Current Events > why aren't kids into modern comic books?

(+) Yeah! (+)

when they do get into comics or graphic novels it's usually the old stuff like Transmetropolitan or Sandman

yeah. indie comic is always pretty ballin. nowadays there's so many options.

Maybe their leaning towards manga more

marvel and DC mainline superhero stuff hasn't been marketed to children in years. I think sometime in the 2000s, they made a decision to focus on adult fans. The comics have been changing and are no longer designed for a child audience. Also, its hard to find comics as a kid these days. From the late 30s when comics began to like the 90s I think, you could find comics in drug stores, grocery stores, department stores, gas stations, newsstands. That last one was more back in the older days granted. But as an 80s kid, I remember seeing comics in stores still. And then before the end of the 90s, that changed

Kids don't see comics in front of them. Access to them as an impulse buy no longer exists. And they are no longer the intended audience

There was a bunch of kids at my local comic shop for free comic book day.

BTW, the Blood Hunt event that just started is amazing. I highly recommend picking up the first issue. First Marvel Comics thing I've been excited for in a long while. What a fucking reveal at the end.

I didn't know there was a red band version with more explicit scenes when I bought it, but after finding out I immediately went online and purchased a $50 special variant.

If ya wanna read about the differences and see the last page surprise here you go:

MAJOR SPOILER WARNING

https://www.thepopverse.com/marvel-blood-hunt-1-red-band-differences-explicit-comic

Too damn expensive. When I was a kid, this shit was 60 cents.

Gamespoht posted...

Maybe their leaning towards manga more

It's definitely this.

A lot of libraries carry manga now just because its so popular.

Beveren_Rabbit posted...

when they do get into comics or graphic novels it's usually the old stuff like Transmetropolitan or Sandman

Along with manga's popularity already being mentioned....judging by your examples I think the fact that the internet is a thing has a hand in it as well.
When a 12 year old googles "best comics ever" they're not going to get the latest issue of Batman or Spider-Man as a result, but things like Transmetropolitan and Sandman.

Respectfully, and this is coming from someone who is 38. Even during my youth I had no interest in them. Comics in general are very static in how they pose characters, and its a hundred different stories rather than one contiguous story. Yes, you have one artist that started the series, but there are a hundred different takes on that one character.

I much rather read Japanese Manga, or Korean Manwha, which focus on bolder colouring, as well as one long story.

Marvel and DC is intimidating to get into is why. With all the resets and abundance of characters it's hard to know where to start.

I think people still have an old fashion view of comics and don't see going down to a shop to drop money on a single issue as worth it. I don't think people are aware that you can get a digital subscription and just read whatever you want. They also view comics as massive long running things like Spider-Man and can't get past the barrier of entry. Comics don't have big traditional marketing campaigns like movies so people don't even know about smaller comics. All of this is compounded for kids. Unless they're actively seeking stuff out or have a friend that read something, they just aren't going to know about anything. Also, something something dropping attention spans.

Ivany2008 posted...

Comics in general are very static in how they pose characters, and its a hundred different stories rather than one contiguous story.

That's not so much "in general" as it is Marvel/DC's superhero comics. There are literally thousands of comics out there that tell a single story from start to finish. It's just that Marvel and DC are more prolific due to being around for a long time.
Hell, my name is from a superhero comic telling a continuing story written and drawn by the same person for over 30 years now.

In b4 someone says something about comics being too woke now unironically.

Theres also stuff like WebToon that give people their comic fix

The barrier of entry is more daunting with the large amount of imprints, series, and crossovers compared to manga. Manga is also more bang for your buck per page.

Oh, thought of another one. Comics, in general, have a multitude of starting points. So if you tell me to start reading Batman, I can get overwhelmed at "which" Batman to start reading. The classic Batman? Or how about the Darkest Knight? Or Batman who laughs? Or Flashpoint Paradox (which has my favourite Batman). Manga, for the most part have 1. The beginning.

Ivany2008 posted...

Comics, in general, have a multitude of starting points. So if you tell me to start reading Batman, I can get overwhelmed at "which" Batman to start reading. The classic Batman? Or how about the Darkest Knight? Or Batman who laughs? Or Flashpoint Paradox (which has my favourite Batman).

Again, you're attributing things from 2 companies to the entire industry. The problem doesn't seem to be Marvel and DC doing all those things, the problem seems to be people are unaware of anything but Marvel and DC. It's like saying every manga out there is a shonen isekai because that's what brings in the big bucks right now.
You're bringing up legit issues with Marvel/DC though. Also Flashpoint Paradox isn't a comic, that's the title of the animated movie. The comic itself was just called Flashpoint.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

Yep. With Marvel going mainstream, comics are not the counter culture they use to be. The kids have searched out the more indie and undiscovered gems in comics; manga is taking its fair-share of the audience.

DC and Marvel are basically the most stagnant media out there, ESPECIALLY the comics. Yes, they occasionally come out with a fun movie, but aside from that the comic-verses are a total mess with basically no proper entry point aside from immediately after a reboot (and then not always even then).

And yes, I am saying they are more stagnant than even the pokemon anime, which is about a kid and his yellow zappy mouse and seasonal friends going around having pet battles with the locals of the latest region he just travels to, living on the road with no school or real oversight and such.

Or for that matter, more stagnant than <insert other stagnant media here>.

Seriously, DC and Marvel have mostly just been retelling the same core stories over and over again, while having a few side heroes do things a little differently each time. Or unless you want to look at differences in the level of goofiness or campiness from different eras (which is why I would say there is some value in watching both Batman TAS+Justice League as well as Brave and the Bold if you like Batman stuff).

But basically every good thing about the comic universes are constrained to the better-made among the other media based on them. Even when some of those media are basically no better than a one-season anime that basically tells you "if you want to see more, go check the comics/LN" at the end (this sadly includes some really good ones like X-men Evolution).

The #1 issue is price. The standard price for a comic nowadays is $4-5, compared to a minimum wage of about $7.25. Comics are a luxury that consumers are more than happy to cut instead of not eating. This is compounded by the fact that comics continue to get less and less dense, providing even worse value for your money. The nature of comic serialization is another big one; it's basically the only medium you have to look up a reading order for, and every issue that isn't part of the series you already care about is even more money you have to spend. Modern comics are also competing with older comics at this point; there's such an uncountable volume of comics, and a prospective new reader is probably going to stick with the ones that have recieved praise for the last 30 years instead of gambling their time and money on new stuff. Both of the big 2 have also become obsessed with cancelling and relaunching titles within the span of a few years, which can make discussing comics unweildy when, say, "Superman #3" could be referring to 6 different comics. The obsession with keeping the status quo is another big one; why would you care about any of the stakes when you know everything will return to the way it was within a year? Extremely shitty executive decisions and chasing comic book movies are contributing factors, but far from the main cause.

TheSavageDragon posted...

Again, you're attributing things from 2 companies to the entire industry. The problem doesn't seem to be Marvel and DC doing all those things, the problem seems to be people are unaware of anything but Marvel and DC. It's like saying every manga out there is a shonen isekai because that's what brings in the big bucks right now.
You're bringing up legit issues with Marvel/DC though. Also Flashpoint Paradox isn't a comic, that's the title of the animated movie. The comic itself was just called Flashpoint.

The problem I find is that there is just a barrier for entry. There is a lot of material. People may look at One Piece and say "that's too many chapters". Not realizing that Batman by itself has over 700 issues, and that's just the base story. Brave and the bold is another 200 issues. Comic writers are having to go back and create bundles just to get a starting point for new readers.

I mean, if your a comic fan, its a good time to be a fan. As long as you know where to start. For me though, manga will always have an easier entry point, as its nearly always Issue 001.

i wonder if another reason is that comic book movies are so prevalent now, and how they're different from the comic books as well. someone may get interested in guardians of the galaxy because of the movies, try the comics, and be irked that they're apparently vastly different

Ivany2008 posted...

The problem I find is that there is just a barrier for entry. There is a lot of material. People may look at One Piece and say "that's too many chapters". Not realizing that Batman by itself has over 700 issues, and that's just the base story. Brave and the bold is another 200 issues. Comic writers are having to go back and create bundles just to get a starting point for new readers.

"There's 1000s of comics that don't do the things you dislike about comics"
"But Batman though"

Then don't read Batman or anything from Marvel and DC. There is literally no barrier for entry with thousands of comics. There is a wide variety of genres amongst different publishers that aren't Marvel or DC and don't do all the things Marvel/DC get rightfully criticized for. Even a whole bunch of superhero comics.

Ivany2008 posted...

I mean, if your a comic fan, its a good time to be a fan. As long as you know where to start. For me though, manga will always have an easier entry point, as its nearly always Issue 001.

Which is the exact same thing for Y The Last Man, Fables, Sandman, Transmetropolitan, Sweet Tooth, 100 Bullets, Saga, Paper Girls, Gideon Falls, Black Science, Invincible, Savage Dragon, The Walking Dead, Rat Queens, Irredeemable, Kick-Ass,...

CountCorvinus posted...

There was a bunch of kids at my local comic shop for free comic book day.

BTW, the Blood Hunt event that just started is amazing. I highly recommend picking up the first issue. First Marvel Comics thing I've been excited for in a long while. What a fucking reveal at the end.

I didn't know there was a red band version with more explicit scenes when I bought it, but after finding out I immediately went online and purchased a $50 special variant.

If ya wanna read about the differences and see the last page surprise here you go:

MAJOR SPOILER WARNING

https://www.thepopverse.com/marvel-blood-hunt-1-red-band-differences-explicit-comic

hold up... is Blade the mastermind of this?

KnightofShikari posted...

someone may get interested in guardians of the galaxy because of the movies, try the comics, and be irked that they're apparently vastly different

Not really. At least if you check out the Guardians beyond the release date of the movie when they basically were turned into their movie versions save for some lore here and there.
Before that they were vastly different though.

Ivany2008 posted...

Respectfully, and this is coming from someone who is 38. Even during my youth I had no interest in them. Comics in general are very static in how they pose characters, and its a hundred different stories rather than one contiguous story. Yes, you have one artist that started the series, but there are a hundred different takes on that one character.

I much rather read Japanese Manga, or Korean Manwha, which focus on bolder colouring, as well as one long story.

hey now... let's not go on saying manga has better coloring than graphic novels/comics. Fully colored manga is still a rare thing and most of the time just a "special edition"

When you started with the movie Spiderman, then you go into the comics and realize Peter is an adult but then became a kid again but hes actually a ghost and Doc Oc is in his body and MJ was married to Peter but the devil reversed the marriage

yeah

Beveren_Rabbit posted...

hey now... let's not go on saying manga has better coloring than graphic novels/comics. Fully colored manga is still a rare thing and most of the time just a "special edition"

That part of their post is referring to manhwa which are generally colored in my experience. But they'd still be wrong as manhwa generally looks like somebody digitally colored it using Paint's auto-fill feature. That's not to say there aren't any impressive manhwa out there.

Take this for instance

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/d/dded6aa0.jpg

I've never encountered a manhwa with this level of coloring. It's not the standard for comics either, but at least they're out there. Any of Alex Ross' work for instance puts all the coloring I've seen from manhwa to shame. Image is not by Ross though, it's Sejic. And it's all thanks to artists coloring all of it which sadly tend to be forgotten as I don't even recall who actually colored that.

Beveren_Rabbit posted...

hey now... let's not go on saying manga has better coloring than graphic novels/comics. Fully colored manga is still a rare thing and most of the time just a "special edition"

I was more pointing towards Manwha with the colouring. I just forgot to separate the two.

Yazarogi posted...

hold up... is Blade the mastermind of this?

Yup :)

Very simple.

Comics are EXPENSIVE.

manga at least the anime is free and you can get a whole minibook for the price of.... 2 comics.

specialkid8 posted...

I think people still have an old fashion view of comics and don't see going down to a shop to drop money on a single issue as worth it. I don't think people are aware that you can get a digital subscription and just read whatever you want. They also view comics as massive long running things like Spider-Man and can't get past the barrier of entry. Comics don't have big traditional marketing campaigns like movies so people don't even know about smaller comics. All of this is compounded for kids. Unless they're actively seeking stuff out or have a friend that read something, they just aren't going to know about anything. Also, something something dropping attention spans.

Kids usually don't have credit cards.

WingsOfGood posted...

Very simple.

Comics are EXPENSIVE.

manga at least the anime is free and you can get a whole minibook for the price of.... 2 comics.

Anime isn't free though. Unless you're pirating it.

manga is $9.99

comics are about $2.99 an issue

Beveren_Rabbit posted...

comics are about $2.99 an issue

Not really, depends on the publisher. Marvel and DC do this once in a while to get good press or new readers to jump on board, but generally their comics are 3.99 to even 4.99 an issue these days. That's 4-5$ for about 25 pages. It's why many people these days just wait for the trades.
People make a good point when they say comics are expensive and manga gives you more bang for your buck. It's partially due to the fact comics are printed in color on higher quality paper.

But there are alternatives that aren't as pricy like buying trades and using the digital subscription services

TheSavageDragon posted...

Anime isn't free though. Unless you're pirating it.

If their parents have Netflix or Prime to them it is free.
Crunchyuroll has some that are free.
One Piece is 100% free on Crunchyroll.

So yes, anime is free.

manga is also sold as chapters or they show up as chapters in books such as Shonen Jump.

$$$

Beveren_Rabbit posted...

manga is $9.99

comics are about $2.99 an issue

No comic is 2.99 today that I know of.

And the events, 1st issues and important issues are 4.99 now and sometimes 5.99

WingsOfGood posted...

If their parents have Netflix or Prime to them it is free.

And if their parents buy comics they are free as well going by that logic. Everything is free when you're a kid.

WingsOfGood posted...

Crunchyuroll has some that are free.
One Piece is 100% free on Crunchyroll.

So yes, anime is free.

"A few here and there" does not mean anime is free at all. Comics are also free as there is literally a day called Free Comic Book Day where free comics are handed out to people. You see how that logic doesn't work?

Manga is King and their main focus is making good stories

TheSavageDragon posted...

And if their parents buy comics they are free as well going by that logic. Everything is free when you're a kid.

That is not the logic though. The logic is parents buy these services unrelated to an anime. This is not the same as a parent buying a comic and sharing it.

TheSavageDragon posted...

A few here and there" does not mean anime is free at all. Comics are also free as there is literally a day called Free Comic Book Day where free comics are handed out to people. You see how that logic doesn't work?

One Piece is 1000+ episodes.
The whole S1 of Demon Slayer is free.
Naruto is free.

But kids probably will go to an actual free site and watch whatever they want entirely free.

deoxxys posted...

and their main focus is making good stories

Their main focus is making money just like any other industry. If making good stories was the main focus the market wouldn't be flooded with hundreds of variations on the isekai genre. It's just "this is popular, let's make more" regardless of actual quality like any other.

most casual anime watchers nowadays surprisingly subscribe to Crunchyroll, Netflix, Hulu, Funimation instead of using free streaming sites.

TheSavageDragon posted...

Their main focus is making money just like any other industry. If making good stories was the main focus the market wouldn't be flooded with hundreds of variations on the isekai genre. It's just "this is popular, let's make more" regardless of actual quality like any other.

The real difference is the Mangaka is the original author and so they have some pride usually in their work at least for the bigger hits.

The original authors of most American comics are long dead so they hire people who don't share the same vision or who just wants a paycheck and does what some bigwig says.

WingsOfGood posted...

That is not the logic though. The logic is parents buy these services unrelated to an anime. This is not the same as a parent buying a comic and sharing it.

That's exactly the same thing. "Parent buys thing, kid gets to use it without forking over any money as they have none"

WingsOfGood posted...

One Piece is 1000+ episodes.
The whole S1 of Demon Slayer is free.
Naruto is free.

And yet none of that supports the claim that anime is free. Those anime are free in a select number of streaming services in a select number of countries. The other thousands of anime require a fee from someone. The claim "anime is free" is radically different from "oh those 2 or 3 anime or free" as you willfully ignore the vast majority.

WingsOfGood posted...

But kids probably will go to an actual free site and watch whatever they want entirely free.

We have come full circle. Yes, anime is free when you pirate it.

This is a stupid and pointless argument. I am both a comic nerd and an anime fan. Comics are vastly more expensive and I proved you can watch the biggest titles free legally.

Yet you go "no you are wrong."

What in the actual fuck is your goal here? Are you an out of touch exec at marvel or DC or something? Like even if you proved me wrong which you couldn't what would that do for you? There is no reason to refuse reality here
Smh

Probably online video gaming. Fortnite etc.

It kinda sucks that comic book movies made billions but comic book sales are stagnant.