Board 8 > Rank the Tracks 225: Deftones - White Pony

(+) Yeah! (+)

spreadsheets with previous results can be found here:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/12PpZ3uQ093tRPVu-KLewIxmrzfLJf1oo?usp=drive_link

Previous results can be seen here:
https://board8.fandom.com/wiki/Rank_the_Tracks
https://board8.fandom.com/wiki/Rank_the_Tracks_Set_2
https://board8.fandom.com/wiki/Rank_the_Tracks_Set_3
https://board8.fandom.com/wiki/Rank_the_Tracks_Set_4
https://board8.fandom.com/wiki/Rank_the_Tracks_Set_5

The rules:
1. Listen to the album in full
2. Rank every track on the album
3. For the results, there will be a curve at the top of each list; two additional points between #1 and #2, and one additional point for the next two ranks. This way, the songs that really stick out to someone get an edge that is not immediately negated by someone else putting it lower. In the case of Demon Days, someone's 15th track will get 1 point, 14th 2 points, 4th 12 points, 3rd 14 points, 2nd 16 points, and 1st 19 points. For albums with greater than 15 tracks, everything ranked below #15 will be given 0 points and the scale for the top 15 will be the same as a 15-track album. For albums with more than 20 tracks, you only have to list your top 15 (with 16-20, I still like having the average rank listed)
4. If you want to include comments for individual songs, I will compile them in the results
5. The results will be posted at the beginning of the next topic
6. The deadline to vote is Thursday, July 24th at 8:00 AM Central Time; If you do get in a vote after the deadline but before I post the results, I will probably include it.
7. Every few weeks, a nomination period will open; there may or may not be a theme. Each user can nominate one album. The following week, everyone will be able to rank their top ~5 among the choices - this will use a bottom-up scoring approach, i.e. voting for one album will give your #1 a single point, voting for five will give your #1 five points, so it is always better to vote for the maximum number of albums. The top ~5 will then be covered (if there is a tie leading to six entries, both get in - if more than that, I will do a tiebreaker)
8. Skits and tracks under 40 seconds will be excluded from the rankings unless argued otherwise

Deftones - White Pony track list:
0*. Back to School (Mini Maggit)
1. Feiticeira
2. Digital Bath
3. Elite
4. Rx Queen
5. Street Carp
6. Teenager
7. Knife Prty
8. Korea
9. Passenger
10. Change (In the House of Flies)
11. Pink Maggit
*A reissue soon after the original release included this as the opening track - since it's on the Spotify version, I'm including it

Future weeks:
7/24: Joni Mitchell - Blue
7/31: The Clash - London Calling
8/7: Bob Dylan - Highway 61 Revisited
8/14: Public Enemy - It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back
8/21: Beyonc - RENAISSANCE
8/28: Johnny Cash - At Folsom Prison

FoolFantastic posted...

I finally got things aligned so the cycles would line up for the 25 week period and then we get a tie.

I'm sorry, I deliberately voted to get both RENAISSANCE and At Folsom Prison through, and somehow without it ever occurring to me that our Tracks and Albums cycles had at last reached alignment before my vote disrupted that.

I understand if you choose to disregard my vote as such. If that's not the solution you think this calls for, maybe we could run a tiebreaker between the two aforementioned albums, if remaining in alignment is important for us?

I missed the voting so if you needed a quick tiebreaker of some sort I can try and help, but if you want to do a broader tiebreaker that's fair too

MetalmindStats posted...

I'm sorry, I deliberately voted to get both RENAISSANCE and At Folsom Prison through, and somehow without it ever occurring to me that our Tracks and Albums cycles had at last reached alignment before my vote disrupted that.

I understand if you choose to disregard my vote as such. If that's not the solution you think this calls for, maybe we could run a tiebreaker between the two aforementioned albums, if remaining in alignment is important for us?

Sorry, I was being a bit absurd with that complaint. Any fix I did was going to be temporary until the next tie - it's just funny that it happened immediately.

(though I'm not sure how I feel about deliberately causing a tie, but whatever; especially with this batch, the more we cover the better)

I could even change it to always be six albums and leave space for a special 25th album each cycle, whether it be the annual holiday album or an emergency feature like we did with Pet Sounds. That way, more people get their chosen album through.

I think five albums is usually good. Usually leaves room for a less well-known album to sneak in at the bottom, but means we cover very few things that only one or two of us were interested in.

I'm really, really not a fan of people "gaming" their votes just to "cause chaos" or whatever. Just vote your heart and let the results come what may. This is why, in an earlier nomination process, we moved away from poll voting, because the results where getting skewed/screwed up from non-participants. If people are doing that then I'm a fan of making the voting private (via PM), or at least making that an option to minimize the gaming.

FoolFantastic posted...

I could even change it to always be six albums and leave space for a special 25th album each cycle, whether it be the annual holiday album or an emergency feature like we did with Pet Sounds. That way, more people get their chosen album through.

Not the worst idea here. I'm sure there's always a "bonus" album that could be plugged in, even if it's a "20/30/40th anniversary of xyz important album's release".

I'll say that I'm a fan of doing a sort of automatic tiebreaker resolution by counting back the number of 1st then 2nd then 3rd place votes and so on for the tied albums until one has more votes. In other words, if albums A and B are tied, then it goes to 1st place votes for the 2; if album A has a 1st place vote and album B doesn't, then album A is selected. If they tie on 1sts then it goes to 2nds and so on. Just a thought.

I could also just keep my vote private until the results and then no one can meaningfully game it since it requires being the last vote. Of course, later voters always have the advantage of seeing which albums not to bother on, but that's the nature of open voting.

Seanchan posted...

I'm really, really not a fan of people "gaming" their votes just to "cause chaos" or whatever. Just vote your heart and let the results come what may.

I agree. This is part of the reason why I kind of dislike the "best of the system" topic series having public voting, along with the fact that someone with enough time on their hands could just spoil the result for themselves.

I think it's pretty harmless (though I agree with discouraging against it). I wouldn't want to see any changes to the current voting system over it. We should keep the barrier to entry low and I enjoy seeing the discussion and what people support and don't. It also helps inform future noms.

MarkS2222222222 posted...

I think it's pretty harmless (though I agree with discouraging against it). I wouldn't want to see any changes to the current voting system over it. We should keep the barrier to entry low and I enjoy seeing the discussion and what people support and don't. It also helps inform future noms.

these are basically my thoughts as well

Happy to have revisited this, as I think I get this style of music more nowadays.

Change (In the House of Flies)
Digital Bath
Passenger
Rx Queen
Pink Maggit
Knife Prty
Feiticeira
Korea
Elite
Street Carp
Teenager
Back to School (Mini Maggit)

I'll try and do a final listen this afternoon

Wont get to a final listen until late Thursday/Friday.

This is fine stuff, although I don't feel too strongly about it.

Digital Bath
Pink Maggit
Change (In the House of Flies)
Knife Prty
Korea
Rx Queen
Passenger
Feiticeira
Elite
Back to School (Mini Maggit)
Teenager
Street Carp

Really not sure how I feel about this. Decent in small portions but too much of it is a LOT.

1. Change (In the House of Flies)
2. Passenger - legitimately thought I was listening to Tool for a moment here
3. Digital Bath
4. Knife Prty
5. Teenager
6. Pink Maggit
7. Feiticeira
8. Street Carp
9. Back to School (Mini Maggit)
10. Korea
11. Rx Queen
12. Elite

Woo, Deftones! And their album where they really set forth their future defining sound for the years to come, both for themselves and many other alternative metal acts. Their previous album, Around the Fur, teased their newer influences beyond standard nu-metal but this one delved into them even further, going for more atmospheric cuts and utilizing Chino's higher register to go for some dreamier passages. There's definitely still a heaviness to it all, both lyrically and musically, but they aren't afraid to incorporate shoegaze, electronic, and trip hop into the mix along some other genres. Not my all time favorite album from them, that's Around the Fur, but their most important album nonetheless.

1. Passenger - Still my second favorite song from them, first is My Own Summer, the vocal play between Chino and Maynard is stellar. And I love the eeriness of it, you can really feel like you're going on a night drive, the air brisk as it comes in through the open window. Hayley Williams of Paramore has actually done a great stand-in for Maynard's part in some live performances of it!
2. Digital Bath - Another track to get absolutely lost in, this is probably the biggest example for me of the band just going full throttle into a newer sound and killing it. Also the juxtaposition of how gorgeous it sounds compared to the lyrics (A scenario of taking a girl into a bathtub, then electrocuting her) is fascinating.
3. Change (In the House of Flies) - The biggest hit from the album, goes right along with Digital Bath of having this newer, atmospheric sound for them and sounding massive.
4. Elite - Shows that they still wanted to show off their heavy chops, and a song that won them a Grammy award which shocked them at the time, being a relatively new band in the scene still.
5. Korea - The other heavy song, I love the groove of it especially in the chrous.
6. Rx Queen - Probably my favorite song on the album lyrically, telling of someone who is in a relationship with an addict to painkillers, and stays with them and helps enable the addiction despite knowing how much it hurts them both until it ultimately kills the addict.
7. Pink Maggit
8. Street Carp
9. Knife Prty
10. Feiticeira
11. Teenager
12. Back to School (Mini Maggit) - Such a shame Spotify has this version of the album, with this version of Pink Maggit as the first song, as the main one. Created out of a fight with the band and their label, the label wanted a certified "hit" for the album so Chino and the band went and banged this out out of frustration, then very soon regretted it when the label released it with a newer version of the album. It's not terrible, but very clearly not part of the original vision of the album.

1. Digital Bath - Absolutely mind-blowing production. Amazing main riff and there are multiple spots that give me chills every time (the "feel like more" screams at 2:18 and 3:04, as well as the guitar scream at 2:54). On certain days, this is my favorite Deftones song (usually it's Be Quiet and Drive (Far Away)).
2. Change (In the House of Flies) - Again, stunning main riff with an extremely memorable vocal line. Just a really well-written song all-around.
3. Passenger - Somehow I never noticed that Maynard was in this track until reading Bane's comment. No wonder it sounds so much like a TOOL track. Regardless, this track is incredible. There's an ethereal aura to both the guitars and the vocal delivery that I absolutely love.
4. Rx Queen
5. Knife Prty
6. Korea
7. Street Carp
8. Feticeira
9. Elite
10. Pink Maggit
11. Teenager
12. Back to School (Mini Maggit)

My favorite album by one of my favorite metal bands. It's a step down in heaviness after Around the Fur, but I feel they get the mix of metal, shoegaze, and post-metal just right here. The production is amazing and my top 3 songs are all-timers. Great stuff and I'm glad we finally got to cover this band.

Also, just for fun, here's my Deftones album ranking (definitely looking forward to their new album coming in a few weeks!):

1. White Pony
2. Koi no yokan
3. Around the Fur
4. Saturday Night Wrist
5. Diamond Eyes
6. Ohms
7. Deftones
8. Gore
9. Adrenaline

whoops late entry. i didn't see the results posted, so hopefully I squeaked in.

1. Digital Bath
2. Passenger
3. Change (In the House of Flies)
4. Knife Prty
5. Pink Maggit
6. RX Queen
7. Korea
8. Feiticeira
9. Street Carp
10. Teenager
11. Elite
12. Back to School (Mini Maggit)

Should get mine in later today if that's alright! Not had much time the past couple weeks.

1. Knife Prty
2. Change (In the House of Flies)

3. Pink Maggit
- Originally a lot lower with Back to School, but it sounds better, it has the lady from Knife Prty, and feels like a nice wraparound. Honestly didn't expect top half much less my top three.

4. Digital Bath
5. Rx Queen
6. Street Carp
7. Passenger
8. Korea
9. Back to School (Mini Maggit)
10. Elite
11. Feiticeira

12. Teenager
- Listening to albums again in anticipation of RTA 9, and in addition to being a song I dislike, all I came away from it was comparing it disfavorably to Beach Boys' "Caroline, No"

Edits exclusively for Teenage write-up

Change (In the House of Flies)
Digital Bath
Passenger
Elite
RX Queen
Knife Prty
Korea
Pink Maggit
Street Carp
Teenager
Feiticeira
Back to School (Mini Maggit)

I think I have a clear top five, then am not too bothered about the bottom four. Elite is really good, it's rare for me to like something that heavy! Everything below RX Queen, not my kinda thing. Overall though, enjoyed this probably a bit more than I expected.

Edit: Pasted in Change in the complete wrong place, edited list is correct!

Digital Bath
Korea
Street Carp
Change (In The House of Flies)
Back in School - might be different if I hadn't heard this so much before Pink Maggit. It feels nostalgic somehow, like this was on the soundtrack of something, but I can't figure out what. I wanna say Tony Hawk but I couldn't find in search
Passenger - I like Maynard's vocals in general, but his voice with these lyrics is just an odd fit. Good song as a whole though
Knife Prty
Feiticeira
Elite
Pink Maggit
Rx Queen
Teenager - only one I tend to skip

I love this album and the sound they carved out within this subgenre. I should check out more of their other stuff

I'm sorry again for deliberately causing that tie, and I'll make a point of not counting others' votes before casting my own again.

~~~

1. Digital Bath
2. Passenger
3. Change (In the House of Flies)
4. Rx Queen
5. Pink Maggit
6. Elite
7. Knife Prty
8. Feiticeira
9. Teenager
10. Korea
11. Street Carp
12. Back to School (Mini Maggit)

Johnbobb posted...

Really not sure how I feel about this. Decent in small portions but too much of it is a LOT.

I agree with this and lack anything of substance to add to it.

1. Change (In the House of Flies)
2. Digital Bath
3. Back to School (Mini Maggit)
4. Passenger
5. Elite
6. Pink Maggit
7. Korea
8. Teenager
9. Knife Prty
10. Rx Queen
11. Feiticeira
12. Street Carp

Not really my thing. This is just a type of music that I listened to as a teenager that I don't care for anymore as an adult. The 3 singles I knew from back when are decent enough, but there's a reason I never bothered to check out more of Deftones.