Current Events > Google lays off 12k

(+) Yeah! (+)

TheGoldenEel posted...

Do you have a family?

Nah but if I did have mouths to feed, I'd just take more initiative at work and go for a manager role. That jump alone without any other bonuses or more shares after performance evaluations is ~20k, so there's the private sector difference. And larger pension since your highest 3 years of income is part of that formula

WingsOfGood posted...

okay I don't get it.

How does this do anything for google?
They are basically paying a lot of these people as if they were still working there for 4 more months....

* We'll pay employees during the full notification period (minimum 60 days).
* We'll also offer a severance package starting at 16 weeks salary plus two weeks for every additional year at Google, and accelerate at least 16 weeks of GSU vesting.
* We'll pay 2022 bonuses and remaining vacation time.
* We'll be offering 6 months of healthcare, job placement services, and immigration support for those affected.
* Outside the US, we'll support employees in line with local practices.
By the time they no longer paying Economy may be up again and they just lost valuable employees they haven't been getting value from because they laid them off.

I don't think they plan on the economy going up again this year, so to answer your question they're bracing themselves like all the others.

VeggetaX posted...

After working for the government I will never go back to private sectors.

Same, it's awesome once you learn to embrace all the politics and slowness of getting things done.

Sheesh, it's tough out here being a recent college grad. At this rate I'll never find a job out here. I guess it's time to leave the bay.

TheGoldenEel posted...

Also at least where I live the government salaries arent quite in the threshold of not having to worry about money. Its like $50-70k for a mid-level development job vs like $80-100k

Oh ok then I see where you're coming from

It's a bit different for me because the salary comparisons are CS PhDs in government vs CS PhDs in private sector. Private sector pays more and in the extreme cases a lot more, but typically it's a small difference that's not worth the stress (read: any) for me.

Yeah, Macadamia does cool research stuff for the govt I think

MacadamianNut3 posted...

Oh ok then I see where you're coming from

It's a bit different for me because the salary comparisons are CS PhDs in government vs CS PhDs in private sector. Private sector pays more and in the extreme cases a lot more, but typically it's a small difference that's not worth the stress (read: any) for me.

Should also note that I live in the Midwest and $90k is a very comfortable salary here

i know the Bay Area folks are probably saying wtf to that post

emblem-man posted...

cool

making me shy af

But yeah I'm also probably biased because I live in the DMV area and a surprisingly large number of people in federal jobs are just feasting and coasting here. I have zero experience with that kind of life in other states

Yeah my husband is a contractor for the government. The government team he works with really likes him though and he knows he could get a job with them. But they pay less than his company does so hes on the fence about it.

Cleo_II posted...

Yeah my husband is a contractor for the government. The government team he works with really likes him though and he knows he could get a job with them. But they pay less than his company does so hes on the fence about it.

Have to weight the benefits too. And if it's federal government they usually make it rain with raises every year.

TheGoldenEel posted...

honestly I dont even understand how the government is even able to hire tech folks

Ive been looking and most government jobs in my field are a good $20-30,000 lower in salary

i dont know how anyone would say yes to that

Work as a contractor for a government agency. You get competitive pay and healthcare... and you get all the holidays the agency observes.

voldothegr8 posted...

Have to weight the benefits too. And if it's federal government they usually make it rain with raises every year.

We were actually having this conversation this morning as the government team he works with announced they intend to hire. Hes mulling it over. The biggest thing is hes not sure he can work remotely like he is now and so I encouraged him to dig around and find out.

VeggetaX posted...

TBH I got lucky. I've looked at state and federal level with the same position as mine and the pay isn't better. The benefits are insane. I get sick days, personal days and vacation days all can be used separately and I get all national holidays off. Health care is fucking awesome and I don't pay into social security. Instead I pay into a State pension for my retirement and I can retire after 30 years of working and I will keep 90-100% of what I was getting paid when I retire, and then I can go do anything else I want. Government is like a tenured job with stability. My QoL has improved greatly.

And if you choose to retire overseas, like in the EU... than pension cannot be taxed by your new country. So you pay a US tax rate and get European-level services.

Tom_Joad posted...

And if you choose to retire overseas, like in the EU... than pension cannot be taxed by your new country. So you pay a US tax rate and get European-level services.

NICE.

So what IS the exact same reason for layoffs? Is this preventive over the looming recession to protect profit margins? Or lower demand?

CARRRNE_ASADA posted...

So what IS the exact same reason for layoffs? Is this preventive over the looming recession to protect profit margins? Or lower demand?

During Covid there was a big surge in company profits as people stayed home and consumed more. They saw record breaking gains. And so companies started hiring like crazy and many bet that the surge would continue post Covid. As a recruiter, those times were insane. I was highly desirable with dozens of companies trying to poach me weekly.

Now that things are going back to semi normal, companies arent reporting the crazy high earnings they had which is causing stock prices to dip and investors are unhappy. So they are just reducing workforce to appease them. Its disgusting and we are all just expendable sheep for slaughter.

Cleo_II posted...

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2023/01/20/google-to-lay-off-12000-people-memo-from-ceo-sundar-pichai-says.html

My close friend was impacted as a recruiting manager. I just called her and shes in tears. She loved her job so much. Freaking awful.

:(

you know, mass layoffs like this were supposed to be an exception, sort of a painful but necessary thing.

now they are part of the big firms corporate strategy, for example we will grow a lot during the pandemic. So lets hire in mass right now to benefit from that and then fire them all when the dust settles.

people are being thought of more and more as cattle, and it will get worse. Small businesses need to make a comeback, I keep saying it

TaylorHeinicke posted...

So who all in tech has had mass layoffs in the last few months? Google, Microsoft, Salesforce all off the top of my head. Amazon too I think, yeah?

oracle too.

It's fine, though. Half the lambs will still praise the butcher.

Are these layoffs due to headwinds or layoffs due to too much expansion during covid and the free printer money era?

hockeybub89 posted...

It's fine, though. Half the lambs will still praise the butcher.

yes, and it drives me insane

WingsOfGood posted...

By the time they no longer paying Economy may be up again and they just lost valuable employees they haven't been getting value from because they laid them off.

The economy before was a bubble due to the pandamic that burst last year. Along with the entire past decade tbh. Particularly in the tech sector.

As such there will be a recovery but downward instead of up upward. Mostly because these company's believed 2020s lvs would become the new norm, so they over grew, over hired and are now forced to downsize.

bound to happen with inefficient governments who just prints money like it ain't no thang

Prismsblade posted...

The economy before was a bubble due to the pandamic that burst last year. Along with the entire past decade tbh. Particularly in the tech sector.

As such there will be a recovery but downward instead of up upward. Mostly because these company's believed 2020s lvs would become the new norm, so they over grew, over hired and are now forced to downsize.

by recovery I'm guessing you mean correction, kind of like in financial markets

return to the means :(

VeggetaX posted...

After working for the government I will never go back to private sectors.

I just signed on to a state job. Got 2 holiday paid days off my first month and in March I get a fat raise...benefits are insane too. Govt job where it's at!

Fuck I'm trying to get a government job. I'm relatively new working as an engineer and my interview for a biomedical engineer GS7 went really well. I'm waiting to hear back, but my god are they so fucking slow.

I've had 2 offers since that interview both of which I would reject to get into the government.

Hayame_Zero posted...

What the fuck?

https://twitter.com/readDanwrite/status/1616453244561297408?t=hHkfGDlhooz-qODLlWajfg&s=19

emblem-man posted...

Damn. I refuse to believe they'd be that incompetent about it.

well-excuse-me posted...

Damn. That's evil future in the movies shit

The Google high ranking executives really are that incompetent. Granted, I wouldn't use the word "incompetent", I would use the word COWARDLY. At least they didn't pull the bullshit where they send security to tell the now former employees they are fired and then have the former employees escorted by security away from the building like they are criminals being sent to prison (yeah, they sometimes do that shit too, and they do it to the most harmless people imaginable). Nonetheless, the badges thing is highly cowardly as fuck and just really fucked up on so many levels. The former employees will most likely receive a NON-personalized automated e-mail (A.K.A: copy and paste corporate bullshit) sent to them (and everyone else on the fired list) hours later today, which is just adding insult to injury.

ROOTFayth posted...

by recovery I'm guessing you mean correction, kind of like in financial markets

return to the means :(

Yes, I'm not so good at articulating these sorts of things.

Anyways Techs golden ages are likely over now, and the days of them hiring a abudance of useless people to do essentially redundant ad hoc task for 6 figures are done.

I mean it really sucks losing your job but from the former employee's perspective wouldn't it just be a waste of time to go up to the office and being told in person that you're being fired, you're basically just wasting more time, I understand it sucks losing your job but I fail to see how getting the news through e-mail or in person or through this badge thing is different, the end result is the same isn't it?

Prismsblade posted...

Yes, I'm not so good at articulating these sorts of things.

Anyways Techs golden ages are likely over now, and the days of them hiring a abudance of useless people to do essentially redundant ad hoc task for 6 figures are done.

baaah I wouldn't say that, we're just in the middle of the biggest recession ever, need to get back to strong financial markets first before these jobs are available again

warm bodies for the war in Ukraine.

see you all on the front lines. Lets get it!!

ROOTFayth posted...

baaah I wouldn't say that, we're just in the middle of the biggest recession ever, need to get back to strong financial markets first before these jobs are available again

you dont get it. Listen to what I posted and then Cleo too.

the modus operandi is hire stupidly when they see a chance of growth, no matter how small the window is, and then fire in mass, because why the fuck not.

the_pika posted...

you dont get it. Listen to what I posted and then Cleo too.

the modus operandi is hire stupidly when they see a chance of growth, no matter how small the window is, and then fire in mass, because why the fuck not.

I understand their primary concern is profits yes, that's kind of what capitalism is, what would you have done in their shoes though? they could afford a lot more employees so they created jobs(good ones), they can no longer afford those employees... what's the solution if not firing them?

it really sucks for the people affected by this but how would you have done things differently if you were running google, I'm curious because I'm not sure there was a better way, unless you mean they shouldn't have had the job to begin with

ROOTFayth posted...

I understand their primary concern is profits yes, that's kind of what capitalism is, what would you have done in their shoes though? they could afford a lot more employees so they created jobs(good ones), they can no longer afford those employees... what's the solution if not firing them?

it really sucks for the people affected by this but how would you have done things differently if you were running google, I'm curious because I'm not sure there was a better way, unless you mean they shouldn't have had the job to begin with

you are acting as if hiring in mass knowing you will fire people in mass after a few months was the standard practice all along. No, its something new.

stop acting as if you were one of them (CEOs, majority stakeholders), youre not

Prismsblade posted...

Yes, I'm not so good at articulating these sorts of things.

Anyways Techs golden ages are likely over now, and the days of them hiring a abudance of useless people to do essentially redundant ad hoc task for 6 figures are done.

You clearly understand very little.

Were at over 100k employees in tech that have been laid off in the last 3 months. Over 50k in January alone and the month isnt over. They are not useless people. I know several who have been impacted and they are some of the hardest working people I know. They just no longer serve a purpose to the company they were at. My friend who was laid off had full weeks every week and would work late hours all the time. She gave her heart and soul to Google. But whatever team she was on was deemed to not generate enough revenue. She was just a number on a spreadsheet. Her boss didnt even know she was getting laid off and called her crying because she was a top performer.

Cleo_II posted...

You clearly understand very little.

Were at over 100k employees in tech that have been laid off in the last 3 months. Over 50k in January alone and the month isnt over. They are not useless people. I know several who have been impacted and they are some of the hardest working people I know. They just no longer serve a purpose to the company they were at. My friend who was laid off had full weeks every week and would work late hours all the time. She gave her heart and soul to Google. But whatever team she was on was deemed to not generate enough revenue. She was just a number on a spreadsheet. Her boss didnt even know she was getting laid off and called her crying because she was a top performer.

these guys like prismblade dont get it.

they think theyre specially smart or hard working so theyre over this - theyre not

the_pika posted...

you are acting as if hiring in mass knowing you will fire people in mass after a few months was the standard practice all along. No, its something new.

stop acting as if you were one of them (CEOs, majority stakeholders), youre not

you didn't answer my question, how would you have done it? and no I'm not a majority shareholder of google nor am I CEO of google, you got that right

ROOTFayth posted...

you didn't answer my question, how would you have done it? and no I'm not a majority shareholder of google nor am I CEO of google, you got that right

how did companies do it before this new trend?

*works for a tech company*

*starts sweating*

It's fintech, idk how those are doing right now lol everything seems to be fine though

the_pika posted...

how did companies do it before this new trend?

it's not "trend" it's a recession

companies bust during recession, people lose their job, that's literally what a recession is, maybe the tech sector is getting hit harder, recessions are bad for everyone but especially for people living paycheck to paycheck

ROOTFayth posted...

you didn't answer my question, how would you have done it? and no I'm not a majority shareholder of google nor am I CEO of google, you got that right

The problem was how they overhired to start with. There was no thought or planning to it. I saw it myself with teams I recruited for that just hired with no plan for growth or long term. Companies treated people like commodities and planned extremely poorly. Not all though. Also many companies right now dont need to layoff as theyre still very profitable but they see a trend going and want to jump on the bandwagon to cut costs.

As someone who works at a relatively small tech company that didn't increase headcount at all during the pandemic, all these giant tech companies laying off doesn't cause me any concern for the industry as a whole.

They overhired to an absolutely insane degree. I ignored so many recruiting emails over the past 3 years because the writing was on the wall.

Cleo_II posted...

The problem was how they overhired to start with. There was no thought or planning to it. I saw it myself with teams I recruited for that just hired with no plan for growth or long term. Companies treated people like commodities and planned extremely poorly. Not all though. Also many companies right now dont need to layoff as theyre still very profitable but they see a trend going and want to jump on the bandwagon to cut costs.

yeah I mean I can see they might have underestimated or really didn't give a crap about the talk of an upcoming recession and just got greedy, very possible, they probably could have planned this a little better and hired less people

but these people who were hired and are now fired probably wouldn't have found such a good job elsewhere and might have made only half the money or I dunno 70% or whatever, they're fired now but it gives them a cushion compared to if they had had another job doesn't it? it sucks because of the hassle of finding another one but technically in the grand scheme of thing they were paid for the work they have done

anyway I understand if we look at it exclusively from a human perspective and emotions it really sucks but from the company's perspective they had no choice to lay off, but you're right they maybe could have planned better and maybe hired less people, they got greedy maybe in a mega bull market

ROOTFayth posted...

it's not "trend" it's a recession

companies bust during recession, people lose their job, that's literally what a recession is, maybe the tech sector is getting hit harder, recessions are bad for everyone but especially for people living paycheck to paycheck

i am starting to feel youre playing dumb on purpose.

it is one thing to fire a bunch of people because there is a recession.

it is another thing to hire a bunch of people to take advantage of a very short (few months) super-growth period knowing you will fire them in mass once things return to normal

the_pika posted...

i am starting to feel youre playing dumb on purpose.

it is one thing to fire a bunch of people because there is a recession.

it is another thing to hire a bunch of people to take advantage of a very short (few months) super-growth period knowing you will fire them in mass once things return to normal

So I guess the solution was to be transparent and tell the new employees that they might get fired when and if the recession hits?

ROOTFayth posted...

I mean it really sucks losing your job but from the former employee's perspective wouldn't it just be a waste of time to go up to the office and being told in person that you're being fired, you're basically just wasting more time, I understand it sucks losing your job but I fail to see how getting the news through e-mail or in person or through this badge thing is different, the end result is the same isn't it?

Are you being fucking serious or are you trolling?
If you are being serious then no amount of explaining is going to make sense to you since it's obvious you are missing some key human components, one of which happens to be empathy towards other human beings.

ROOTFayth posted...

I mean it really sucks losing your job but from the former employee's perspective wouldn't it just be a waste of time to go up to the office and being told in person that you're being fired, you're basically just wasting more time, I understand it sucks losing your job but I fail to see how getting the news through e-mail or in person or through this badge thing is different, the end result is the same isn't it?

For one, they seemingly have no access to any personal things in the building. And think of how you'd prefer to be informed of having stage 4 cancer. With some care and empathy or via email?

Look man I don't think it's asking that fucking much to not be made to wait outside in line in January in new York City to find out if I still have a job.

The web search and video sharing giant will offer U.S.-based employees 16 weeks of severance pay plus two weeks for each additional year they've worked at Google, Pichai added.

Thats pretty damn good. If your mid-level and worked 7 years, thats damn near 8 months!

Cleo_II posted...

She gave her heart and soul to Google.

That wasn't very smart