Current Events > FYI - We don't make extra for saying people died of COVID19

(+) Yeah! (+)

Yeah he's a piece of trash. We are currently undergoing a supply shortage on gloves and masks.

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What's the difference between dying with Covid and dying of Covid?

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Holy shit this topic is a dumpster fire thanks to Patty

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Tag

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3PiesAndAFork posted...

Anything in support of the president is blatantly trolling and spreading misinformation. Face it, anyone with a brain, not extraordinarily rich, or not paid by the Russians don't support Trump, and in fact actively hate his guts.

Posts like this are why my parents dont want me coming here anymore. You cant just mass label the support of a sitting president trolling just because you dony like his policies.
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Duncanwii posted...

Posts like this are why my parents dont want me coming here anymore. You cant just mass label the support of a sitting president trolling just because you dony like his policies.

lmfao

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MaverickXeo posted...

What's the difference between dying with Covid and dying of Covid?

Dying with covid = You have the virus but died of something else. Anything from a heart attack to getting hit by a car technically.

Dying of covid = symptoms from covid is the primary reason you died.

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BalanceLost posted...

Dying with covid = You have the virus but died of something else. Anything from a heart attack to getting hit by a car technically.

Dying of covid = symptoms from covid is the primary reason you died.

So when we talk of Covid deaths, what is being used as the measure?

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Shablagoo posted...

Yeah, literally my last moderation (which I actually got Purgd for) was for mocking the Trump cult.

ICE should be abolished. Nothing about the organization is good.

You know ICE does more then just go after people for illegal immigration right? They are also the ones responsible for scanning cargo containers to make sure there isn't drugs/weapons/people/whatever in them being smuggled into the country. ICE is just two agencies combined, Immigration and Customs. They were combined to try and cut down on government bloat by just having one federal agency responsible for anything coming into the country, whether it be people or inanimate objects.

People mostly think of ICE for their immigration stuff so they shit all over them but they do other stuff. They are like the Secret Service, everyone knows them for protecting the President but they do a bunch of other stuff as well. And even if you abolished ICE you still need someone to do the exact same job. So disbanding the agency that already exists would be a massive waste of time and money.

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Right wingers get so much leeway on this site and they still complain.

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Duncanwii posted...

Posts like this are why my parents dont want me coming here anymore. You cant just mass label the support of a sitting president trolling just because you dony like his policies.

At the very least you have to be okay handwaving blatant racism and xenophobia if you support Trump.

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Error1355 posted...

At the very least you have to be okay handwaving blatant racism and xenophobia if you support Trump.

I agree, but I also like food in my belly and a roof over my head so you can see why'd I be compromised in this subject.
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Duncanwii posted...

I agree, but I also like food in my belly and a roof over my head so you can see why'd I be compromised in this subject.

Aren't you in your 30s?

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FursonaNonGrata posted...

Aren't you in your 30s?

its....complicated.
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Duncanwii posted...

its....complicated.

Yes but I also need my mommy to tell me where I can go on the Internet

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MaverickXeo posted...

What's the difference between dying with Covid and dying of Covid?

FFS

You're more likely to die of ANYthing if you have comorbidities (diabetes, congestive heart failure, COPD, etc).

The fact is that someone with COPD and COVID died of COVID superimposed on COPD. They probably weren't just going to keel over and die of COPD.

I'm sick of Trumpsters muddying these waters.


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Error1355 posted...

Fuck Donald Trump

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DarkRoast posted...

FFS

You're more likely to die of ANYthing if you have comorbidities (diabetes, congestive heart failure, COPD, etc).

The fact is that someone with COPD and COVID died of COVID superimposed on COPD. They probably weren't just going to keel over and die of COPD.

I'm sick of Trumpsters muddying these waters.

Not a Trumpster, first of all - I just want to see what the actual death rate is related to comorbidities. In my province, they have it separated by no comorbidities, 1, 2, and 3 or more (they also have the same for hospitalizations, total cases, and ICU). Do other health regions do the same?

The data from my province shows 3.1% of all deaths have no comorbidities - up to 72.6% with three or more. This means that in my province, Covid alone counts for 9 out of 300 deaths - which is about a 0.03% confirmed death rate. With 1 comorbidity, that means its 0.07%; 2 is 0.22% and 3 or more is 0.90%.

So using this, are we able to deduct that Covid has a death rate of 0.03% in my province, or are we to say it has a 1.24% death rate?

A person who has Covid and COPD did not die of Covid - they died of Covid AND COPD.

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King_Hutton posted...

Yes but I also need my mommy to tell me where I can go on the Internet

I'm not going to explain my situation because you clearly dont care. Just know that I'm unable to live on my own and completely dependant for food and transportation.
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DarkRoast posted...

FFS

You're more likely to die of ANYthing if you have comorbidities (diabetes, congestive heart failure, COPD, etc).

The fact is that someone with COPD and COVID died of COVID superimposed on COPD. They probably weren't just going to keel over and die of COPD.

I'm sick of Trumpsters muddying these waters.

Seriously.

according to Trumpers, AIDS is apparently the most nonlethal, nothing burger condition on the planet. After all, NOBODY dies of AIDS

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Gamerguymass posted...

You know ICE does more then just go after people for illegal immigration right? They are also the ones responsible for scanning cargo containers to make sure there isn't drugs/weapons/people/whatever in them being smuggled into the country. ICE is just two agencies combined, Immigration and Customs. They were combined to try and cut down on government bloat by just having one federal agency responsible for anything coming into the country, whether it be people or inanimate objects.

People mostly think of ICE for their immigration stuff so they shit all over them but they do other stuff. They are like the Secret Service, everyone knows them for protecting the President but they do a bunch of other stuff as well. And even if you abolished ICE you still need someone to do the exact same job. So disbanding the agency that already exists would be a massive waste of time and money.

Ok just abolish the parts that separate families, keep people in dungeons for seeking asylum, and run around kidnapping Hispanic construction workers like stormtroopers.


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So when dozens of people die at the same time in a retirement center during a pandemic it wasn't the pandemic that killed them? Even when we know that they tested positive for having covid and showed all the symptoms?

Their different comorbidities somehow conspired together to kill everyone at the same time?

Covid truthers are so fucking dumb.

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Shadow Don posted...

So when dozens of people die at the same time in a retirement center during a pandemic it wasn't the pandemic that killed them? Even when we know that they tested positive for having covid and showed all the symptoms?

Their different comorbidities somehow conspired together to kill everyone at the same time?

Covid truthers are so fucking dumb.

It's infuriating. The excess mortality graphs clearly show that, if anything, we've significantly undercounted COVID19 deaths.


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Shadow Don posted...

So when dozens of people die at the same time in a retirement center during a pandemic it wasn't the pandemic that killed them? Even when we know that they tested positive for having covid and showed all the symptoms?

Their different comorbidities somehow conspired together to kill everyone at the same time?

Covid truthers are so fucking dumb.

Is this directed at me? If so, no - they died of Covid + X. Not Covid alone - this needs to be stated when statistics are compiled. It is misleading to say that Covid has a higher death rate than it does.

Covid has a small death rate - but it's the fact that it makes other conditions far worse that we need to look into more, though.

Once again, my province has an overall rate of 1.24% - but that is misleading because A) we are NOT testing everyone, and B) comorbidities play a role in death rate. Covid itself has a death rate of 0.3% based on our confirmed cases to deaths without comorbidities.

EDIT:

To make it clear - I am NOT downplaying the seriousness of Covid. We need to be careful and stay safe, but we need to have real data to determine who is at risk.

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Medicare does pay higher rates if the patient is diagnosed with covid.

That said the claim that they're doing so fraudulently is unsubstantiated

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Hilarious how butthurt @Patty_Fleur got over his cult leader being criticized

SHUT the FUCK up.

I'm sick of your "COVID DEATH RATE IS ACTUALLY LOW IF YOU TEST EVERYONE BLAH BLAH BLAH"

COVID KILLED A QUARTER OF A MILLION AMERICANS IN SIX MONTHS. GROW THE FUCK UP.


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Fuck Trump and his cult of supporters. Fuck the Covid Deniers. Fuck those being "ACHTUALLY THE STATISTIC"...!"

You are pathetic, the lot of you.

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DarkRoast posted...

SHUT the FUCK up.

I'm sick of your "COVID DEATH RATE IS ACTUALLY LOW IF YOU TEST EVERYONE BLAH BLAH BLAH"

COVID KILLED A QUARTER OF A MILLION AMERICANS IN SIX MONTHS. GROW THE FUCK UP.

Covid played a part in killing a quarter million Americans.


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Duncanwii posted...

I'm not going to explain my situation because you clearly dont care. Just know that I'm unable to live on my own and completely dependant for food and transportation.

...and which websites youre allowed to use?

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MaverickXeo posted...

Covid played a part in killing a quarter million Americans.

Seems to have played a part in an excess of predicted mortality of 300,000 in 2020

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DarkRoast posted...

Seems to have played a part in an excess of predicted mortality of 300,000 in 2020

It very well could've.

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Duncanwii posted...

Posts like this are why my parents dont want me coming here anymore. You cant just mass label the support of a sitting president trolling just because you dony like his policies.

People arent going to stop posting stuff like that just because your parents get mad about it.

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MaverickXeo posted...

Covid played a part in killing a quarter million Americans.

Those quarter million Americans probably would not have died otherwise

You realize that underlying conditions aren't fatal themselves? If coronavirus complicates a non-fatal condition resulting in death, that person died of coronavirus. End of story. Coronavirus truthers are fucking ridiculous.

Rathinor posted...

Those quarter million Americans probably would not have died otherwise

You realize that underlying conditions aren't fatal themselves? If coronavirus complicates a non-fatal condition resulting in death, that person died of coronavirus. End of story. Coronavirus truthers are fucking ridiculous.

We're talking about people who think they're educating physicians and public health experts by using middle school logic.


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Rathinor posted...

Those quarter million Americans probably would not have died otherwise

You realize that underlying conditions aren't fatal themselves? If coronavirus complicates a non-fatal condition resulting in death, that person died of coronavirus. End of story. Coronavirus truthers are fucking ridiculous.

Yes, that is true. But at the opposite side of things, if it weren't for those underlying conditions, then Covid most likely would've not been fatal.

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MaverickXeo posted...

Yes, that is true. But at the opposite side of things, if it weren't for those underlying conditions, then Covid most likely would've not been fatal.

That's a classic anti-vaxxer bullshit logic reply.

"Those kids wouldn't have died with measles if they weren't vitamin A deficient"

They wouldn't have died if they didn't get measles. Full stop.


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MaverickXeo posted...

Yes, that is true. But at the opposite side of things, if it weren't for those underlying conditions, then Covid most likely would've not been fatal.

"Yes officer, I ran her over with my car, but she had cancer anyway, so isn't that what really killed her?"

DarkRoast posted...

That's a classic anti-vaxxer bullshit logic reply.

"Those kids wouldn't have died with measles if they weren't vitamin A deficient"

They wouldn't have died if they didn't get measles. Full stop.

Not at all - Covid by itself is not that fatal. Underlying conditions by themselves are not often that fatal. Combining the two creates a greater chance of fatality. We need to include this information when talking about Covid deaths to better understand who is at risk, what conditions make Covid worse, etc.

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Rathinor posted...

"Yes officer, I ran her over with my car, but she had cancer anyway, so isn't that what really killed her?"

Uh, totally different?

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MaverickXeo posted...

Uh, totally different?

Can you just fuck off already with your bullshit?

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MaverickXeo posted...

Uh, totally different?

What media are you consuming that's brainwashing you into thinking you understand Covid better than experts?

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FursonaNonGrata posted...

What media are you consuming that's brainwashing you into thinking you understand Covid better than experts?

I don't, nor do I claim to. I look at my province's data and interpret it. I understand the statistics that are presented though and wish it was more available in other regions.

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MaverickXeo posted...

Not at all - Covid by itself is not that fatal. Underlying conditions by themselves are not often that fatal. Combining the two creates a greater chance of fatality. We need to include this information when talking about Covid deaths to better understand who is at risk, what conditions make Covid worse, etc.

Or maybe we can be like the rest of the world and not have cases, therefore not have deaths. Trying to find excuses for why it's not so bad is pathetic.


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MaverickXeo posted...

Uh, totally different?

Not really, just using your (il)logic against you. You're saying that COVID only kills people who had underlying conditions and that as a result they didn't die of COVID, but a combination of the two. So when people get run over by cars maybe we should start checking if they had preexisting conditions before determining the accident was completely at fault.

MaverickXeo posted...

I don't, nor do I claim to. I look at my province's data and interpret it. I understand the statistics that are presented though and wish it was more available in other regions.

I literally have a degree in epidemiology, a master of public health. Everything you're saying is entry-level anti-vaxxer BS.

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MaverickXeo posted...

I don't, nor do I claim to. I look at my province's data and interpret it. I understand the statistics that are presented though and wish it was more available in other regions.

Okay so it's the Dunning Kruger effect.

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Just 4 and a half more years and we can finally see dis nightmare end, you can endure it ce!!
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You don't understand what the purpose of tracking co-morbidities is.

If we lived in the world of WALL-E where everyone is morbidly obese and thus covid had a higher fatality rate then that would be the fatality rate of covid.

Your logic is so fucking silly when you use it to determine the lethality of other infectious diseases. The Black death? Ha! Not quite so much, everyone in Europe was malnourished and thus had a comorbidity! Nothing more than the sniffles.

Your logic would tell us that HIV doesn't even kill people.

Your logic says that malaria isn't nearly as deadly as it would appear. It only caused more human deaths than literally everything else.


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DarkRoast posted...

I literally have a degree in epidemiology, a master of public health. Everything you're saying is entry-level anti-vaxxer BS.

So you are saying that statistics do not matter when dealing with a virus? I am not claiming anything out of the ordinary - I merely shared my province's own findings on Covid deaths.

0.3% of deaths have no comorbidities in my province. That is a fact. 99.7% do have comorbidities - that is also a fact. What I am interpreting is that Covid is not that fatal on its own - it is only fatal when paired with another condition.

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