Current Events > So this Guardian thing is really throwing up a lot of red flags.

(+) Yeah! (+)

CloneTheHero posted...

predominately hispanic

Not a race, but do go on.

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Sounds cool

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CloneTheHero posted...

except that by the time we start colonizing space america will be predominately hispanic

Lmao. Jesus, didn't take very much for you to launch into that.

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CloneTheHero posted...

except that by the time we start colonizing space america will be predominately hispanic

LordRazziel posted...

What do heritage and culture have to do with extending our military to space. Very suspicious. Actually, it's not even suspicious, it's pretty overt messaging.

That's what I was thinking.

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Homer Stokes announced as new director of Space Force



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I'm still amused about them ripping off Starfleet's logo

LordRazziel posted...

What do heritage and culture have to do with extending our military to space. Very suspicious. Actually, it's not even suspicious, it's pretty overt messaging.

We haven't even met intelligent alien life yet and already we're declaring war on them

Seems about right...

Ah yes all that American culture in fucking space

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MAGA.

Make America Guardians Again?

When did we stop being guardians?
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I could go for Chinese right now

I can't believe I totally missed the "BY SPACE PROFESSIONALS, FOR SPACE PROFESSIONALS" tagline

like wtf, this can't be real. it's like a bad car insurance advertisement

ImAMarvel posted...

Man, "heritage" and "culture". What the fuck, man? >_>

I was thinking, if deaf people were ever allowed to serve, I would go Space Force and become a guardian but idk man. That's so weird.

In space, no one can hear you scream about white genocide

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Holy shit that's real Nazi sounding shit. Like right out of Mein Kampf bad.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wPH4MEK4tk

"The Moon belongs to America, and anxiously awaits the arrival of our Astromen. Will YOU be among them?"

The way we're going I'm afraid we would become the Terran Empire instead of join the Federation.

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we always have unlimited money to throw at the stupidest things but never for anything we actually need

CloneTheHero posted...

science is culture. were one of the few nations that embrace science and do so extensively.

This is a truly impressive level of bullshit

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we're just going back to our roots. manifest destiny, slavery, jim crow. we even supported the nazis before the war broke out and were sympathetic to them for a while during it

fuck this country sometimes

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Bruh -_-

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Presumably he is referring to this being a creation of the Trump administration, an administration that openly denies and throws scorn at science. To the point that Trump himself said people should vote for him because Biden listens to the scientists.
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CloneTheHero posted...

feel free to elaborate (bet you wont)

Not really sure there's a need to, but I'd be happy to hear what you consider to be a metric for how much a nation "embraces science".

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Basically they only want certain people to apply for these jerbs. You know because of the heritage and culture thing.
hint - Norway not Haiti

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CloneTheHero posted...

actually no you do need to clarify your stance. dont deflect or ill just tag you as a troll and ignore you lol. if youre going to call someones take bullshit you better be able to prove it. as predicted you werent able to lol.

A) He... didn't deflect? He asked you to back up YOUR claim (America embraces science more than other countries)... ball is in your court.

B) If that IS the case, why not just say Science instead of Heritage?

The only things objectionable there are the "Guardians" and the knockoff Star Trek logo. The "By Space Professionals. For Space Professionals" tagine is also kind of dumb. Well, that and that it wasn't called the US Spacy.

CloneTheHero posted...

ignoring inquiries and hot-shotting yours is in fact deflecting. hop off your alt and face me like a man lol.

I don't have any alts... are you confused?
An inquiry that rests on YOUR assumption (the definition of embraces science) still needs to be clarified...
Why did you ignore my second question?

can someone explain the problem

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CloneTheHero posted...

its give n take buddy. thats how debates go. if you cant answer a simple inquiry and deflect youre not worth debating with. enjoy my ignore list lmao.

So you are admitting you can't back up what you claimed?

CloneTheHero posted...

who posted?

Still can't back up your claim?

Wait, its bad now to be pro american? Cant keep up with the dos and donts anymore!

We must strive to hate our american heritage and culture, got it! Will do better next time I promise.

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CloneTheHero posted...

it is for the left. anything patriotic is considered nationalist and automatically draws parallels to nazism lol. people jump to extremes like its nothing.

everything they disagree with has to have shock value attached to it or they cant peddle it and rally people up to cancel something that hurt their tummies lol.

Oh, im not so keyed in to the "culture war" like many of you guys are.

Its amazing how different peoples views can be with certain words from that picture.

When I saw the logo, (first off it looks cheap af and stupid lol) the words heritage, mission, and culture immediately made me think of pro american values in the context of the long ago space races we had with russia. I saw it as a proud american type wording.

Then I read the posts and people were looking at it through the lens of racism and nazi LOL.

Like wtf, are people so far gone on this site? Or is this just what all people heavily entrenched in this "culture war" feel now?

Either way, I find it hilarious. Well, a little sad too, but mostly funny.

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CloneTheHero posted...

actually no you do need to clarify your stance. dont deflect or ill just tag you as a troll and ignore you lol. if youre going to call someones take bullshit you better be able to prove it. as predicted you werent able to lol.

I'd figured it was pretty obvious. I don't think that the US as a nation "embraces science" more than other countries. But to make sure that we just aren't using two different definition of "to embrace science as a nation", I figured it would be best to ask you first. That way we can actually establish a common baseline.

But I understand that you don't want that. So I'll elaborate. I think it's laughable to suggest that the US embraces science when the govt has been ignoring climate science for decades. In fact, oil companies have been paying congress to have them ignore science. And this is just an example of what's going on in a lot of fields. Food companies paid to suppress research about sugar for decades, tobacco companies suppressed research on the dangers of smoking, etc. The US actively governs against science.

Another component of this is information literacy. I would think that a nation that embraces science would take steps to make sure that its citizens can understand it. In America, getting a degree will put you in huge debt unless you're very wealthy. The nation does not value high information literacy in its populace.

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MrToothHasYou posted...

Not a race, but do go on.

White isn't a race either

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I totally get the need for a space program. The idea behind space force is good....but whoever is in charge of naming things has seen too many shitty scifi movies.

Space Force sounds like Space Balls and Guardians? Really? Kevin from Wisconsin who watched satellites flying around on a screen 8 hours a day is now a Guardian? Right.


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CloneTheHero posted...

i said most countries. hinting at most of the west which spends a sizable chunk of their gdp in rnd and a main reason why we got a vaccine out so quickly our govts spent billions in order to get it done. asian countries arent doing that, latin america, africa, middle east arent going to develop shit, theyre so far behind us and dont embrace anything but their own agendas.

See, this is why I asked you to clearly define what you mean first, so we don't get stuck in this back and forth that will essentially boil down to different definitions of "a nation embracing science". The US spending the most money doesn't necessarily mean they're the ones who are embracing science the most. And here you're actually arguing that spending on rnd is a factor. A lot of that spending is from the govt.
Oh and aren't China developing a vaccine as well?

CloneTheHero posted...

govt = science lol. the govt holds science back the two arent mutually exclusive in this context. and btw you just proved me right. its OUR science that discovered climate change because you guessed it WERE (the west) the leaders in the sciences.

In my view, if you're going to argue that you are one of the few nations to embrace science (and to do so extensively), then you need to show that the people in power actually do "embrace" it. Discarding scientific results that aren't profitable does not really seem like embracing science to me. Spending billions of dollars on military development (i.e., classified results) is also something that I would consider runs contrary to embracing science. Even more contrary is, in my view, spending billions of dollars on FUD-based disinformation campaign with the express purpose of discrediting science.
Moreover, you're now pivoting and talking about "the west" rather than the US. How many countries do you include here? You said "few nations". How few?

Not to mention, you're talking about the climate research as "our" research, but that would include a lot of work from eastern countries like Russia/Soviet, China, Taiwan, Japan, South Korea, etc. And there are various developing countries making efforts to join the international scientific community, something that has been incredibly difficult for them due to poverty caused by imperialism. Are they somehow embracing science less because they literally can't spend as much (because "the west" took and are still taking their wealth)? The US are spending more than any other country in the world on active warfare, which quite literally prevents a lot of countries from contributing to science.

As far as climate monitoring goes, the US are currently acting in direct opposition to what the international scientific community wants. The country isn't embracing science so much as it is doing whatever it can to make sure private actors can make money on science.

CloneTheHero posted...

again youre trying to paint the govt as the deal breaker. the govt doesnt represent the science community nor does it represent or share the same sentiments as its denizens. most of which agree that climate change is real and should be addressed immediately. just because the govt takes the opposite stance doesnt make my statement of embracing science any less true. i guess what im trying to say is. get. a. clue.

Again we discover that you're actively trying to make this into an issue by deliberately refusing to explain what "a nation embracing science" actually means. I'm making the argument that when the people in power of a nation actively obstruct scientific efforts and deny scientific result, it's bullshit to say that that nation embraces science any more than other nations.

CloneTheHero posted...

our literacy rates are on par with most developed countries. thats just fucking nutty reasoning there. education? thats another thing. education does fail us and thats why we get so many flat earthers and moon hoaxers, yet those same bozos are pretty literate. so no literacy is not the issue

Ok, well, I'm taking about information literacy, not literacy. Those are two distinct, different things. If you don't even know the difference, then it seems like whatever opinion you have on the subject is pretty uninformed.
In my view, a country that embraces science would seek to make sure that information literacy is high among all its citizens. The US as a country does not do this. But again, this is pretty pointless as long as you're unwilling to even explain what you mean. At best you just have a weird definition of what you mean and then there's no arguing because of course, if you just use your own metric, you'll be correct. Who cares if the metric is useless, right?

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i do wonder wtf they're doing over at the Space Force...

wtf are they gonna protect us from anyway? aliens trying to enslave our species or something?? lmao