Board 8 > FFXIV Topic Part 8 -- Suffering from Success

(+) Yeah! (+)

As the resident Crystal person, get off my lawn (unless you wrote in my message book.)

---

Would this be a broken idea for a Bard trait in Endwalker? Can't do an actual dot spread like Summoner because that would be busted, but:

Dots have a percentage chance to spread to the nearest enemy with every tick. Continues to refresh if it spreads, percentage never goes up but each enemy that catches it gets the same effect per tick so the actual RNG chance increases. Dot refresh only happens on the enemy if it's the one that spread.

Been weighing some kind of solution that would work for me because boy do I think managing song upkeep in trash packs feels like total garbage. It's the reason I like Bard the least so far out of ever job even though I like using it on bosses a lot.

---

As a Bard main I think that's too complicated and a lot of RNG. And it's probably MORE powerful than just a Bane-style spread with a damage falloff, if the spread happens on tick. It wouldn't significantly change how I approach AOE situations either. In a big pack, I'm still putting up 5-6 dots or so before starting to spam QN/RoD? On 2 targets I can't afford to wait for random proc chances to spread and I need to manually upkeep with IJ anyways, it would either become a headache to manage disparate timers or just go infinite or something. So yeah, I think that Bane with damage falloff and maybe a long cooldown is just the easiest way to go. Tbh the dot damage isn't as important as the sweet, sweet procs for Rain of Death and fat Apex Arrows.

Bard AOE is a bit annoying but I think it's the best of the 3 ranged when you get the hang of it? I do agree that it becomes a huge pain to manage songs and Raging Strikes mid-dungeon because you want to lead with Mage's Ballad and buff it but make sure RS and WM are up for the boss and ugh. If you have questions about it let me know because Bard aoe is fairly unintuitive. Some kind of dot spreading would really help people grok it.

---

I think the issue may be that Bard is just rough on a controller. There's no way for me to justify putting my dots on Bar 1 so manually applying to whole mobs of trash is made worse. Would probably be less of a hassle on standard M&K.

I assume when you say it's the best AoE you mean by damage, because Machinist and Dancer AoE is ABSOLUTELY braindead...which, for AoE, is just fine by me lol.

---

What's your setup? I do play keyboard but it is probably a pain to have to see all your procs on your first bar. I still think you want easy access to dots though.

And yeah I meant best in terms of damage. For most fun, MCH is the most consistent in dungeons. Bard is better when I can REALLY pop off with Apex or I am fighting exactly two bosses but otherwise goes in the middle. And DNC aoe puts me to sleep.

---

The thing with applying dots on multiple targets as BRD is that the DPS you gain is only partially related to the dots themselves - the additional procs you get from having more than 2 dots active at a time mean you get radically more Pitch Perfects/Rains of Death, which means that you're suddenly doing far more damage than you would simply by using your AoE abilities. So preventing you from easily dotting every single target in a 12+ enemy big trash pull is a very deliberate balance decision, because otherwise BRD would be comically overpowered in any content involving trash mobs. It's even something the developers have to be careful about in raid encounters with multiple bosses, since having lots of uptime on 2+ dotted targets upsets the expectations the class balance developers had in mind when designing the toolkits. This is why encounters with more than one boss generally either don't let you hit both bosses at the same time (the pre-fusion phase of E6, O12) or only have two targets active for a small part of the encounter (TEA, UCOB).

---

I'd have to take a look at my bars later but I do have my procs and dots on different bars. I may just have to look at Bard as it's own thing and change up what I'm used to regarding my ability zoning on every other class. It's probably not as hard as I'm making it, a side effect of me going and planning my level 80 hotbars off the get go instead of waiting to learn everything.

---

Hey, hi, been playing BRD a lot lately. AoE is fine, especially if you bear in mind that Quick Nock can reset Bloodletter (and, by extension, Rain of Death) at a 30% chance. Combine this a reset during Mage's Ballad (especially the one you can force from Empyreal,) the faster spam speed from Army's Paeon (plus the lingering effect during next song) and you rarely need to keep DoT up on more than two targets unless you're fishing for quickcharging Apex Arrow.

In short, presuming you dont let a song drop off, Wanderer's is your burst single-target window, Mage's is your "buff party now" AoE spam, and Army's is your followup AoE spam and reapplication period if there's more than 3 targets to hit.

---

Not_an_Owl posted...

The thing with applying dots on multiple targets as BRD is that the DPS you gain is only partially related to the dots themselves - the additional procs you get from having more than 2 dots active at a time mean you get radically more Pitch Perfects/Rains of Death, which means that you're suddenly doing far more damage than you would simply by using your AoE abilities. So preventing you from easily dotting every single target in a 12+ enemy big trash pull is a very deliberate balance decision, because otherwise BRD would be comically overpowered in any content involving trash mobs. It's even something the developers have to be careful about in raid encounters with multiple bosses, since having lots of uptime on 2+ dotted targets upsets the expectations the class balance developers had in mind when designing the toolkits. This is why encounters with more than one boss generally either don't let you hit both bosses at the same time (the pre-fusion phase of E6, O12) or only have two targets active for a small part of the encounter (TEA, UCOB).

Yeah, E6S the two bosses are literally targetable for ONE Apex Arrow. I still feel ripped off. You say the devs have to be "careful" but come on, I'm asking for like ONE fight per tier where dot users get to go off. TEA was great and I appreciated that they mix phases like that so different jobs shine at different parts of the fight.

But my point is they have balance levers they can pull if they want to add it in. They could adjust the rate of procs from the spread by making it a different debuff, for example.

---

Isquen posted...

Hey, hi, been playing BRD a lot lately. AoE is fine, especially if you bear in mind that Quick Nock can reset Bloodletter (and, by extension, Rain of Death) at a 30% chance. Combine this a reset during Mage's Ballad (especially the one you can force from Empyreal,) the faster spam speed from Army's Paeon (plus the lingering effect during next song) and you rarely need to keep DoT up on more than two targets unless you're fishing for quickcharging Apex Arrow.

Not exactly, you SHOULD be fishing for Apex Arrow because it's absurd potency with no falloff. In Mage's Ballad it's actually worth it to keep slapping Windbite on things and just cash in your RoD procs until you are pretty sure the mobs won't live for 30 more seconds before starting to spam Quick Nock. For other songs and big pulls it's as you say. Double dot one thing, throw out a couple more, and get to spamming.

And the other thing is that on big pulls you should be dotting enemies as much as possible and have a song running while the tank is still pulling, just to build Apex meter. It is THAT good. This might seem pretty rude but I have yet to have a tank get mad at me for doing it and it really does charge up your Apex meter super fast so.

anyways this is why I advocate for bard bane because how the fuck is anyone supposed to know any of this

---

Finished my first resistance weapon last night and decided to dip back into Eureka to work on finishing the last step for the rest of the weapons (I currently have PLD and WHM). It blows my mind how absolutely self entitled people are in Eureka. They will either sit in town afk, or do bunny chests the whole time, then bitch at people for "not waiting for them" before pulling an NM. I've just started insta pulling every time I prep one because I'm absolutely sick of it. If you want to leech of everyone else's work, go for it, but at least have the courtesy to AFK near where people are prepping them so we don't have to wait 5 minutes before every pull

---

If You can't do ceto while also protecting a bunny solo and get gold, get out

---

While I personally don't instapull, so long as you helped prep it and everyone else who helped prep it is ready to go, you're justified in doing so.

---

Not waiting is a dick move. It's not a huge issue in Hydatos, but on the other maps people could easily be prepping something else and it can take quite a while to get across the map.

---

Most of the time there's only 1 or 2 parties actively prepping, and maybe a solo prepper or 2, and if you have Return up, you can get to any location on the map well before the boss dies. Obviously if there are other people actively prepping I have no problem waiting, this is more for the times where there is only 1 group actively prepping and everyone else is afk in town whining that we didn't wait for them.

---

Wisdom of the breathtaker goes brrrrr

---

I wish I could sell all these t-rex

---

I ended up giving away most of my excess Gabriel mounts to friends. They might go back up in value again eventually but they won't ever go for as much as an Eldthurs or Petrel.

---

well no turning back now I have my first trophy on the PS5 version



I'll get the platinum sometime before the end of my lifespan


---

Yes. YES.

---

Destiny's Child

<img src="https://www.playstationtrophies.org/images/icons/trophy_bronze.png">
Complete 3,000 FATEs.

Rip

Everything else didn't look bad! (Or could be braindead SHINE grinded, like unsync ifrit normal 2000 times)

---

just do what I just did 29 more times

---

This is why even if I get a PS5 I'm going to stick to the PS4 version for a while (at least until I plat it, which has the much more reasonable 1000 FATEs requirement).

---

whenever I get the ps5 platinum I'll just load up the PS4 version and assume it will autopop all that's games trophies except maybe the levequests ones since those aren't a requirement in the PS5 version's trophies

---

It's ok you'll get the Levequest trophies as you become an honest gillionaire

---

ninkendo posted...

whenever I get the ps5 platinum I'll just load up the PS4 version and assume it will autopop all that's games trophies except maybe the levequests ones since those aren't a requirement in the PS5 version's trophies

PS5 also doesn't require you to craft/gather 1000 times as each hand/land class.

---

I imagine a good chunk of that will happen on its own if I end up leveling class to see their stories


---

Today is the last day of Beast Tube Quests, 2 more for the Qitari, then whatever the Allied quest is, and I'm home freeeeee~

Will then officially be in maintence mode before Endwalker, mostly just running daily Leveling, Trial, and Normal Raid.

---

Theres no ShB allied quest due to covid

---

:(

Ah well, one less thing to do!

---

Make a new relic, coward :)

---

I don't think I'm ever going to be able to bring myself to care enough to go about the process of getting a relic weapon unless it's blue. If it's not blue, then the KotR weapon looks better.

If any of them are blue, I'm all ears.

And even then, PROBABLY NOT!

---

The last thing I'll do to be done with Shadowbringers is max Shared Fates.

---

https://youtu.be/gOAUemiJ2Ic

They're not uniformly colored- you're thinking of Ultimate weapons.

---

The biggest thing that dissapoints me about ShB relics is that the thing with Norvrandt's Gerolt didn't go anywhere.

---

I am so hyped to get home and watch asmon and rich talking with Xeno

---

The disparity between how complicated the final BLM job gauge looks versus how simple it actually is to read is nuts.

---

Job Action trailer and live letter 9/18.

I think that the evening of the 17th here.

Also talks of buffing Cape Westwind NOOOOOOOOOOOO!

---

I've been in and out watching bits and pieces of Max' prog streams, but watching him throw a hissy fit at the Seat of Sacrifice cutscene...bleh. I image he's going to be unbearable while proging E8.

---

UshiromiyaEva posted...

I've been in and out watching bits and pieces of Max' prog streams, but watching him throw a hissy fit at the Seat of Sacrifice cutscene...bleh. I image he's going to be unbearable while proging E8.

Wait...don't they remove that cutscene in EX? Is he getting mad about cutscenes in a NORMAL mode?

Yeah I hope he's not doing savage because E8S has approximately two minutes of downtime and cutscenes in the first third of the fight lmao

---

The best part is the first three fights of that tier are all rather easy, so his group is going to breeze through them and then run into a brick wall at full speed once they hit Light Rampant. It's going to be great.

---

HeroDelTiempo17 posted...

Wait...don't they remove that cutscene in EX? Is he getting mad about cutscenes in a NORMAL mode?

Yes, he was literally rubbing his fingers to his forehead like he was having an aneurism. He was absolutely livid about forced cutscene on normal difficulty.

And they are indeed full proging every Eden Savage and Extreme trial.

He might just quit altogether once he realizes what E8 is.

---

Ive still never done any current-expansion savages

I should probably try to get around to that at some point; I dont like the pressure that Id imagine comes with progging them at release, but presumably I could handle them with 530 gear and echo...

---

To be fair, Seat of Sacrifice mash sequence is fucking obnoxious in that one person failing = restart from the beginning.

---

trdl23 posted...

To be fair, Seat of Sacrifice mash sequence is fucking obnoxious in that one person failing = restart from the beginning.

He didn't get mad at the mash, he got mad at the part after.

---

Oh.

Who is this clown, again?

---

From what I have gathered it's a mult world first WoW raid group who all boosted and are blind proging all of Shadowbringers with no assistance at min no echo. Other members have been doing other content, but the raid leader Max is only doing the raids (other than a dungeon here or there waiting for everyone to get there).

The idea has appeal and they've actually been enjoying themselves plenty (they just beat E4S), but perhaps in retaliation towards the anti boosting trolls (which, boosting is literally the only reason they even started doing this, don't complain about how other people play the game if they aren't affecting you in the slightest), he seems to have taken this stance of actively making fun of cutscene watchers and making snide comments about it here and there. Which if I was streaming and those people were spamming me...canr super blame him.

I don't actually have a problem with Max in general, but it's more that his reaction was kind of ridiculous. And that was during a one shot, not even a rewatch. It's more than shit's going to be rough proging E8S if they don't just skip it altogether.

---

LordoftheMorons posted...

Ive still never done any current-expansion savages

I should probably try to get around to that at some point; I dont like the pressure that Id imagine comes with progging them at release, but presumably I could handle them with 530 gear and echo...

If you're comfortable progging extremes at release, the first two floors of any given Savage tier aren't much harder. Typically the first floor is about as complex as an EX just with a higher DPS check and one harder mechanic. Second floor will increase that slightly but occasionally they will push one mechanic too far (hello E2S final phase and E10S towers). Still, you don't even typically need a static to do them and pugs can clear them on release just fine. Things don't get truly wild until the 3rd or 4th floors.

I think Savage raiding has a more intimidating reputation than it actually deserves because it USED to be that way in 3.0-3.3 era, but ever since Stormblood they have done a really good job of easing people into it with the difficulty and have also streamlined the game in numerous other ways.

---

Yeah I've cleared all of the extremes and I've done some complicated savages unsynced (O4,8,12S) and know my rotation; the thing that seems daunting to me is mostly having to deal with relatively tight dps checks while learning new mechanics.

(I also kind of have a philosophical issue with statics/raiding guilds etc in that I don't want to schedule my life around a game, even if it's one I put a ton of time into).

---

Engaging in clown-to-clown communication still means he's being a clown

---