Current Events > I think gambling should be illegal.

(+) Yeah! (+)

This is one of my more authoritarian views but I also don't feel like I should need to defend it. Just look at all the sports betting ads and how many people it fucks over. The pleasure it might give to people who might be able to gamble responsibly is outweighed by the mass harm it causes.

I think gambling ads should be illegal.

I have no problem with gambling but I think there's lots of rigging behind the scenes.

The act of a government doing something isn't authoritarianism. Wanting to ban gambling wouldn't make you authoritarian.

I don't see an issue with the fact that some portion of people will still gamble with it being illegal. The fact that it wouldn't be in the App Store would be a huge victory and immensely cut down on it. Wouldn't let the perfect be the enemy of good.

The gambling ads and ease of gambling has had some negatives for sure.

Doe posted...

I don't see an issue with the fact that some portion of people will still gamble with it being illegal. The fact that it wouldn't be in the App Store would be a huge victory and immensely cut down on it. Wouldn't let the perfect be the enemy of good.

banning online gambling and forcing it back to in-person would probably help.

I dont know what laws were changed but online gambling exploded here a couple years ago. Last year we had recruiters / advertisers for tons of different gambling websites constantly in the college trying to get our students onto their platforms. This year we have gamblers anonymous and self help posters everywhere.

I definitely think its one of those things, especially with the internet now, that should not be so readily available and needs more safeguards / warnings. Even in a real casino its so easy for someone who doesnt understand what they're doing to walk in and lose $100 in a slot machine in a couple minutes.

ellis123 posted...

The act of a government doing something isn't authoritarianism. Wanting to ban gambling wouldn't make you authoritarian.

Agree. It makes one a supporter of the nanny state. (Also bad imo).

emblem-man posted...

banning online gambling and forcing it back to in-person would probably help.

Even in person can be predatory though... when I went to an in person get together in Illinois for my remote job, I learned they have slot machines in gas stations in Illinois. The lead sales guy I know told me that when he goes into a store in the morning there will be a guy at a slot machine just doing pulls while his tank fills up.

The team went to an Italian restaurant after work one day and there were a bunch of TVs on the walls and while a couple had normal sports stuff, it was like a majority of them had video poker on them, and I think there was an area you could go to to play or maybe you could connect with your phone.

Honestly I'm not even comfortable with dedicated casinos existing. But at least they can be dedicated cordoned off containers where you know what you're getting into if you enter. Having gambling machines everywhere in otherwise mundane areas that provide services you need to live is very very bad.

I think odds of that actually happening are pretty poor.

Gambling has long been considered a vice for a reason, it is easy to get out of control and suddenly society itself is at risk. And like other vices, it continues to exist for a reason.

One thing you have to consider though is much of life ultimately comes down to gambling, whether it be loans, insurance rates, or something less abstract like what show you will watch. There is an opportunity cost for nearly anything you do, and thus you are betting with nearly every action.

The problem in the modern world is that gambling by the rich is backed by what amounts to super computers and endless legions of corporate cronies, all with a warranty paid for by tax payers. And that's not even getting into the propaganda either.

emblem-man posted...

banning online gambling and forcing it back to in-person would probably help.

Yep

I agree. Also alcohol.

Across various studies, about 10-15% of people (or even great apes!) have addiction problems. Whether it's alcohol, gambling, or substance abuse, sex, social media, etc. it's the addiction that's the issue.

IMO, there should be guardrails in place to help people who have fallen into gambling addictions. Many major casinos allow you to voluntarily ban yourself or set a limit. We could expand that nation-wide, but we'd have to deal with the privacy issues and technical debt this country isn't prepared to deal with.
There's enough people who are able to gamble responsibly AND gambling is poorly defined such that I would not support a full gambling ban. Just provide a safety net so that Mom or Dad can't bet the house/rent.

The ads have gotta go. But I'm sure Big Gambling has enough politicians in their pocket to make sure that wont happen

Had a new co-worker last week who, after telling me his name, proceeded to ask me what my biggest hit on FanDuel was. Lmao dawg i dont use any of those garbage sports betting apps.

Baphometa posted...

Across various studies, about 10-15% of people (or even great apes!) have addiction problems. Whether it's alcohol, gambling, or substance abuse, sex, social media, etc. it's the addiction that's the issue.

IMO, there should be guardrails in place to help people who have fallen into gambling addictions. Many major casinos allow you to voluntarily ban yourself or set a limit. We could expand that nation-wide, but we'd have to deal with the privacy issues and technical debt this country isn't prepared to deal with.
There's enough people who are able to gamble responsibly AND gambling is poorly defined such that I would not support a full gambling ban. Just provide a safety net so that Mom or Dad can't bet the house/rent.

There are guardrails in place.

I used to watch baseball all the time like 10-15 years ago. Just got back into it last year, and I was amazed at how many gambling ads and references there were.

It used to be illegal in most areas I think, and then both governments found out how much revenue it brings in and just looked a blind eye. It's actually infuriating how many times it pops up.

Baphometa posted...

There's enough people who are able to gamble responsibly AND gambling is poorly defined such that I would not support a full gambling ban. Just provide a safety net so that Mom or Dad can't bet the house/rent.

I would argue that this is a naive take, as long as companies control this country through monetary means, they not only have incentive financially, but politically to make sure that never happens.

Moreover, many companies benefit from mom and dad not being able to pay the mortgage. Such losses not only benefit the gambling institutions, but those who reap from the losses. The only thing forming such things benefits is the individuals, families, and society in the long term... none of which are a priority to the people wielding the power.

Some addictions are clearly more damaging to both individuals and society than others.

TheShadowViper posted...

One thing you have to consider though is much of life ultimately comes down to gambling, whether it be loans, insurance rates, or something less abstract like what show you will watch. There is an opportunity cost for nearly anything you do, and thus you are betting with nearly every action.

Nah we are not comparing six step parlays to fucking treasury bonds.

Does that extend to lottery's that some states (such as New Mexico) use to fund public schooling?

Kradek posted...

Does that extend to lottery's that some states (such as New Mexico) use to fund public schooling?

Lottery is more likely to be bought by people in disadvantaged neighborhoods. That makes it a regressive tax. I don't care that people technically voluntarily buy it; if you have the statistics and know to expect that X% of people are going to buy lottery, then you are effectively levying a tax on them. Just raise taxes on the people and entities that can afford to pay them!

Doe posted...

Nah we are not comparing six step parlays to fucking treasury bonds.

Could you have picked a safer comparison? Treasury bonds are literally one of the least risky investments out there.

Once you get outside the "safer" options the stock market immediately begins to look like a casino. Complete with market manipulation by the house.

Eh. Just teach people self control. Its not that difficult to just say no.

TheShadowViper posted...

Could you have picked a safer comparison? Treasury bonds are literally one of the least risky investments out there.

Once you get outside the "safer" options the stock market immediately begins to look like a casino.

No it doesn't. The 30-year average return of the S&P 500 is about 11%. 5-year average return is about the same.

Tell me the 5-year average return of DraftKings.

The stock market is conceived around both parties hoping to mutually benefit. Buying the stock from the company gives them capital they can use to develop the company thus making that share worth more. Betting odds and slot machines are designed for the house to win.

rexcrk posted...

Eh. Just teach people self control. Its not that difficult to just say no.

Literally most of the problems of the first world stem from the fact that it is, actually, very difficult to say no for a significant amount of the population.

rexcrk posted...

Eh. Just teach people self control. Its not that difficult to just say no.

this is such an internet thing to say

Doe posted...

Lottery is more likely to be bought by people in disadvantaged neighborhoods. That makes it a regressive tax. I don't care that people technically voluntarily buy it; if you have the statistics and know to expect that X% of people are going to buy lottery, then you are effectively levying a tax on them. Just raise taxes on the people and entities that can afford to pay them!

That's a rather fair evaluation.

rexcrk posted...

Eh. Just teach people self control. Its not that difficult to just say no.

Gambling can become an addiction similar to drugs. One time I went to a casino and blew $100 super quick and felt the desire to withdraw more money to continue. It was at that time that I realized I would have a problem with gambling if I indulged myself further. A few years after that I went to Vegas and had to exhibit serious self-control on the amount of money I was spending as I watched my coworkers blow hundreds of dollars, sometimes, on an almost nightly basis.

I was able to catch myself early and recognize I'd have a problem, most people don't realize that until it's too late.

Not Blackjack though.

Thats just doing math for money.

Doe posted...

The stock market is conceived around both parties hoping to mutually benefit. Buying the stock from the company gives them capital they can use to develop the company thus making that share worth more. Betting odds and slot machines are designed for the house to win.

So is the stock market. You are being deliberately obtuse here. The indexes you are referring to are averages, and are dependent on the manager who himself is calculating risk - sometimes not for his clients benefit. The entire concept of fiduciary duty (something that is not significantly enforced mind you) is based on the fact that these people gamble with their client's funds.

Insider trading by politicians who effect policy.

Market manipulation by apps when large organizations are about to lose big.

Software that crunches the numbers well beyond the average person's ability to compete.

You are talking about the house, the only difference is that the house is a cabal of forces working together to fix things rather than a single entity.

Doe posted...

Lottery is more likely to be bought by people in disadvantaged neighborhoods. That makes it a regressive tax. I don't care that people technically voluntarily buy it; if you have the statistics and know to expect that X% of people are going to buy lottery, then you are effectively levying a tax on them. Just raise taxes on the people and entities that can afford to pay them!

lol. you obviously don't understand that people who gamble like to do it and have fun with it. it's enjoyable. the same way you enjoy...whatever you enjoy. stripping away their enjoyment and replacing it with more tax is literally just going to get you murdered.

It's terrible for office talk as all these office bros care about is sports gambling.

Evening_Dragon posted...

Literally most of the problems of the first world stem from the fact that it is, actually, very difficult to say no for a significant amount of the population.

Seriously. Most people are terrible at self-control. It's a major reason why we have so many regulations.

Advertisement of gambling and gacha/gambling-adjacent mechanics in games marketed towards children and teens should be illegal, but don't think gambling itself should be.

I bet it shouldn't.

I think it should be regulated to lower the juice. Criminal how far the +/- delta can stray.

R_Jackal posted...

Advertisement of gambling and gacha/gambling-adjacent mechanics in games marketed towards children and teens should be illegal, but don't think gambling itself should be.

This.

I would also say not an outright ban on advertising, but only allow it in spaces that are already gambling-related. You can advertise a new game to existing gamblers, but you can't advertise "hey come do some gambling".

reminder there are leagal ways to get around the very limited regulations we do have on gambling

like those slot machines where you can change 1 of the icons that makes int "interactive" thus not legally a slot machine

Trumble posted...

This.

I would also say not an outright ban on advertising, but only allow it in spaces that are already gambling-related. You can advertise a new game to existing gamblers, but you can't advertise "hey come do some gambling".

Yeah, that's fair enough there.

TheShadowViper posted...

So is the stock market. You are being deliberately obtuse here. The indexes you are referring to are averages, and are dependent on the manager who himself is calculating risk - sometimes not for his clients benefit. The entire concept of fiduciary duty (something that is not significantly enforced mind you) is based on the fact that these people gamble with their client's funds.

"Hey I want to put my money in the S&P 500."
"Okay. We can do an index fund or ETF . . ."

That some account managers or fiduciaries can be bad actors is not an equivalent comparison to house odds.

Insider trading by politicians who effect policy.

You know there are ETFs that copy Congress members' trades and you can invest in those if you want?

Market manipulation by apps when large organizations are about to lose big.

This is the closest to a legitimate criticism here, but there was huge blowback for Robinhood's decision making in the GME fiasco including federal and mass media scrutiny, damage to their IPO, and a surviving lawsuit they're apparently currently settling. And the larger narrative is more complicated than all the little guys getting screwed over for Citadel. Other large investors made money off the squeeze and the volatility harmed a bunch of retail investors.

Software that crunches the numbers well beyond the average person's ability to compete.

Again, you can just be a free rider on any large organization whose number crunching you trust.

You are talking about the house, the only difference is that the house is a cabal of forces working together to fix things rather than a single entity.

*eye roll*

Gambling on NFl,NBA,WNBA,NHL,Profesional Soccer,Boxing,UFC,Nascar,Golf,MLB and Horse racing is fine, gambling on college sports needs to go the fuck away.

The constant ads need to be illegal.

There needs to be more advertising from gambling addiction help.

Gambling in of itself has gotten out of control, young kids are betting over games and getting addicted early.

I think my views are a little out of the mainstream on this, but I dont really believe the government should go too far in deciding what vices are acceptable and what should be banned. Partly because prohibition of any kind doesnt usually work. But mostly because I dont want government telling people what to do generally, and it is a slippery slope when the group in power get to decide the habits of adults based on their whims.

There are obviously some vices that are deadly enough to directly hurt other people that need to be regulated. But I have seen bills over the years looking to ban fast food, soda, video games and all sorts of stuff. Which is exactly the kind of thing you get when you start banning gambling etc.

My basic philosophy of government is that it should provide everyone opportunity and a good standard of living. Pour money into education, infrastructure, job training, social safety net etc.-and then get the hell out of the way and let us do what we want. Someone making bad decisions is part of the price of self determination and a free society. Unless they are directly hurting someone else, people should make their own choices. Government should educate about the perils of gambling, smoking etc. But I dont like whoever is making laws at the time deciding what vices or activities adults can or cant engage in.

Doe posted...

You know there are ETFs that copy Congress members' trades and you can invest in those if you want?

This isnt even possible.

I think it depends. Stuff like card games, sports betting, even roulette to an extent is fine IMO. Stuff like slot machines or those "stackers" arcade games should be banned. Gambling ads should be banned. I think online gambling should be banned as well.

Krojen posted...

This isnt even possible.

Yes it is, congress members have to report their stock movements within 45 days due to the STOCK act.

I think the lottery tickets should be abolished. Its just another way for the poor to waste their money on unnecessary things.

gambling is honestly just an unintelligence tax

Dungeater posted...

this is such an internet thing to say

It's because people do tend to project so those of us who do have self control assume it's just as easy for other people. I'm a substance addict. Was drugs now alcohol but I tried gambling once or twice and have never been tempted to do it again and every gas station in this state sells lottery tickets one closest to me has video poker.

Patty_Fleur posted...

I have no problem with gambling but I think there's lots of rigging behind the scenes.

It really is rigged to favor the "house". Look at scratch-off lottos. Most of the cards are designed to always let you get so close (usually one number off) without winning, and even when you do, you've spent more than you've won in the long run.