's event. I did Luxury course and said No deal to Sam. And all guides say conflicting things. Not sure if people have really figured this out yet?

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It was weird since from the stuff I've read, Sam's route is supposed to be the one where you run errands for the pharmacy guy. But I definitely got that and Sam definitely told me to go fuck myself and talk to Madam

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I ended up with Sam's route, which was fine since you need that for the Jonny trophy apparently

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I got Madam M's route, so I need to go back later to finish Johnny's stuff.

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They involve the massage price you pay, what you say to Aeris about her dress and also which option you pick for the coin flip

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Just finished, and as someone with no reverence for FFVII I thought it was still radical. Rufus fight was the highlight for me.

Gonna need someone to explain the "killing off the 97 cast" thing, because I have no idea what you're talking about.

UshiromiyaEva posted...

Just finished, and as someone with no reverence for FFVII I thought it was still radical. Rufus fight was the highlight for me.

Gonna need someone to explain the "killing off the 97 cast" thing, because I have no idea what you're talking about.

Read the descriptions of the three minibosses you fight before Sephiroth. One fights with a sword, one fights with its fists, and one fights with ranged attacks.

So it's strongly implied to be related to the original party members, and maybe it's not LITERALLY them but it's symbolic as shit

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Speaking of Sephiroth, I'm assuming if he gets that countdown off you die? I think I finished him at a six count

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So if you check the in-game summary of Chapter 18, it says Sephiroth is showing Cloud a vision of the 7 seconds before the planet is destroyed. Maybe that Aerith theory is just coincidence.

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Okay I just beat the game. Gonna need some time to digest it but basically:

-Did not like it too much at the start
-Absolutely loved it from Aeris's church to the end of the game
-Did not like the end of the game

It is a classic Nomura fuckfest though. I like the theories, I didn't notice the different version of Stamp but I did notice this, which I haven't seen addressed yet, and someone please tell me if I'm mistaken:

Here's the ending on youtube, jump to 10:16: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWp8fq0m-sI

When Zack appears to have survived, he gets knocked down by the blast of what you think is an explosion, but we see it's light that's enveloping Midgar (and maybe some whisps of Whispers) and when it fades away we see Midgar, at 10:46 (I've taken a crappy screenshot below)

https://i.imgur.com/HaEodwS.png

That does not look like present-day Midgar at all, to me at least. That looks like a Midgar that's still under construction. But my understanding is Zack's death took place very close to the beginning of FF7 - close enough for the time for Cloud to walk (crawl?) in his messed-up state to the Sector 7 train station and Tifa finding him there. The "fate" light was clearly doing something to the city of Midgar too. So what's going on with that? Is Midgar in an earlier state in the alternate timeline? Was Zack sent back in time? Good god.

Other areas in the game that I really got stuck on for making no logical sense:

-Why are they re-entering the Sector 7 slums after the plate's fallen. There shouldn't be a Seventh Heaven sign, you shouldn't be able to see the sky, a giant fucking plate fell on top of you. Like, you can seriously see the sky. Everything should be smooshed under tons of metal that fell from 300 metres above. Where is the plate!!!?!

-Putting the giant Hojo labratory in the Shinra building. It's a 70 storey building and it's pretty clear The Drum is more than a storey or two. Literally makes no sense unless we're bringing Doctor Who TARDIS technology into the FF7-verse.

Also I can't believe I missed the scan text on those 3 Whispers you fight at the end, I did scan them but must not have read it. I like the implication of sword/guns/barehanded being the '97 crew... geez.

Lastly, between Heidegger talking about "S and G"-type soldiers, that one soldier who recognizes Cloud saying he's going to get Kunsel, and the ending literally doing a copy-and-paste on Crisis Core, I think we can say Compilation of Final Fantasy VII 100% confirmed Genesis Rhapsodos incoming let's fucking goooooo

You and I are probably the only ones excited for a Genesis appearance.

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Tag for eventually

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Who said anything about excitement, I was thinking of this meme: https://i.imgur.com/7oRa8iB.jpg

And I was also going to joke about a Dirge of Cerberus remake. And if the Compilation is real then maybe we'll get Cissnei in Remake Part 2...

...but now I'm thinking about Crisis Core 2 with alternate Zack and Cissnei. Now we're talking.

I forget when Elena first shows up. Is it post-Midgar?

Either way just replace her with Cissnei regardless

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In the cave after Zolomy. She shows up to go "We're going to Junon after Sephiroth and not telling you! Top Secret!"

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Okay replace Elena with Cissnei but don't make Cissnei the dumb one

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no one seems to care that FF7 Remake is set in the same universe as Chrono Trigger

Marle (as an old lady) and Johnny (before he becomes half motorcycle)

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MartinFF7 posted...

Lastly, between Heidegger talking about "S and G"-type soldiers, that one soldier who recognizes Cloud saying he's going to get Kunsel, and the ending literally doing a copy-and-paste on Crisis Core, I think we can say Compilation of Final Fantasy VII 100% confirmed Genesis Rhapsodos incoming let's fucking goooooo

The scenario writer (Nomura is not actually doing the scenario writing) is one of the original FF7 writers and the guy who wrote Crisis Core, and that actually does a lot to give me hope for the future parts. I think CC has a pretty decent plot with some VERY good bits and some really stupid bits (I know everyone hates Genesis but he doesn't bother me too much), so if we get CC-quality plot with this much, MUCH better battle system, I think that's a success.

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HeroDelTiempo17 posted...

so if we get CC-quality plot with this much, MUCH better battle system, I think that's a success.

What if we could have gotten FF7-quality plot by retelling the original story with this much, MUCH better battle system? Imagine the success of that!

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now that I am deep into hard more, I am actually liking the combat even more.

They really make you think and try different things against different bosses.

Hell House was so damn easy on Hard somehow. I guess I over prepared

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davidponte posted...

What if we could have gotten FF7-quality plot by retelling the original story with this much, MUCH better battle system? Imagine the success of that!

Sure but I'm of the opinion that they were always going to add the compilation stuff in regardless of these other major changes so I dunno man. Better to go all-in on changing things if you're doing it anyways.

like I think this hypothetical ff7 remake where they ignore all the other context and hype and fanservice and tie-ins built up over 20 years never ever happens

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One thing I did want to say, and I thought I called it and boy was I wrong... but before the truth was revealed, I thought the "whispers" were the souls of Sephiroth-clones who had died and, because of Sephiroth influence and/or the taint of Jenova, their souls weren't dissolved back into the lifestream and Sephiroth could control them to do his bidding. And because his end goal requires Cloud (who he can control) and Aerith to get the black materia, he needs those two to link up and survive.

And this was based on Whispers:
-Harassing Aerith on the street (when he first meets her, right after Cloud sees a hallucination of Sephiroth next to her)
-Taking a keen interest in a sleeping Cloud right before the attack in the slums
-Attacking the slums (in order for Cloud to go on the mission that leads to his meeting Aerith)
-Guiding his descent while falling so he would land in the church (and not die)
-Protecting Aerith & Cloud in the church
-Trying to stop Cloud and company from going to the Sector 7 pillar (too great a chance of them dying there)
-Stopping Hojo from revealing the truth about Cloud

Trying to think of when they show up other than those times but right from his crashing into Aerith's church I thought they were in Sephiroth's control, their actions serving to get them on the path to getting the black materia; and that they were a script writer's way of explaining away some stuff in the original FF7 that was too outlandish/coincidental, e.g.:
-Cloud meeting Aerith on the streets after the No. 1 bombing
-Cloud crashing into Aerith's church
-Cloud surviving the fall from the No. 5 reactor

Like somebody said, it's too unrealistic that these people keep running into each other, so let's get Sephiroth ghosts to set up their meeting so it's not coincidental, Sephiroth has this ghostly army at his disposal, working to set up events to his benefit. And they existed in the original but we didn't see them in action, kind of the same way we didn't see the extra Crisis Core events in the original Nibelheim flashbacks, or whatever.

Which really annoyed me thinking about that... but in hindsight think I would've preferred rather than what we actually got. Like seriously, if the whispers are trying to ensure events unfold the same as the original game, why attack them prior to the Sector 7 pillar? Cloud and Tifa climb the pillar in the original timeline anyways.

Though it also makes me feel better, when Cloud got a glimpse of the clones in the Northern Cave when touching "Marco" the neighbour, I thought why the hell is he seeing the future... and when he got a future-vision of Aerith after meeting her and shed a tear I was likely, what the fuck is going on right now. So at least both of those are more explainable, seeing glimpses of the future, but geez.

HeroDelTiempo17 posted...

Sure but I'm of the opinion that they were always going to add the compilation stuff in regardless of these other major changes so I dunno man. Better to go all-in on changing things if you're doing it anyways.

I think a remake with FF7 plus all the compilations tied into the story is a fantastic game. I loved CC. This isn't what we're getting, though.

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I don't know, there were literal shot for shot recreations from CC at the end there.

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I'm sure we'll get CC stuff, I meant to say that this isn't FF7 + Compilations, this is FF7 + Compilations + KH + Whatever Nomura thinks of next week.

Can't wait for part 11 when Sephiroth becomes Sin.

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im on chapter 13!

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New plan:

CC remake and just re-use the Midgar environments from this game. Reactor layout in Modeoheim is the same. Build out the Nibelheim models as first thing when making Remake Pt 2 and use that. Tweak the script to put more focus in Midgar to accommodate it too.

So then you only need to create explorable environments for like.... 2 or 3 locations. We never did get a Crisis Core port, frankly they owe us.

davidponte posted...

I think a remake with FF7 plus all the compilations tied into the story is a fantastic game. I loved CC. This isn't what we're getting, though.

I still think we are getting mostly this and the major changes/additions are going to be in the interest of cramming in as much fanservice as possible (Zack lives, Aerith probably lives at least past the original). That's how it was used every time in this part, honestly. Hojo showing up early, Jesse/Biggs/Wedge surviving, cramming in cool battles against the Turks and Sephy, and every time the game has to come up with some excuse for why this blatant fanservice doesn't outright wreck the plot.

Like I think they keep almost everything up to Temple of the Ancients, swerve the death scene everyone knows is coming, and then...they still have to keep the Reunion stuff intact too because they've hinted at it so much already. So you're really only looking at a potential major rewrite of the final act?

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Just did Chapter 9 with Tifa's "sporty" dress.

Boobs.

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I really liked the new ending and the story changes but it felt a little rushed. 95% of the game being basically identical and then the wild crazy ending didn't really feel earned.

Excited to see where they go though, even if it's a train wreck.

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Just finished it. That was really good! I guess I am in the crowd that finds the change interesting (though to be fair I didn't play the original FF7 at the time and nabbed / played a bit later). Pretty much anything can happen now!

I want confirmation if Jessie made it or not! If my boy Biggs managed to pull through surely she's got a chance right!? She owes me a pizza damn it! Also everything with Wedge was a surprise. I was really pulling for the guy to make it after the slight twist at the pillar and was always half expecting some bullshit to screw him at the last second but...who knows? Then there is the whole Zack situation...

Man there is so much shit going on.

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I am pretty sure that wedge is 'dead' and jessie is actually dead.


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The worst part about this game, since I went in completely blind and didn't start looking things up until I beat it:

Items being pretty garbage, which makes steal pretty garbage and a waste of a slot, but then having one of the weapons a steal from one of the most annoying bosses.

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Oh is Steal useless? Materia slots are so hard to come by in this game that I wasn't sure if I should be using it. I guess I'll look up which boss to steal that weapon from and then drop it out of rotation.

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So I didn't die against the ghoul or ghost chariot, but both were way harder than Hell House

Gimmicky fights where you have to use magic at some points really suck when there are 2 bosses in a chapter and no MP regen

Steal is needed like... two times, once for a weapon and once for an armor. The rest of the time it is useless

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Lucavi000 posted...

I am pretty sure that wedge is 'dead' and jessie is actually dead.

Looking back, are those Jessie's gloves on the desk next to Biggs bed at the end? Maybe she survived or its just all they managed to recover. Guess we will see if anything pops up with any of the trio in the next part. Would be funny if Jessie shows up at the Gold Saucer given the letter you can find at her house.

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Played 8 straight hours to finish the last few chapters tonight

Definitely more interesting than original FF7 ever was and I'll be first in line to get the next one.

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How do they even explain Biggs (and maybe Jessie) surviving when
-They were seriously injured
-Way up on the pillar
-Nobody coming to their rescue
-Not enough time to not only get down the pillar in their injured state, but also free of the plate collapse?

Unless it's alternate timeline or "whispers saved him/them because reasons", I mean... struggling here.

FFDragon: stumbled on an even better theory than your "fighting the '97 crew" theory on the Remake board - https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/168653-final-fantasy-vii-remake/78604155

A guy conjectured that the whispers are actually the three guys from Advent Children, based on the swordwielder being left-handed (while Cloud is right) and the gunner having 2 guns vs. Barret's lone gun arm. The sword/fists/guns aesthetic also matches those three too, I haven't checked the other claims. Still... interesting!

I mean they can just say the neighborhood watch evacuated them off-screen after Cloud and Tifa cleared the way up. It's really not that deep.

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Redoing chapter 16 for cleaning stuff up and missed that you could actually climb the stairs the first time through hah.

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I took the stairs the first time. It was glorious. Never again though.

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I am surprised it wasn't a trophy.

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I did the elevator, saved, loaded a previous save and did the stairs. At least last time you could get an elixir that way... I don't believe there was anything of value going up the stairs?

...so promptly loaded up the elevator save file afterwards, at least I got some exp there.