Current Events > C/D JRPGs are boring now

(+) Yeah! (+)

i mean really you just press x on a menu most of the time. couldn't even finish yakuza like a dragon.

i think they're okay

kind of have to agree. Don't get me wrong, now and then you'll find a gem, but most of the time they are just mediocre or not well promoted. I miss the PS1/PS2 days of RPGs. When RPGs were good.... excluding FF12 (I can't stand that game). But I was introduced to Shadow Hearts which everyone should play at least once.

duuuude, FF12 is amazing

I never liked traditional JRPGs. There was one dude at my college who tried to convince me diagaea was a great game if that counts as one and it might be, but holy fuck I never cringed so hard in my life watching like 2 mins of it.

If games like Pokmon and Paper Mario are considered JRPGs, those are good. But aside from games like that they dont appeal to me.

Skyrim is top tier tho as far as RPGs go

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Now?

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I'm not really a fan of turn-based JRPGs these days, but action JRPGs can be fun, though.

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I liked them when I was younger, especially on the first Playstation and Dreamcast. I don't remember where I fell off but I can't get one to grab me in anymore. It's not without trying, i've probably tried 20 JRPGs in the last 3 years or so, didn't finish any of them.

Closest thing I loved that is somewhat similar was South Park Stick of Truth.

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ROOTFayth posted...

duuuude, FF12 is amazing

That came out in 2006. TC said "now"

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ROOTFayth posted...

duuuude, FF12 is amazing

From a gameplay perspective I can agree. The world is gorgeous as well, and there are a ton of things you can do. Here's why I hate it. I'm a massive story nerd. I love a good story. I think the background for FF12 has a great story, but it was extremely poorly executed. You had characters who have motivation for going on a journey, but its never actually executed properly.

Case in point. Vaan has his reasons for journeying through the death of his brother, but its only mentioned a couple times and once he meets Basch, it disappears entirely so he becomes a background character in the game where he is technically the main character.

Ashe should have been given the Laguna treatment from Final Fantasy 8. Laguna appears now and then during a break in the story for his own mini story to drive forwards plot happening in the background, which again is what Ashe should have had. She's should have been doing little plot points in the background to try and regain trust within her kingdom and rally people behind her to overthrow the empire before she joins the main party. Instead she mentions she wants to get her kingdom back, but never actually takes any action towards it other than the main story plot.

Basch for the most part ends up as the main character going against his brother Galbranth who has more dialogue and story put towards him than Vayne the actual main villain of the game.

And that's about it. I feel like everything story-wise in 12 is quarter-assed. They couldn't even half-ass it. Plot points aren't fully explored. Everything else about the game is pretty great. Though I will say I was extremely disappointed it had the combat system it had, but that's more of a personal preference than anything against the actual game.

Ivany2008 posted...

kind of have to agree. Don't get me wrong, now and then you'll find a gem, but most of the time they are just mediocre or not well promoted. I miss the PS1/PS2 days of RPGs. When RPGs were good.... excluding FF12 (I can't stand that game). But I was introduced to Shadow Hearts which everyone should play at least once.

even if i try to go back and play JRPGs of my youth i find them boring. i couldn't make it through ffix or vii for instance. the combat is literally pressing x.

MabusIncarnate posted...

I liked them when I was younger, especially on the first Playstation and Dreamcast. I don't remember where I fell off but I can't get one to grab me in anymore. It's not without trying, i've probably tried 20 JRPGs in the last 3 years or so, didn't finish any of them.

Closest thing I loved that is somewhat similar was South Park Stick of Truth.

this is exactly how i feel

games like dark souls have far more engaging gameplay. i think square had the right idea with the ff7 remake to totally revamp the gameplay. it was really good.

Persona 5 Royal is a blast, and that came out last year iirc
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Ivany2008 posted...

From a gameplay perspective I can agree. The world is gorgeous as well, and there are a ton of things you can do. Here's why I hate it. I'm a massive story nerd. I love a good story. I think the background for FF12 has a great story, but it was extremely poorly executed. You had characters who have motivation for going on a journey, but its never actually executed properly.

Case in point. Vaan has his reasons for journeying through the death of his brother, but its only mentioned a couple times and once he meets Basch, it disappears entirely so he becomes a background character in the game where he is technically the main character.

Ashe should have been given the Laguna treatment from Final Fantasy 8. Laguna appears now and then during a break in the story for his own mini story to drive forwards plot happening in the background, which again is what Ashe should have had. She's should have been doing little plot points in the background to try and regain trust within her kingdom and rally people behind her to overthrow the empire before she joins the main party. Instead she mentions she wants to get her kingdom back, but never actually takes any action towards it other than the main story plot.

Basch for the most part ends up as the main character going against his brother Galbranth who has more dialogue and story put towards him than Vayne the actual main villain of the game.

And that's about it. I feel like everything story-wise in 12 is quarter-assed. They couldn't even half-ass it. Plot points aren't fully explored. Everything else about the game is pretty great. Though I will say I was extremely disappointed it had the combat system it had, but that's more of a personal preference than anything against the actual game.

I guess I cant disagree about the story, but for me the characters (aside from vaan) made up for it, really enjoyed the gambit system, music was great, world was great, so yeah story felt a little weak but still enjoyed the hell out of the game

most modern jrpgs are bad. I still love all the classics just as much as ever though

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arpgs killed the genre by catering to the lowest common denominator

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Ivany2008 posted...

From a gameplay perspective I can agree. The world is gorgeous as well, and there are a ton of things you can do. Here's why I hate it. I'm a massive story nerd. I love a good story. I think the background for FF12 has a great story, but it was extremely poorly executed. You had characters who have motivation for going on a journey, but its never actually executed properly.

Case in point. Vaan has his reasons for journeying through the death of his brother, but its only mentioned a couple times and once he meets Basch, it disappears entirely so he becomes a background character in the game where he is technically the main character.

Ashe should have been given the Laguna treatment from Final Fantasy 8. Laguna appears now and then during a break in the story for his own mini story to drive forwards plot happening in the background, which again is what Ashe should have had. She's should have been doing little plot points in the background to try and regain trust within her kingdom and rally people behind her to overthrow the empire before she joins the main party. Instead she mentions she wants to get her kingdom back, but never actually takes any action towards it other than the main story plot.

Basch for the most part ends up as the main character going against his brother Galbranth who has more dialogue and story put towards him than Vayne the actual main villain of the game.

And that's about it. I feel like everything story-wise in 12 is quarter-assed. They couldn't even half-ass it. Plot points aren't fully explored. Everything else about the game is pretty great. Though I will say I was extremely disappointed it had the combat system it had, but that's more of a personal preference than anything against the actual game.

Eh to be fair pplenty of rpg villains have little dialogue. Gabranth was literally the poster boy for the game though. Basch wad originally intended to be thr MC so story was probably already mostly wrote out by the time higher ups said he was too old. Or the maker made him more important as a fuck you to those who insisted he used a younger MC cause it was how he wanted the story and wasnt budging.

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If gamefreak got their shit together and actually made the RPG that their fans actually *want* instead of the ones they always serve up, RPG's would be BACK in the spotlight again. They are the only ones, at this point, with a predictable Ace up their sleeve (SE already remade FF7, playing their trump card) that hasn't gone "all-in" on an extremely bankable idea (in theory) that has yet to exist and be ran into the ground by over-monetization. (For those that aren't aware of who gamefreak is, they're the ones behind Pokemon)

This would put renewed interest in upcoming RPGs that people would have had very little interest in otherwise giving the genre a much needed boost to it's dying ecosystem.

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I just dont agree. P5R last year. Neo: the world ends with you comes out this week. Fire Emblem three houses a couple years ago. Plenty of good/great jrpgs coming out lately

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mooreandrew58 posted...

Eh to be fair pplenty of rpg villains have little dialogue. Gabranth was literally the poster boy for the game though. Basch wad originally intended to be thr MC so story was probably already mostly wrote out by the time higher ups said he was too old. Or the maker made him more important as a fuck you to those who insisted he used a younger MC cause it was how he wanted the story and wasnt budging.

and that's really a problem they had with both 12 and 15. Both times they dropped the director for some reason and the new director had to pick up the pieces and try to put together some sort of story. I liked Gabranth as much as I liked Ravus, both very much.

Thing is, if they had stuck with the Kingsglaive story for 15, it would have been so much better. Then again, Tabata himself was kind of a garbage director to begin with.

GirTheRobot posted...

i think square had the right idea with the ff7 remake to totally revamp the gameplay. it was really good.

just to be sure here, but you do realize this still counts as a jrpg right

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I guess it's too much to hope for a modern classic to be created that struck the same art style and game play of Breath of Fire 1 and 2+Dragon Quest 3+Chrono Trigger, I'd eat that shit from dawn till dusk but sadly anything JRPG is automatically delegated to Anime cutscenes and rehashed cliched storylines. There really isn't anything innovative about the genre as a whole since....MMO's put their spin on the genre, I guess. Before that was collecting stuff, either materials to make gear or gear itself, or monsters (pokemon) was used to play on people's natures of hoarding and collecting everything from the best to the pointless to artificially inflate gameplay time. Kind of shitty that's the only real mechanic used in RPGs now-a-days anyways. Seems like every game all a crossed the RPG spectrum got hit with the skill tree stick and the collect-a-thon stick at the same time.

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Ivany2008 posted...

and that's really a problem they had with both 12 and 15. Both times they dropped the director for some reason and the new director had to pick up the pieces and try to put together some sort of story. I liked Gabranth as much as I liked Ravus, both very much.

Thing is, if they had stuck with the Kingsglaive story for 15, it would have been so much better. Then again, Tabata himself was kind of a garbage director to begin with.

I mean the bitch with vaan as the MC goes away when you tell yourself hes not the story is just told from his point of view. Some books do that .

and honestly I liked 15 too. But to each their own. I got a really weird top 5 final fantasy list. In no particular order 4 7 8 12 15. 7 remake shaping up to take a spot if the inevitable changes to the story dont suck.

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kirbymuncher posted...

just to be sure here, but you do realize this still counts as a jrpg right

i'm talking traditional turn based JRPGs. modern ones are still being made. i think that style has just not aged well and it's really boring.

I think we just got old, right? If Chrono Trigger was released today for iphone or whatever it would still be a 10/10 game. We just probably wouldn't have the patience to sit down and immerse ourselves in it like we did when we were 10 years old or whatever.

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The problem with Yakuza like a Dragon is that it has a very simple battle system that doesn't evolve much as the game goes on. This would be fine in a shorter game, but Yakuza is a long game with a lot of fights in it.

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nexigrams posted...

I think we just got old, right? If Chrono Trigger was released today for iphone or whatever it would still be a 10/10 game. We just probably wouldn't have the patience to sit down and immerse ourselves in it like we did when we were 10 years old or whatever.

I think it's us getting old and wanting new experiences.

I played *a lot* of turn based, classic JRPGs in my youth. Chrono trigger, mario RPG, paper mario, Final fantasy, golden sun, xenosaga...the list goes on. I've just had enough of it. I've tried going back to some of those classics, and the only ones that still hold up are the mario ones because at least the characters and setting are fun and unique. The gameplay is slightly better than the rest...

I just prefer more active, engaged combat like i said with FF7 remake. Or of course any action RPG like Dark Souls. Hell, i like disco elysium a lot and it has no combat at all. but i guess that's a CRPG not a JRPG

I think another reason why Chrono Trigger is so well liked is that it doesn't drag on. It is set in a bunch of different set pieces by different timelines to keep things fresh. It is also only about a 25 hour game.

Compare this to Like a Dragon, which I enjoyed very much till I got worn out and just dropped the game after about 50 hours. It is not just combat issues, but story pacing issues too....

The game builds up the big Yakuza gangs disbanding in what seems like a big climatic finale of the game. However, the game then gets bogged down you fighting the remnants of the Yakuza gangs. If this was dealt with in a short epilogue, I think it would work fine but it just goes on and on.... I finally dropped the game after it was revelead the main character and the remaining villain unknowingly had a very intertwined early life that was so melodramatic that a soap opera would blush. Despite all this I may return to finishing the game later, but I was burnt out when I quit.

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These last couple of years, I've gotten back into the JRPG genre, so uhh Not really!

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they're the opposite of boring. they're too busy. Too many flashy lights and popups and BONUS!! MULTIPLYER.

Atmosphere and pace is completely lost in lieu of 400bpm battles and cutesy anime environments

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Monster Hunter Stories 2 just came out and is probably the best Pokemon game to come out in a long while.

GirTheRobot posted...

I think it's us getting old and wanting new experiences.

I played *a lot* of turn based, classic JRPGs in my youth. Chrono trigger, mario RPG, paper mario, Final fantasy, golden sun, xenosaga...the list goes on. I've just had enough of it. I've tried going back to some of those classics, and the only ones that still hold up are the mario ones because at least the characters and setting are fun and unique. The gameplay is slightly better than the rest...

I just prefer more active, engaged combat like i said with FF7 remake. Or of course any action RPG like Dark Souls. Hell, i like disco elysium a lot and it has no combat at all. but i guess that's a CRPG not a JRPG

For me its action rpgs got to a point where the combat was actually really fun AND visually pleasing enough it made turn based seem archaic

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mooreandrew58 posted...

I mean the bitch with vaan as the MC goes away when you tell yourself hes not the story is just told from his point of view. Some books do that .

and honestly I liked 15 too. But to each their own. I got a really weird top 5 final fantasy list. In no particular order 4 7 8 12 15. 7 remake shaping up to take a spot if the inevitable changes to the story dont suck.

yeah... that list is really weird. I have it as (in no order) 9, 6, 4, 7 and 10. I somewhat enjoyed 15, but I played the launch release. And again... the story is crap. It had an alternate opening they should have went with, I can't remember which game it was in, but they already escaped Noctis home city, so there was no radio broadcast letting them know that the city was under attack. They also had this interesting weather mechanic that was never used where you activate nodes to change the weather. I did like Pitioss Ruins though.

TWEWY looks fun and DQ XI is pretty damn good.

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Ivany2008 posted...

yeah... that list is really weird. I have it as (in no order) 9, 6, 4, 7 and 10. I somewhat enjoyed 15, but I played the launch release. And again... the story is crap. It had an alternate opening they should have went with, I can't remember which game it was in, but they already escaped Noctis home city, so there was no radio broadcast letting them know that the city was under attack. They also had this interesting weather mechanic that was never used where you activate nodes to change the weather. I did like Pitioss Ruins though.

Yeah I'll give you I waited to play the game. In hindsight my best friend spoiling the ending Was a good thing(turns out it was just his personal speculation though fortunately) but it pissed me off bad enough the game remained in its plastic seal for ovee a year before I touched it

Glad to see another lover of 4. I consider it my pound for pound best. Not the most spectacular but also the one I have no nitpick with. 5 would replace it if the story and characters wherent so forgetable. I love the gameplay but a turn based style rpg has gotta have at least a decent story and cast to really shine

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mooreandrew58 posted...

Yeah I'll give you I waited to play the game. In hindsight my best friend spoiling the ending Was a good thing(turns out it was just his personal speculation though fortunately) but it pissed me off bad enough the game remained in its plastic seal for ovee a year before I touched it

Glad to see another lover of 4. I consider it my pound for pound best. Not the most spectacular but also the one I have no nitpick with. 5 would replace it if the story and characters wherent so forgetable. I love the gameplay but a turn based style rpg has gotta have at least a decent story and cast to really shine

I'm just a fan of turn based rpgs in general. I played nearly all the ones for SNES, and most of the ones for the original PS. Still haven't played Suikoden 1 or 2, can't get past the intro for 1.

Square sucks ass but there are still other companies putting out decent to good ones I'm sure. My interest has shifted though

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I voted no

They have always been boring

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Ivany2008 posted...

I'm just a fan of turn based rpgs in general. I played nearly all the ones for SNES, and most of the ones for the original PS. Still haven't played Suikoden 1 or 2, can't get past the intro for 1.

I mean I don't mind them. I didn't play chrono trigger until I was an adult and that and ff 12 made me come to the conclusion its really random encounters I dislike. It's emersion breaking to me espcially since the battle area doesnt always match the exact spot the battle triggered

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