Board 8 > King of Fighters 2020 (NOT MERCS) R2D21: Kirby vs The Flash (High)

(+) Yeah! (+)

Welcome to the King of Fighters 2020 (NOT MERCS) Simulated Character Battle Tournament!

The game is simple. The two* listed characters are placed in an (imaginary) location with a variety of (imaginary) environments, kind of like a picture in a child's schoolbook that describes different types of geological features. Within a ten mile radius, there is an (imaginary) urban downtown, exurbs, plains, snow-clad mountains at the edge, dry plains, etc. Fighters start wherever is most appropriate for them, but feel increasingly compelled to seek out their opponent and fight. Strong-willed fighters can try to hold out in their chosen environment for longer... eventually, all will succumb and actively search for the other to battle.

To participate, just vote in bold for whichever character you believe will win. Giving reasoning is optional, but please be polite and read what others have said and carefully make your decision. I'll ping the nominators (they can opt out) to give arguments if they wish.

Results/Discussion: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/78797189

TODAY'S PARTICIPANTS:
Kirby (Kirby)


vs

The Flash (DC)


@Dantezoid

FIGHT

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Well, honestly, I think Flash has the advantage, he's too fast to be caught by the endless vacuum that is kirby's maw, and if you can always be on the backside of kirby, there's not much that can be done there by the pink puff.

but would the flash even want to fight kirby, or would kirby's disarming cuteness disarm him with cuteness, leading to his demise?

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kinda leaning Kirby here

say he inhales Flash and copies his superspeed (which seems the most logical copy ability). does Flash have powers other than his speed? my general impression is that he relies on outstatting his enemies
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Drakeryn posted...

kinda leaning Kirby here

does Flash have powers other than his speed? my general impression is that he relies on outstatting his enemies

Flash can take speed from other people, I think?

Kirby copying him would make him double fast. Which Kirby could then copy. And so on and so forth.

... this match is horrifying.

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flash becomes so fast he exceeds the limits of even comic-book physics and collapses into a black hole, which kirby can clearly survive

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Flash is definitely cocky enough to let his guard down against an opponent like Kirby and get eaten, I think

then you've got 'Flash speed' against 'Flash speed but can also naturally hit a world threatening meteor at billions of times the speed of light"

yeah I'm leaning Kirby here, but when you've got Flash and the speed force in a battle who even knows

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How forceful is Kirby's inhaling? In the games he has to be fairly close to something to inhale it. Would Flash really let himself get that close? And if he does, what's stopping him from outrunning it? Doesn't he outrun significantly faster things all the time?

Kamekguy posted...

Flash can take speed from other people, I think?

Kirby copying him would make him double fast. Which Kirby could then copy. And so on and so forth.

... this match is horrifying.

...amazing
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rwlh posted...

Would Flash really let himself get that close?

To my understanding, Flash is primarily melee, so he's definitely going to get close in combat. (We saw this in the Deathstroke vs. Flash comic that got posted a few matches earlier. Even before the actual fight starts I think everyone's standing around in reasonably close proximity to each other.)

https://memestatic.fjcdn.com/pictures/Deathstroke+vs+flash_73a810_7389958.jpg

As to your other questions though, I dunno.
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rwlh posted...

How forceful is Kirby's inhaling? In the games he has to be fairly close to something to inhale it.

it kinda varies. In Return to Dreamland his inhale was a lot more forceful, allowing him to inhale multiple objects from pretty strong distances

usually the rule of thumb is "it's as forceful as it needs to be right then" as it frequently is a lot stronger against the final boss than against anything else in the games

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I also really like the image of Flash punching Kirby at lightspeed and Kirby just flying ridiculously far off into the distance like hitting a rubber ball with a metal bat

Only to be instantly transported back on a warp star, unharmed

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Flash. If nothing else he's shown that if he can't beat something by punching it, he isn't above vibrating them into another dimension and leaving them there

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DeathChicken posted...

Flash. If nothing else he's shown that if he can't beat something by punching it, he isn't above vibrating them into another dimension and leaving them there

hey remember that time in smash ultimate when a galaxy-destroying monster killed everyone except Kirby who literally warped out of the galaxy

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gonna go kirb

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Flash

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Kirby Kirby Kirby

that's a name you should know

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Also I could pretty easily see this going "Kirby eats Flash, Kirby gets all of Flash's powers, Kirby disintegrates himself into the Speed Force by going too fast"

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Flash

NFUN posted...

but would the flash even want to fight kirby, or would kirby's disarming cuteness disarm him with cuteness, leading to his demise?

NFUN, you don't get to use that argument.

Strong-willed fighters can try to hold out in their chosen environment for longer... eventually, all will succumb and actively search for the other to battle.

When your argument goes against the rules you set for the setting in the first place, it kind of ruins the point.

Flash

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Flash.

Flash.

Joke arguments aside, Flash can speedsteal Kirby if he doesn't want to harm him. A kirbster who literally cannot act at all is legally KO'd and that ends the match. Zero reason to assume he gets copied.

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Is speedstealing his go-to in combat? Like again bringing up Flash vs. Deathstroke, Flash doesn't speedsteal, he charges in for a melee attack and gets himself stabbed.
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Yeah I can't see Flash attempting to speed steal Kirby right off the bat. Kirby's whole thing is that he doesn't appear as a threat. Flash wouldn't have any reason to think he needs to pull out all the stops to take on a literal pink marshmallow, and by the time he realizes what Kirby can do, it'll be too late

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Drakeryn posted...

Is speedstealing his go-to in combat? Like again bringing up Flash vs. Deathstroke, Flash doesn't speedsteal, he charges in for a melee attack and gets himself stabbed.

Flash's default tends to be disabling opponents, particularly those he doesn't want to harm. If you think Flash would assume something as cute as Kirby couldn't possibly want to fight on purpose, he's not liable to go for melee attacks, for the same reason he wouldn't punch out a child. More often than not, he uses the environment to take care of business. For example, while fighting a guy who can run on water, he simply kicks the tide back at him to throw him back and retrieves a McGuffin he was carrying. That kinda thing. I really don't see a reason why he tries to melee Kirby as a first approach.

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ZeeksFire posted...

NFUN, you don't get to use that argument.

When your argument goes against the rules you set for the setting in the first place, it kind of ruins the point.

Look up what "disarm" means and try again

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Why would it be too late? Even if Kirby ate/spit him, then Flash would definitely yoink the speed out of the guy who just copied his speed

Notably this doesn't work in reverse. There have been a few villains who copied powers and tried to take Flash's speed (Savatar was the big one), it doesn't work because of how he's linked to the Speed Force

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DeathChicken posted...

Why would it be too late? Even if Kirby ate/spit him, then Flash would definitely yoink the speed out of the guy who just copied his speed

Notably this doesn't work in reverse. There have been a few villains who copied powers and tried to take Flash's speed (Savatar was the big one), it doesn't work because of how he's linked to the Speed Force

Also this

Even if you think Kirby copies him, it's not gonna be a mirror match. Multiple speedsters have tried to do this kind of thing to Flash and he always has 'home field advantage' on them.

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The Flash is very cocky and he is not going to take something that looks like Kirby seriously until it demonstrates a serious threat to him. If he went right out of the gate treating Kirby like the eldritch cosmic abomination he is he could probably win, but that is not going to be the case here. Flash is gonna taunt and play with his opponent and that is a fatal mistake.

The strength of Kirby's inhale hasn't really been quantified, but given that he once completely inhaled a planet-destroying superlaser fired from Queen Sectonia, it must be pretty damn strong. But it must be noted that while the most common way kirby gets his copy abilities is by inhaling enemies, he can also get powers from just touching the essence of the power (most notably in kirby superstar he can gain powers by doing nothing more than touching a statue of someone with his body).

tl;dr if Kirby copies Flash's connection to the speed force Flash is in big trouble, and he will have quite a few opportunities to do so.

As to how the fight plays out after that, the most likely result is that the fabric of the universe breaks as a result of having two characters with infinite speed who can steal speed from each other and the entirety of reality loses.

As for a winner of this match however I must pick Kirby simply for the fact his base physical abilities far surpass that of the ordinary human Wally.


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Y'all do know this isn't Smash, right? In the Kirby games, when he swallows enemies to take their powers, the enemies don't come back

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Flash

Like, I agree that Kirby is the best copycat possible. I even fully believe he could survive the Speed Force - lore's there to suggest he's the primordial incarnation of the universe's end, or at least an infinite entity of possession and control, shaped into the form of 'friendship'. Warp Star has revived him from death on instinct in the vacuum of space, and it's a part of him that he can summon at will. I desperately want to make Gamefaqs Kirby a thing, because I fully believe he's utterly ridiculous at his peak and has flexibility beyond pretty much anyone else. I believe he can survive near anything once as long as the Warp Star's intact, and sucking people into his stomach dimension is a KO for 90% of high tier. Hell, I'm pretty sure I'd take him over all of high tier aside from Flash and D'arby because how do you play video games without hands.

I have racked my brain for a consistent way for Kirby to win where Flash wouldn't have an opening, and I've come up with nothing. Warp him to another dimension? Flash can tear through it. Match speed? Flash's mind works faster and would win a war of attrition. Be cute? Flash ends it non-lethally and adopts Kirby as a pet or something (assuming it's Wally because I like Wally, screw Barry).

Flash is just better to such a ridiculous degree that I could really only see him losing to someone who basically out-banters him and gets in.a cheap shot that's immune to time travel. Or maybe if he lost a video game if mashing wasn't involved.

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Johnbobb posted...

Y'all do know this isn't Smash, right? In the Kirby games, when he swallows enemies to take their powers, the enemies don't come back

By the same token, why would Flash be unable to survive being eaten? We have never seen the deets for how Kirby's monching works. It's perfectly feasible that Flash tears out of Kirby. This is not a good line of reasoninng because it's inconsistent in its application.

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KanzarisKelshen posted...

It's perfectly feasible that Flash tears out of Kirby.

this has happened exactly zero times as far as I know, so not really that feasible without something better to support it than "it might work this way, maybe"

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Shonen_Bat posted...

this has happened exactly zero times as far as I know, so not really that feasible without something better to support it than "it might work this way, maybe"

Flash has torn out of alternate dimensions before. He ends up moving his molecules so fast that he is able to interact with alien and extradimensional physics that he himself does not understand to get his desired result. Unless we're arguing that Kirby's stomach is a perfect, inescapable void (which, given that he can store things in bubbles and bring them out inside of it as well as traverse himself, it probably isn't), Flash has precedent for being able to do it.

Speed Force is stupid.

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Shonen_Bat posted...

this has happened exactly zero times as far as I know, so not really that feasible without something better to support it than "it might work this way, maybe"

Yeah, and Kirby has never faced Flash either. There's a lot of unsupported assumptions being made, which is exactly the point I was making. There's no more reason to believe Flash could escape being swallowed than there is to believe Kirby could eat him in the first place.

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DeathChicken posted...

Notably this doesn't work in reverse. There have been a few villains who copied powers and tried to take Flash's speed (Savatar was the big one), it doesn't work because of how he's linked to the Speed Force

oh yeah, if copying doesn't work then Kirby's kinda screwed

it's kinda too bad because (taking speed out of the equation, or giving them the same speed) I think base Kirby is probably a lot better than base Flash

but yeah

Flash
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