Current Events > I urge you all to discard the notion that "America voted for this".

(+) Yeah! (+)

reincarnator07 posted...

There is a difference between "Americans voted for this", which is what we're saying here btw, and "Americans wanted this", which is also a different statement than "Americans wanted this because most Americans voted for this.

Again, on a fundamental level we do not agree. A majority of the people that voted, did not vote for Trump. That mattering, and why the distinction matters is where we disagree at a fundamental level to this entire discussion. Given where I stand, Republican false narratives flourish on this distinction not being made to attack Dem turnout.

reincarnator07 posted...

That is an entirely different argument.

It's not, as it ties into this overall discussion. But like I said, we don't agree on a fundamental level.

reincarnator07 posted...

People are noting the noticeable difference between now vs the start of the Biden admin, where they seemed to struggle to get a lot of stuff passed and attributed a lot of that to GOP obstruction. Either the GOP wasn't actually the issue, or they have avenues available that they aren't pursuing...

Or the third option, which is that the Dems are doing what they can and it just isn't being appropriately publicised, which would make sense given how much the Dems actually managed to get done in 21-22 without appropriate fanfare. This goes back to a key issue with the Democrats: They utterly suck at PR and communicating positively with the America of today.

Nothing you said here or the rest of your post change what my point is. Which is both our politicians and voters have a serious problem of happily regurgitating Republican false narratives that has an unintended affect on election results.

Some like to put this all on the politician, but skirt around even when ignorant voters are given information/facts, they proudly reject that information.

Some even on this very board do that, as there's always reason to justify spreading a false narrative. With those examples I provided being easily one of the most popular. There's literally an ongoing topic right now skirting around some voters literally believe Democrats can literally stop Trump but choose not to.... which is yet again a false narrative. Many of which are proud vanguards of "Dems need to earn your vote" while confused why Democrats don't have the power to do anything..... since you know, they were part of the brigade that promoted not voting for them since "they aren't good enough. "

Democrats sucking at PR (which we agree they do suck) is absolutely not an excuse for voters to willfully be ignorant spreading false narratives even when facts are provided. Which yes, we very much also have a voter problem that is very proud of their ignorance, unwilling to budge on that ignorance, and have a tendency to spread that ignorance.

SydnieStarlight posted...

tl;dr: What we are getting is obviously not what the American people voted for, and pretending otherwise is stifling any hope of resistance.

Even setting aside the increasing likelihood that the Trump party may not, in fact, have secured victory through wholly legitimate means...

No one voted for Elon Musk and a small team of baby-faced cronies to be given free reign to dismantle literally everything. That wasn't on any ballots.

The people didn't vote for Trump to just appoint republican losers like Kari Lake and Herschel Walker into positions of influence. In fact, the people specifically voted for those losers to not have such positions. That's why they lost their respective races.

And no matter what you want to believe, the overwhelming majority of Americans did not vote in the hopes of Trump firing officials en masse and replacing them with his own loyalists (if he replaces them at all), thereby making Trump and Trump alone the law.

What we're seeing unfold is not and never has been the earnest desire of the average American voter. Republicans just want us to think it is. Because "America voted for this" carries the implicit follow-up of "so no one has any right to question or resist it". "America wanted this, so just shut up and accept it." "This is the will of the people, so who are you to think you can reject it?"

No, America did not vote for this. We are presently experiencing a hostile takeover of our government by authoritarian agents. And the thing about authoritarianism is that it really doesn't care what its people want.

I want to end on one final, very important note: DO. NOT. FALL. FOR. THEIR. LIES. Republicans have become synonymous with lies and deceit. Worse, they own mainstream media and the largest social media networks, which gives them free reign to twist the narrative however they want. So why would you ever accept "The majority of people totally love us" as an honest conclusion? Anything, at all, EVER that paints them in a good, honest, upstanding light should be met with intense scrutiny, because evil and dishonesty is their modus operandi.

Hate to break it to ya but there's a non-0 # of people who voted for him for this specific reason.

They want to watch the system come down and burn.

And this is what they voted for. If they were too ignorant to even look into project 2025 after hearing about it, thats on them

asdf8562 posted...

Again, on a fundamental level we do not agree. A majority of the people that voted, did not vote for Trump. That mattering, and why the distinction matters is where we disagree at a fundamental level to this entire discussion. Given where I stand, Republican false narratives flourish on this distinction not being made to attack Dem turnout.

It's not, as it ties into this overall discussion. But like I said, we don't agree on a fundamental level.

Nothing you said here or the rest of your post change what my point is. Which is both our politicians and voters have a serious problem of happily regurgitating Republican false narratives that has an unintended affect on election results.

Some like to put this all on the politician, but skirt around even when ignorant voters are given information/facts, they proudly reject that information.

Some even on this very board do that, as there's always reason to justify spreading a false narrative. With those examples I provided being easily one of the most popular. There's literally an ongoing topic right now skirting around some voters literally believe Democrats can literally stop Trump but choose not to.... which is yet again a false narrative. Many of which are proud vanguards of "Dems need to earn your vote" while confused why Democrats don't have the power to do anything..... since you know, they were part of the brigade that promoted not voting for them since "they aren't good enough. "

Democrats sucking at PR (which we agree they do suck) is absolutely not an excuse for voters to willfully be ignorant spreading false narratives even when facts are provided. Which yes, we very much also have a voter problem that is very proud of their ignorance, unwilling to budge on that ignorance, and have a tendency to spread that ignorance.

Y'know what, I can't be assed with you anymore. For all your claims of false narratives, you don't appear to be looking at the reality of America today, a flaw most certainly shared by the Democrats at large. I only hope that there are pieces to pick up by the time you come to your senses.

asdf8562 posted...

A majority of the people that voted, did not vote for Trump.

Hmm.

asdf8562 posted...

A majority of the people that voted, did not vote for Trump.

Trump won the popular vote by a margin of over 2 million votes, and ended up with 49.8% of that vote.

So this is technically true, because he would have needed to have 50.1% or more of the vote to have a "majority".

"Technically" is doing some very heavy lifting here, and this is simply not a point worth arguing.

Suppose there is an advantage to taking TC's advice such as Trump, Musk & their money have not anticipated such an eventuality ?

In a political discussion on the Chicago reddit, I saw the concept "our algorithms."

Take a deep breath and think. Some of our algorithms are good, fantastic even! What happened? Most of us know that at least 4 years of planning went into this. Did they build models of how we would respond?

If they did, no way will they be prepared for us to go TC's route.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

Yep this. Even if we can somehow unite on the basis of class conflict, like basically occured for a bit with Luigi M, even when the smoke clears we still have
Racists
Transphobes
Anti intellectuals/conspiracy theorists
People who truly are okay with billionaires existing and soon to be trillionaires

So we will inevitably get back to where we are down the line. We cannot and have never stopped violent cycles of oppression. I have very little hope tbh

reincarnator07 posted...

Y'know what, I can't be assed with you anymore. For all your claims of false narratives, you don't appear to be looking at the reality of America today, a flaw most certainly shared by the Democrats at large. I only hope that there are pieces to pick up by the time you come to your senses.

You didnt need to inform me you're done, just be done.

I am looking at the reality of America along with our side falling victim to Republican pushed false narratives. We already established fundamentally you and I don't agree the distinction doesn't matter. As I'm of the position it matters given the GOPs position to justify their actions, and past false narratives used to affect election turnout.

asdf8562 posted...

A majority of the people that voted, did not vote for Trump

Anyone that didn't vote Harris has enabled Trump. Only Trump or Harris was ever going to win. Anybody voting 3rd party was as bad as staying home.

Well I learned my lesson. Im voting from now on. said nobody to the surprise of no one.

Is this a "Mask Off" topic?