Poll of the Day > ATTN: Gun people

(+) Yeah! (+)

Jen0125 posted...

I don't understand the comment. Every home has locks on the doors and windows.

Then what are you worried about? No one is going to XCom style break through your window and come and harm you. No, seriously, the statistics of that happening nearly approach zero in America. If your solution is to get a gun because your alarm went off, it's a knee jerk reaction that will do the opposite of what you think it will (protection).

Get outdoor cameras or motion sensor lights. Hell, the cameras can be fake. Deterrence is the best way to end any fear of a break in. Way cheaper, and without the risks and hurdles of becoming a new gun owner.

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Jen0125 posted...

There's a million gun stores and ranges in Arizona.

Ah. I never asked (or cared) about your location. From the topic I was wondering if you lived in the south, they like their guns. Despite what you think about me I'll never fault anyone for preparing to defend themselves and their property. If someone 'visits unexpectedly' it's YOUR right to go home in one piece, not theirs.

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Do you live in a bad area of town?

CyborgSage00x0 posted...

Then what are you worried about? No one is going to XCom style break through your window and come and harm you. No, seriously, the statistics of that happening nearly approach zero in America. If your solution is to get a gun because your alarm went off, it's a knee jerk reaction that will do the opposite of what you think it will (protection).

Get outdoor cameras or motion sensor lights. Hell, the cameras can be fake. Deterrence is the best way to end any fear of a break in. Way cheaper, and without the risks and hurdles of becoming a new gun owner.

I have all those.

And there are no hurdles to becoming a gun owner here. I go to the store, I buy a gun. If I want to be safe I practice at the range and take a safety course. It'll probably be easier and less time consuming to buy a gun than it was to get my security system installed.

DPsx7 posted...

Ah. I never asked (or cared) about your location. From the topic I was wondering if you lived in the south, they like their guns. Despite what you think about me I'll never fault anyone for preparing to defend themselves and their property. If someone 'visits unexpectedly' it's YOUR right to go home in one piece, not theirs.

If you wondered if I lived in the south then you cared about where I lived, genius.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHqB2t-DGb8

Bill Burr goes into depth about gun ownership.

Didn't read the whole topic. See that you're uncomfortable with a shotgun, which is fine. There's always 20 gauges, but a pistol will just fine for home defense. Saw that you two are planning to take a safety course which is smart. I'd definitely recommend going to a gun store and finding a gun that feels comfortable in your hands. As for caliber, 9mm should be a good balance of power and ease of use. Get hollow points for your ammunition in whatever pistol you get. There's less worry of over penetration and you'll be more lethal to soft targets.

Hopefully you'll be like most of us gun owners and never have to fire your gun in defense. Good luck with your safety course and hopefully all of this wasn't covered ad nauseum in the thread already.

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Jen0125 posted...

If you wondered if I lived in the south then you cared about where I lived, genius.

Not even close or I would have brought it up. Not all gun toting yokels are from the south.

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DPsx7 posted...

I think NY is one of the strict ones. I said a year because there's probably a long line due to a rush to get them now that some stores won't carry guns anymore (Dicks and Wally I think). I don't have interest in them so I haven't looked for specifics. Our area isn't big on crime. Or stuff to do for that matter, wouldn't know where to look for a range.

Got it. So, again, you dont know what the fuck youre talking about.

Also, strengthen your wrists if you want to fire a handgun rapidly, and accurately.

Cacciato posted...

Got it. So, again, you dont know what the fuck youre talking about.

I ALWAYS know more than you though so I'm good.

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1.) Here's a good video for neutral advice on guns, including finding the weapon for your needs:
What You Need to Know Before Buying Firearms
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHIPyF9fKHg
"Type of Gun" can be found at the 5:45 mark through the 6:50 mark
TL;DW - It depends on what you're looking for & what you're able to handle. Try a variety of guns.
2.) Remember to keep it clean
3.) Go to the range at least once a month

get a PS90


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Jen0125 posted...

I have all those.

Then you need to do nothing, because you're already fine. Your systems worked and possibly scared someone off.

I say possibly, because I'm not seeing evidence that someone actually tried to break in. Your alarm could have just gone rogue. Even if it didn't, your system worked, so....

Jen0125 posted...

And there are no hurdles to becoming a gun owner here. I go to the store, I buy a gun. If I want to be safe I practice at the range and take a safety course. It'll probably be easier and less time consuming to buy a gun than it was to get my security system installed.

This is what I meant. Since America is a joke, obtaining a gun is laughably easy, which wasn't what I was referring to. Being the mythical "responsible gun owner" does require some hurdles, though. But seeing as you are debating getting one for illogical reasons, I'm doubting your plan to go that route.

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I literally said we're going that route so

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The irony of someone who has talked so much s*** about guns, gun rights, and gun owners wanting to purchase a firearm to defend herself.

BeerOnTap posted...

The irony of someone who has talked so much s*** about guns, gun rights, and gun owners wanting to purchase a firearm to defend herself.

I already said I don't want to. My boyfriend wants to. It's almost like you should read the topic.

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Jen0125 posted...

I already said I don't want to. My boyfriend wants to. It's almost like you should read the topic.

so you are with someone whose values are so opposed to your own that if you WERENT dating them you would practically foam at the mouth over this conversation. but because you are dating them, you are willing to compromise those values that you held onto so vehemently in the past? sounds healthy.

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Noop_Noop posted...

you would practically foam at the mouth over this conversation

Strawman much?

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Noop_Noop posted...

so you are with someone whose values are so opposed to your own that if you WERENT dating them you would practically foam at the mouth over this conversation. but because you are dating them, you are willing to compromise those values that you held onto so vehemently in the past? sounds healthy.

What? I don't think you guys understand what my gun beliefs are. And my boyfriend doesn't have diametrically opposed beliefs to mine. He just doesn't care about politics or gun laws. We have access to buy a handgun, he wants a handgun for his perceived safety. It's very basic. He doesn't care about gun rights lol.

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Sounds like love, actually. Doing something that goes against your beliefs because you love the person enough to look past their own beliefs.

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DesertPenguin09 posted...

Sounds like love, actually. Doing something that goes against your beliefs because you love the person enough to look past their own beliefs.

I mean, he wants to get one because I'm home alone while he works nights and he would feel more comfortable if we had a gun in the house because I would be "safer." That's how he feels so if he wants to get a handgun, we can get one and stick it under the bed.

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Just get a 9mm shield. 380 sucks. 380 is just a shortened 9mm. When I pick up brass for reloading sometimes I accidentally pick up 380. Stupid 380. I have a sw 9mm shield and let me tell you it shoots everything. No failures to fire feed or eject unlike some other guns I have used *cough* Glock, Sig *cough*

Jen0125 posted...

The one I'm looking at is $350

You can get a shield 9 for under 300. Go to a gun shop and look for a used one.

Ruger LC9 is another good choice. Way better trigger than MP Shield too. Can't go wrong with either

Jen0125 posted...

I don't feel comfortable with guns yet so I don't think I can get a shotgun. I think I need to start with a handgun

Handgun is way harder to shoot. Shotgun only kicks like a fucker when you load slugs or buckshot. Practice with birdshot or game loads. All that bullshit about hand size kick etc is just that, bullshit. Get out there and shoot. I know a girl who is 5'4" and she can shoot my p320 x carry no problem. 1911 is a great starter gun too but they are heavy and are a bitch to take down for beginners

GameLord113 posted...

Someone posted a shotgun made by Beretta that was high speed with little recoil that absolutely would tear any intruder up. Not sure what the model is and Im sure it is expensive but you would hardly have to aim with that thing.

Don't listen to people who use terms like "high speed" when talking about guns

Just pm me

Bugmeat posted...

The Kel Tec KSG 25 can hold 25 of them. That's enough to put down an entire gang of intruders.

All right, last post.

Magazine, not clip, and most shotguns have tube mags, not box mags. Although I do have a VEPR12 with a 12 round mag... and 10... and 8... and 2 5 rounders. Okay, well, shut up.

If it really is just your boytoy's opinion and you aren't comfortable around guns... a knife or a taser would probably be better

I mean, if someone breaks in and they do have a gun... once you are aware of them you'd have to find your gun, remove it from its safety box, assemble it, load it................. ok, scratch that, no one actually does that.

You'd still have to go get your gun, which I'd assume is under your pillow in this situation, and shoot the first thing that moves and hope it is an intruder... 'cuz otherwise it could be the intruder and they're already armed and likely pointing at you.

Or, basically, it's all a disaster waiting to happen. 2/3s of all gun injuries are self-inflicted, and 4/5ths of all gun injuries affect non-belligerents.

...

I'm not saying you shouldn't defend youself, just saying the home is an ironically difficult place to defend safely - especially if you have friends/family/pets coming in and out at all hours. - so you would want something that you can use safely in a "neutralize first, ask questions later" manner... with a gun as a backup

Of course, guns are hella fun - so ignore all that

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I don't know how many times I have to say this but I'm not getting a shotgun.

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dude posted 5 times in a row

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He sent me a PM as well.

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Lokarin posted...

You'd still have to go get your gun, which I'd assume is under your pillow in this situation, and shoot the first thing that moves and hope it is an intruder... 'cuz otherwise it could be the intruder and they're already armed and likely pointing at you.

Isn't one of the main things about gun safety to confirm your target before you shoot? You don't want to shoot up your wife or kid or anything like that.

MabinogiFan posted...

Isn't one of the main things about gun safety to confirm your target before you shoot? You don't want to shoot up your wife or kid or anything like that.

Of course, that's the paradox - an intruder doesn't need to worry about safety

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So, lots of things.

What is your living situation as far as neighbors or house mates? Do you have a second floor? Over penetration is a concern, and you should make a plan to try to minimize collateral damage.

Handguns and long guns both have advantages and disadvantages.

Handgun advantages:

Easier to use one hand to keep in operation keeping the other free for a phone on the line with 911, open doors, etc.

More manageable if you need to navigate through the house in close quarters.

Handgun disadvantages:

Harder to use effectively.

Less effective on targets than shotguns or rifles.

Long gun advantages:

Easier to use effectively.

More effective on targets.

Long gun disadvantages:

Harder to maneuver in side a house.

Harder to manage one handed if need be.

The Shield 380 ez is a fine gun, but for a gun that you don't plan on ever carrying, that is going to be dedicated home defense I would look at something bigger and easier to shoot.

If you are able to hunker down in one position in the house (no need to secure/protect children/housemates) or if overpenetration is a concern I'd recommend a 556 rifle. With proper load selection it has the least over penetration of appropriate self defense loads. They are easy to handle, low recoil, perform well, and much easier to gain proficiency with vs a handgun.

A handgun is a also a good choice, but if you are locking yourself in a bedroom and defending the door, you miss out on most of its advantages over a long gun.

Size, weight, and caliber are all consideration for a defensive handgun. Since you do not plan on carrying this gun, bigger and heavier are good, as they will reduce recoil. 380 is acceptable for defense, but in a scenario where compact size, and light weight are not needed, I would look at a full size 9mm. A full size 9, especially in a steel frame, will be very tame, and offer increased sight radius and capacity over the 380 shield.

Disregard anyone that tells you to use birdshot for defensive purposes or "you don't have to aim" or "you can't miss" with a shotgun. appropriate self defense loads, at in home ranges, will have a spread somewhere between a 50 cent piece or fist size, they can still easily miss.

Shotgun for home defense is grossly over rated.
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Thanks for all that info, ultra magus. As far as our home layout it's one floor and the bedroom is in the back connected to the kitchen. I have no housemates other than my pets and boyfriend and he works nights so I'm not concerned about collateral damage. I'll talk to the shop owner when we go about full size vs compact.

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I dont know if anyones suggested it, but you should get a shotgun.

You should get a shotgun pistol.

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Cacciato posted...

I dont know if anyones suggested it, but you should get a shotgun.

I don't think they have yet. I'm just not comfortable getting a shotgun tho but ty

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what if you got two shotguns though

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Bulbasaur posted...

what if you got two shotguns though

Make shotchucks

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Lokarin posted...

Make shotchucks

Fucking awesome!

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Why don't you get a shotgun AND a pistol all in one package?

https://youtu.be/4H5GepjBRsM?t=119

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Smarkil posted...

Why don't you get a shotgun AND a pistol all in one package?

https://youtu.be/4H5GepjBRsM?t=119

Because the Taurus Judge is a pile of shit. .410 out of that size barrel has garbage ballistics, and if you want to shoot .45 LC just get a revolver that shoots it.

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if youre not comfortable with firearms id atleast think about beefing up your home security rather than going to a firearm IF you have the means. theres lots of ways to detract criminals from robbing you. motion lights, random on/off switches for home lights, steel frames on doors with security locks, beware of dog signs (NOT "firearms in side" or "intruders may be shot"), security film over windows, outdoor cameras (even if there fake), a security system ect.

that all said a lot of those things are not practical for the same price, but also know that if youre going to get robbed its most likely while your not at home of which those precautions will make them think twice about robbing you in general, home or not.

with that said again there ARE some real crazies out there that might just not give a shit. iv seen it before and theres lots of videos out there showing it of which a gun would be the last line of defense and one you can get for a substantially lower cost.

as far as the type of firearms themselves go i would personally goto a handgun. not that rifles or shotguns arnt good too, but chances are pretty high the areas your going to be defending consists of narrow corridors and tight corners which really isnt 100% practical for a long gun.

as for the type of handgun the skies the limit as are the philosophies, but in general if it will reliably go bang and you can handle it then its a good HD weapon. the M&P EZ is a nice little gun and can be managed by everyone, but its also a single stack .380. not that 9 shots of .380 wont cause someone to skater or put them down, but it can leave you open for intruders to still react to the situation and something liek 45% of home invasions tend to have more than one individual. because of that (and the unknown) its good to either have maximum power (like a .357, 10mm or even .44 of which if someone gets hit with just one of these they are going to be down for the count) or maximum capacity (like a whole host of double stack 9mm's) which gives you more opportunities to end the threat(s).

there is also something to be said for the sound of the firearm. guns are LOUD to the point that many calibers can deafen individuals and cause issues with their awareness (which HAS gotten people killed because they couldnt properly respond to a police presence afterwards). because of this i am personally fond of a .45 handgun for home defense. its a big bullet with a wide variety weights, its naturally subsonic so it wont completely blow your eardrums out and modern handguns offer decent capacities for it (like the Glock 21 and FNX).

a couple more things to ponder is the argument for "tacticool" features of their firearms (liek shell holders, mean looking compensators, extended magazines, suppressors, unique forms of ammo ect.) which depending if you actually had to use your weapon the most shit you put on it might make it seem like you were waiting for that oppertunity which may not play well to a jury depending on the state your in.

the other thing is the idea of magazine fed weapons and spring compression. the magazine of a firearm which holds the bullets and the firing pin spring which hits the primer causing the round to go off can decompress after a period of time if left cocked and loaded. if your someone who takes care of their firearms and mantains them regularly this is less of an issue, but if this is a "set it and forget it" type weapon that could be setting in a closet, loaded collecting dust for years then this issue might be a serious problem and can mean malfunctions at the worst possible time (this goes for the ammunition you have loaded in them. if the weapon is meant for a life and death situation its VERY important that you change out the ammo in them atleast once every year since they will be susceptible to every day elements and the components in the bullets will start to break down causing issues). because of this some people tend to use revolvers or break open shotguns as HD weapon since that factor is out of the question. largely not an issue, but something to consider since oyu said you arnt big into guns so this weapon may or may not just be sitting around waiting.

and in general just be safe with them and learn to use them right AND make sure you shoot them and maintain them regularly (even if you dont particularly enjoy it). they are deadly, but they arnt some mystical force that requires years of practice to get right. they are very simple tool to learn on and use.

this guy said you should get a shotgun^

Is Jen getting a shotgun or not guys I'm confused.

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Shotguns are for hillbillies

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Jen0125 posted...

Shotguns are for hillbillies

My first post was for a cool-ass bullpup shotgun, but ya

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I recommend a Nerf N-Strike Elite DoubleBreach Blaster. Personally for me when it comes to home defense its Nerf or nothing.

sounds like you should just leave the home defense to the police.