Current Events > A picture that explains why wealth tax makes alot of sense

(+) Yeah! (+)

People often say it is not fair to tax billionaires cause their wealth is sitting in stock or whatever.

What these people fail to realize is that the average american pays more in taxes than their wealth grows over a 10 year period.

Whereas these billionaires pay almost nothing compared to their wealth growth as this picture shows.

As you can see, if the Average American grew their wealth by $89k in this period, they paid $142k in taxes.
They paid more in taxes than their wealth had grown.

Meanwhile...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/1/9/0/AAefUOAAC4ne.jpg

I only do pie charts fix it

Among all the issues with this, one of the biggest is tax money isnt exactly spent well in the first place.

R1masher posted...

I only do pie charts fix it

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/1/9/1/AABUaRAAC4nf.png

Yuuko-Chan posted...

Among all the issues with this, one of the biggest is tax money isnt exactly spent well in the first place.

So you say that suggest we tax the average american less or to excuse why Bezos is getting off scott free?

maybe put more money in a retirement account? if your AGI is 20k or under you can reduce your tax bill to zero with credits/deductions. thank you

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/1/9/7/AAe_4aAAC4nl.png

As you can see from the graph, rich people are bad.

CharlesBronson posted...

maybe put more money in a retirement account? if your AGI is 20k or under you can reduce your tax bill to zero with credits/deductions. thank you

poor people do something else!!
right?

If your poor why don't you just make more money

Smh

Yes, we should definitely remove large chunks of equity out of the stock market and crash everyones retirement accounts to fund a notoriously wasteful federal government which produces nothing. More importantly we get to stick it to the ultra wealthy for the lulz

what a great idea tc

Solid Snake07 posted...

a notoriously wasteful federal government which produces nothing

what is medicare? what is social security? what is federal student loans?
Where is that guy who got a loan for college?

What is stimulus checks?

But this argument is also ridiculous because as the graph shows, we are taking more tax money from the average american than their wealth will grow

for what?

for

Solid Snake07 posted...

to fund a notoriously wasteful federal government which produces nothing.

If we say that people who do not have 1 million in wealth no longer have to pay taxes, what would you say to that?

Sound good?

WingsOfGood posted...

what is medicare? what is social security? what is federal student loans?

.three highly criticized government programs?

WingsOfGood posted...

But this argument is also ridiculous because as the graph shows, we are taking more tax money from the average american than their wealth will grow

for what?

for

If we say that people who do not have 1 million in wealth no longer have to pay taxes, what would you say to that?

Sound good?

what youre suggesting would absolutely wreak havoc on the markets and global economy. So no, that doesnt sound good at all.

The only real beneficiaries of France's several attempts at a wealth tax have been Belgium and UK, where the rich French fled to.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4932482/Wealth-tax-forces-12-000-millionaires-YEAR-France.html

Solid Snake07 posted...

what youre suggesting would absolutely wreak havoc on the markets and global economy. So no, that doesnt sound good at all.

How exactly would that happen?

Bezos will purposely destroy amazon in a fit of rage because he now has to pay some taxes on his wealth gains?

Rather than... just paying that and seeing his wealth STILL continue to increase every year?

You didn't think very hard on that reply did you?

WingsOfGood posted...

How exactly would that happen?

Bezos will purposely destroy amazon in a fit of rage because he now has to pay some taxes on his wealth gains?

Rather than... just paying that and seeing his wealth STILL continue to increase every year?

You didn't think very hard on that reply did you?

Must simp for billionaire

SIMP HARDER

WingsOfGood posted...

So you say that suggest we tax the average american less or to excuse why Bezos is getting off scott free?

Tax everyone less, I say.

Dakimakura posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/1/9/7/AAe_4aAAC4nl.png

As you can see from the graph, rich people are bad.

This picture explains TC's point way better

Questionmarktarius posted...

The only real beneficiaries of France's several attempts at a wealth tax have been Belgium and UK, where the rich French fled to.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4932482/Wealth-tax-forces-12-000-millionaires-YEAR-France.html

https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2019/02/26/698057356/if-a-wealth-tax-is-such-a-good-idea-why-did-europe-kill-theirs

UC Berkeley economist Gabriel Zucman, whose research helped put wealth inequality back on the American policy agenda, played a part in designing Warren's wealth tax. He says it was designed explicitly with European failures in mind.

He argues the Warren plan is "very different than any wealth tax that has existed anywhere in the world." Unlike in the European Union, it's impossible to freely move to another country or state to escape national taxes. Existing U.S. law also taxes citizens wherever they are, so even if they do sail to a tax haven in the Caribbean, they're still on the hook. On top of that, Warren's plan includes an "exit tax," which would confiscate 40 percent of all a person's wealth over $50 million if they renounce their citizenship.

Warren's tax is also only limited to the super rich, whereas in Europe the threshold was low enough to also hit the sort-of rich. This higher threshold helps it avoid problems like someone having a family business that makes them look rich on paper but, in fact, they're short on the cash needed to pay the tax.
Also important, Zucman argues, the higher threshold means only a small group will be affected. And smaller groups have a harder time fighting for exemptions, which hurt European efforts. Some countries, for example, exempted artwork and antiques on the grounds they were hard to value. It's true, but it creates a huge loophole: Buy lots of art! Economists hate incentives like these because they distort markets. Warren's proposal calls for no exemptions.

WingsOfGood posted...

https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2019/02/26/698057356/if-a-wealth-tax-is-such-a-good-idea-why-did-europe-kill-theirs

Gated community, on the moon.

aeiou!

WingsOfGood posted...

What is stimulus checks?

A crock of shit. They gave everyone pittance of what they paid in taxes and people are it up. If they really cared about helping people they would have suspended tax collection for 2020 at the federal level.

Questionmarktarius posted...

Gated community, on the moon.

aeiou!

How will they get to the moon when the government owns the airspace?
Even SpaceX is subject to this.

WingsOfGood posted...

How exactly would that happen?

Bezos will purposely destroy amazon in a fit of rage because he now has to pay some taxes on his wealth gains?

Rather than... just paying that and seeing his wealth STILL continue to increase every year?

You didn't think very hard on that reply did you?

Fun fact, Bezo's cash salary is aobut 1.6 million per year. Guess how many decade it would take to save enough to pay even a 1% wealth tax.

Wealth taxes are either things thought up by people with zero sense of financial terms, or crooks that want to have the government take over the business and the only way they can do it is to go "oh, can't pay your wealth tax? Guess it's all mine now."

Crazyman93 posted...

If they really cared about helping people they would have suspended tax collection for 2020 at the federal level.

Well, about that....

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/07/how-race-plays-tax-policing/619570/

https://www.foxbusiness.com/money/irs-audits-poor-taxpayers-easier

Which is ironic when certain people pretend the rich pay basically all the taxes.
If that were true, why go after the poor so hard?

WingsOfGood posted...

If that were true, why go after the poor so hard?

The rich can afford better lawyers.

lightwarrior78 posted...

Fun fact, Bezo's cash salary is aobut 1.6 million per year. Guess how many decade it would take to save enough to pay even a 1% wealth tax.

Wealth taxes are either things thought up by people with zero sense of financial terms, or crooks that want to have the government take over the business and the only way they can do it is to go "oh, can't pay your wealth tax? Guess it's all mine now."

Bezos sold his stock once in 2006 to 2018 and made 6 billion off of that sale.

Only once!

WingsOfGood posted...

If that were true, why go after the poor so hard?

Because the poor and middle class can't pay an accountant to shuffle their money enough to make an audit a pain in the ass. Government likes to go the easy route. And in this case it lets the IRS investigative division brag about having the best conviction rates on their cases in the US.

But thank you for proving my point. The government doesn't care about us.

Crazyman93 posted...

Because the poor and middle class can't pay an accountant to shuffle their money enough to make an audit a pain in the ass. Government likes to go the easy route. And in this case it lets the IRS investigative division brag about having the best conviction rates on their cases in the US.

But thank you for proving my point. The government doesn't care about us.

Point is, why is that money so important? People act like the amount they pay is so small, but the government uses most it resources to collect it.

Crazyman93 posted...

A crock of shit. They gave everyone pittance of what they paid in taxes and people are it up. If they really cared about helping people they would have suspended tax collection for 2020 at the federal level.

Lmao.

WingsOfGood posted...

How exactly would that happen?

Bezos will purposely destroy amazon in a fit of rage because he now has to pay some taxes on his wealth gains?

Rather than... just paying that and seeing his wealth STILL continue to increase every year?

You didn't think very hard on that reply did you?

You can't just remove tens or hundreds of billions of dollars of equity from the markets with no repercussions.

Even a whiff that something like this was a real possibility would send the market into an absolute panic. This would totally flatline everyone's retirement accounts, the politicians that were stupid enough to implement it will be pariahs and replaced with people who will immediately undo it. Which is why it'll never happen.

This is absolute nonsense talk

Dakimakura posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/1/9/7/AAe_4aAAC4nl.png

As you can see from the graph, rich people are bad.

dear god, suddenly it all makes sense

Solid Snake07 posted...

You can't just remove tens or hundreds of billions of dollars of equity from the markets with no repercussions.

Even a whiff that something like this was a real possibility would send the market into an absolute panic. This would totally flatline everyone's retirement accounts, the politicians that were stupid enough to implement it will be pariahs and replaced with people who will immediately undo it. Which is why it'll never happen.

This is absolute nonsense talk

https://www.forbes.com/sites/brendancoffey/2019/09/25/a-wealth-tax-could-actually-make-billionaires-richer-while-raising-revenue/

A few years ago I was researching the majority shareholding Shoen family of U-Haul parent Amerco, when a fund manager I was speaking with had a serious request of me. When I spoke to Amerco management, would I emphasize they needed to free up more shares in the company? There were too few Amerco shares and too little daily trading volume, he said, that he couldnt buy more shares as things stood without breaking his funds rules.

That anxious fund manager shines light on a seeming beneficial paradox with proposed wealth taxes from Senators Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders: its possible the government can raise more money and the taxed billionaires end up richer.

The reason is liquidity. Scarcity generally increases prices but not always, especially in the equities markets. Too few shares available to freely trade and businesses begin to be worth less, not more. Simply: dozens, perhaps hundreds, of large, successful companies are trading at inferior values and less-than-efficient capital costs because ultra-wealthy insiders own too many shares. That excludes them from trillions of dollars of potential investor money from many mutual funds, ETFs and indexes. Creating more freely traded shares through billionaire insiders needing to sell some shares to pay wealth taxes can unlock that trapped value.

More significantly for shareholders of billionaire-dominated companies, the lack of liquidity and independent shareholder control excludes many companies from being included in the indexes which are the basis for massive amounts of ETF investments. The S&P 500 is the index basis for $3.4 trillion of funds (and another $6.5 trillion benchmarked to it). The S&P excludes companies that are below a minimum $4.1 billion float of shares and only recently changed its rules to allow companies with less than 50% float (it previously had permitted some low-float, billionaire dominated listings, like Warren Buffetts Berkshire Hathaway).

You guys appear to have not researched this at all and just come up with this most bs hanging fruit arguments possible.

Dakimakura posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/1/9/7/AAe_4aAAC4nl.png

As you can see from the graph, rich people are bad.

haha

If I was rich I would buy these shoes

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/2/5/2/AAP2ssAAC4oc.jpg

DespondentDeity posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/2/5/2/AAP2ssAAC4oc.jpg

What do they cost?

WingsOfGood posted...

What do they cost?

$1095 retail but my size is no longer available at retail, I didnt even bother trying to find an after market

WingsOfGood posted...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/brendancoffey/2019/09/25/a-wealth-tax-could-actually-make-billionaires-richer-while-raising-revenue/

You guys appear to have not researched this at all and just come up with this most bs hanging fruit arguments possible.

no you see, pulling value out of the market could actually unlock untapped value in the market!

this may be the dumbest thing youve posted all night

Solid Snake07 posted...

no you see, pulling value out of the market could actually unlock untapped value in the market!

this may be the dumbest thing youve posted all night

You didn't read it? The article explains exactly how it works.
You mocking it just makes you look like you don't know what you are talking about but that was obvious anyways.

WingsOfGood posted...

You didn't read it? The article explains exactly how it works.
You mocking it just makes you look like you don't know what you are talking about but that was obvious anyways.

I did read it. I also looked into the author whos a sports writer that dabbles in stock commentary.

try again

Solid Snake07 posted...

I did read it. I also looked into the author whos a sports writer that dabbles in stock commentary.

try again

Brendan Coffey is the sports finance reporter at Sportico. Prior to joining Sportico in June 2020, Coffey spent years writing about business, markets and innovative thinkers, during which he called Carl Icahn more times than he can remember, split a bottle of wine with Gordon Getty three times and was cursed at by Leon Cooperman more than once.

His prior stints include serving as founding senior reporter for Bloomberg News billionaires news team, reporter for Forbes magazine, commodities and bond reporter at Dow Jones and freelancer for Fortune, Esquire, Barrons, Inc. and The Washington Post Magazine. Coffey graduated from Boston College Phi Beta Kappa with honors. He lives in Newburyport, Mass., and has broken only one finger playing vintage baseball.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/bpcoffey

My work has been featured in classes at Harvard and Marquette business schools and favorably cited on A&E television, BBC radio and in the New York Times. I'm also a certified technical analyst of securities.

Fouding Editor & Chief Analyst
Greentech Advisor
Oct 2019 - Present2 years 5 months
Salem, Massachusetts, United States
I'm the founding editor and chief analyst of Greentech Advisor, published by Cabot Wealth Corp., a well-regarded publisher of investment advisories. The newsletter is the only subcription service on investing in the Cleantech and ESG stock space. I founded and self-published the publication as "ESG Impact" in late 2019, subsequently renaming it as part of joining Cabot. The portfolio's 2020 total return was 103%.

vs. user on gamefaqs.com

Dakimakura posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/1/9/7/AAe_4aAAC4nl.png

As you can see from the graph, rich people are bad.

The badder you are, the richer you get.

What's really ironic is that just earlier today in another topic, Wings here was going off at someone else for, basically the same thing everyone's going off at him in this topic for.

Solid Snake07 posted...

You can't just remove tens or hundreds of billions of dollars of equity from the markets with no repercussions.

Btw this literally happened yesterday.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2022/02/03/facebook-zuckerberg-retirement-funds/6654000001/

According to Snake our economy should be dead and our retirement accounts as well.

230 billion in equity gone.

How interesting.

Solid Snake07 posted...

You can't just remove tens or hundreds of billions of dollars of equity from the markets with no repercussions.

Even a whiff that something like this was a real possibility would send the market into an absolute panic. This would totally flatline everyone's retirement accounts, the politicians that were stupid enough to implement it will be pariahs and replaced with people who will immediately undo it. Which is why it'll never happen.

This is absolute nonsense talk

Well gee, maybe we shouldn't tie our livelihoods to speculative assets.

DespondentDeity posted...

If I was rich I would buy these shoes

Where does the foot go?

1337toothbrush posted...

Well gee, maybe we shouldn't tie our livelihoods to speculative assets.

Further still, it is a good thing the wealth tax forces them to sell some stock periodically and keeps the stock from bubbling too much.

Facebook losing $230 billion in one day just because proves this. It is very easy for stock that has been blowing up like these billionaires stock do to pop and do the thing Snake claims is the worse thing ever.

Similar to the article about freeing up shares, it helps ground the price more and makes the rest of the market healthier.

Questionmarktarius posted...

Where does the foot go?

in from the top.