Current Events > creepy transphobe got called out and trys to play the victim

(+) Yeah! (+)

Razor posted...

If Christians were holding back cultural and technological progress , why did those countries end up leading the world in math , science , civili rights, and gross GDP? Among other things

What destroyed cultures are you referring to that were outperforming Christians?

Dude, meso Americans had freaking waterways delivering water up mountains to allow them to live in those areas. Meanwhile Europe was still having people die from infections and diseases because they'd shit in the streets or at best they would shit in a bucket and then dump it into the streets. Only castles (military kind included) really had dedicated areas to void your bowels in and there's several pretty well known incidents where floors gave out and people fell into the waste and drowned. The Erfurt latrine disaster being the most hilariously absurd seeming one.

Has anyone posted the frame-by-frame, yet?

Warning: language.

https://twitter.com/LauraJedeed/status/1642708523820695554

CyricZ posted...

Has anyone posted the frame-by-frame, yet?

Warning: language.

https://twitter.com/LauraJedeed/status/1642708523820695554

Yep, no possible way to deny that the guy wasn't just pushing her away but that he outright grabbed her.

watching that video upset me

remandramdoll posted...

Dude, meso Americans had freaking waterways delivering water up mountains to allow them to live in those areas. Meanwhile Europe was still having people die from infections and diseases because they'd shit in the streets or at best they would shit in a bucket and then dump it into the streets. Only castles (military kind included) really had dedicated areas to void your bowels in and there's several pretty well known incidents where floors gave out and people fell into the waste and drowned. The Erfurt latrine disaster being the most hilariously absurd seeming one.

Are you arguing meso Americans were more advanced than Europeans?

Who the heck is Razor and why did this topic get into the idea of "Christians were the ones to make actual progress"?

This is some real "taming the savages" shit.

Getting that close up on somebody and screaming in their face like that is assault and using reasonable force to remove them from your personal space is justified.

CyricZ posted...

Who the heck is Razor and why did this topic get into the idea of "Christians were the ones to make actual progress"?

This is some real "taming the savages" shit.

Yep, I have better things to waste time on than dealing with revisionist bs

Tenlaar posted...

Getting that close up on somebody and screaming in their face like that is assault and using reasonable force to remove them from your personal space is justified.

No, screaming in someone's face isn't assault. It isn't making direct contact with him and he didn't try getting her away, he was grabbing her shirt in a spot that would actually make him the one committing assault if anything. It's why he won't succeed in suing the police.

remandramdoll posted...

No, screaming in someone's face isn't assault.

Yes, it is.

It isn't making direct contact with him

Assault is not the same thing as battery.

and he didn't try getting her away, he was grabbing her shirt in a spot that would actually make him the one committing assault if anything. It's why he won't succeed in suing the police.

This is nonsense.

Tenlaar posted...

This is nonsense.

I mean we have the slowed down zoomed in footage of him grabbing her so either you don't live in reality or you simply opt to replace it with your own version of events. Same goes for the rest of your post.

Wait so now that we've proven who was the first to lay hands, we're now moving the goalposts to "when you think about it, words can actually be assault".

After an entire day's worth of "it's just words, they don't justify violence"?

CyricZ posted...

Wait so now that we've proven who was the first to lay hands, we're now moving the goalposts to "when you think about it, words can actually be assault".

After an entire day's worth of "it's just words, they don't justify violence"?

But wait, if yelling in people's faces is assault then how do protesters outside planned parenthood avoid getting in trouble? Oh right, because it isn't a crime.

"They're just words unless the words are calling me out for protesting against LGBTQ people."

Some people itt act like being a trans ally means you have to support every stupid thing they say or do.

For example , acting like this dumbass in the video was the oppressor. Yea he walked around with his sign but that trans woman bulldogged him from start to finish. She picked the fight.

Razor posted...

Yea he walked around with his sign

He picked the fight.

CyricZ posted...

Wait so now that we've proven who was the first to lay hands, we're now moving the goalposts to "when you think about it, words can actually be assault".

After an entire day's worth of "it's just words, they don't justify violence"?

I guess the sign was assault after all, which means he really did instigate everything. Glad we got to the bottom of this.

remandramdoll posted...

Yep, I have better things to waste time on than dealing with revisionist bs

Shit, the topic started in on the revisionism early when people tried claiming that black activists just talked their way to victory in the Civil rights movement. Ignoring that the black panthers were instrumental in any progress being made.

remandramdoll posted...

I mean we have the slowed down zoomed in footage of him grabbing her so either you don't live in reality or you simply opt to replace it with your own version of events. Same goes for the rest of your post.

Trying to act like his hand curling somewhat as part of trying to move her out of his face means that he was actually trying to grab her and hold her there is complete nonsense. He was justified in attempting to move her away from him.

CyricZ posted...

Wait so now that we've proven who was the first to lay hands, we're now moving the goalposts to "when you think about it, words can actually be assault".

After an entire day's worth of "it's just words, they don't justify violence"?

I was not posting yesterday and am not responsible for what other people say, dont try to make it out like Im changing my stance here. Going body to body with somebody and screaming in their face is assault. It justifies trying to move somebody out of your personal space.

Someone said it earlier ITT but it needs saying again.

When you preach violence, don't be shocked when the people you preach violence against start being violent with you.

"Why aren't trans people and their allies civil with us!? We only just want to erase them all from existence one way or the other! Mean intolerant liberals!"

Tenlaar posted...

Trying to act like his hand curling somewhat as part of trying to move her out of his face means that he was actually trying to grab her and hold her there is complete nonsense. He was justified in attempting to move her away from him.

It's all about escalation. Which escalations were and were not justified?

CyricZ posted...

It's all about escalation. Which escalations were and were not justified?

was a light touch justification for aggressive assault?

manhookcardoor posted...

was a light touch justification for aggressive assault?

Grabbing a shirt isn't the same as a light touch though

ah ok I see what happened now thanks. its very split second. gunpla

You guys are aggressively exaggerating his movement for the purpose of narrative. He wasn't even looking at her direction when he touched her. Doesn't matter if it was a grab or a flick or a brush or whatever it was. It was light movement of his body against someone who were up in his grill.

The "he instigated the assault by being there" angle makes more sense than this.

CyricZ posted...

It's all about escalation. Which escalations were and were not justified?

The protestors surrounding the bigot and trying to shout him down was justified.
The protestors tightening the circle until the bigot had people right around him was questionable at best, I lean on the side of not justified.
The woman going fully body to body with the bigot and screaming in his face was not justified (and in fact was assault.)
The bigot trying to push the woman away from him was justified.
The woman attacking the bigot for it was not justified.

well there we go, I guess tenlaar the authority has spoken so we can just close this topic now.

/s

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

110%

It's all well and good to claim that you just need to be civil to everyone, but the reality is some people need to have their fucking bell rung.

Doom_Art posted...

well there we go, I guess tenlaar the authority has spoken so we can just close this topic now.

/s

Why is my post expressing my stance on the situation somehow different from all the other people who have expressed their stances on it?

Tenlaar posted...

The bigot trying to push the woman away from him was justified.

Really.

I mean I'm not surprised, but I didn't expect you to just...

CyricZ posted...

Really.

I mean I'm not surprised, but I didn't expect you to just...

Yes, really. Trying to move somebody who is aggressively invading your personal space away from you is justified. I know that there are many situations where you would fully agree with that but you will go to your grave denying it here because it involved an anti-trans bigot.

Tenlaar posted...

Yes, really. Trying to move somebody who is aggressively invading your personal space away from you is justified. I know that there are many situations where you would fully agree with that but you will go to your grave denying it here because it involved an anti-trans bigot.

I know there are many options available that don't involve laying hands on someone else.

So my conclusion about your presumptions about me is that you don't know shit and are only coming to this bigot's defense to be your usual pedantic self.

What a weird fucking topic. My head hurts trying to understand what I'm reading......

Tenlaar posted...

Why is my post expressing my stance on the situation somehow different from all the other people who have expressed their stances on it?

Your perspective is too biased, that's all.

CyricZ posted...

So my conclusion about your presumptions about me is that you don't know shit

I know very well that this is an area where you are incapable of seeing one party as doing any wrong.

remandramdoll posted...

Your perspective is too biased, that's all.

Please, do explain my bias here.

i love the "the person is bad so crimes against them are justified' rhetoric

Tenlaar posted...

I know very well that this is an area where you are incapable of seeing one party as doing any wrong.

And I know very well you'll take any opportunity to admonish someone for upsetting the civil order, no matter the context.

CyricZ posted...

And I know very well you'll take any opportunity to admonish someone for upsetting the civil order, no matter the context.

The difference is that you are wrong.

The protestors surrounding the bigot and trying to shout him down was justified.

famfam posted...

i love the "the person is bad so crimes against them are justified' rhetoric

Yeah, its pretty common around here.

CyricZ posted...

Really.

I mean I'm not surprised, but I didn't expect you to just...

Consistent behavior considering Tenlaar once said we need to respect Nazis. Despite Richard Spencer getting clocked being the reason he's irrelevant today.

Gwynevere posted...

Consistent behavior considering Tenlaar once said we need to respect Nazis.

I have never said such a thing, please dont make things up in place of actual rebuttal.

Tenlaar posted...

The difference is that you are wrong.

The protestors surrounding the bigot and trying to shout him down was justified.

Right. People have to protest in the way you decide for them

tenlaar what your doing now in this topic is why i called your a right winger over on the politics board

CyricZ posted...

Right. People have to protest in the way you decide for them

Without violence, correct.

AceMos posted...

tenlaar what your doing now in this topic is why i called your a right winger over on the politics board

You called me a right winger because you are a dishonest person and resorted to trying to discredit me with a lie because I pointed out that you were advocating for police brutality against an acceptable target. Very similar to how people in this topic are excusing violence against an acceptable target.

Has it never occurred to you that maybe some people deserve to be smacked?

Like it's all nice to be like "turn the other cheek" or "kill em with kindness" but sometimes a very physical display is the most simple and effective message that what is being said/done is not okay.

Doom_Art posted...

Has it never occurred to you that maybe some people deserve to be smacked?

Like it's all nice to be like "turn the other cheek" or "kill em with kindness" but sometimes a very physical display is the most simple and effective message that what is being said/done is not okay.

You can just look at any major movement for rights as proof that this is the case. Workers rights, women's suffrage, the civil rights Era, the origins of pride, none of these things happened through 100% peaceful protest. It's inevitable whenever people's fundamental rights are called into question that there will be physical clashes along the way. People that turn their nose up at the idea of ever defending yourself at a protest either:

A) are completely unaware of the actual history of civil rights movements, or

B) are aware, and want them to be as unsuccessful as possible

Look I'm not going to say violence must happen or that I want to see it, but it is extremely likely for violence to occur when people's lives are on the line here.

Nothing is gained by being the one to turn up their nose to the oppressed turning on their oppressors.

At worst, you enable the oppressor.

At best, you're a useless centrist.

CyricZ posted...

Look I'm not going to say violence must happen or that I want to see it, but it is extremely likely for violence to occur when people's lives are on the line here.

Yeah, I would love nothing more than to see my kid grow up in a world where we can resolve everything peacefully, without major conflict. I hate seeing violence over this shit.

Unfortunately, no one ever got the boot off their neck by asking nicely.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

You're leaving out a lot of context to create a scenario in a vacuum that isn't at all the same as what happened here.

Gwynevere posted...

People that turn their nose up at the idea of ever defending yourself at a protest

That is not at all what happened here. The woman was the attacker, not the attacked.